Hill

[Clay Davis]

he will win stkildas b&f this year.

Umm, nah. You couldn't be more wrong. If it isn't Dal Santo's it's no ones, and Montagna would be behind a few others like Fisher, Milne, etc.

 

[docker_champ29]

1. He's too unselfish
2. He doesn't like to burn the ball so he tends to hold it till there is a viable option. When the team is down on confidence like now there tends to be no leading players or in fact anyone who even wants the ball so Hill gets trapped with the thing because there isn't a good release option.

It's actually one of the things that should see him reach elite level, his decision making is excellent and his execution top class.

But yes he needs to confidence to kick at goal from anywhere around 50 and to generally take the high risk option.

Yeah I think this has definitely been a big factor for Hill later in the year. This plus the fact that Collingwood don't give you a second to find a good option made a couple of his disposals. But the vast majority of our players probably made more mistakes than Hilly last night and understandably. The important thing is that Hill's confidence is rising going in to next year and he's showing a bit of that toughness we know he has.

 

[yakka man]

- These days there is no such thing as a purely outside midfielder.

- Comparing Hilly and Morabito is mute. Morabito plays very much similar to Chris Judd and Hill ain't never gonna be similar to Judd. First of all Hill is a great kick of the footy.

- Last year Montagna was in the top 10 players in the AFL but this year has dropped off. A lot of this has to do with the loss of Hayes, their primary inside mid.

- Hill is stilll developing. I remember at the game last night seeing him before half time and he was completely stuffed. Hands on his hips breathing like he was having a heart attack.

- Interesting though that when he was drafted one of his criticisms was his decision making under pressure. It was said that he will often try to take the opposition on, run himself into trouble, panic, and quickly dish of the ball turning it over. This has happened many times this year but I don't remember it happening much last year.

- Don't forget though the kid is put under enormous pressure. Patrick Dangerfield is already considered a superstar and yet he hardly ever has a good game and is never tagged. While Hill is tagged every game and is crucified if he doesn't star.

The only worry for Hill is simply his courage and committment to winning the ball. The latter can easily change but courage will be his biggest question mark. But from what I can tell he is the coaches pet for good reason and the players have a lot of respect for him. Brownlow medal is still on the cards.

 

[Kickett Punches Read]

Umm, nah. You couldn't be more wrong. If it isn't Dal Santo's it's no ones, and Montagna would be behind a few others like Fisher, Milne, etc.

pretty sure i could be more wrong if i said andrew mcqualter... i was forgetting montagnas knee injury that kept him out for weeks though, never the less, he is a very good footballer and if hill had an output like his i would be happy... and i reckon most others would too

 

[BeinPurplenGreen]

if there was a block, or he had half a step on his opponent, he could have broken free from congestion, in a Judd/Ablett like fashion, and sprinted clear.

He IS good at getting the ball in traffic and obviously has lighting acceleration and elite evasiveness. If he had some blocks and people throwing weight around he could be a superb inside player.

Good points - and the puzzling thing for me is that while we have had injuries this season we've never been short of players who have the potential to do this blocking role - heck, it doesn't take huge footskills or impeccable athleticism. IMHO guys like Lower, Palmer, DeBoer, Crowley, hell even JVB and Pearce could have been rolled through the midfield and given the key role of blocking for Hilly. It never happened all year...

he's not getting the protection that he needs at the moment, but. last year, morabito was his brother in arms, shepherding players off his run, but he hasn't received much of that this year. this year, he's had to run alone, and like last night, when he went for that run off half back only to be confronted by a wall at half forward and had to handball backwards because his running team mate couldn't keep up with him just ended up looking feckless. how many times did we see that this year? too many. some of that is hill not being smarter with his run. sometimes he just puts on the afterburners only to turn it over, but if he played it smarter and with the off the ball support, he'll be better for it.

Beautifully put.

Sums up the core of the problem that Hill has had this season, and why he is the subject of so much discussion, in just seven words.

His shin splints have also had an impact I reckon, but at the heart of the problem is the lack of support from his teammates and lack of strategies and guidance from the coaches. He simply must get more support from both coaches and his team-mates next year.

 

[Nickos66]

^Agreed, well summarised.

 

[strobe00]

hilly shouldnt have to be the inside player when we get our boys back. we won the clearances last night, low and behold hill gets 30 touches. he should be the finisher, and thats what he will be when we get our midfield back. we will revisit this in one years time.

i think the question we should be asking is why the hell did we beat the best team in the league in clearances when we have lost that stat all year, and that is without a lot of our best players

Hill actually got a bunch of his 30 touches inside or in contested situations. And contributed a good 3 or 4 clearances that I counted by running through packs and sidestepping his way through. Probably better than any other example I saw from one of our players. I actually side with Clay here.

Hill has the capability to be very, very damaging running through stoppages and stepping his way out. Much like Fyfe, he isn't a crash and bash extractor but is able to work his way out of traffic, and I think he needs to do this more. Not saying he should do this the whole game, but I think he should spend a decent chunk of time getting in there every game.

Just like Wells, the capability is there but I think he's forgotten how well he can do it. Probably also has something to do with directions by the coaches, so they need to give him license to commit himself whenever he sees an opportunity. Even if he's tagged, he can still have a real impact there. Much easier to tag a player that's wandering around the outside of a stoppage waiting for an outlet handball than one that'll run through, pick up the ball and burst out the other side or dish out a handball himself.

well i guess its all about perception then, i would have montagna in my top 20. he will win stkildas b&f this year. and i would only have him behind hayes and reiwoldt last year as far as importance and game winning ability goes, and he actually came runner up in the best and fairest in a team that probably should have won a flag (how they lost that first final i will never know).... i think hill will be around that mark, if not better.

Sorry mate, but you missed Goddard.

 

[Moo]

Hill needs to get his head straight, and we need not to focus on him gaining kgs through the weight room.

If we can get our extractors going - Sandi, Mundy, Barlow and Morrabitto ....life for Hill will get better.

Mind right Hilly.

 

[BananaOnTheRun]

Hill needs to spend the off season in Lake Grace with Fyfe. Going to the gym, maybe throw some cows around.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Hill said in an interview just on DockerTV that he will seek the advice of Mundy on how to break a tag. He's not a stupid kid.

 

[Moo]

Hill said in an interview just on DockerTV that he will seek the advice of Mundy on how to break a tag. He's not a stupid kid.

As a player who finished his playing life as a tagger, I would humbly suggest that Mundy may want to talk to the team mates as well. Breaking a tag is a team effort requiring player, team mates and coaching staff to all do their bit.

Take another leaf out of basketball, if you have a tight 1 on 1 situation - you run them threw a series of picks to take the sting out of them early.

Must say I have not seen a lot of evidence of clever physicality this year from us.

 

[prattsta]

Take another leaf out of basketball, if you have a tight 1 on 1 situation - you run them threw a series of picks to take the sting out of them early.

Must say I have not seen a lot of evidence of clever physicality this year from us.

It's somewhat embarrassing that the kids at GC can manage to block for Ablett - Palmer got hit by every single player he ran past all day - but our team can't do it for anyone. None of our players get the support they need regularly enough to break tags.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Ablett doesn't get blocks really, he is just an elite player.

 

[prattsta]

Ablett doesn't get blocks really, he is just an elite player.

Ummm nah. He is an elite player, who also gets help from his teammates.

Seriously, Palmer was blocked at pretty much every single stoppage when we played them. It was the best example of it I've seen all year.

 

[Sigwald]

It's somewhat embarrassing that the kids at GC can manage to block for Ablett - Palmer got hit by every single player he ran past all day - but our team can't do it for anyone. None of our players get the support they need regularly enough to break tags.

This has been bothering me as well. Hopefully something they'll address during pre-season.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Ummm nah. He is an elite player, who also gets help from his teammates.

Seriously, Palmer was blocked at pretty much every single stoppage when we played them. It was the best example of it I've seen all year.

Yeah nah, don't think you have seen too many GC games. He does it almost all himself, using opponents as picks too. That is why he is the best player in the game.

 

[prattsta]

Yeah nah, don't think you have seen too many GC games. He does it almost all himself, using opponents as picks too. That is why he is the best player in the game.

You're spot on, I've seen bugger all GC games. I saw them play us live and I saw them on TV yesterday (?). When they played us he got shit loads of help and when he was playing for Geelong in recent years he got shit loads of help.

I'm not disputing how hard he works, or how much he does himself. I'm just saying, from what I've seen he does get a lot of help from teammates. He certainly gets a lot more help than any of our players.

 

[E Shed]

It's an inditement on our footy dept and team that our players don't block more for Hill.
That is all.

 

[Bradesmaen]

It's an inditement on our footy dept and team that our players don't block more for Hill.
That is all.

They can't block for everyone. They block for Mundy at times, or Barlow...

 

[E Shed]

They can't block for everyone. They block for Mundy at times, or Barlow...

I don't care. It incenses me when I see him being scragged and pushed around at stoppages that no one comes in and lays a heavy shepherd or tries to put the tagger into the dirt.

 

[Moo]

They can't block for everyone. They block for Mundy at times, or Barlow...

We are amongst the worst teams for blocking/shepherding and I would add closing out.

Watch us give off hands and then stand there as trailing opponents pressure the ball carrier.

De Boer is a master at hands then take the body. Against a C'wood - it is magnified due to their willingness to run for each other.

Compare this to a Roberton who I can not recall blocking ever... this is where we need to get the fundies into the guys.

 

[Bradesmaen]

I don't care. It incenses me when I see him being scragged and pushed around at stoppages that no one comes in and lays a heavy shepherd or tries to put the tagger into the dirt.

He's a big boy now, he can deal with it himself. Judd, Ablett, Goodes. They all learnt how to deal with it. You don't become an elite player by letting someone else do all the hard work for you.

 

[strobe00]

We are amongst the worst teams for blocking/shepherding and I would add closing out. What's closing out? Shielding opponent players away from a marking team mate?

Watch us give off hands and then stand there as trailing opponents pressure the ball carrier.

De Boer is a master at hands then take the body. Against a C'wood - it is magnified due to their willingness to run for each other.

Compare this to a Roberton who I can not recall blocking ever... this is where we need to get the fundies into the guys.

Agree completely. We're frigging terrible at it.

Such a simple, simple thing. Have seen Hill, MJ, Palmer and Hinkley (not the only guys of course) not shepherd after dishing to a team mate, while on the run... almost invariably leads to a sh!t kick inside the 50 as their team mate has to get rid of the ball under pressure.

And have seen guys under pressure handball to a team mate behind them, and allow the pressuring player to run straight to the receiving team mate. Surely it wouldn't be a difficult thing to lay a bump to give the receiver time to find the next target. Makes zero sense. Is probably another part of the reason why our skills have been crappy. A small part, true, but it has surely contributed.

All in all our team skills have been pretty poor this year... competing for marks with team mates, not blocking or shepherding, everyone going up for a mark and no-one staying on the ground. Fortunately the fundamentals are easy things to fix, if they become a focus and the whole team commit to it.

He's a big boy now, he can deal with it himself. Judd, Ablett, Goodes. They all learnt how to deal with it. You don't become an elite player by letting someone else do all the hard work for you.

I can understand why you wouldn't want him to be babied on a continuous basis, but Judd and Ablett (for certain) have all been the beneficiary of good work by their team mates, which has enabled them to get free of their tagger and influence the game. And to keep the tagger on edge.

Leaving Hill to deal with it all by himself makes no sense. A couple of solid blocks or shepherds to make the tagger realise it's going to be a long night will make Hill's job easier, and will give him a couple of touches that'll help pick up his confidence. Abandoning a team mate to being monstered all game isn't going to help his development. Judd and Ablett both had the benefit of team mate assistance while they were learning the trade.

 

[prattsta]

He's a big boy now, he can deal with it himself. Judd, Ablett, Goodes. They all learnt how to deal with it. You don't become an elite player by letting someone else do all the hard work for you.

It's not about someone doing the hard work for him. He's still going to need to work bloody hard a la Ablett. It's a team sport though, you help your team mates, in order to help your team. All that 1%er stuff adds up. It's as simple as that.

 

[Moo]

He's a big boy now, he can deal with it himself. Judd, Ablett, Goodes. They all learnt how to deal with it. You don't become an elite player by letting someone else do all the hard work for you.

You become an elite team by grinding down the opposition and making sure you are working for each other.

Taggers should be buffeted, if only to wear them down. They are relatively easy pickings too as they normally have 1 focus.

Hands and then block ....is a basic skill.

Basketball as a skills and tactical sport has close alignment with footy. One of the first things you learn is pass and screen away, and on a fast break once you give then trail the runner so the opponent has to get around you. In footy you can nail the opposition pursuer so you don't even have to teach the subtle angle of it.

Everybody gets physical contact and everybody breaks on that Pies team ...to me their discipline is outstanding. We for whatever reason have dropped off noticeably in this area - it pisses me off.