Recommitted Dustin Martin [re-signed]

[stevo75]

Just like you were saying before, that seems like an assumption.

Regardless 800k is still a lot to commit to a player who wants to leave yet Adelaide still held firm and Geelong buckled.



It doesn't look like grovelling at all, it looks a club weren't prepared to get completely shafted.

It won't max out Richmond's available cap because like Geelong did North would cave and enter trade talks for Martin because otherwise he'd be off to Brisbane and it wouldn't look good for North Melbourne to heavily commit to a player and then back out at the last second.

That is not a lot for a player of Dangerfields caliber. his market value was way higher at the time, and Adelaide's original offer was upwards of one million I believe or thereabouts, so they had plenty of room in the cap.

There's significant difference between the two situations. Richmond will not risk Dusty staying for the money rumored on offer for reasons already mentioned. It's just too much, and too much of a negative impact on culture.

It won't come down to "North caving". List managers aren't stupid, they know full well in this situation that Richmond wouldn't match. Richmond can flirt the idea around all they like, but come crunch time, they wouldn't do it. It's just too risky.

But like I said, it's a professional business, it won't come down to any of that. Dusty will nominate a club, said club will offer upwards of 1.2m, Richmond will not match, and receive first round compo and be happy.

 

[THE_GUN]

I see quite a few problems with this:

1) Why his club of choice is North Melbourne?
2) Why won't Richmond risk matching?

Should he choose to leave, it'll end up in the Dangerfield scenario and North will simply trade for him.

However I doubt he'll leave Richmond.

Looks like everybody can see it this way except north melbourne supporters.

Marley williams his best mate ................. You guys really don't know Dusty at all , There would be atleast 5 other guys that are infront of williams
Dusty is a competitive beast he wants to win games doesnt want to play in a losing team just to be with his mate.

 

[THE_GUN]

If Richmond decided to match, it wouldn't come down to psd, he'd just stay. Problem here is, Richmond don't want to be paying the amount of north's offer, which they inevitably would if they decided to match. Not to mention its way overs for a player already playing for your club. To make matters worse, they'd be paying all that money, for a player who essentially wants to play elsewhere. Not good on culture.

Once again, If Dusty wants to leave, Richmond will let him go, and they'll receive first round compo. That's it. Believe it. That's what happens.

This guy is funny, He must believe if he says the same thing over and over again that it will come true ..... What did you say ? Once again, If Dusty wants to leave, Richmond will let him go ....

You talk about keeping a player by over paying not being good for Culture , But your club will be paying a player coming from another club more than double you are paying your best player and captain - Thats looks fantastic for Culture

WOW - 250 post's and your already heading south with a rocket






















What did you say again ?? If Dusty wants to leave richmond will let home go and not match

 

[UpTheTigs]

Hahahahahahahahahaha Dusty isn't playing for North Melbourne. Close thread.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Marley williams his best mate ................. You guys really don't know Dusty at all , There would be atleast 5 other guys that are infront of williams.

Wow, is there any chance you can rank them in order from 1 to 6?

 

[stevo75]

This guy is funny, He must believe if he says the same thing over and over again that it will come true ..... What did you say ? Once again, If Dusty wants to leave, Richmond will let him go ....

You talk about keeping a player by over paying not being good for Culture , But your club will be paying a player coming from another club more than double you are paying your best player and captain - Thats looks fantastic for Culture

WOW - 250 post's and your already heading south with a rocket






















What did you say again ?? If Dusty wants to leave richmond will let home go and not match

I'll say it again, just for you

If Dusty wants to leave, Richmond will let him go, and they'll receive first round compo.

 

[Snake_Baker]

I'll say it again, just for you

If Dusty wants to leave, Richmond will let him go, and they'll receive first round compo.

Or nothing.

 

[Bad Seed]

North and St Kilda are minnow clubs who play in front of pathetic crowds every week. Dusty is worshipped by 70k members and plays on the big stage at the G every second week. If the money is right he ain't going nowhere. And if he does, it won't be to one of those minnow clubs.

 

[THE_GUN]

Wow, is there any chance you can rank them in order from 1 to 6?

I can actually

Marley is really not that close to him mate, They are friends but only through swan

 

[Topkent]

I'm not saying he will move I'm just saying it's a possibility. If you think Judd, Danger and Beams were all about homesickness you would have to be incredibly naive - but then, the fact you think there's no chance Dusty goes tells me that already. FYI the salary cap just went up by two million bucks and never to be repeated offers are very much on the table.

All 3 moved interstate then. Again point to me a single example where a superstar Victorian player moved to another?
You do realize Richmond have the extra 2 million as well mate? No chance of moving to North. No chance unless they offer 2 million for 10 years or something stupid which would cripple the club

 

[Ry009]

All 3 moved interstate then. Again point to me a single example where a superstar Victorian player moved to another?
You do realize Richmond have the extra 2 million as well mate? No chance of moving to North. No chance unless they offer 2 million for 10 years or something stupid which would cripple the club

Understand the angle you are getting at, but player movement is gradually picking up year by year, and it will eventually get to the stage of NRL/American sports where players will move a lot more freely. Free agency has already seen it progress from where it was 15-20 years ago and it will be a different landscape in another 15-20.

Martin will stay because Richmond can't afford to lose him and will match, but if they continue the upward trend they are on, it will be reduce their capacity for them to bring in another big name recruit in the future.

Hence the amount of our alleged offer, it's one that will make Richmond at least thinking a lot about their list management.

Days are gone where champions stay for reduced coin.

 

[Toadvine]

Understand the angle you are getting at, but player movement is gradually picking up year by year, and it will eventually get to the stage of NRL/American sports where players will move a lot more freely. Free agency has already seen it progress from where it was 15-20 years ago and it will be a different landscape in another 15-20.

Martin will stay because Richmond can't afford to lose him and will match, but if they continue the upward trend they are on, it will be reduce their capacity for them to bring in another big name recruit in the future.

Hence the amount of our alleged offer, it's one that will make Richmond at least thinking a lot about their list management.

Days are gone where champions stay for reduced coin.

I don’t agree with you, regarding the days of taking less coin to stay are gone. Grundy did that just last week. Plus it is extremely common in US sports (which is the direction you think we’re heading in). You only need to look as far as the Patriots to see Tom Brady accepting much below his market value and even take a pay cut to make sure his team stay in the hunt.

On the flipside, the Browns have the most salary cap space in the NFL yet none of the big names even consider them outside of trying to gain leverage over another team… sure SOME players go there but the best ones never even really think about signing with them.

I do think that we’ll see clubs matching offers/keeping players as is very common in American sports when they have the option. Players exercising their right to test the market and waiting until the post season (when they actually come out of contract) to sign will become much more common as well. The old “put off contract talks = leaving” will become a thing of the past.

 

[Ry009]

I don’t agree with you, regarding the days of taking less coin to stay are gone. Grundy did that just last week. Plus it is extremely common in US sports (which is the direction you think we’re heading in). You only need to look as far as the Patriots to see Tom Brady accepting much below his market value and even take a pay cut to make sure his team stay in the hunt.

On the flipside, the Browns have the most salary cap space in the NFL yet none of the big names even consider them outside of trying to gain leverage over another team… sure SOME players go there but the best ones never even really think about signing with them.

I do think that we’ll see clubs matching offers/keeping players as is very common in American sports when they have the option. Players exercising their right to test the market and waiting until the post season (when they actually come out of contract) to sign will become much more common as well. The old “put off contract talks = leaving” will become a thing of the past.

Is Grundy an A-Grader?, are Richmond at level you can see them at the level of sustained success that the Pats have had?

Take what you're saying on board, but don't think they are like for like scenarios.

Also, man my Philly Eagles, what a rough stretch. **** the 04 Pats

 

[Toadvine]

Is Grundy an A-Grader?, are Richmond at level you can see them at the level of sustained success that the Pats have had?

Take what you're saying on board, but don't think they are like for like scenarios.

Also, man my Philly Eagles, what a rough stretch. **** the 04 Pats

Oh I in no way think the Tiges are anything like the Pats haha. I was speaking more generally about "the days of staying for under are gone"

I think Grundy is an A-grader. At an under valued position though. Maybe Schache or Dylan Shiel are better examples? They definitely would have got more $ if they chose to return to Victoria.

Also, as a Ravens fan. We can truly bond over our hatred of the Pats!

 

[THE_GUN]

Looks like the North fans are really invested in Dusty and will be devastated when he signs and says - Nah thanks to north

Must be really depressing to be so invested in a player from another club,Perhaps consider supporting Richmond guys

 

[Snake_Baker]

Looks like the North fans are really invested in Dusty and will be devastated when he signs and says - Nah thanks to north

We're invested in so much as he would be a great addition to our list. Wouldn't that be the same for any other club?

Must be really depressing to be so invested in a player from another club,Perhaps consider supporting Richmond guys

There you go with the "invested" again. I'd like you to post a single link of a North supporter that is certain we will get him.

 

[THE_GUN]

We're invested in so much as he would be a great addition to our list. Wouldn't that be the same for any other club?



There you go with the "invested" again. I'd like you to post a single link of a North supporter that is certain we will get him.

But looks like your "Investment will only go as far as getting Dusty's friend lol

$2 million a year it would take for him to go to North = Thats a Big "INVESTMENT' by north

 

[tigerwill]

You're not quite up to speed on how things work.

Richmond can't make an offer based on driving up draft pick value

Richmond have the final offer and he stays or goes to the PSD:

Restricted free agents have the right to move to a club of their choice, subject to the current club’s right of first refusal over their services. That is, if the current club can ‘match’ the offer from a suitor club, the player must stay or enter the draft

http://www.afl.com.au/afl-hq/the-afl-explained/free-agency

When they mention"the player must stay or enter the draft". Where does it mention anything about the PSD?
I believe they are referring to the National Draft. Seeing it has to be the current years draft. Ie this ND is the 2017 ND. Whereas the PSD is the 2018 PSD.
The ND is a lottery, he would have to take his chances and end up with whoever picks him first. The PSD isn't an option where a player can just hold out for a particular club

 

[Snake_Baker]

When they mention"the player must stay or enter the draft". Where does it mention anything about the PSD?

In that link the word is in its generic form. It doesn't pertain to one draft or the other.

I believe they are referring to the National Draft. Seeing it has to be the current years draft. Ie this ND is the 2017 ND. Whereas the PSD is the 2018 PSD. The ND is a lottery, he would have to take his chances and end up with whoever picks him first.

Nup. It doesn't work like that mate.

If Martin accepted an offer from another club and Richmond did not match his offer he could freely move to the club of his choice and Richmond would receive and AFL compensation pick. If Richmond matched any final offer, and Martin still did not want to sign with Richmond, he becomes a delisted, uncontracted player and eligible to apply for the pre-season draft:

The AFL pre-season draft is the drafting of uncontracted players to teams in the Australian Football League. The draft is conducted after the national AFL draft and before the start of the next AFL season. It is conducted at the same time as the AFL rookie draft. The pre-season draft is a place for any uncontracted players to nominate that missed the AFL draft or who were delisted after the main draft.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AFL_pre-season_draft

The PSD isn't an option where a player can just hold out for a particular club

Possibly.

This depends on where his club of choice sits in the PSD rankings, and is also affected by the money on his head, and the willingness for clubs that were not first choice to match the offer. The Nick Stevens trade is a good example. However, this also requires Richmond, in this case, giving up a 1st round draft pick. I doubt they would be that stupid.

 

[tigerwill]

In that link the word is in its generic form. It doesn't pertain to one draft or the other.



Nup. It doesn't work like that mate.

If Martin accepted an offer from another club and Richmond did not match his offer he could freely move to the club of his choice and Richmond would receive and AFL compensation pick. If Richmond matched any final offer, and Martin still did not want to sign with Richmond, he becomes a delisted, uncontracted player and eligible to apply for the pre-season draft:

The AFL pre-season draft is the drafting of uncontracted players to teams in the Australian Football League. The draft is conducted after the national AFL draft and before the start of the next AFL season. It is conducted at the same time as the AFL rookie draft. The pre-season draft is a place for any uncontracted players to nominate that missed the AFL draft or who were delisted after the main draft.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AFL_pre-season_draft



Possibly.

This depends on where his club of choice sits in the PSD rankings, and is also affected by the money on his head, and the willingness for clubs that were not first choice to match the offer. The Nick Stevens trade is a good example. However, this also requires Richmond, in this case, giving up a 1st round draft pick. I doubt they would be that stupid.

Sorry about not multiquoting you back. But the reply will cover it

You're having a bit each way there.
He doesn't become a delisted FA. He may be uncontracted, but not delisted. Delisted, he wouldn't have to enter any draft, he could sign with whoever he likes. So he wouldn't need to enter any draft. So that makes your "delisted" and "PSD" comments irrelevant.

BUT.
The rules state the club can decline to match, then they get a compensation pick..in the ND
If a club matches, t he player can either accept and stay, or refuse and take his chance that the 2 clubs can agree on a trade. OR if those 2 clubs can't reach an agreement and he still decides to leave he goes into the ND. This I believe is the mechanism the afl have put in place so that any UFA can't just "walk" to the PSD. They still want club's to receive something for their player, otherwise they could have just said a player becomes a delisted FA.

That just doesn't make sense on so many levels.

The issue of the PSD is that with the advent of DFAs there really is no need for it, it's an outdated mechanism, there is even some talk of it being removed. The Wikipedia link you provided is pre FA coming in. Granted it's still there for the moment, but not for the purpose you're suggesting.
Once a RFA player accepts a contract offer under FA he comes under the rules that pertain to it. He has to go through that process and the rules that govern it.

I'm very confident there is no PSD option for RFA.

And unless a player had a toxic relationship with his club or coaches or team mates, or were made a godfather offer a club couldn't match, I doubt too many players would take that route. Which certainly isn't the case with Dusty.

The Nick Stevens case isnt relevant.Once again it was before FA rules changed the landscape. (Collingwood thought they'd bend Port over with a crap trade. Port bit the bullet and set an example for others. Even though that was costly to them, ultimately getting zero for him, but that's another topic) most club's have grown up a bit from where it was about pulling a swiftly over another club. Most clubs have a reasonable relationship when trading. Maybe hardline at times but that's trading. Usually it's a reasonably fair exchange. Some exceptions.

What are you talking about Richmond giving up a 1st round pick for? In a trade?If the club doesn't believe it to be an equitable trade of course they would. There's 1st rounders and 1st rounders, not all are the same value. ie Pick 1 might be considered, pick 18 or pick 23 (after academy/FS noms) certainly wouldn't

 

[Snake_Baker]

Sorry about not multiquoting you back. But the reply will cover it

You're having a bit each way there.
He doesn't become a delisted FA. He may be uncontracted, but not delisted. Delisted, he wouldn't have to enter any draft, he could sign with whoever he likes. So he wouldn't need to enter any draft. So that makes your "delisted" and "PSD" comments irrelevant.

How can he be "listed" if he isn't contracted?

A contract isn't fulfilled because a club offers one, it must be signed by the player party in order to be a contract.

I can understand your anguish about the situation, but what I posted is correct.

 

[Go Woods]

I can actually

View attachment 386051

Marley is really not that close to him mate, They are friends but only through swan

Hopefully Swanny is convincing him to join the Pies....

 

[stevo75]

Hopefully Swanny is convincing him to join the Pies....

Spent all their money on Greenwood and Wells

 

[THE_GUN]

How can he be "listed" if he isn't contracted?

A contract isn't fulfilled because a club offers one, it must be signed by the player party in order to be a contract.

I can understand your anguish about the situation, but what I posted is correct.

Snake looks to be extremely 'Invested' In Dusty - The Devastation will be too hard for you to fathom and you might just become a Richmond supporter with the amount of love you have for Dusty old boy

 

[THE_GUN]

Spent all their money on Greenwood and Wells

Mayne