Politics Centrelink

[Over The Post]

The good ol' Liquid Assets Waiting Period. Causes untold hardship as people with virtually no money are forced to bend over backwards trying to prove to Centrelink that they are not hiding money to avoid the waiting period.

Yup. I lost my job in October '14, my savings ran out in August '15, pride and shit earnings from a casual job kept me away from applying for the dole until early '17. I had a couple of thousand left from my share of the house equity when it was sold, they waited until that was gone too and I had nothing. Literally $5 in the bank and $70 in my wallet. That was it. Ever so grateful to the guy at the Centrelink office who backdated my application 2 weeks so that I'd get paid straight away and not have to live for a fortnight on $75.

Going through the bankruptcy process later - even though it carried a lot of social stigma inherited from growing up in the 60s and 70s - was far less invasive and demeaning.

 

[Rotayjay]

Yup. I lost my job in October '14, my savings ran out in August '15, pride and sh*t earnings from a casual job kept me away from applying for the dole until early '17. I had a couple of thousand left from my share of the house equity when it was sold, they waited until that was gone too and I had nothing. Literally $5 in the bank and $70 in my wallet. That was it. Ever so grateful to the guy at the Centrelink office who backdated my application 2 weeks so that I'd get paid straight away and not have to live for a fortnight on $75.

Going through the bankruptcy process later - even though it carried a lot of social stigma inherited from growing up in the 60s and 70s - was far less invasive and demeaning.

Whilst I believe a welfare system should not support those who can support themselves, the Liquid Assets Waiting Period in particular is a cruel policy that crushes honest people. I'm not sure when it was introduced or by whom. Would be somewhere in here Number 13: A compendium of legislative changes in social security 1983-2000 | Department of Social Services, Australian Government (dss.gov.au) or here Number 12: A compendium of legislative changes in social security 1908-1982 | Department of Social Services, Australian Government (dss.gov.au)

When the pandemic struck, Centrelink waived the assets limit and the liquid assets waiting period, thereby removing the need to provide and comb through dozens of pages of bank statements looking for naughty secret accounts that have five bucks in them. This allowed Centrelink to process people's Jobseeker claims in a day or two after submission. Now, with the waiting period and assets limit reintroduced, it's taking a good 5-30 days from submission to decision.

 

[Over The Post]

Isabel was paid $120 for a week's work and was threatened with losing her visa if she didn't accept

A royal commission into Australia's blueberry industry is being called for after a new report alleges evidence of systemic wage theft by labour hire firms recruiting international workers to pick the fruit in NSW.

www.abc.net.au

But waaaaah fruit is falling off trees because the dole pays too much and nobody wants to come here and work.

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Isabel was paid $120 for a week's work and was threatened with losing her visa if she didn't accept

A royal commission into Australia's blueberry industry is being called for after a new report alleges evidence of systemic wage theft by labour hire firms recruiting international workers to pick the fruit in NSW.

www.abc.net.au

But waaaaah fruit is falling off trees because the dole pays too much and nobody wants to come here and work.

It's a scam. There's locals that cant get these jobs because the labor contracts are with backpacker hostels and you have to stay in the hostel.

 

[Over The Post]

Well who says the USA can't learn from anyone else. This is a carbon copy of what the 457 visa rort has done to Australian workers.

21st century indentured servitude? Justice Dept sues Facebook for ‘discriminating against US workers’ by hiring H-1B visa holders

Facebook has been accused of systematically discriminating against US citizens in a lawsuit filed by the Justice Department, which charged the tech behemoth with prioritizing company-sponsored temp visa holders for 2,600 posts.

www.rt.com

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I don't know how much its changed, but back in the old CES days , i'd say i was looking for work, "Mechanical Engineer " they'd then proceed to find jobs for me requiring Chemist, PHD in physics etc. "Enjuneer is some sort of technical stuff isn't it"?

What really sucks is if you own your own house and lose your job as the main breadwinner. If your wife partner doesn't earn enough for the mortgage, you can lose a massive amount of money really fast.
Of course under those circumstances you probably aren't counted as "unemployed "

 

[Rotayjay]

I don't know how much its changed, but back in the old CES days , i'd say i was looking for work, "Mechanical Engineer " they'd then proceed to find jobs for me requiring Chemist, PHD in physics etc. "Enjuneer is some sort of technical stuff isn't it"?

What really sucks is if you own your own house and lose your job as the main breadwinner. If your wife partner doesn't earn enough for the mortgage, you can lose a massive amount of money really fast.
Of course under those circumstances you probably aren't counted as "unemployed "

The family home is not counted in the assets limit, but if you have investment properties you have a problem. That assets limit was waived from March to September, I believe to prevent a tsunami of property investors selling their properties and having to evict tenants during the pandemic, thereby causing a social disaster and a plunge in house prices. That rate of $1100 per fortnight was probably designed to support mortgages as well.

Now that the assets test is back in, the amount the Jobseeker's partner can earn per fortnight is much more generous. Now a job seeker can still be eligible if the partner earns about 2,800 per fortnight.

But the current Jobseeker payment is not designed to support a mortgage. But then again, I guess lenders might accept reduced payments for a little while while landlords will often evict tenants for just a few weeks of arrears.

So overall the Jobseeker Payment is designed for the tenant or mortgage holder to get another job very quickly.

Today's Jobactive is designed to force the person to take up any suitable paid work, not necessarily what the person studied or trained for.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

The family home is not counted in the assets limit, but if you have investment properties you have a problem. That assets limit was waived from March to September, I believe to prevent a tsunami of property investors selling their properties and having to evict tenants during the pandemic, thereby causing a social disaster and a plunge in house prices. That rate of $1100 per fortnight was probably designed to support mortgages as well.

Now that the assets test is back in, the amount the Jobseeker's partner can earn per fortnight is much more generous. Now a job seeker can still be eligible if the partner earns about 2,800 per fortnight.

But the current Jobseeker payment is not designed to support a mortgage. But then again, I guess lenders might accept reduced payments for a little while while landlords will often evict tenants for just a few weeks of arrears.

So overall the Jobseeker Payment is designed for the tenant or mortgage holder to get another job very quickly.

Today's Jobactive is designed to force the person to take up any suitable paid work, not necessarily what the person studied or trained for.

Lenders can choose to accept or not, most Mortgages give them the right to foreclose after a single skipped payment.

So you lose your job. You were on a good Salary, your wife is on the minimum. What do you get from Centerlink? Zip. You would be better off if you weren't married and your wife was a room mate. As it stands you are a stay at home parent, you are not unemployed, simply looking for work. You get nothing.
So you can stumble through, hoping you will get a job but not really knowing if you will or not. ....ignoring silly little things you need like food.
Or you sell your house in a hurry, you might be lucky but chances are it won't be a bargain for you.

At that point you will have a heap of liquid assets you are forced to live off.

 

[eddiesmith]

I’m just glad Gillards changes to the DSP forcing them to search for jobs didn’t affect anyone already on them. Sounds like job search programs are a disaster.

 

[Rotayjay]

Lenders can choose to accept or not, most Mortgages give them the right to foreclose after a single skipped payment.

So you lose your job. You were on a good Salary, your wife is on the minimum. What do you get from Centerlink? Zip. You would be better off if you weren't married and your wife was a room mate. As it stands you are a stay at home parent, you are not unemployed, simply looking for work. You get nothing.
So you can stumble through, hoping you will get a job but not really knowing if you will or not. ....ignoring silly little things you need like food.
Or you sell your house in a hurry, you might be lucky but chances are it won't be a bargain for you.

At that point you will have a heap of liquid assets you are forced to live off.

If you have an owner-occupied home but no other real estate and a wife on minimim wage you'd probably get some Jobseeker eventually.

 

[Crusey]

Anyone familiar with the NEIS program ?

I'm starting a new business and reading the info I should be able to stay on Jobseeker type payments until the business gets up and running

 

[Over The Post]

Yes, I was on it for a few months. In essence, you get paid the same rate as Jobseeker, but under a different name, for a period until your business is established. Goodbye mutual obligations!

You will be enrolled in a small business administration course, to do at your own pace, and will have regular compulsory meetings with your fellow NEIS guys and mentors, which can be a lot of fun. You'll get assistance coming up with a business plan, getting a trading name and ABN registered, doing projected financials and setting goals and targets. Your job service provider can also be tapped to pay for small but essential items that you cannot afford up-front, in my case $250 worth of protective clothing and $650 business insurance.

A couple of data points:
1. Keep up with the program, do not fall behind in your homework. The mentors/instructors won't have time to chase up.
2. The instructors/mentors can be a mine of information, use them.
3. Your JSP might not give you a cent, it can help if a mentor calls them first to explain what you need. But if the NEIS group is being handled by Sarina Russo (for example) don't expect $$$ if your JSP is the Salvos.
4. FFS do not even *mention* the word bankruptcy. My situation was dire but I was struggling along trying to dig myself out. I made the mistake of saying that at some point in the future I might have to consider it. Three days later I got a letter telling me to **** off back to Centrelink. In the end it took me another 18 months of hardship before I actually had to declare bankruptcy. Who knows what would have happened if my business had succeeded, even modestly.
5. The NEIS rate may be just the basic jobseeker rate without the corona supplement. Check that. I did get the equivalent of rent assistance and medical allowance.

Hope that helps a little.

 

[Crusey]

Thanks buddy sounds good

I've done all the groundwork and am ready to go, as you said just getting rid of the mutual obligations for a while would be handy

Some funds to cover setup costs / training I have outlayed would be nice

 

[Kram]

Mutual Obligations of 4 jobs a month are back

Anyone know what actually happens if you just dont do them ?

I'm back at work but all cashies, not sure if I should just cancel the jobseeker or apply for 4 jobs with no intention of taking them for a few more months

Whilst tempting to get one up on a scummy government not sure doing this is a good idea, sort of stuff that gives honest people on welfare a bad name.

 

[Crusey]

Not really trying to get one up

I'm in Hospo (Specifically Foodtrucks) and slowly starting to get back into work however hours and jobs are spasmodic

Dont see the point in applying for jobs that I have no intention of taking

 

[Over The Post]

Online reporting has changed. Instead of ticking the box, filling in the amount and the hours worked on the main page, you now have to go through an entirely new page for each individual part with multiple tick boxes and pull down menus. Lots of "confirm" and "review". Utter, utter bullshit and a nice reversion to 1980s-style user interface.

 

[Chief]

Online reporting has changed. Instead of ticking the box, filling in the amount and the hours worked on the main page, you now have to go through an entirely new page for each individual part with multiple tick boxes and pull down menus. Lots of "confirm" and "review". Utter, utter bullshit and a nice reversion to 1980s-style user interface.

It's a plain old attempt to block people.

 

[Over The Post]

As in, give them more opportunities to make a mistake so their benefit can be suspended.

 

[scottyt2]

Getting my job back after xmas...if i select no to the job plan requirements will i still get paid jobseeker???

 

[NSWCROW]

I see the cashless card passed the lower house ( by 1 vote when the 1 lib who opposed it decided to abstain lel )


Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh that must be a real dick-punch for anyone who voted lib at the last election hey

 

[Over The Post]

Getting my job back after xmas...if i select no to the job plan requirements will i still get paid jobseeker???

NO NO NOOOOO the centrelink guy who showed me how to do the weekly reporting said "FFS never, ever put no. Your payment will be cut off immediately and it'll take weeks to sort out."

 

[Over The Post]

They really are campaigners. campaigners. There is no other word to describe them.

Robodebt 'forgotten' as tough targets revealed for Centrelink debt collectors

Centrelink's new debt collecting companies must compete with each other by meeting rigorous collection targets to increase market share.

www.abc.net.au

TLDR;
Centrelink tendering for three external debt collection agencies
Those who recover more debts will have extra debts assigned to them
Those who recover less will get fewer
Companies may still be awarded contracts if they have a history of breaking the law
There is no penalty for companies with contracts if they continue to break the law
Companies not required to be members of Aust Financial Complaints Association

But if a victim (and I use the word deliberately) of these campaigners threatens to go to politicians or the media, these companies must inform DHS within an hour as they are considered:

events that have "potential for serious adverse impact to the department's reputation".

**** them.

 

[brucetiki]

They really are campaigners. campaigners. There is no other word to describe them.

Robodebt 'forgotten' as tough targets revealed for Centrelink debt collectors

Centrelink's new debt collecting companies must compete with each other by meeting rigorous collection targets to increase market share.

www.abc.net.au

TLDR;
Centrelink tendering for three external debt collection agencies
Those who recover more debts will have extra debts assigned to them
Those who recover less will get fewer
Companies may still be awarded contracts if they have a history of breaking the law
There is no penalty for companies with contracts if they continue to break the law
Companies not required to be members of Aust Financial Complaints Association

But if a victim (and I use the word deliberately) of these campaigners threatens to go to politicians or the media, these companies must inform DHS within an hour as they are considered:


fu** them.

That article was disturbing to read - especially the fact that the department head still refuses to acknowledge the fact that Robodebt lead to people taking their own lives.

 

[Rotayjay]

They really are campaigners. campaigners. There is no other word to describe them.

Robodebt 'forgotten' as tough targets revealed for Centrelink debt collectors

Centrelink's new debt collecting companies must compete with each other by meeting rigorous collection targets to increase market share.

www.abc.net.au

TLDR;
Centrelink tendering for three external debt collection agencies
Those who recover more debts will have extra debts assigned to them
Those who recover less will get fewer
Companies may still be awarded contracts if they have a history of breaking the law
There is no penalty for companies with contracts if they continue to break the law
Companies not required to be members of Aust Financial Complaints Association

But if a victim (and I use the word deliberately) of these campaigners threatens to go to politicians or the media, these companies must inform DHS within an hour as they are considered:


fu** them.

Was just about to post this.

This is typical Coalition bull****.

1. Create stupid Centrelink policies like Robodebt

2. Understaff Centrelink

3. Hire private companies to do Centrelink's dirty work, effectively meaning a non-public servant gets paid approx half as much to do the same complex job as a public servant

4. In the contract, Centrelink places in certain KPIs, which are then passed onto the private company's employees

5. The KPIs are unrealistic

6. Private company employee cuts corners in order to meet the KPIs and keep their job

All in the name of the neoliberal ideology that welfare recipients are all cheats and that the private sector ought to take over government services. Campaigners. I'll be popping the champagne if and when they're voted out one day.

 

[Rotayjay]

And to all those who voted for the Coalition in 2019 - this is the kind of behaviour you voted for, you utter ****sticks.