Autopsy Hawks lose to *

[HODGEYROAD]

Both us and Essendon had 5 players with less than 50 games on Friday night, we had 10 with 150+ where as they only had 4 with 150+.

 

[Milkshaker]

Some other wise poster noted that the club could never have foreseen the 3 knee recos for Alex Woodward who was shaping up as a ball magnet. Nor that JOR when recruited would have chronic hammies or that Lovell was not up to AFL standard.

Two were drafted one a trade. It has left a hole in our midfield depth. Looking a those three I doubt JOM would have thought he was ever going to be the 'be all and end all' of our midfield in 2019 (with Mitch going down) and neither did the club.

Coniglio and the draft will fix one part of the ground. As for the forward line...........fks?

 

[Harper_Hawk]

Both us and Essendon had 5 players with less than 50 games on Friday night, we had 10 with 150+ where as they only had 4 with 150+.

Yes we should have won that game with the amount of I50's. We play like a constipated old lady...that maybe a metaphor for Clarkson. Time for new ideas...looks like Beveridge/Fagan/Hardwick/Leon Cameron and finally Adam Simpson took them all with them. Bolton may have taken a few as well..but it he took them to Carlton.
Napoleon needed generals to help him win the wars!

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

James Harmes
Matt DeBoer
No tag vs Richmond, got 30 + 6 tackles
Powell-Pepper
Mathieson/Robinson, got 12 tackles but minimal influence (and no plaudits for his tackle numbers)
Dylan Clarke

If you watch the replays of these games you will see that opposition teams often have a player dedicated solely to stopping O’Meara. They deny him space (often holding mind you) and then let the opposition midfield go head to head with Worpel/Cousins/Sheils. When they tire we often have periods where we get dominated. As previously stated, his stats prior to being tagged are exceptional. Go back, watch the games and concentrate on O’Meara if you believe it is a fallacy - I can assure you it isn’t

I agree O’Meara isn’t a Fyfe/Cripps. O’Meara still racks up large tackle numbers when being held, he just had one poor game vs Essendon and is being made a scapegoat. Cripps and Fyfe can also both be tagged out of games They are different types of players and perhaps that is where the frustration is coming from.

The argument that his recruitment ‘stifled our development’ because we ‘sold the farm’ is based on the idea that we gave up the opportunity to draft young talent for O’Meara. It is a commonly used argument.
How do you propose quantifying the influence that ‘selling the farm has’ without trying to define the farm? In this instance it was the draft picks we gave up, and putting players next to the names of draft picks provides a rough guideline of what we gave up and what we got. I do not enjoy arguing in hypotheticals, but this particular line of thinking requires arbitrary limitations. You are effectively telling me that recruiting O’Meara potentially made us a worse side based on his current form because the potential players we potentially recruited with those picks may have potentially developed to potentially improve our side.

Mate, not all of those players are "taggers." Some of them are simple "run with" types (Harmes, Powell-Pepper) that all teams possess but I will leave that aside.

I never said that recruiting O'Meara has made us a worse side. Not once. Of course he doens't make us a worse side. And I didn't claim that it has stifled our list development. Not once.

My argument is a rebuttal of the notion that we get good deals because we are easy to deal with. Scully and Scrimshaw were cited as evidence of this. My position is that we paid more than what Wingard and O'Meara are really worth, therefore challenging that assertion. Negotiating at the trade table is rarely if ever predicated on whether someone is easy to deal with. People that are easy to deal with usually lose out on the haggle.

That is all I said.

O'Meara is not worth what we paid for him but he is a very good footballer (although I am critical of his game on Saturday night. It was putrid but can happen). We paid for a Ferrari and got a Lexus. A Lexus is a very nice car but it isn't a Ferrari.

 

[Holy Rioli]

Mate, not all of those players are "taggers." Some of them are simple "run with" types (Harmes, Powell-Pepper) that all teams possess but I will leave that aside.

I never said that recruiting O'Meara has made us a worse side. Not once. Of course he doens't make us a worse side. And I didn't claim that it has stifled our list development. Not once.

My argument is a rebuttal of the notion that we get good deals because we are easy to deal with. Scully and Scrimshaw were cited as evidence of this. My position is that we paid more than what Wingard and O'Meara are really worth, therefore challenging that assertion. Negotiating at the trade table is rarely if ever predicated on whether someone is easy to deal with. People that are easy to deal with usually lose out on the haggle.

That is all I said.

O'Meara is not worth what we paid for him but he is a very good footballer (although I am critical of his game on Saturday night. It was putrid but can happen). We paid for a Ferrari and got a Lexus. A Lexus is a very nice car but it isn't a Ferrari.

Hunter Clarke is the 1st rounder we gave up to get O'Meara, Josh Battle & Ben Long were the 2nd rounders we gave up to St Kilda for pick 10.

Reckon we're a lot better off with O'Meara in our midfield than Hunter Clark, Josh Battle & Ben Long.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Hunter Clarke is the 1st rounder we gave up to get O'Meara, Josh Battle & Ben Long were the 2nd rounders we gave up to St Kilda for pick 10.

Reckon we're a lot better off with O'Meara in our midfield than Hunter Clark, Josh Battle & Ben Long.

Really?

That’s who we would have taken, is it?

How the hell can you possibly even know that?

Crystal-balling who we would have taken with draft picks we were never taking to the draft. Wow.

 

[HODGEYROAD]

I personally think what we gave in the Wingard trade is currently of much greater concern that what we gave up to land Jaeger.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

I personally think what we gave in the Wingard trade is currently of much greater concern that what we gave up to land Jaeger.

Quite possibly correct.

 

[Spursfan]

I personally think what we gave in the Wingard trade is currently of much greater concern that what we gave up to land Jaeger.

Burton and 1st would've been fine. Not sure why needed to give up the extra pick

 

[Holy Rioli]

Really?

That’s who we would have taken, is it?

How the hell can you possibly even know that?

Crystal-balling who we would have taken with draft picks we were never taking to the draft. Wow.

Those were the players taken with the picks we traded out. We don't know who the club would have taken but I still don't see how our team is better off with those picks.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Those were the players taken with the picks we traded out. We don't know who the club would have taken but I still don't see how our team is better off with those picks.

Highly unlikely we take those picks. Most clubs can’t even agree on the number one pick most years, let alone picks further down.

We might have taken Luke Ryan and Tom Stewart.