Has our depth Improved?

[ACTion Hawks]

Everyone acknowledges that a large part of our success this season was our amazing depth, with upward of 30 players more than capable of being first team players. Given our successful trade period, and the natural progression of our younger players, has our depth improved?

INS
Frawley
O'Rourke
Whitecross (effectively)

OUTS
Sewell
Hallahan
Lowden
Cheney
Kelly
Wanganeen
Ross
Note: Not including Garlett as we never really had him available.

IMHO
We have gained in Key Position depth, with Frawley a significant upgrade on Cheney (no disrespect to Cheney) and TOB needing another pre-season.
We have lost on Ruck depth - Luke never got much of a chance, but performed the one time he could.
Midfield/Utility - I think we have almost improved, with the improvement in Woody (a full season of games), the return of Whitecross (hopefully can slot back in). We also effectively get Jed back and the introduction of a potential champ in O'Rourke. BH reporters have good reports on Sicily and the club obviously see something in Willsmore and Webster.

We also have two picks in the draft, which may bring a Hartung.

 

[WWSD]

Brendan Whitecross and Jed Anderson (who both missed the entire 2014 season) would be like new recruits. Despite Whitecross having had two knee reconstructions, he's played in seven finals matches in his career, whilst Jed Anderson played in that Qualifying final against Sydney last year. Both players are potentially in our starting 18 if they can stay injury free next year. Players like Ceglar, O'Brien, Litherland, Woodward and Hartung will all play plenty of games next year. I reckon Woodward and Litherland will end up having breakout seasons in 2015. Of the lesser likes Webster, Sicily and Brand are all likely to make their debuts next season. Our depth is arguably the best it's been for quite some time.

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

I think our depth has weakened with all the departures, but the quality of our best 18 has improved. Hopefully we get two gems with our picks in the ND.

 

[Always Hawks]

If you're talking about genuine AFL quality depth, I don't think you can include Kelly, Wanganeen and Ross as outs. And for the ins, I think you can include Sicily for next year because he will be capable of playing at AFL level (whereas in his first year he wasn't ready yet).

So I see it more like:
*INS*
Frawley
O'Rourke
Whitecross
Anderson
Sicily

*OUTS*
Sewell
Hallahan
Lowden
Cheney

Would have been nice to have kept Hallahan, but otherwise we've had a great offseason and our depth is stronger. As per the "greatest weakness" thread, our only real weaknesses next year are: (1) losing top-line players (Roughead, Hodge, Mitchell, Burgoyne) to injury, and (2) mental fatigue / inability to get ourselves "up" for another flag tilt.

 

[Ordovician]

Realistically:

Ins:

Frawley (double plus good)
O'Rourke (so WTF is Agarn ???)

and in effect

Whitecross
Anderson

Outs:

Sewell
Hallahan
Cheney
Lowden

Has that improved our depth?

Frawley certainly has and should save us form sweating on Lake and Spangher every week like Last season.

O'Rourke is a huge unknown but should take a while to develop and fit in with the hawks game plans.Will probably spent most of next year at Box Hill with the odd taste of senior footy to show him how far he needs to catch up.

It will be hard for Wx to step up immediately after two knee recos so I don't expect much from him next year. hopefully he might be ok go at a reasonable rate by the second half of the season. Anderson who will throw himself in regardless and should make a reasonable contribution in 2015.

Sewell was finished with those hamstrings and I think the both he and the club realised it and made the right decision. He was good when he returned but the recurring nature of the problem finished him off.

Hallahan is a funny one. He really lacks pace and agility and we have so many other developing mids that need game time that he became superfluous.

Cheney was the emergency backup for the emergency key defender slot. With Lake, Frawley, Gibbo, Spangher and Schoey at a pinch he really would have no chance of getting a game in that role and even less chance as medium and small defender role where he ranked well behind Birch, Strats, Suckers, Duryea & Lithers.

Lowden will be a real loss to the depth if we ever suffer two injuries to our three rucks. I suspect they'll have to rookie a ruckman to cover this eventuality.

So we have gained an important cog for our defence and lost a bit depth but more importantly opened up some space to develop and expose our younger mids and defenders to AFL. Given that we will need to replace H,M&B and well as Gibbo, Hale and Lake over the next three years we need to get some serious game time into their successors particularly the young mids.

Unfortunately, we don't know who they are exactly in the case of the mids so we will have to trial and develop a lot of players like Anderson, Woody, O'Rouke, Webster et al. to see who makes the grade, as Langers did this year. As for the others retirees, Frawley may replace Lake but it is unclear who will relieve Gibbo and we really don't have a true ruck/forward to replace Hale.

 

[Cyril the Squirrel]

Yep.

Frawley will start on the park. O'Rouke, Anderson and Whitecross are first tier reserves. Cheney, hallahan, lowden and (honestly next year) Sewell are backups for reserves.

 

[Easy Slips Catch]

Our Depth has changed.

frawley pushes Spang back into depth, Gus and Schoe provide ample cover for Bocca and Wang. That is better depth.

Sewell, Boxer and Ross are amply covered by a healthy Jed, match fit Woody, emerging Billy and Joknow. That is better depth.

We bat deeper with far more upside.

 

[kenneje]

I only really count players as depth if they realistically will get a look in at some stage, so;

IN
Frawley
O'Rourke
Whitecross
Anderson
Pick 31
Pick 49

OUT
Cheney
Hallahan
Lowden
Sewell
Ross
Wanganeen
Kelly

I think we're in a better position going into next year than 2014.

Frawley > Cheney
Anderson > Ross
O'Rourke = Hallahan
Whitecross = Sewell
31 + 49 ? Lowden + Kelly + Wanganeen

Lowden is no doubt a loss, but Frawley will fit straight into our 22 and I'm betting by the end of the year both Anderson and Whitecross are also there.

 

[Roger Rogerson]

The pace of the ins versus outs is certainly a major upgrade to our list. The plodders have thinned out enormously.

There are questions marks on all of O'Rourke Anderson and Whitecross in terms of being able to stay on the park and be meaningful depth contributors when called upon. But all have talent superior to those moved on so demand being given games - great list management.

Obviously moving Lowden on thins our ruck stocks but between Roughie, Spang, Schoey and Grimley we can pinch hit for a game or two if things go pear-shaped and we dont draft a mature ruck or want to throw a rookie ruck to the wolves. That is the luxury of bringing Frawley in that any of these guys can be deployed to problem areas even the ruck.

Throw in Hartung, Simpkin, Woody, Litherland and the depth is excellent. We are going to be a seriously quick side in 2 years time.

 

[eldorado]

Was Woodward included as depth this season? If not, I'd say he's certainly an addition to next years depth...

 

[Agent Smith]

Our depth was a little thin in 2012 and then some kids really developed and with some clever trades and draft selections our 2013 side suddenly developed a number of players who could come in and play a role, even in big games. I remember being a lot less concerned about injuries coming into finals and we could potentially cover a few outs. The team was strengthened even more in 2014 to the point where we were potentially delisting/trading players who really could play a role at AFL level.

We're now at a point at identifying the players with the most AFL potential while trying to assist those who want to move on for more opportunities. Based on our ins/outs, I think our overall depth has stagnated slightly for 2015 with the need for new and untried blood to come in, but the depth we have left will be of a higher quality, especially with the likes of Sicily and Hartung having another preseason under their belts, along with the return of Anderson and Whitecross. Frawley and O'Rourke have to be looked at as positives at this point. Depending on our draft picks this year, our potential depth could exceed what we had in 2014 over the next year or two.

 

[Taskmaster]

Was Woodward included as depth this season? If not, I'd say he's certainly an addition to next years depth...

Yep Woody is up there and also TOB. I think we are stronger than 2014!

 

[Procrastinator35]

We've been the best team quite comprehensively for the past 3 seasons now, if you factor in the $wines counterfeit draw from last season!....Our list is every bit as solid & deep as it has been for the 3 season prior.....The more significant question is whether or not it is as well balanced as last season's?....We are a Ruckman short IMO at the present time!

 

[Ordovician]

We are a ruckman and one elite key forward short of where we were in 2013 even though we are a key back man up over the 2013 list.

 

[B&GBlood]

We cannot by definition have a spare elite key forward in the reserves.
We have Spang and Shoe as forward pack smashers if necessary and Lake could help out too.

TOB does some nice things and will progress.

We have Rough and the resting ruck with Gunner making three talls. Gunner and Rough are special(TM) so we cannot be the same side without either.

We will just have to be happy with our version of perfection, flawed as it is.

 

[cryptor]

Judging by the end of Sicily's 2014 I'd add him to the list of in's. Could easily play half a dozen games.

 

[CasuallyDressed]

I only really count players as depth if they realistically will get a look in at some stage, so;

IN
Frawley
O'Rourke
Whitecross
Anderson
Pick 31
Pick 49

OUT
Cheney
Hallahan
Lowden
Sewell
Ross
Wanganeen
Kelly

I think we're in a better position going into next year than 2014.

Frawley > Cheney
Anderson > Ross
O'Rourke = Hallahan
Whitecross = Sewell
31 + 49 ? Lowden + Kelly + Wanganeen

Lowden is no doubt a loss, but Frawley will fit straight into our 22 and I'm betting by the end of the year both Anderson and Whitecross are also there.

I'd argue that Hallahan > O'Rourke if you're talking next year or 2016.

Hallahan has looked a whole lot more impressive at the top level than O'Rourke. I'm sure Johnathan has a higher ceiling (potentially) but Hallahan would be better depth for the next year or two.

 

[JeddaB]

Judging by the end of Sicily's 2014 I'd add him to the list of in's. Could easily play half a dozen games.

Sicily will play quite a bit next year imo... Well I hope so. Love his attitude and game!

 

[Roger Rogerson]

We are a ruckman and one elite key forward short of where we were in 2013 even though we are a key back man up over the 2013 list.

But what about the 2014 list?

 

[Roger Rogerson]

Sicily will play quite a bit next year imo... Well I hope so. Love his attitude and game!

I am not quite as bullish as others re: Sicily. Reckon he has a fair way to go. Dont doubt his ability and certainly has class but I think he needs to develop other aspects of his game than mark and kick if he is to push for AFL games. Needs to become a running player so he can play as a high HFF/winger as well as a FWD pocket.

I am not sure what his running ability is like and perhaps it is why he wasnt an early draft pick but he doesnt really show any up and down the ground running power in games. He is one I will watch closely during the preseason to see where he sits in the running groups. Definately a very promising type but to make it I think he needs to spend time at VFL level as a midfielder. He wont lose his ability to read the ball as a forward.

 

[threesixpio]

But what about the 2014 list?

That list went alright I hear

 

[threesixpio]

We cannot by definition have a spare elite key forward in the reserves.
We have Spang and Shoe as forward pack smashers if necessary and Lake could help out too.

TOB does some nice things and will progress.

We have Rough and the resting ruck with Gunner making three talls. Gunner and Rough are special(TM) so we cannot be the same side without either.

We will just have to be happy with our version of perfection, flawed as it is.

Would love a big preseason from TOB.

Here's a crazy thought - if TOB takes off how bout Ruff to spend a bit more time in the middle?

Hmm. (This could rival Ruff to CHB!)

 

[Flukey!]

I think our depth will actaully be better next year, particularly with Frawley coming in.
How are sides going to outscore us now?

 

[threesixpio]

Can't believe how well we've done with runners over the last few drafts. Would hate Smithy or Hill to go down but goddamn Hartung is not that far off the...pace

 

[MrFujiMoto]

Our depth this year will be far classier than last year. I think we had about 28 guys that were genuinely able to win us a premiership this season. in 2015 I think we have about 32 that could genuinely play in a winning premiership side and hold their spot. Depth is 2 fold and that is where the key is in my book. Yes we have depth for injury cover and we saw how important that was this season just gone. Just as importantly though is the flexibility our list now has. That guys that come in are more versatile than the guys we lost -
In:
Frawley - KPD and able to swing forward
O' Rourke - Midfielder and HBF
Anderson - Genuine utility, inside mid, outside mid, HFF
Whitecross - Has played multiple AFL games at BP, HBF, Center, HFF and tagger

Out:
Cheney - Undersized KPD or BP
Hallahan - Inside Mid
Sewell - Inside Mid or maybe a forward tag at a stretch
Lowden - Ruck

All four of the main inclusions this year can cover multiple spots, which is not the case with the 4 main guys we lost.