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Harcourt presentation "bombshell"

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60sbomber

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The contents of AFL Medical Officer Peter Harcourt's presentation in Zurich in late 2013 is indeed a "bombshell".

It sheds light on what led to the ASADA investigation into the EFC supplement program and, even more significantly, it helps us understand some aspects of the way the investigation has evolved.

It reveals that in 2012 the AFL, for reasons not explained, suspected EFC of using banned substances. Combine this with the revelation of the contents of a letter provided to Essendon players and officials prior to their ASADA interviews, which states that the investigation was aimed at the suspected use of 3 growth hormone related peptides (GRHP-2 GRHP-6 & CJC1295), and we start to understand what the AFL & ASADA expected to find when the EFC was pushed into "self reporting" in Feb 2013.

Harcourt's presentation shows the fears that the AFL & ASADA had about player safety and cancer risks etc were a major concern, and underlay the dramatic nature of what the AFL leaked to Fairfax during the investigation.

However, after an investigation lasting 16 months, the expected outcome of EFC being found to have given growth hormone related peptides to its players has failed to emerge.

Despite their best attempts, the combined efforts of ASADA & the AFL have produced absolutely no evidence to support the original suspicion!

In July 2013, the AFL, having carefully laid the groundwork by selective leaks of damning tidbits of "evidence" via its Fairfax mouthpiece, is left in an awkward position. Essendon is winning enough games to make it a likely finals participant. The AFL has convinced the public that EFC has used illegal performance enhancing supplements. But there is still no sign of any damning evidence to support the original suspicion.

What can the AFL do? It solicits an interim report from ASADA with enough bits & pieces of emails & texts to make it look like something bad has happened (eventhough they can't find any evidence of it). They take strong action against the club, excluding them from the finals & imposing a ban on golden boy James Hird, who has threatened to upset the whole master plan by exposing the AFL manipulation of the investigation to its own chosen agenda. It then hopes the whole thing will fade away, with no further action against the players.

However, ASADA has a different need. Having been thrust into the role of prosecuting the case following the ACC "darkest day" press event, it can't just let the whole thing fade away.

The presumption of growth hormone use has proved to be a fallacy. Blood tests of the entire playing group have shown no sign of its use. No evidence of its use at EFC can found. But the whole investigation was founded on the belief it had been used.

ASADA is desperate to find something........anything, to justify its investigation, and not look like a lame duck pursuing something that doesn't exist.

AOD use is established, but ASADA can't prosecute it without looking incompetent for giving wrong advice.

What is left?
There is plenty of evidence that Dank used "thymosin", one form of which is banned. ASADA have enough in texts and emails involving Dank to be able to make a circumstantial case that it might have been the illegal TB4.

They have evidence from Charter that he ordered TB4 for Dank, and a non committal statement from Alavi that he could possibly have made up either the legal or the illegal form of "thymosin" for Dank from the raw materials provided by Charter.

The trouble is it is only a pathetically inadequate amount for the purpose it is supposed to have served. No matter, it is the best ASADA can come up with. Let's ignore that it might have been for use by Dank's customers other than EFC, let's ignore that there was only one invoice for this small amount of whichever form of thymosin it was, and that that invoice was withdrawn, presumably because the thymosin never reached the club.

TB4 it is then.

What started out as a hunt for human growth hormone related GRHP-2, GRHP-6 & CJC1295 ends up as a prosecution of an unlikely and trumped up case for the use of TB4.

Harcourt's fears for player health as a consequence of the use of HGH related substances is just an AFL illusion, conjured up by an over reaction to ACC suspicions that have proven unfounded.

Loveable Caroline's slanderous condemnation of James Hird and the EFC hierarchy turns out to be gutter journalism of award winning grandeur.

The heart wrenching story of "Sarah" remains a mystery to all those naive enough to doubt the depth to which the AFL is willing to stoop to manipulate public opinion.

Discuss.
 

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The contents of AFL Medical Officer Peter Harcourt's presentation in Zurich in late 2013 is indeed a "bombshell".

It sheds light on what led to the ASADA investigation into the EFC supplement program and, even more significantly, it helps us understand some aspects of the way the investigation has evolved.

It reveals that in 2012 the AFL, for reasons not explained, suspected EFC of using banned substances. Combine this with the revelation of the contents of a letter provided to Essendon players and officials prior to their ASADA interviews, which states that the investigation was aimed at the suspected use of 3 growth hormone related peptides (GRHP-2 GRHP-6 & CJC1295), and we start to understand what the AFL & ASADA expected to find when the EFC was pushed into "self reporting" in Feb 2013.

Harcourt's presentation shows the fears that the AFL & ASADA had about player safety and cancer risks etc were a major concern, and underlay the dramatic nature of what the AFL leaked to Fairfax during the investigation.

However, after an investigation lasting 16 months, the expected outcome of EFC being found to have given growth hormone related peptides to its players has failed to emerge.

Despite their best attempts, the combined efforts of ASADA & the AFL have produced absolutely no evidence to support the original suspicion!

In July 2013, the AFL, having carefully laid the groundwork by selective leaks of damning tidbits of "evidence" via its Fairfax mouthpiece, is left in an awkward position. Essendon is winning enough games to make it a likely finals participant. The AFL has convinced the public that EFC has used illegal performance enhancing supplements. But there is still no sign of any damning evidence to support the original suspicion.

What can the AFL do? It solicits an interim report from ASADA with enough bits & pieces of emails & texts to make it look like something bad has happened (eventhough they can't find any evidence of it). They take strong action against the club, excluding them from the finals & imposing a ban on golden boy James Hird, who has threatened to upset the whole master plan by exposing the AFL manipulation of the investigation to its own chosen agenda. It then hopes the whole thing will fade away, with no further action against the players.

However, ASADA has a different need. Having been thrust into the role of prosecuting the case following the ACC "darkest day" press event, it can't just let the whole thing fade away.

The presumption of growth hormone use has proved to be a fallacy. Blood tests of the entire playing group have shown no sign of its use. No evidence of its use at EFC can found. But the whole investigation was founded on the belief it had been used.

ASADA is desperate to find something........anything, to justify its investigation, and not look like a lame duck pursuing something that doesn't exist.

AOD use is established, but ASADA can't prosecute it without looking incompetent for giving wrong advice.

What is left?
There is plenty of evidence that Dank used "thymosin", one form of which is banned. ASADA have enough in texts and emails involving Dank to be able to make a circumstantial case that it might have been the illegal TB4.

They have evidence from Charter that he ordered TB4 for Dank, and a non committal statement from Alavi that he could possibly have made up either the legal or the illegal form of "thymosin" for Dank from the raw materials provided by Charter.

The trouble is it is only a pathetically inadequate amount for the purpose it is supposed to have served. No matter, it is the best ASADA can come up with. Let's ignore that it might have been for use by Dank's customers other than EFC, let's ignore that there was only one invoice for this small amount of whichever form of thymosin it was, and that that invoice was withdrawn, presumably because the thymosin never reached the club.

TB4 it is then.

What started out as a hunt for human growth hormone related GRHP-2, GRHP-6 & CJC1295 ends up as a prosecution of an unlikely and trumped up case for the use of TB4.

Harcourt's fears for player health as a consequence of the use of HGH related substances is just an AFL illusion, conjured up by an over reaction to ACC suspicions that have proven unfounded.

Loveable Caroline's slanderous condemnation of James Hird and the EFC hierarchy turns out to be gutter journalism of award winning grandeur.

The heart wrenching story of "Sarah" remains a mystery to all those naive enough to doubt the depth to which the AFL is willing to stoop to manipulate public opinion.

Discuss.
Absolutely agree - they have nothing at all. Essendon's injunction to block the use of player testimony is just a bit of fun and an interesting academic exercise which benefits us all.

You know what - I would love to see how this plays out properly where players can respond to show cause notices but the club is too busy being worried about self incrimination.

Maybe you're right - they're not guilty - who knows. So why don't we find out sooner than later?
 
Ah yes the afl and ASADA have all made it up to make themselves look better. :rolleyes:

After all it was a storm in a teacup

"Ok I've just heard from someone near to the source. It's amazing how these people pop up when you quote some rumour online that has a few half truths in it, and attract a number of flies to it.

Turns out that this whole thing is a storm in a tea-cup.

1. The medical waivers are normal.

2. There is no synthetics involved, just some "techniques".

All in all it is a storm in a tea-cup and has come about from the review of the fitness department. I for one am greatly relieved. "
fishardansin, Feb 5, 2013 Report
#81
 
this is deadset the first time ive ever heard of HGH being linked to the bombers.

In fact from the get go it was well ****ed if we know what they took.
Still even if they suspected HGH use it's a bit of stretch to reach the conclusion you've come to.

Assuming you are right here's where we now.
the AFL suspected (for un disclosed reasons) that essendon were doping and putting players health at risk, they believed it involved HGH.
investigation is done: use of illegal drugs is gathered namely around TB4.
ASADA has issued show cause letters citing TB4
Essendon is currently trying to get the subsequent investigation declared illegal and get a permanent injunction on evidence collected.

was HGH involved? it seems unlikely, but by essendons own internal report. the EFC injected players with unkown substances kept no records and actively subjected there players to a Pharmacological experiment.

We have certainly a health risk, evidence of illegal drugs use (which may or may not be enough to convict) and we have a the EFC trying to get off on technicality.

it is suffice to say something was rotten in the state of denmark, no matter if Essendon use their fancy lawyers to avoid facing justice or not.
 
Last edited:
So they didnt find these in the investigation, but is there any chance someone will come forward in the future and confirm GRHP-2, GRHP-6 & CJC1295 use?

I'm guessing they had to have some reason to suspect them.

danks history at NRL ?
 
The contents of AFL Medical Officer Peter Harcourt's presentation in Zurich in late 2013 is indeed a "bombshell".

It sheds light on what led to the ASADA investigation into the EFC supplement program and, even more significantly, it helps us understand some aspects of the way the investigation has evolved.

It reveals that in 2012 the AFL, for reasons not explained, suspected EFC of using banned substances. Combine this with the revelation of the contents of a letter provided to Essendon players and officials prior to their ASADA interviews, which states that the investigation was aimed at the suspected use of 3 growth hormone related peptides (GRHP-2 GRHP-6 & CJC1295), and we start to understand what the AFL & ASADA expected to find when the EFC was pushed into "self reporting" in Feb 2013.

Harcourt's presentation shows the fears that the AFL & ASADA had about player safety and cancer risks etc were a major concern, and underlay the dramatic nature of what the AFL leaked to Fairfax during the investigation.

However, after an investigation lasting 16 months, the expected outcome of EFC being found to have given growth hormone related peptides to its players has failed to emerge.

Despite their best attempts, the combined efforts of ASADA & the AFL have produced absolutely no evidence to support the original suspicion!

In July 2013, the AFL, having carefully laid the groundwork by selective leaks of damning tidbits of "evidence" via its Fairfax mouthpiece, is left in an awkward position. Essendon is winning enough games to make it a likely finals participant. The AFL has convinced the public that EFC has used illegal performance enhancing supplements. But there is still no sign of any damning evidence to support the original suspicion.

What can the AFL do? It solicits an interim report from ASADA with enough bits & pieces of emails & texts to make it look like something bad has happened (eventhough they can't find any evidence of it). They take strong action against the club, excluding them from the finals & imposing a ban on golden boy James Hird, who has threatened to upset the whole master plan by exposing the AFL manipulation of the investigation to its own chosen agenda. It then hopes the whole thing will fade away, with no further action against the players.

However, ASADA has a different need. Having been thrust into the role of prosecuting the case following the ACC "darkest day" press event, it can't just let the whole thing fade away.

The presumption of growth hormone use has proved to be a fallacy. Blood tests of the entire playing group have shown no sign of its use. No evidence of its use at EFC can found. But the whole investigation was founded on the belief it had been used.

ASADA is desperate to find something........anything, to justify its investigation, and not look like a lame duck pursuing something that doesn't exist.

AOD use is established, but ASADA can't prosecute it without looking incompetent for giving wrong advice.

What is left?
There is plenty of evidence that Dank used "thymosin", one form of which is banned. ASADA have enough in texts and emails involving Dank to be able to make a circumstantial case that it might have been the illegal TB4.

They have evidence from Charter that he ordered TB4 for Dank, and a non committal statement from Alavi that he could possibly have made up either the legal or the illegal form of "thymosin" for Dank from the raw materials provided by Charter.

The trouble is it is only a pathetically inadequate amount for the purpose it is supposed to have served. No matter, it is the best ASADA can come up with. Let's ignore that it might have been for use by Dank's customers other than EFC, let's ignore that there was only one invoice for this small amount of whichever form of thymosin it was, and that that invoice was withdrawn, presumably because the thymosin never reached the club.

TB4 it is then.

What started out as a hunt for human growth hormone related GRHP-2, GRHP-6 & CJC1295 ends up as a prosecution of an unlikely and trumped up case for the use of TB4.

Harcourt's fears for player health as a consequence of the use of HGH related substances is just an AFL illusion, conjured up by an over reaction to ACC suspicions that have proven unfounded.

Loveable Caroline's slanderous condemnation of James Hird and the EFC hierarchy turns out to be gutter journalism of award winning grandeur.

The heart wrenching story of "Sarah" remains a mystery to all those naive enough to doubt the depth to which the AFL is willing to stoop to manipulate public opinion.

Discuss.
The use of GHRP 2 and 6 was done in late 2011 and early 2012. I have been on these boards for a while saying this.
A friend of mine was told by Dank directly that he gave these substances to Essendon. This is fact.
This friend has given evidence to ASADA. This is fact too.
When the AFL did blood samples in late 2012, the players had not received any GHRP for a few months. Blood tests would be of no use then.
Dank completely covered his paper trail for these substances. He had time as he knew that the AFL were on to him.
It is not surprising that ASADA could not use GHRP 2 and 6 on their charge sheet.
If anything, the revelations this morning only strengthen what I have been saying now for a long time.
 
It's not a bombshell to ASADA. They are confident - and so are independent experts who have reviewed the evidence - that show causes are justified.

Really, until the evidence is a) found to be lawfully obtained and b) properly tested, what else is there worth discussing?

And, btw, your claim they have found no evidence is not true and invalidates everything else you say. It keeps getting repeated bit does not get any more true.
 
Purely an Essendon problem, they are the ones who engaged in a pharmaceutical experiment and I guess they have to deal with the repurcussions.

It was the clubs decision to inject the players and if they did not self report then the commission should increase the penalties because they got a discount on the assumption they did.

I am so over Essendon, if they died tomorrow I would not give a shit.
 

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Oh boy, this is getting uglier and uglier.

Surely the esteemed journalists milking this saga knew of this video before now?
 
Purely an Essendon problem, they are the ones who engaged in a pharmaceutical experiment and I guess they have to deal with the repurcussions.

It was the clubs decision to inject the players and if they did not self report then the commission should increase the penalties because they got a discount on the assumption they did.

I am so over Essendon, if they died tomorrow I would not give a shit.

I reckon youre not alone in this.:thumbsu:
 
I reckon youre not alone in this.:thumbsu:

Every ****ing day we wake up to this shit. Every day we get told how its the AFL and ASADA's fault by the cultists in the media and the big footy cult of Hird.

Not once do these clowns even accept that what Essendon did was so wrong, they just want to blame everyone else for their **** up.

The only mistake the AFL made was not standing the whole club's admin and coaching staff down as soon as they self reported. They went soft and 'negotiated' because dollars came before integrity. And because of the love of dollars, the AFL is the only ally by default, that they have, and they seek to go after them because they are arrogant cheats who can't accept they got caught.
 
Tests found nothing.

Discuss

Considering you can't test for all substances and the drug dealer who was supplying the program specializes in masking. No surprise.

Why don't you look up WADA and their affiliates percentage of prosecutions without there being a positive test.
 

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The contents of AFL Medical Officer Peter Harcourt's presentation in Zurich in late 2013 is indeed a "bombshell".

It sheds light on what led to the ASADA investigation into the EFC supplement program and, even more significantly, it helps us understand some aspects of the way the investigation has evolved.

It reveals that in 2012 the AFL, for reasons not explained, suspected EFC of using banned substances. Combine this with the revelation of the contents of a letter provided to Essendon players and officials prior to their ASADA interviews, which states that the investigation was aimed at the suspected use of 3 growth hormone related peptides (GRHP-2 GRHP-6 & CJC1295), and we start to understand what the AFL & ASADA expected to find when the EFC was pushed into "self reporting" in Feb 2013.

Harcourt's presentation shows the fears that the AFL & ASADA had about player safety and cancer risks etc were a major concern, and underlay the dramatic nature of what the AFL leaked to Fairfax during the investigation.

However, after an investigation lasting 16 months, the expected outcome of EFC being found to have given growth hormone related peptides to its players has failed to emerge.

Despite their best attempts, the combined efforts of ASADA & the AFL have produced absolutely no evidence to support the original suspicion!

In July 2013, the AFL, having carefully laid the groundwork by selective leaks of damning tidbits of "evidence" via its Fairfax mouthpiece, is left in an awkward position. Essendon is winning enough games to make it a likely finals participant. The AFL has convinced the public that EFC has used illegal performance enhancing supplements. But there is still no sign of any damning evidence to support the original suspicion.

What can the AFL do? It solicits an interim report from ASADA with enough bits & pieces of emails & texts to make it look like something bad has happened (eventhough they can't find any evidence of it). They take strong action against the club, excluding them from the finals & imposing a ban on golden boy James Hird, who has threatened to upset the whole master plan by exposing the AFL manipulation of the investigation to its own chosen agenda. It then hopes the whole thing will fade away, with no further action against the players.

However, ASADA has a different need. Having been thrust into the role of prosecuting the case following the ACC "darkest day" press event, it can't just let the whole thing fade away.

The presumption of growth hormone use has proved to be a fallacy. Blood tests of the entire playing group have shown no sign of its use. No evidence of its use at EFC can found. But the whole investigation was founded on the belief it had been used.

ASADA is desperate to find something........anything, to justify its investigation, and not look like a lame duck pursuing something that doesn't exist.

AOD use is established, but ASADA can't prosecute it without looking incompetent for giving wrong advice.

What is left?
There is plenty of evidence that Dank used "thymosin", one form of which is banned. ASADA have enough in texts and emails involving Dank to be able to make a circumstantial case that it might have been the illegal TB4.

They have evidence from Charter that he ordered TB4 for Dank, and a non committal statement from Alavi that he could possibly have made up either the legal or the illegal form of "thymosin" for Dank from the raw materials provided by Charter.

The trouble is it is only a pathetically inadequate amount for the purpose it is supposed to have served. No matter, it is the best ASADA can come up with. Let's ignore that it might have been for use by Dank's customers other than EFC, let's ignore that there was only one invoice for this small amount of whichever form of thymosin it was, and that that invoice was withdrawn, presumably because the thymosin never reached the club.

TB4 it is then.

What started out as a hunt for human growth hormone related GRHP-2, GRHP-6 & CJC1295 ends up as a prosecution of an unlikely and trumped up case for the use of TB4.

Harcourt's fears for player health as a consequence of the use of HGH related substances is just an AFL illusion, conjured up by an over reaction to ACC suspicions that have proven unfounded.

Loveable Caroline's slanderous condemnation of James Hird and the EFC hierarchy turns out to be gutter journalism of award winning grandeur.

The heart wrenching story of "Sarah" remains a mystery to all those naive enough to doubt the depth to which the AFL is willing to stoop to manipulate public opinion.

Discuss.
I have had some conversations with some Essendon supporters who have raised a lot of the above issues or similar ones with respect to political manipulation by Gillard etc.

I then ask the question "what about the possibility that everything you're saying is true but the players still used banned substances" and there is more often than not an uncomfortable pause which feels never-ending
 
Tests found nothing.

Discuss

On the tests not coming to anything at the time, what I Rock said. It's a limited system, which ASADA/WADA don't have to rely on.

But it is still a bit of a shock that this is apparently the most compelling thing in the article for you.
 
Tests found nothing.

Discuss
Like many other self confessed drug cheats. Despite any bias surely thus isn't the only thing you gave gleaned out of this and other similar articles today.

Article points out Bomber players in health danger but club yet to sign up to health scheme - discuss

".....but it's all about the players"
 

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