Dog training

[Handyandy]

Re: Punishing sessions planned

Can anyone see a pattern developing here? I used to have a dog who would dig holes whenever I left him home alone. I would always give him a spanking and rub his nose in it, but as sure as the sun rises in the east and sets in the west, he would dig another hole when left alone. He was just a bastard of a dog. I am starting to think the same about our playing group. Nothing will change. Same story, different week.
Does anyone seriously think that suddenly flogging the players is the recipe for success. It smacks of desperation and a playing/ coaching group that has no idea.
Perhaps the answer to these rubbish performances is to cut some dead wood and try to be consistently professional.
Its a bit like the tough stuff they tried early in the season, one week tough with lots of reports, the next as soft as shite with no contested ball. From one extreme to another.
Im actually starting to think that this problem wont be resolved until we get rid of the coach and a core of dud players. By reappointing chocco the club has said to the players that the total shite they serve up is fine, when its fricking not.

 

[Steve Dore]

Re: Punishing sessions planned

... I used to have a dog who would dig holes whenever I left him home alone. I would always give him a spanking and rub his nose in it, but as sure as the sun rises in the east and sets in the west, he would dig another hole when left alone. He was just a bastard of a dog. .....

So you taught your dog to associate you coming home with getting a belting. No wonder he dug holes when he was left alone and bored. All he had to look forward to all day was you coming home and giving him a spanking

 

[Handyandy]

Re: Punishing sessions planned

So you taught your dog to associate you coming home with getting a belting. No wonder he dug holes when he was left alone and bored. All he had to look forward to all day was you coming home and giving him a spanking

Ohh derrrrrrrrrr

Rubbing the dogs nose in the hole associates the digging with the punishment (which was a very light tap on the bum followed by being ignored for an hour (the worst punishment)). Point is the punishment never broke the pattern of behaviour.

I will now ignore you, you are very tiresome.

 

[Steve Dore]

Re: Punishing sessions planned

Ohh derrrrrrrrrr ....

The fact that your method of training your dog failed miserably is testimony to its ineffectiveness. It says far more about you than the dog you accuse of being a "bastard of a dog".

The punishment never broke the pattern of behaviour because of the time lapse between the act of digging, ie the behaviour, and the punishment. Hopefully our players are more intelligent than dogs and are able to understand that the punishment is not for turning up at Grange beach at 6:00 am.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Re: Punishing sessions planned

Just to continue to run this thread OT, any reputable dog trainer or book will tell you dogs have an attention-span of about 2 seconds. Correct them in the act of what they're doing 'wrong' (and you have to face it, one of a dog's natural instincts is to dig) or all your doing is reinforcing whatever is happening immediately to the correction- as wharfie posted, for example, the owner coming home.

Clearly Port's players have an attention-span of at least a week, because they believe how well they played the week before transfers effortlessly into the next game.

 

[Handyandy]

Re: Punishing sessions planned

Just to continue to run this thread OT, any reputable dog trainer or book will tell you dogs have an attention-span of about 2 seconds. Correct them in the act of what they're doing 'wrong' (and you have to face it, one of a dog's natural instincts is to dig) or all your doing is reinforcing whatever is happening immediately to the correction- as wharfie posted, for example, the owner coming home.

Clearly Port's players have an attention-span of at least a week, because they believe how well they played the week before transfers effortlessly into the next game.

Oh dear, I thought this was a footy forum, not a dog training forum. I will have to be more careful with my analogies.

Due to overwhelming interest shown by ford and wharfie in my dogs and their welfare Ive decided to post a picture of them.

The massive black one is a 60kg retired cop dog (kodi, he was the hole digger, retired from the force at seven and took it pretty bad), the other is a very young dog who failed basic training (chomps, too aggressive for correctional services even). My housemate/ landlord was a professional dog trainer/ handler for the police/ correctional services. Im no dog training expert but he was and the punishment for digging holes was devised by him (it would be preferable to punish during the act but not imperative). These dogs are pretty smart, and comments about having a “two second memory” serve only to underline your gross ignorance on the subject (somebody who makes those sort of comments has clearly never owned a shepherd or had to train one). My dogs are so well trained that Ive never used a leash when I walk them. I would suggest they are better trained and have had a better life than 99.9% of dogs I know. A 60kg dog that knows it can bring down a fully grown man and rip his face off requires a higher level of training than one of those stupid yappy little dogs that’s locked in the yard forever.

The first time I went to spank the big one he gave me this look, reminded me of an episode of the simpsons when krusty went to hit sideshow reheem (a massive black dude who took over from sideshow bob) with a rubber mallet. krusty "the script says Im supposed to hit you with this"
sideshow reheem "i wouldnt".

Now I know what chocco must feel like with ‘armchair experts’ making sweeping, speculative, judgemental statements with only a part of the information on topics they have NFI about.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

And now I know what Williams must feel like when people make sweeping, speculative, judgemental statements based on what they think he said.

My comment on the two-second attention span comes from a personal discussion with a successful dog trainer/handler with over 30 years experience, and is supported by a number of texts from similarly qualified experts. So really, it's not my "gross ignorance" at all, but apparently that of a number of qualified people. It's a funny old interpretation that one can be called ignorant after making it clear a comment comes from a reasonable amount of research on a topic. Perhaps an oxymoron? But yes, the "any reputable" comment was a sweeping generalisation. I should've remembered another truism the dog handler told me - get 10 'dog experts' in a room and chances are you'll get 10 different opinions on how to handle a situation.

Anyway, that's neither here nor there, I was not trying to be presumptuous about how successful you are at caring for dogs, but just putting some of my learning and experience out there. It was not my intention to offend you.

 

[Steve Dore]

Re: Punishing sessions planned

.... Due to overwhelming interest shown by ford and wharfie in my dogs and their welfare Ive decided to post a picture of them. ...

Lovely looking dogs. I have always owned Shepherds myself.

....Now I know what chocco must feel like with ‘armchair experts’ making sweeping, speculative, judgemental statements with only a part of the information on topics they have NFI about.

Pot, kettle, black

 

[portentous]

Re: Punishing sessions planned

Get a labrador. Beautiful dogs. Most of them are smarter than footballers.