Ebert

[mic59]

One thing that may hold Ebert back a bit in Choco's thinking is the spread of his possessions. Last year, in a few of his high possession games he would have in the last quarter the same number of possessions he had in the first three. Whether that will be viewed as a failing(inconsistent) or a plus(runs the game out) only time will tell. I can't see him in the first game, but after having spent one year on the list and been called interstate, albeit only in an emergency role, I am sure he will play 10-15 games.

 

[Portia]

I only saw Ebert playing the once last year, and it seemed to me that he played pretty unaccountable footy....which is fine, because he made it work in the SANFL, but Choco would be understandably leery of letting him try and do that at AFL level where the opposition players can actually keep up.

My argument would be that with Stevens gone, Ebert perfectly fills his role in Plan A, but certainly Choco might not see it that way. Being a Son Of himself, he might judge Brett a little harder.

 

[Macca19]

Originally posted by Porthos
I only saw Ebert playing the once last year, and it seemed to me that he played pretty unaccountable footy....which is fine, because he made it work in the SANFL, but Choco would be understandably leery of letting him try and do that at AFL level where the opposition players can actually keep up.

Im guessing that game was the Norwood epic at Alberton you went to? THat was Eberts 2nd game in the midfield for the year and as such didnt really get given an opponent as noone thought he would be a threat. Your right he was a bit unaccountable, but he was BOG and his opponenet didnt do a lot. The week after and each week after that he was given a tag which he subsequently destroyed each and every week for the rest of the year.

 

[ClintEastwood]

I think Porthos is saying the fitness of AFL players is a level above SANFL, and while Ebert might be able to break SANFL tags (esp. in last quarter), the AFL is a different story.

 

[Adrian Shelton]

Who knows, maybe all the taggers are a year older,slower and dumber! I like the kid, he'll do some good things this year

 

[portly]

My problem was that he seemed to spray his kicks under pressure, and they went too high in the air even though he kicks them very flat in training.

But he has improved markedly, and will no doubt do so again.

 

[Portia]

Originally posted by Macca19
Im guessing that game was the Norwood epic at Alberton you went to?

Yep.

THat was Eberts 2nd game in the midfield for the year and as such didnt really get given an opponent as noone thought he would be a threat. Your right he was a bit unaccountable, but he was BOG and his opponenet didnt do a lot. The week after and each week after that he was given a tag which he subsequently destroyed each and every week for the rest of the year.

Yep, and thats all cool, but I don't reckon Choco will have the same high estimation of that SANFL form. Because Brett has done it `easy' in the SANFL, being fairly unaccountable, he's probably more loathe to make him an option because its a) a big perceived jump and b) he wouldn't be able to use him as a tagger to break him in. Really, he's a lot like young Nick Stevens in that he is built to play one position and hasn't had to do a lot else.

There are a few reasonable reasons why Choco wouldn't have big plans for Ebert this year, but I still expect him to get games on the back of these injuries and no doubt others also.

 

[PJ Power]

The last player whom I can recall cruising to such SANFL dominance and blitzing the Magarey voting was back in 1992 - one Nathan Buckley. The competition was marginally stronger then but so too was the Magpie side he was playing in. I reckon Bucks might have turned 20 that year (he certainly was not a raw 18yr-old), which puts him a year older than Brett for the same achievement.

Gee, I don't know, but people here are talking about a kid like Cassisi playing a vital role in our midfield. If anyone kicks the ball up-and-down on the one spot it would be him, and he certainly does not get anywhere near the weight of possessions that Brett does. Everytime Dom takes a mark or free possession, his instinct is to look sideways....just the thing we are all so resentful of in our gameplan.

Talking about temporal spread of Brett's touches, I do agree that last quarter surges can be deceiving, but this wasn't always the case. I recall several games where he virtually went missing in the last ten minutes after turning on fireworks earlier.
One match which particularly highlighted his maturity and standing as a player of match-changing quality was against Westies at Richmolnd mid-season. He didn't have quite as many touches as usual (maybe 25ish) but he was extremely dangerous when he got the ball and showed an ability to mark inside of 50 and convert, something that Francou and Stevens have never had as part of their repertoire.

I am genuinely excited by this kid. His rate and degree of improvement are what impress me. 12 months ago you could have been excused for thinking that he was a sentimental pick-up as a father-son. Now he has just come off from being clearly the best player in the second best league in the land.

He has a star quality and if you're good enough, then let the opposition players defend against and chase you. We have enough defensive-minded midfielders to supply at least three other clubs. Let's inject some possession gathering and free-spirited brilliance into our pretty unimaginative midfield.

 

[PAfolwr]

Good post PJ.
What gets me is the way that people are so excited about Cooney, yet Ebert obviously had a much better year despite not being much older or much more experienced to start with.

Cooney is being talked about playing heaps of games this year and definitely all the pre-season cup matches and Round 1, whilst Ebert is being seen as perhaps a future something or other.

I have never seen Ebert play and Cooney only a couple of times on TV, but tell me if Ebert had been in this years draft how would he have gone?

 

[Portia]

Originally posted by PJ Power
Gee, I don't know, but people here are talking about a kid like Cassisi playing a vital role in our midfield. If anyone kicks the ball up-and-down on the one spot it would be him, and he certainly does not get anywhere near the weight of possessions that Brett does. Everytime Dom takes a mark or free possession, his instinct is to look sideways....just the thing we are all so resentful of in our gameplan.

Except when Francou does it. Cassisi is being mentioned because he plays a lot like a young Josh Francou, although it will obviously take him some time to get there. Until then he's still a useful player. Brett would be pretty hard to compare to Francou, I would've thought.

Originally posted by PAfolwr
I have never seen Ebert play and Cooney only a couple of times on TV, but tell me if Ebert had been in this years draft how would he have gone?

Thats a dodgy question, because its usually used as a way to talk up a guy who's had the advantage of AFL training and an opportunity (remember Crows supporters theorizing about Mattner being worth a first round or second round pick last offseason?)

For what its worth, no one drafted Brett in his first draft, and we picked him up in his second. In draft terms, Brett is two years ahead of Cooney and has probably displayed less versatility in roles he can perform. If for some reason he was delisted....he might've gone to Sydney at #16 instead of Willoughby. Maybe.

 

[Sandola]

Originally posted by PAfolwr

...Cooney is being talked about playing heaps of games this year and definitely all the pre-season cup matches and Round 1, whilst Ebert is being seen as perhaps a future something or other....

Wouldn't this have to do with the relative quality of the two sides Cooney and Ebert are coming into?

Or is it just that Cooney's in Melbourne?

 

[Portia]

Originally posted by Sandola
Wouldn't this have to do with the relative quality of the two sides Cooney and Ebert are coming into?

Or is it just that Cooney's in Melbourne?

Well, there's that too.

Same as how the post-draft stories always talk about how its a tragedy that 18 year old Victorians have to go interstate, but their counterparts travelling from SA or WA are really lucky and looking forward to going to Melbourne. This is despite both kids spouting nothing but the usual identical cliches.

The only time there's a counterpart is when they want to take another potshot at their own local paupers like the Dogs or Roos by implying homesick draftees.

 

[PAfolwr]

Originally posted by Porthos
...Thats a dodgy question, because its usually used as a way to talk up a guy who's had the advantage of AFL training and an opportunity (remember Crows supporters theorizing about Mattner being worth a first round or second round pick last offseason?)...

100% agree, and not having seen him play that is the main reason for asking the question.
How good is his Magary medal win, at such a young age, as an indicator of worth?

Originally posted by Porthos
...For what its worth, no one drafted Brett in his first draft, and we picked him up in his second. In draft terms, Brett is two years ahead of Cooney and has probably displayed less versatility in roles he can perform. If for some reason he was delisted....he might've gone to Sydney at #16 instead of Willoughby. Maybe.

The versatility part is the bit I have absolutely no idea about. When I saw Cooney play in the SANFL finals he didn't play that well, but he had that confidence/arrogance that is usually a good sign.

 

[PAfolwr]

Originally posted by Porthos
...For what its worth, no one drafted Brett in his first draft, and we picked him up in his second. In draft terms, Brett is two years ahead of Cooney and has probably displayed less versatility in roles he can perform. If for some reason he was delisted....he might've gone to Sydney at #16 instead of Willoughby. Maybe.

Come to think about it, Pavlich got passed up his first time round.
Perhaps the father-son rule saved us this time.

 

[mic59]

Originally posted by PAfolwr
Come to think about it, Pavlich got passed up his first time round. Perhaps the father-son rule saved us this time.

First time round Pavlich was 17 and with the one 17-yr-old rule only had 16 chances to be picked up, so that part of the draft's always a bit of a raffle. Brett could have been taken in his first draft but wasn't, not that there was much in the way of SANFL form to go on. Before 2003 he still hadn't shown all that much but I'd have expected him to go if we hadn't claimed him under father-son. Which would have prevented a bit of history, a father and a son both winning Magareys.

 

[portsmouth]

I'd rather have SOG any day..