Gardiner.

[Nardz]

Discuss.

 

[Hadders]

this is what I posted in another thread:

I might be on my own here but I would be very reluctant to get Gardiner to the club. I know that we desperately need a ruckman to support Big Josh but Gardiner?

He was a good player before all his injury problems and since he's come back he hasn't really shown that he still has a lot to offer. Plus theres also his questionable attitude and character. It's well documented that football hasn't always been his first priority through his career and he has only recently returned from a club imposed suspension. As for his character we have a lot of promising youngsters coming through at Collingwood and a person such as Gardiner could possibly lead one or more of them astray.

Now I know he has potential but I don't want to give up a high draft pick or decent player to get a broken down ruckman who is going to be of limited value. Overall get him if we can cheap otherwise target a young ruckman like a Maric that has the potential to become a champion ruckman rather than a guy who may be serviceable but will never again get back to playing his best footy.

 

[dids4]

get him.

give him one chance, and one chance only.

pay him minimum wage.

the end.

 

[G.O.B]

Listen, no one subscribes to the old adage that all that matters is winning more than me, but what sort of message would it send to our playing group, especially the youngsters if we were to recruit this idiot.
What about our stance on Chad and his little indescretion? Does it matter that Gardiner's offences would have been comitted at another club. I think not.
What stance would the club be able to take on other players that bring shame on the club after we have recruited one of the most irresponsible and ill disciplined players in the league?
As earlier stated, it's not like Gardiner's best football awaits him even if we were to turn his career around.
There are other options out there even though on face value they may not seem as attractive.
Collingwood.........stay the f**k away please.

 

[Nardz]

in the end of the day maybe he just needs the right change of environment to set himself straight. barry hall did it, peter everitt did it.

when was the last time a collingwood player recieved an internal suspension? i think mick is good at instilling discipline.

 

[bren_gc]

If he was committed to changing his ways I would pick him up in the PSD or a late draft pick, nothing more, and pay him minimum wage or close to it. I would still prefer to pick up a Maric type from another club though.

 

[Palmer Stoat]

If we could get him for nothing in the PSD, you'd consider it. I definitely wouldn't be giving up anything for someone of his age, injury record, and character, though.

 

[Murray]

Jonothan Ross

 

[King Woodie]

There is NO WAY that we will get Gardiner. His latest indiscretion with a drink driving offense will rule him out due to our major sponsor (TAC).

WOuldn't mind having him if at the right price, but wouldn't expect he will be at Lexus next year.

Stkilda and Sydney would do everything to get him...

 

[Tony Francis]

There is NO WAY that we will get Gardiner. His latest indiscretion with a drink driving offense will rule him out due to our major sponsor (TAC).

WOuldn't mind having him if at the right price, but wouldn't expect he will be at Lexus next year.

Stkilda and Sydney would do everything to get him...

Well said King Woodie, two very good points.

I would be happy to pick him up in the PSD with pick 9-12 or whatever we get, I think he would be worth that price and a $200k salary. But I doubt he will slip through that far with St Kilda desperate for a ruckman too, I could see them using a 2nd or 3rd round pick because their time is slipping away.

 

[Coin_Toss]

get him.

give him one chance, and one chance only.

pay him minimum wage.

the end.

What he said.

 

[MarkT]

Jonothan Ross

All men are not created equal. Gardiner can play. The question is can his knee and his brain get fit?

Anyway, I'll see your Ross and raise you a Pike.

 

[MarkT]

Stkilda and Sydney would do everything to get him...

Saints have an age and a character test that they have supposedly built the club turnaround on. I can’t see GT taking Gardiner. Ordinarily I couldn’t see MM doing it either and I highly doubt he will but he does have a history with Gardiner and he might have an idea how to unlock him or a relationship that could help him.

As for TAC, if they have any say in who we recruit we HAVE to dump them. If sponsorships impinge list maintenance we have to go with being a footy club over being a business and if this was the reason for not taking a player that could help us win a premiership then I for one want the board removed for inappropriate priorities.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I cant see what else the Eagles could have done for him this year and he still let them down.

Avoid at all costs.

 

[Madd Matt]

I think the big issue, which has been raised, is the fact that we are sponsored by TAC, and to pick up such a publicly disgraced player for driving indiscretions could cause a problem. MarkT, I'm not saying they should dictate who we pick up, and technically we can argue that he didn't do those things under Malthouse, and while at Collingwood, but we should be taking it into consideration to a degree, surely. I agree that people need fresh starts, and moving interstate can work wonders (Lockett, Pike, Hall), but this specific case is different, and we should not be getting him for those reasons. And, he's 27 already, with quite a few injuries piled up.

Yes, we need a ruckman, but surely he's not the only solution. He'd actually be just a stop-gap until we get Richards/Fanning/Cloke developed into our 'new' number one option.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

As for TAC, if they have any say in who we recruit we HAVE to dump them. .

Nice theory but are we going to take a moral stand over a person like Michael Gardiner? Why would we do that?

 

[King Woodie]

Therefore it comes down to cost still

If we get him he will cost us

A) a second round draft pick in the NATIONAL draft
B) 250K at least salary
C) A multi million dollar sponsorship with the TAC.

The question is, can he deliver us the premiership?

I would argue that our MAIN deficiencies (and therefore recruiting priorities) lie elsewhere.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

The question is, can he deliver us the premiership?

His performance in the 2005 Grand final would suggest the answer is NO.

 

[Murray]

All men are not created equal. Gardiner can play. The question is can his knee and his brain get fit?

Anyway, I'll see your Ross and raise you a Pike.

mmm do I fold or raise with a Zantuck?

 

[Jabso]

His performance in the 2005 Grand final would suggest the answer is NO.

That was Gardiner the forward.
Gardiner the ruckman, sharing the load with Fraser, may be different. We can nurse him through games wtih Fraser getting a fair chunk of time in the ruck.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

That was Gardiner the forward.
Gardiner the ruckman, sharing the load with Fraser, may be different. We can nurse him through games wtih Fraser getting a fair chunk of time in the ruck.

Ball was nearly best on ground. Gardiner was not used in the ruck because he wasnt up to it. He's washed up on the field as well as off it.

 

[Jabso]

Ball was nearly best on ground. Gardiner was not used in the ruck because he wasnt up to it. He's washed up on the field as well as off it.

Cox was much better. Add to that Seaby was used as backup. Gardiner was lost up forward.

 

[MarkT]

Nice theory but are we going to take a moral stand over a person like Michael Gardiner? Why would we do that?

Probably not but my point is that we need to make list assessments on football matters and the only relevant criteria should be whether Gardiner upsets the team and upends team disciplines etc. The moral stand would the one taken by TAC if indeed they took that stance which as yet is unknown.

 

[MarkT]

mmm do I fold or raise with a Zantuck?

Given we have 1 flag in your life and mine you can raise with anyone you like. 1 flag success is worth a number of relatively cheap trade failures. Hell we’ve taken less effective players that are probably good blokes almost every year we’ve done a trade or used the PSD. The point is you make the character assessment prospectively not retrospectively and even then it’s a balance of the good with the bad. I don’t doubt Gardiner is a risk. I also don’t doubt we can’t win a flag without risk. Had we taken a risk on Everitt the first time the Saints floated him on the market we might have won a flag. IMO it is likely we would have won in 2002. 2003 who knows. A lot would have been different from round 1 to the GF had we even made it that far given a hangover possibility or whatever else may have worked out differently. At least had we made it and played Brisbane they wouldn’t have set the agenda for the game in the ruck like they did.

 

[Nardz]

has gardiner ever played under malthouse? west coast website says he was drafted in 1996 so i'd say theres a good chance that could have something to do with any decision we make on him. Malthouse occasionally likes to pick up his former disciples.

Lets not forget he is stil a good ruckman. in only 3 games this year he has averaged 17 hitouts with limited game time. Fraser has averaged 13. We'd be crazy to not at least think about it..