But why, the whole point of living in a free and democratic country is the right to protest. Do you want to take that right away?
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Flag Burning
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But why, the whole point of living in a free and democratic country is the right to protest. Do you want to take that right away?
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I didn't say it was unique, I think it's pretty bland. But it still dosen't make me think of it any differently. That monarchist story doesn't suprise me at all.
I know that. I was trying to say that the whole flag dosen't represent our english past just because of the union jack, if you know what I mean.
The union jack, shouldn't be there though, right? And it's position is a dominate position on a flag.
Depends on your viewpoint. The aborigines would view it differently I guess. What exactly is the Australian "way of life" I hear so much about?
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Perhaps a little time in the USA would do the same. The Land of the Free, my arse.
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I don't agree that burning the flag is a terribly effective or intelligent way to voice your concerns. Personally, I dislike the action and wouldn't consider it myself yet firmly believe that if someone wishes to protest in this way, it is their right. It's a muddled democracy some people here are prescribing to, 'Australia's a free country, if you don't like here, move to Iraq!' WTF!?
One of the great things about Australia is that it is a democracy and as such people are allowed to voice their own opinions, views or concerns without the fear of retaliation or punishment. A great many countries in this world unfortunately do not allow their citizens such freedom.
This flag burning issue is similar to a courageous stand a US college basketballer is taking by turning her back to the US flag as the anthem is played before games due to her disillusionment at the current stage of America, she's copping a lot of flak for it too as can be expected.
That's democracy, people may say or do things which many dislike though provided they do not endanger or hurt others in doing so, should be allowed to.
One of the great things about Australia is that it is a democracy and as such people are allowed to voice their own opinions, views or concerns without the fear of retaliation or punishment. A great many countries in this world unfortunately do not allow their citizens such freedom.
This flag burning issue is similar to a courageous stand a US college basketballer is taking by turning her back to the US flag as the anthem is played before games due to her disillusionment at the current stage of America, she's copping a lot of flak for it too as can be expected.
That's democracy, people may say or do things which many dislike though provided they do not endanger or hurt others in doing so, should be allowed to.
Mobbs
A Large Portion, Yes
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Turning your back on the flag is one thing.
Burning it is quite another.
Burning it is quite another.
I disagree both are actions showing your disgust at what your country is doing under that flag & showing there disapproval by rejecting the flag, just one is a bit more radical.
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"If you want a symbolic gesture, don't burn the flag; wash it."
-Norman Thomas
Maybe it be more effective if the protestors wash it instead of burning it
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The ultimate purpose of symbols is for them to be hit with drumsticks.
Symbols are a literary concoction, they are not real. You are all just a bunch of frustrated Jungians. GET real. If you think symbols are important tell it to the families of Australian soldiers, sailors and airmen who are going to be killed in this war.
It would also be an interesting exercise to peddle the sanctity of the flag to the mental cripples who come home from this war. This assumes these people are capable of any sentient activity, after their exposure to chemicals and to the horrors YOU are foisting upon them.
Fact is you'd probably succeed with the veterans of this war. If they're dumb enough to go, they'd certainly be dumb enough to listen to your flapdoodle.
If everyone decided not to go, there would be no war. Praise be the really dumb f*cks. If it weren't for them the advocates of war on this board would have to make a decision which might involve them sitting somewhere else other than in front of a computer.
When are you all enlisting?
Symbols are a literary concoction, they are not real. You are all just a bunch of frustrated Jungians. GET real. If you think symbols are important tell it to the families of Australian soldiers, sailors and airmen who are going to be killed in this war.
It would also be an interesting exercise to peddle the sanctity of the flag to the mental cripples who come home from this war. This assumes these people are capable of any sentient activity, after their exposure to chemicals and to the horrors YOU are foisting upon them.
Fact is you'd probably succeed with the veterans of this war. If they're dumb enough to go, they'd certainly be dumb enough to listen to your flapdoodle.
If everyone decided not to go, there would be no war. Praise be the really dumb f*cks. If it weren't for them the advocates of war on this board would have to make a decision which might involve them sitting somewhere else other than in front of a computer.
When are you all enlisting?
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At least they are out there sacrifising themselves in the thick of things where soft bastards like you are sitting at home on your moral high chair criticising away...
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Originally posted by myee8
At least they are out there sacrifising themselves in the thick of things where soft bastards like you are sitting at home on your moral high chair criticising away...
Speaking of thick things. When are you enlisting Myee? You will be entitled to adopt a morally superior attitude when you've done so. So, you think sitting behind a computer is sacrificing oneself?
Thanks for addressing the points I raised in such a succinct manner. No mention at all is fairly succinct.
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Originally posted by Fred
Just like Suzie?
Indeed!
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Originally posted by Sydneyfan
"If you want a symbolic gesture, don't burn the flag; wash it."
-Norman Thomas
Maybe it be more effective if the protestors wash it instead of burning it
The feminists would have to protest with them for that job.
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What's the point of burning the flag? Just serves to give pollies devoid of any new ideas something to complain about(remember George Bush and his draft constitutional amendment?). Would have been more to the point to burn Howard in effigy.
But to the point of this thread, if it has one, who cares? So he was an angry young man, so he did something that people may object to. He'll probably look back on this and he won't be proud but please don't suggest we should make it a crime to express your thoughts in whatever way you see fit. Countries who have passed laws such as that are exactly the type of countries we are against.
But to the point of this thread, if it has one, who cares? So he was an angry young man, so he did something that people may object to. He'll probably look back on this and he won't be proud but please don't suggest we should make it a crime to express your thoughts in whatever way you see fit. Countries who have passed laws such as that are exactly the type of countries we are against.
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Once i finish uni fool. The families are well aware of the sacrifice their children and relatives have to make, compared to people who just hold banners and holler and protest in the streets.
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Congratulations Myee, you have done something nobody in the media has been able to do in my memory. That is point up an example of really begging the question. The point I'm making is that if people refuse to go and fight in this stupid war, there won't be any distraught relatives or children who HAVE to make sacrifices. There IS no overweaning compulsion to be involved.
People who hold banners and protest enjoy more respect from me than people who mindlessly succumb to incompetent PR from the most dangerous man on earth and his yapping yea-saying acolyte. John Howard, the man whose time should never have come.
It surprises me that you wouldn't postpone your studies if you are so committed to being able to kill Arabs, Iraqis or just anyone who wears a towel on their head, or just happens to upset Mr Less-Than-Fifty percent of 39% of Yanks. The level of passion you display for Bush's cause should surely have left you with no alternative but to join up immediately. Or are you hoping it will be all over by the time you finish uni.? Never fear, Iran and North Korea are next cabs off the rank. There will be enough murders to go round for at least twenty years. You are aligning yourself with a certifiable madman and his lapdog. I think you're better than that.
Why only "in effigy"?
Just burn him.
I can't believe all this hysterical brouhaha over a piece of rag.
It's the height of hypocrisy for any God-fearing blue-eyed capitalist to complain about someone burning a flag.
If you truly believe in our apple-pie free-enterprise system and the concept of private property, then you've got to agree that if I go to a shop and BUY an Australian flag with MY money, then I've got the RIGHT to burn it.
Argue against that, you pack of whingeing jingoists ...
GO ON !
Argue against that !
You can't can you?
Because there is NO VALID ARGUMENT against what I've said.
SO GET OVER IT
And find something a bit more important to get upset over ...
... like innocent people dying, maybe.
It's the height of hypocrisy for any God-fearing blue-eyed capitalist to complain about someone burning a flag.
If you truly believe in our apple-pie free-enterprise system and the concept of private property, then you've got to agree that if I go to a shop and BUY an Australian flag with MY money, then I've got the RIGHT to burn it.
Argue against that, you pack of whingeing jingoists ...
GO ON !
Argue against that !
You can't can you?
Because there is NO VALID ARGUMENT against what I've said.
SO GET OVER IT
And find something a bit more important to get upset over ...
... like innocent people dying, maybe.
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For starter, i never said i wanted to kill "anyone who wears a towel on their head" as you so put it. This to me suggests i a racists and just want to kill all those types, which isn't the case. I am not racist as i am friends with a Sikh person, one who wears a towell over their head. I mean why do the muslim and islam people always say America, Britain and Australia is against muslims? I thought it was Iraqis and al-qaeda people the coalition is willing, yet people are not thinking this.
With your point about refusing to fight, isn't this a democratic country, hence you are allowed to now fight if you choose? Or is it a case of having to fight when you are told. I thought it was the former, leading to my conclusion that these soldiers are choosing to fight.