Remove this Banner Ad

Happy Australia day everyone

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

jmac70 said:
A Victorian treaty is currently being worked on. Once it is signed we can make that our day of reconciliation and get rid of Jan 26.
Click to expand...
A treaty, are we at war? The Country is called Australia, not Victoria. The whole country needs to change the date, not just Victoria
 
manicpie said:
Wouldn't that cause even more division throughout Australia? All that would achieve is extra girth around the head of a real Murderer in Dan Andrews. Responsible for the death of thousands of Victorians as a result of his Hotel Fiasco. Lied in front of the whole of Australia and denied everything. This is the idiot you are hoping that will change the day for Victorians. If the rest of australia isn't changing the day then I will still be celebrating the 26th as Australia day. One in, all in
Click to expand...

Couldn't think of a more divisive day than Jan 26, not sure how a different day could be even more divisive.

A lot of people here --including those in favour of the current national day-- have been non-committal about Jan 26. I don't think it'd be too much of a fuss, except among a right-wing rump.

It should be emphasised, Jan 26 has only been a national holiday in recent times, so it ditching the holiday won't be doing away with long-held tradition.

Not sure why anyone would be hung up about whatever date other States decide to have a holiday, maybe you can explain that one.

As for your rant about Andrews, the issue pre-dates Dan and it will survive him. In short, Dan might be the agent of change but it wouldn't be about him.

All hypothetical. There is no treaty as yet, quite a way to go.

I see that you're contesting the need for a treaty in another post. Fair enough, but if you have any portion of goodwill towards the First Australians then I recommend you have a look at what a treaty might actually achieve.
 
JB1975 said:
Reckon this is a distinct possibility, Victoria goes its own way and ditches Jan 26.

Jan 26 wasn't always a national holiday, States did their own thing, and Victoria's move would likely set a precedent for others to follow.
Click to expand...
manicpie said:
Wouldn't that cause even more division throughout Australia? All that would achieve is extra girth around the head of a real Murderer in Dan Andrews. Responsible for the death of thousands of Victorians as a result of his Hotel Fiasco. Lied in front of the whole of Australia and denied everything. This is the idiot you are hoping that will change the day for Victorians. If the rest of australia isn't changing the day then I will still be celebrating the 26th as Australia day. One in, all in
Click to expand...
Without going so far as to agree that Andrews is a murderer, I have seen enough over the last 12 months to voice strong opposition to the idea of states setting their own political agenda. We are a country not a bunch of states all pulling in different directions.
 
jmac70 said:
A Victorian treaty is currently being worked on. Once it is signed we can make that our day of reconciliation and get rid of Jan 26.
Click to expand...
What are the details of the treaty? What's it say, give and do to the respective parties?
 

Log in to remove this Banner Ad

TheGreatGrundy said:
Without going so far as to agree that Andrews is a murderer, I have seen enough over the last 12 months to voice strong opposition to the idea of states setting their own political agenda. We are a country not a bunch of states all pulling in different directions.
Click to expand...

I hear what you're saying, and I think that the last 12 months has shown some unfortunate tendencies, but public holidays (including Australia Day) have been varied between States in the past and I don't see any reason why that can't happen again.

We might be a country, but we're also a federation of States born from a collection of colonies, and I'm not sure that a public holiday should be a cause to doubt the independence of States.

In relation to everything, States have always had and always will have different agendas. Most times I'm happy to see the Commonwealth prevail, but on many things (euthanasia, abortion laws etc etc) I remain happy to see States go their own way.
 
manicpie said:
A treaty, are we at war? The Country is called Australia, not Victoria. The whole country needs to change the date, not just Victoria
Click to expand...
It’s happening, and has been public knowledge for quite some time.
 
manicpie said:
Wouldn't that cause even more division throughout Australia? All that would achieve is extra girth around the head of a real Murderer in Dan Andrews. Responsible for the death of thousands of Victorians as a result of his Hotel Fiasco. Lied in front of the whole of Australia and denied everything. This is the idiot you are hoping that will change the day for Victorians. If the rest of australia isn't changing the day then I will still be celebrating the 26th as Australia day. One in, all in
Click to expand...
It seems Dan will enact a Treaty which will inevitably drag along the other states and hopefully the Feds as well. Not sure how consulting First Nations people can be so difficult for Scotty and his party.

Similarly, how about this novel idea: ask our indigenous peoples to come up with an alternative date; ask all Australians about a new date. Get consensus and then act upon it.

I read through this thread and am still surprised there are people who claim to not understand the reasons put forward for a change of date. It bewilders me, it really does. If our First Nations People say they are hurt and have endured the hurt for a long time; it seems it would be pretty easy for us to listen and begin the process of changing the date.

Of course we'd have to ensure the public holiday status remains, otherwise a majority would not be interested. Sad but true.

As for posters continuing the lie that Daniel Andrews caused hundreds of deaths. This view ignores the fact that 90% of these deaths occurred in nursing homes supposedly overseen by the federal government. This was the finding of the Royal Commission.

The same government that presided over borders and allowed the Ruby Princess to dock in Sydney.

The same government that looked at the deaths in Newmarch House in Sydney and shrugged its shoulders and watched as low paid workers living below the poverty line, spread the virus through nursing homes in Victoria.

The same government that allowed international travelers to land in Sydney, stroll through the airport and catch a domestic flights to Melbourne without anybody in Border Force noticing. Not to mention quarantine. If the Feds aren't responsible for quarantine then who the bloody hell is?

The Invisible Man, Peter Dutton, is great at locking up refugees and families for years, until he suddenly realises it's too expensive, but impotent when it comes to actually keeping our borders safe during a pandemic. It would seem to be a pretty important part of his job to be honest.

I'm not suggesting the Victorian Government and various authorities under its control didn't make errors; obviously they did, but to blame it all on Daniel Andrews is disingenuous.

Scotty passed power to the states, and by doing so was able to blame everything on Andrews, and wash his hands of responsibility. Smart. Very smart. But Morrison would be looking a bit nervously at Andrews. Andrews defeated the second wave by acting decisively and the great majority of Victorians continue to support him. Of course, they may not when it comes to the next election, but if I were a betting man and taking into account the clowns in the Victorian opposition, I'd be putting plenty on Dan. That would be three election wins in a row. Federal Labor might consider tapping a three time winner with a national profile, on the shoulder.
 
jmac70 said:
A Victorian treaty is currently being worked on. Once it is signed we can make that our day of reconciliation and get rid of Jan 26.
Click to expand...
I think I'd still choose the right to vote, as everyone becoming equal in terms of selecting our governance, was a significant concrete change and carries a symbolism of equality that everyone understands. The NZ treaty was a concrete ending of hostility and symbolises unity for the nation. There are no details for the Vic treaty yet, but I can't imagine one that will be either a concrete change or carry symbolism that resonates far beyond indigenous.
 
JB1975 said:
Reckon this is a distinct possibility, Victoria goes its own way and ditches Jan 26.

Jan 26 wasn't always a national holiday, States did their own thing, and Victoria's move would likely set a precedent for others to follow.
Click to expand...
It would fit with a post covid Australia for a state to celebrate the nation on a date for a reason that has nothing to do with any other state.
 
jmac70 said:
You can read about it here: https://www.aboriginalvictoria.vic.gov.au/treaty-process
Click to expand...

There's nothing in detail about what is in the treaty, just basically outlines there's an assembly of indigenous people to negotiate a treaty.

What does the treaty look like? Or is it not at that stage yet?

If there is any positive move toward reconciliation than a treaty is it, just need to know what that is.
 
sr36 said:
I think I'd still choose the right to vote, as everyone becoming equal in terms of selecting our governance, was a significant concrete change and carries a symbolism of equality that everyone understands. The NZ treaty was a concrete ending of hostility and symbolises unity for the nation. There are no details for the Vic treaty yet, but I can't imagine one that will be either a concrete change or carry symbolism that resonates far beyond indigenous.
Click to expand...
That’s a pretty pessimistic view.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Carringbush2010 said:
There's nothing in detail about what is in the treaty, just basically outlines there's an assembly of indigenous people to negotiate a treaty.

What does the treaty look like? Or is it not at that stage yet?

If there is any positive move toward reconciliation than a treaty is it, just need to know what that is.
Click to expand...
I understand that, but at least there is a process towards one. Can you imagine the Libs ever doing anything like this?
 
Apples said:
It seems Dan will enact a Treaty which will inevitably drag along the other states and hopefully the Feds as well. Not sure how consulting First Nations people can be so difficult for Scotty and his party.

Similarly, how about this novel idea: ask our indigenous peoples to come up with an alternative date; ask all Australians about a new date. Get consensus and then act upon it.

I read through this thread and am still surprised there are people who claim to not understand the reasons put forward for a change of date. It bewilders me, it really does. If our First Nations People say they are hurt and have endured the hurt for a long time; it seems it would be pretty easy for us to listen and begin the process of changing the date.

Of course we'd have to ensure the public holiday status remains, otherwise a majority would not be interested. Sad but true.

As for posters continuing the lie that Daniel Andrews caused hundreds of deaths. This view ignores the fact that 90% of these deaths occurred in nursing homes supposedly overseen by the federal government. This was the finding of the Royal Commission.

The same government that presided over borders and allowed the Ruby Princess to dock in Sydney.

The same government that looked at the deaths in Newmarch House in Sydney and shrugged its shoulders and watched as low paid workers living below the poverty line, spread the virus through nursing homes in Victoria.

The same government that allowed international travelers to land in Sydney, stroll through the airport and catch a domestic flights to Melbourne without anybody in Border Force noticing. Not to mention quarantine. If the Feds aren't responsible for quarantine then who the bloody hell is?

The Invisible Man, Peter Dutton, is great at locking up refugees and families for years, until he suddenly realises it's too expensive, but impotent when it comes to actually keeping our borders safe during a pandemic. It would seem to be a pretty important part of his job to be honest.

I'm not suggesting the Victorian Government and various authorities under its control didn't make errors; obviously they did, but to blame it all on Daniel Andrews is disingenuous.

Scotty passed power to the states, and by doing so was able to blame everything on Andrews, and wash his hands of responsibility. Smart. Very smart. But Morrison would be looking a bit nervously at Andrews. Andrews defeated the second wave by acting decisively and the great majority of Victorians continue to support him. Of course, they may not when it comes to the next election, but if I were a betting man and taking into account the clowns in the Victorian opposition, I'd be putting plenty on Dan. That would be three election wins in a row. Federal Labor might consider tapping a three time winner with a national profile, on the shoulder.
Click to expand...
90% of deaths may have occurred in nursing home, but I prefer to focus on the number of daily cases which went above 700. With the high daily totals, co-morbidity deaths in Victorian nursing homes were inevitably going to occur. However I am not going to call Andrews a murderer. Shit happens. As for aged care, no matter which party is in power, it has always been a mess and its workers poorly paid. The same could probably be said for Victoria's DHHS.
 
TheGreatGrundy said:
90% of deaths may have occurred in nursing home, but I prefer to focus on the number of daily cases which went above 700. With the high daily totals, co-morbidity deaths in Victorian nursing homes were inevitably going to occur. However I am not going to call Andrews a murderer. sh*t happens. As for aged care, no matter which party is in power, it has always been a mess and its workers poorly paid. The same could probably be said for Victoria's DHHS.
Click to expand...

I did electrical work for an aged care home where they look after alzhiemers patients. Probably the most miserable and depressing place I've ever seen, felt sorry for the staff. Prob on minimum wage too
 
Black_White said:
The last word of your sentence is the antithesis of the liberal party.
Unless you have money, or can donate money, they really aren’t that smart on any issues that are socially motivated.
Click to expand...

When has any govt. been generally smart?, forget the libs, it's all and sundry.
 

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

Kappa said:
I did electrical work for an aged care home where they look after alzhiemers patients. Probably the most miserable and depressing place I've ever seen, felt sorry for the staff. Prob on minimum wage too
Click to expand...

Was there a security code to open the doors to enter or leave a ward?
 
magpie_marty said:
Was there a security code to open the doors to enter or leave a ward?
Click to expand...

Yeah there were a few different areas depending on how "far gone" people were.

The area for the worst cases was mostly people close to death who have no idea who they are or who the staff are (even though they see them everyday) and everyday the staff have to go through the same conversation and often get abused, have to clean up urine and faeces, and sometimes they refuse to eat or take their medication for hours. It's truly the worst job in the world
 
Kappa said:
Yeah there were a few different areas depending on how "far gone" people were.

The area for the worst cases was mostly people close to death who have no idea who they are or who the staff are (even though they see them everyday) and everyday the staff have to go through the same conversation and often get abused, have to clean up urine and faeces, and sometimes they refuse to eat or take their medication for hours. It's truly the worst job in the world
Click to expand...
If I was unfortunate to spend my twilight years in one of these aged facilities, I would consider it a blessing to be carried off by the virus.
 
Kappa said:
Yeah there were a few different areas depending on how "far gone" people were.

The area for the worst cases was mostly people close to death who have no idea who they are or who the staff are (even though they see them everyday) and everyday the staff have to go through the same conversation and often get abused, have to clean up urine and faeces, and sometimes they refuse to eat or take their medication for hours. It's truly the worst job in the world
Click to expand...

It sure is an eye opener and brings you back to reality very very fast.
 
TheGreatGrundy said:
If I was unfortunate to spend my twilight years in one of these aged facilities, I would consider it a blessing to be carried off by the virus.
Click to expand...

Yep, there are lots of things worse than death.

It's truly horrible imagining these were once good honest proud people reduced to this.

It feels evil to keep them alive in this state tbh.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Happy Australia day everyone

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

Back
Top