Football club finances / FFP

[SM]

Not in the EFL we haven't. We can't have, those accounts don't close until this financial year. That is literally the whole point. They're going off projections before any figures are finalised for the financial year.

So why did they sign off a whole lot of transfers for us before the start of this season if we were in such trouble? Clearly they weren't paying attention while ratifying the Winks deal for instance. So they've agreed with them and then months later realised they shouldn't have? Sounds like they're not really on top of things...

If you think that you can't be over the threshold until a set of accounts comes out this year then surely you're arguing that you can't be in breach for another 2 years? They measure this stuff over a 3 year rolling period.. If you're already significantly over after 2 of those 3 years, of course the league is going to say "You need to be turning a profit of xm in the third year in order to be compliant, therefore you need to meet these thresholds before you can buy players". That's just common sense.

Because you hadn't submitted the accounts for last year and so at that point were presumably compliant? Didn't you make a massive loss in the last set of accounts?

 

[Jatz]

If you think that you can't be over the threshold until a set of accounts comes out this year then surely you're arguing that you can't be in breach for another 2 years? They measure this stuff over a 3 year rolling period.. If you're already significantly over after 2 of those 3 years, of course the league is going to say "You need to be turning a profit of xm in the third year in order to be compliant, therefore you need to meet these thresholds before you can buy players". That's just common sense.

Because you hadn't submitted the accounts for last year and so at that point were presumably compliant? Didn't you make a massive loss in the last set of accounts?

It is. However until that year is finalised, how can they possibly know whether we'll turn a profit or not? Dewsbury Hall could go before June 30 and then all of a sudden there's another 30m there to help balance the books.

Trying to proactively punish clubs before a breach takes place is wrong. There was a breach for our season in the PL, we'll cop a whack for that. There may well yet be a breach in the EFL from this season but they'll have to wait before they can do anything about that.

 

[SM]

It is. However until that year is finalised, how can they possibly know whether we'll turn a profit or not? Dewsbury Hall could go before June 30 and then all of a sudden there's another 30m there to help balance the books.

Trying to proactively punish clubs before a breach takes place is wrong. There was a breach for our season in the PL, we'll cop a whack for that. There may well yet be a breach in the EFL from this season but they'll have to wait before they can do anything about that.

They know because they are the ones approving your transfer spend.

It's not proactively punishing, it's ensuring clubs stay within the guidelines. As I said, it's why we have to get transfers ticked off even though we aren't near the limit, it's to ensure clubs stay within the limits as they go so that they don't need to then retrospectively punish them after the damage is done. The EFL wasn't proposing a points penalty for you based on the PL breach, they were just saying that in order to make signings, you needed to sell players to fall under what would have been your three year threshold.

 

[moomba]

Main concern I have is that this will affect the ability of clubs to compete with the likes of Madrid etc for players.

Initially I thought it was just transfers but if wages, amortisation and transfer fees are a part of it, English clubs will fall behind.

And it doesn't really address the issue of competitiveness within the league, as theres still a spending limit of a % (85%?) Of revenue. Top clubs will still spend way more than the rest. And a club like Villa that's about to get a champions league windfall, won't be able to spend that windfall improving the club to compete at that level.

So it's still a barrier to clubs lifting themselves and competing with the established elite.

Just what the designers of the rules wanted I expect.

 

[Magma]

i personally dont mind a spending cap, think it's something that many have wanted in some way shape or form previously. am interested to see the specifics and to whether it will actually bring the competition closer or if it's just attempting to look like they're doing something

 

[Jatz]

There is zero chance it brings the competition closer together. There’s no chance the big clubs will put up with that.

 

[moomba]

If the rules were in place this year, clubs would be able to spend a max on £501.5m on wages, amortisation and agent fees.

Apparently there is also a limit of spending on wages, amortisation and transfer fees of 70% of total revenue for clubs in Europe and 85% for clubs that aren't.

Looking at last year's revenues, there isn't any club that would be able to spend as much as £501.5m anyway.

Suspect it might hurt us and Chelsea next season when the club world cup money rolls in.

 

[SM]

If the rules were in place this year, clubs would be able to spend a max on £501.5m on wages, amortisation and agent fees.

Apparently there is also a limit of spending on wages, amortisation and transfer fees of 70% of total revenue for clubs in Europe and 85% for clubs that aren't.

Looking at last year's revenues, there isn't any club that would be able to spend as much as £501.5m anyway.

Suspect it might hurt us and Chelsea next season when the club world cup money rolls in.

So who's complaining?

 

[99 Problems]

Main concern I have is that this will affect the ability of clubs to compete with the likes of Madrid etc for players.

Initially I thought it was just transfers but if wages, amortisation and transfer fees are a part of it, English clubs will fall behind.

And it doesn't really address the issue of competitiveness within the league, as theres still a spending limit of a % (85%?) Of revenue. Top clubs will still spend way more than the rest. And a club like Villa that's about to get a champions league windfall, won't be able to spend that windfall improving the club to compete at that level.

So it's still a barrier to clubs lifting themselves and competing with the established elite.

Just what the designers of the rules wanted I expect.

It’s not really clubs like Madrid though is it? It’s just Madrid. And maybe Barca if they got things together. Even without a spending cap have premier league teams really competed with Madrid anyway? It still feels like they get the signings they want. They got Bellingham, they’ll get Mbappe.

The fact the premier league is so far ahead of the rest of Europe financially is the exact reason the clubs will be willing to do something like this.

 

[moomba]

So who's complaining?

I don't know. Who is?

 

[SM]

I don't know. Who is?

You could have fooled me.

 

[moomba]

You could have fooled me.

When you're so desperate to nitpick it's quite easy to confuse yourself.

 

[SM]

When you're so desperate to nitpick it's quite easy to confuse yourself.

So you aren't complaining about the new regulations? Great news.

 

[Zidane98]

So you aren't complaining about the new regulations? Great news.

Ironic some switch their concerns to competing with Real when spending caps for the whole PL are proposed.

Some people just want their club to be able to spend whatever it likes with no regard for sustainability.

 

[moomba]

So you aren't complaining about the new regulations? Great news.

No, don't have a problem with the anchoring, although as I said before you started nitpicking and trying to catch me out, the devil will be in the detail.

And I do have some concerns about the effects it will have on the competitiveness of English clubs in Europe. But that remains to be seen.

Not sure why it's great news or even good news. It's just my thoughts, and ultimately meaningless.

 

[SM]

No, don't have a problem with the anchoring, although as I said before you started nitpicking and trying to catch me out, the devil will be in the detail.

And I do have some concerns about the effects it will have on the competitiveness of English clubs in Europe. But that remains to be seen.

Not sure why it's great news or even good news. It's just my thoughts, and ultimately meaningless.

Fantastic.

 

[moomba]

Ironic some switch their concerns to competing with Real when spending caps for the whole PL are proposed.

Some people just want their club to be able to spend whatever it likes with no regard for sustainability.

Must have said over a hundred times here that I think some form of financial regulation is a good thing. But regulation that stops a club from spending what its rivals can spend is flawed.

And have said many times that I don't have a problem in principal with salary caps (as long as everyone is subject to cap), just a concern.

So my position hasn't really changed at all.

 

[moomba]

Fantastic.

LOL

 

[RossFC]

Footyinsider reporting that Man City if found guilty will likely be fined a hefty fee, and the maximum punishment will be relegation to the Championship, instead of completely out of the football league like some predict.

 

[Jatz]

Footyinsider reporting that Man City if found guilty will likely be fined a hefty fee, and the maximum punishment will be relegation to the Championship, instead of completely out of the football league like some predict.

Imagine City in the Championship

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Imagine City in the Championship

You must have a short memory.

 

[Jatz]

You must have a short memory.

I mean in their current iteration.

 

[moomba]

Footyinsider reporting that Man City if found guilty will likely be fined a hefty fee, and the maximum punishment will be relegation to the Championship, instead of completely out of the football league like some predict.

Seen a dozen articles like this in the last month. All with different guesses as to what the punishment might be.

I guess it gets clicks.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Imagine City in the Championship

Leicester are there and are just coming up

 

[Zidane98]

Imagine City in the Championship

Hull are already there?