Strategy Coach Expectations

[Cotcho]

Can't help to question what our team could be achieving had we snagged Darren Burgess.... but does anyone else find it frustrating that a fair chunk of the competition, including the tigers, are being beaten by a team with seemingly no more talent but a team that is simply extremely fit!!!

It is staggering, and worrying that our team never seems to be "the fittest", "the strongest", "the most gritty", the most anything in the competition. For me it's embarrassing that after so long, suffering as a club, that we can be beaten by a team that works harder off and on the track...because that's all fitness is. Simply tries harder...

Does moving Dustin Martin to the forward line or the back line send a message to the group that it's ok to not have an "AFL standard tank/fitness"? Do we have too many guys like Deledio, with amazing ability, who struggle to break tags (imo code for basically not working hard enough when being tagged)?

I hear stuff like, "We have come from too far back and drafted in the expansion era" and "we have too many recycled players brought in from other clubs that are mediocre", but here I am not talking about talent. For me there is one thing you CAN control...and that's work ethic.

When Dimma arrived he promised steady improvement, promised the group would do everything "right" and many hoped that our players would play the tough, hard working, uncompromising football that he did...but has Dimma himself lessened his expectations of the group and allowed complacency to creep in? Is Dimma in reality softer than Lyon, Roos, Clarkson, Hird? What good is waiting for players to "get preseasons under their belts" or "to reach 50-100 games" when other clubs, in that time are working much harder?

We all smuggly ignore comments from ex tigers like Angus Grahem and Mitch Morton who say work rate and expectations are higher at other clubs, and put it down to disgruntled ex employees, but is there a lot more truth to it than we want to believe?

There are a bunch of threads discussing how we aren't big enough, don't apply enough defensive pressure, aren't consistent enough, aren't two way running, aren't moving the ball quickly....Are these all symptoms of not working hard enough and laziness....which usually starts off the track?

Now I don't want to make this YET another roast thread discussing the same stuff, rather can we discuss whether it is time for us to dramatically increase off field work rate, subject immediately? Even if it is to the detriment to this years performances? Do what the Bombers did in 2012 (minus the help), the Dockers did in 2013 and Port are doing right now? Make sure we go into 2015 the strongest, fittest and hardest working team...maybe...just maybe, to see where it gets us??? Or does everyone want to limp into finals or just miss with a slightly less than average fitness/strength level n plod about for the next few years and wait for the next coach, the next rebuild?
Thoughts?

Sorry if I shouldn't have started this thread! Thought maybe it's unique enough.

 

[GH213]

Yeah I believe fitness is an issue. I don't reckon we are the worst in the comp but we could definitely get better. Where do we get our own burgess? Port got a major tick getting him over from that soccer joint.

The other thing is too, that we will have to wait and see if they can run out the season. Whilst they tear it up atm, look at the 2011,12 & 13 bombers. Did they work too hard early? Will we see ports endurance taper off?

Still a long way to go.

As for our ex players mouthing off about other clubs working harder, we have had players come to us and say its the hardest pre season they have ever done so who knows how much truth there is in what players say re training in the media. It could all be just to please their new club.

 

[Cutty]

Good thread

Now i feel like im a pretty postive poster around these parts but the one thing i have worried about with the team it the ability to put in a solid 4 quarters over the journey.

We always seem to have down points in games where we let the opposition pile on a few with little resistance.

Ive heard it said that we are an "emotional" team that is very hard to stop once it gets going. That speaks to work ethic for me.

I dont know if increased fitness will lead to a better work ethic and a shift from emotion/confidence footy toward cold professionalism and reliability but it couldn't hurt.

 

[nut]

Another thread searching for excuses when its plain and simple. Our game plan is too negative with an over emphasis on stoppages... we lack run because of they way we try an over posses the ball from stoppages..... we try and "find" a player backwards sideways using multiple handballs to players that are virtually stationaruy ... we take the easy option without taking the game on. Then we chip chip chip and because of slow ball movement we allow the opposition to build pressure on us and we turn it over.

I actually think the lack of run in our game plan and the way we play is slowly reducing our fitness base from the pre-season.

If Dimma isnt spending every minute of the break completely changing our mindset to be more attacking than he has learnt nothing from the season up til now. We must now go all out attack.... to get rid of this stupid negative crap we have dished out in the first 7 games.

 

[Craze]

Well said Cotcho. I think the points you make are valid.

It's a competitive industry, AFL. It's just disappointing that at no stage (perhaps with 1995 the exception) in the past 30 years could I confidently say that our group were in the top 5 trainers, top 5 fitness/strength, top 5 work-rate on the training track, top 5 preparation when not at the club, etc. I even remember being surprised at how Ivan Maric came into the club and seemed to have a few stern words to some Richmond players, and moved so quickly into the leadership group. Really doesn't say much for the work ethic of the existing playing group. And didn't someone bringing up the fact that one of our youngest players (Nathan Gordon maybe?) is widely regarded as one of our best trainers? This needs to be addressed.

And I think about what it would take to be in the top 2-3 clubs in this regard. It really requires leadership, the players themselves need to demand this of each other. And how on earth is there any club more hungry than Richmond, after those players looked out to a sea of Richmond supporters ready to get behind them at the Elimination Final.

I don't get it.

 

[Cotcho]

Another thread searching for excuses when its plain and simple. Our game plan is too negative with an over emphasis on stoppages... we lack run because of they way we try an over posses the ball from stoppages..... we try and "find" a player backwards sideways using multiple handballs to players that are virtually stationaruy ... we take the easy option without taking the game on. Then we chip chip chip and because of slow ball movement we allow the opposition to build pressure on us and we turn it over.

I actually think the lack of run in our game plan and the way we play is slowly reducing our fitness base from the pre-season.

If Dimma isnt spending every minute of the break completely changing our mindset to be more attacking than he has learnt nothing from the season up til now. We must now go all out attack.... to get rid of this stupid negative crap we have dished out in the first 7 games.

Perhaps Nut, but we'v seen some big fadeouts from our boys in the last 2 seasons, the Elimination Final the most prominent IMO We are certainly far far from putting teams away in the last like Port are that's for sure. I guess the crux of this thread is, why aren't we ever the standard team putting away other average/good teams.

 

[nut]

Perhaps Nut, but we'v seen some big fadeouts from our boys in the last 2 seasons, the Elimination Final the most prominent IMO We are certainly far far from putting teams away in the last like Port are that's for sure. I guess the crux of this thread is, why aren't we ever the standard team putting away other average/good teams.

Because its the way we play. Not talent... not fitness....

 

[Stylo]

This is the kind of thing I feel would be better discussed at the end of the year, when we've got the whole season as evidence. Recent history shows that teams like Port who play fast attacking footy inevitably drop off at some point. I suspect our fitness guys went with a plan more focused on having us ready in the lead up to finals.

 

[tigs2010]

This is the kind of thing I feel would be better discussed at the end of the year, when we've got the whole season as evidence. Recent history shows that teams like Port who play fast attacking footy inevitably drop off at some point. I suspect our fitness guys went with a plan more focused on having us ready in the lead up to finals.

I think Cotcho is basing this on more than 7 games from a Richmond POV

 

[sante]

It's all in our head. Well the players . We have the talent and the whole "compromised drafts cost us" is bullshit. Every club was apart of those drafts and other clubs seemed to do okay out of them.

Port has the right a attitude and belief, we don't at the moment

 

[TigerImposter]

Out fitness injuries with lack of run and poor game plan are all dependent factors which from one event failing has lead to another
My biggest gripe with fitness has been ongoing Our players just fail to play four q of competitive footy and this is why we are gettable and oppo coaches tell their teams this
We are physically inept and when teams come at us then we add the lack of our mental toughness and leadership to the recipe
I believe our coaching staff have not addressed all of the above in 4.5 years otherwise we would have at least beaten Geelong or collingwod on one occasion
I still have my heart in my mouth when were 16 pts up with two minutes to go. What causes me to feel this way? Fitness ,leadership ,skills ,game plan ,coach tactics to close out game or all of above????

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

Clubs increase workloads at different times of the season to coincide when they believe players can afford to be a little off and when they needs players to be peaking. . I do have to agree with. nut shock horror , our training is not to blame for our seasons commencement it's the mindset of the players and lack of leg speed . Little point having fast delivery from the back half to only have TV to kick to in a one on one contest when he is so dismal once it hits the ground .

 

[nut]

Clubs increase workloads at different times of the season to coincide when they believe they can afford to be a little off and when they needs players to be peaking. . I do have agree with. nut shock horror , our training is not to blame for our seasons commencement it 'a the mindset of the players and lack of leg speed . Little point having fast delivery from the back half to only have TV to kick toto in a one on one contest when he is so dismal once it hits the ground .

only took you until round 7.... well done.

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

only took you until round 7.... well done.

No it only took you till round 7 to come up with something factual rather than your normal dribble of just trying to pot Dimma .

 

[theflea]

It's all in our head. Well the players . We have the talent and the whole "compromised drafts cost us" is bullshit. Every club was apart of those drafts and other clubs seemed to do okay out of them.

Port has the right a attitude and belief, we don't at the moment

Disagree every other club was in the same boat as the top clubs already had the talent but we didn't. On the thread topic, I would expect that all clubs would be similar in fitness work, its just that port have the luck that they have 10 players that can probly do a 15 beep. That's the challenge every other club will face. If you ask chris scott he thinks this idea of port is just bulldust.

 

[Cotcho]

Disagree every other club was in the same boat as the top clubs already had the talent but we didn't. On the thread topic, I would expect that all clubs would be similar in fitness work, its just that port have the luck that they have 10 players that can probly do a 15 beep. That's the challenge every other club will face. If you ask chris scott he thinks this idea of port is just bulldust.

Interesting if true. And if they win a flag it'l make for some read if they ever release their draft strategy.

 

[Nostradumbass]

Ive heard it said that we are an "emotional" team .

Right now we're in need of emotional rescue.

 

[NZ_Tiger]

Another thread searching for excuses when its plain and simple. Our game plan is too negative with an over emphasis on stoppages... we lack run because of they way we try an over posses the ball from stoppages..... we try and "find" a player backwards sideways using multiple handballs to players that are virtually stationaruy ... we take the easy option without taking the game on. Then we chip chip chip and because of slow ball movement we allow the opposition to build pressure on us and we turn it over.

I actually think the lack of run in our game plan and the way we play is slowly reducing our fitness base from the pre-season.

If Dimma isnt spending every minute of the break completely changing our mindset to be more attacking than he has learnt nothing from the season up til now. We must now go all out attack.... to get rid of this stupid negative crap we have dished out in the first 7 games.

Yep. Our high press stoppage game style is also extremely taxing.

I'm interested to see how Port go when it gets cold and the grounds become heavy.

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

I'm happy to wait until much later in the season when it comes to judging how fit nor unfit teams are,or whether it's advantageous or otherwise to be be seemingly super fit at the beginning of the year.
The one area that in my opinion we struggle is self belief.
I think you'll run harder,you'll move the ball faster and more decisively and make better decisions if you believe in yourself, your teammates or in the team.

 

[sante]

This is the kind of thing I feel would be better discussed at the end of the year, when we've got the whole season as evidence. Recent history shows that teams like Port who play fast attacking footy inevitably drop off at some point. I suspect our fitness guys went with a plan more focused on having us ready in the lead up to finals.

We might not be in the running by then

 

[sante]

whether it's advantageous or otherwise to be be seemingly super fit at the beginning of the year.

I'd say it is, means you can rest players later etc. Our aim was to start off the season with early wins, the club said so all pre season. We trained accordingly

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

I'd say it is, means you can rest players later etc. Our aim was to start off the season with early wins, the club said so all pre season. We trained accordingly

I'd say it is too provided it can be sustained.
It's always fascinated me the different ways teams approach seasons fitness wise.

 

[nut]

Yep. Our high press stoppage game style is also extremely taxing.

I'm interested to see how Port go when it gets cold and the grounds become heavy.

Would be interesting to see distance per Possession if thats possible. .... I think we would be closest to be the lowest distance per possession side in the comp.

 

[_RT_]

Another thread searching for excuses when its plain and simple. Our game plan is too negative with an over emphasis on stoppages... we lack run because of they way we try an over posses the ball from stoppages..... we try and "find" a player backwards sideways using multiple handballs to players that are virtually stationaruy ... we take the easy option without taking the game on. Then we chip chip chip and because of slow ball movement we allow the opposition to build pressure on us and we turn it over.

I actually think the lack of run in our game plan and the way we play is slowly reducing our fitness base from the pre-season.

If Dimma isnt spending every minute of the break completely changing our mindset to be more attacking than he has learnt nothing from the season up til now. We must now go all out attack.... to get rid of this stupid negative crap we have dished out in the first 7 games.

I'd suggest missing Deledio(our best run and carry player) and Rance(our best rebounding defender) for 4 weeks might have had something to do with the lack of run and carry for the first 6 weeks. Amazing when they returned in round 7 that we started to run and carry a lot more than we had.

 

[_RT_]

Would be interesting to see distance per Possession if thats possible. .... I think we would be closest to be the lowest distance per possession side in the comp.

You'd be surprised at just how little of a difference there is between us and Port.