Hobart F.C at the cross roads

[Kingpin]

:spade: The Mercury: 8 April 2011 - Tigers' TSL extinction battle - Click here

And now we have this crap. FFS...

Let's just wind up a supposedly financially solid club with 70 years of history and 9 TFL premierships because their changerooms aren't good and their lights aren't bright enough, meanwhile we'll keep in clubs like South who have never even made a final in their history at the top level and don't look like it anytime soon.
We'll keep a club in the comp that's still more than $350k in debt and attracts approximately 300 people to its home matches.
Don't this lot realise that the Huon guys aren't interested in stepping up to TSL level?
Southern Districts was founded under the guise of Project 2000, an idea put in place by key people from Kingston, Channel and Sandy Bay Football Clubs' to represent the Kingborough region in TFL football.
It was admitted to the TFL in 1998 in the wake of Sandy Bay's demise and pretty much struggled for its entire 26 match history to attract crowds.
It was led by Denis Fuller, a former Kingston president and prominent businessman in the region.
Channel supporters did not follow it, Kingston Football Club actively undermined the Cats at every turn and their supporters refused to follow it, the only people following them were old Sandy Bay supporters, in the end the old Seagulls fans also turned away from Southern Districts in their droves, the club was leaking money like a seive and their final match drew a paltry 447 to North Hobart.
Denis Fuller stated in the wake of the club being wound up that 'the bold move of establishing a Statewide League club in the Kingborough region was an abject failure'.
Hobart supporters will most definitely NOT support matches involving in Kingborough so their involvement will not be there for a start.

I thought the object of this competition was for clubs to remain 'in profit'?
Perhaps AFL Tasmania can place the goalposts on centre-wing next week, they seem to keep moving them at every opportunity.
If it wasn't for people like Steve Allie, Wiggins etc, the State League would struggle to last the season out due to lack of interest and supporters being fed up with the constant tinkering with the competition by these incompetent muppets at AFL Tasmania.
They surely are kidding themselves.

 

[madmug]

Just listening to the ABC news. They had a report on the confusion within AFL Tas between Dominic Baker & Shaun Young over Hobarts future & bringing in a huon/kingborough team.
Baker was reported to indicate that Hobart wouldnt survive at the TCA, Young saying Hobart are secure at the TCA.
But if they bring in another made up team, who would go? Hobart? Would the 'new' team just be another Southern Cats.
It seams AFL Tas have gotten a little too smart for themselves once again.

'oh what a tangled web we weave, once we practise to deceive'

 

[GreyBudgie]

Just listening to the ABC news. They had a report on the confusion within AFL Tas between Dominic Baker & Shaun Young over Hobarts future & bringing in a huon/kingborough team.
Baker was reported to indicate that Hobart wouldnt survive at the TCA, Young saying Hobart are secure at the TCA.
But if they bring in another made up team, who would go? Hobart? Would the 'new' team just be another Southern Cats.
It seams AFL Tas have gotten a little too smart for themselves once again.

'oh what a tangled web we weave, once we practise to deceive'

so true madmug.. Nothing surprises me with AFL Tasmania they are a law upon themselves seem to change the criteria on the makeup of the SWL on a daily basis Cannot even get on the same page between themselves .
All tigers supporters get to the TCA Tomorrow to stick it up Dominic Baker

 

[madmug]

so true madmug.. Nothing surprises me with AFL Tasmania they are a law upon themselves seem to change the criteria on the makeup of the SWL on a daily basis Cannot even get on the same page between themselves .
All tigers supporters get to the TCA Tomorrow to stick it up Dominic Baker

Hobart FC President Baker just on ABC radio just gave the biggest DUMP on AFLTas, the Hobart city council & the North Hobart Oval. That was a great rant!!!!!. Fighting words infact Lord Mayor Rob Valentine just on now having his right of reply. He's getting his two bobs worth about Hobarts indecision about the TCA or Kingston. Also discussion about the status of the North Hobart Oval. He's complaining about discussions via the media & the need to sit down & talk this through. He was pissed Will this be the making or breaking of Hobart footy club ??????????

 

[GreyBudgie]

:spade: The Mercury: 8 April 2011 - Tigers' TSL extinction battle - Click here

And now we have this crap. FFS...

Let's just wind up a supposedly financially solid club with 70 years of history and 9 TFL premierships because their changerooms aren't good and their lights aren't bright enough, meanwhile we'll keep in clubs like South who have never even made a final in their history at the top level and don't look like it anytime soon.
We'll keep a club in the comp that's still more than $350k in debt and attracts approximately 300 people to its home matches.
Don't this lot realise that the Huon guys aren't interested in stepping up to TSL level?
Southern Districts was founded under the guise of Project 2000, an idea put in place by key people from Kingston, Channel and Sandy Bay Football Clubs' to represent the Kingborough region in TFL football.
It was admitted to the TFL in 1998 in the wake of Sandy Bay's demise and pretty much struggled for its entire 26 match history to attract crowds.
It was led by Denis Fuller, a former Kingston president and prominent businessman in the region.
Channel supporters did not follow it, Kingston Football Club actively undermined the Cats at every turn and their supporters refused to follow it, the only people following them were old Sandy Bay supporters, in the end the old Seagulls fans also turned away from Southern Districts in their droves, the club was leaking money like a seive and their final match drew a paltry 447 to North Hobart.
Denis Fuller stated in the wake of the club being wound up that 'the bold move of establishing a Statewide League club in the Kingborough region was an abject failure'.
Hobart supporters will most definitely NOT support matches involving in Kingborough so their involvement will not be there for a start.

I thought the object of this competition was for clubs to remain 'in profit'?
Perhaps AFL Tasmania can place the goalposts on centre-wing next week, they seem to keep moving them at every opportunity.
If it wasn't for people like Steve Allie, Wiggins etc, the State League would struggle to last the season out due to lack of interest and supporters being fed up with the constant tinkering with the competition by these incompetent muppets at AFL Tasmania.
They surely are kidding themselves.

I like this part from The Mercury Article from Dominic Bakker
“We'd facilitate it all, we'd help manage it all and over a period of time we'd hand the club over to the stakeholders.”
If that’s the case (AFL Tasmania setting up a club in Kingston) it will be the greatest stuff of all time it will make the Southern Cats look like an established institution! Maybe Noel Morrison could be appointed CEO of this new club with Daryn Cresswell as Coach!

 

[stevo148]

Hobart to stay put and grow...

The Mercury here

 

[TACCA]

Acca this, Acca that, front page, back page, what did we ever do without him, what Hobart needs is a bunch of bogans like Glenorchy to burn down the Grand Stand.

 

[GerogeBluth]

Acca this, Acca that, front page, back page, what did we ever do without him, what Hobart needs is a bunch of bogans like Glenorchy to burn down the Grand Stand.

That would make a big improvement to the ground!

 

[Kingpin]

Acca this, Acca that, front page, back page, what did we ever do without him, what Hobart needs is a bunch of bogans like Glenorchy to burn down the Grand Stand.

Bit hard when it's concrete.
They need to get some people back into the club first. That Akermanis Sportsman's Night was an unmitigated disaster from all reports. Only about 15-20 showed up sadly.

PS: That report in the Saturday Mercury by Stubbs was a real hatchet job on Hobart IMHO, cost the club probably 1,000 casuals on the day.
Well done on turning people off coming to the match!

 

[Norchy_pies4life]

Bit hard when it's concrete.
They need to get some people back into the club first. That Akermanis Sportsman's Night was an unmitigated disaster from all reports. Only about 15-20 showed up sadly.

PS: That report in the Saturday Mercury by Stubbs was a real hatchet job on Hobart IMHO, cost the club probably 1,000 casuals on the day.
Well done on turning people off coming to the match!

Thats certainly dissapointing about the sportsmans night. Think they should of promoted it more in advance.

Was thinking about that article when I saw it that morning and thinking that its going to put a lot of people off. That Clinton Brown quote from last year would work in this instance.

Wasn't to bad an atmosphere at times, was on the ground doing the water and there was a decent amount of noise coming from the stand and around the bar. Quite everywhere else.

 

[DOSACHOKER]

Tigers Face Relocation


AFL Tasmania appears intent on driving Hobart out of the dilapidated TCA Ground, confirming yesterday it wants just one State League-standard venue in the Hobart City municipality.
The move comes a week after Hobart president Phil Baker slammed both AFL Tasmania for hindering a potential relocation to the new Kingston Twin Ovals facility and the Hobart City Council for a lack of funds to assist the redevelopment of the TCA.
It is another blow to Hobart's TSL future, which looks considerably vulnerable once the current licence agreement expires at the end of 2013.
The Hobart City Council yesterday issued a release saying council officers had met with Tigers officials to participate in the development of a strategic plan for the TCA footprint.
Alderman Jeff Briscoe also called on Hobart to show it had a clear direction and future after it committed to staying at the Domain.
"I would encourage the club to get on board with the development of a strategic plan to build a greater future for themselves and the TCA," Ald Briscoe said.
But discussions are likely to be worthless, with AFL Tasmania making its intentions clear.
"The council has been advised today that AFL Tasmania, as part of their long-term strategy for statewide football, want to see one State League quality venue in ... Hobart," Ald Briscoe said.
"They have further advised that they want to work with the council over the next 12 months to consolidate North Hobart Oval as sole venue for State League games."
AFL Tasmania continues its belief of declaring a TSL team will be based in the Kingborough municipality from 2014.
With Hobart last week knocking back an offer to relocate and the Kingborough Football Club no chance of being handed a licence, AFL Tasmania will forge ahead by creating a completely new club made up of representatives from Kingborough, Cygnet, Channel, Huonville and Kermandie.
"If there are some funds available to invest in a State League venue in the Hobart City, we are saying why don't we invest in the one venue," AFL Tasmania general manager Scott Wade said on the move to not support upgrades to the TCA.
"So for example, if there was $1 million available to invest, would the $1 million go further at North Hobart than it would at the TCA?
"We are not backing away from the fact that come 2014 we will have a State League team based at Kingborough and we are also not backing away that we think the Hobart Football Club will stagnate.
"We don't want to see them wither on the vine, but we certainly think they will stagnate at best at the TCA."
When asked if AFL Tasmania wanted to see Hobart in the TSL beyond 2013, Wade was blunt about the available options. He said: "Absolutely. But what we want is a club based at Kingborough.
"We'd like the Hobart Football Club to seriously consider that option of relocation."



Seriously Wadey, have a think about it my friend. The TCA is about 3/4 of the way up the Queens Domain, it has car parking and is pretty much away from all housing. It is 3rd in line facilities wise in a sporting precinct which is being progressively developed, it houses a football and cricket club and the city band and is used 12 mths of the year. Now what has Nth Hobart got on its side for redevelopment it's history and your offices. It is in the middle of a suburb, no parking (well no parking that does not disrupt the residents) inability to redesign or redevelop in some degree because the Bowls club will not leave.

Now the HCC 's vision for a developing sporting precinct for the Domain, which financially makes a lot of sense, is going to stop so you can stay within walking/staggering distance of a couple of pubs Wadey and have a redevelopment of your office ?? you are delusional. Yes Nth Hobart should get lights and remain a sporting field but if you want one club facility in Hobart of high quality then it will be the TCA because the council, HFC, NHCC and HCCB will be all involved at one venue, potentially the Tennis centre would benefit as well from corporate and gym facilities and the ground will be part of a precinct, pool, tennis centre, TCA, Domain aths centre, cross roads sporting fields.

The HCC are not stupid, your "my way or the highway" attitude wont rub when it comes to the HCC being told to spend 1 million away from their current plan just to appease you. Get a grip mate, your fiscal ability track record isn't all that flash mate, they wont be coming to you anytime soon for finaincial advice will they, nor will the HFC, if they want to exist that is. Maybe NHFC should relocate to the TCA as co tennants? wasn't that long ago the HCC wanted to offload NH oval, was it Wadey?

 

[WestClub]

This is all becoming a bit ridiculous isnt it?

Hopefully Hobart (and mostly Phil Baker) spends its time wisely during the season building the case for:

a) Redevelopment of the TCA
b) Strengthening the business case of the Hobart Football Club in the TSL

Past history has shown that a team in that area hasnt worked.

Why is the heirarchy so obsessed with making changes to a very immature model?

Stability is the key...

 

[Tim_in_Philly]

This is all becoming a bit ridiculous isnt it?

Hopefully Hobart (and mostly Phil Baker) spends its time wisely during the season building the case for:

a) Redevelopment of the TCA
b) Strengthening the business case of the Hobart Football Club in the TSL

Past history has shown that a team in that area hasnt worked.

Why is the heirarchy so obsessed with making changes to a very immature model?

Stability is the key...

I agree.

Given the change in North Hobart's demographics, the decline in NHO's usage for football now that the TSL is using Bellerive as HQ for big matches, then surely the HCC should sell NHO and use the money to redevelop the TCA. NHO is prime real estate now given North Hobart's trendy inner-city vibe. Then the North Hobart club can choose between Kingborough and the TCA as a home.

I love NHO as much as anyone and have incredibly fond memories of the place but it has become a white elephant. It's time to bite the bullet and make the domain a true sporting precinct worthy of hosting a Commonwealth Games one day. Unfortunately, Tasmanian governments are not known for their vision ....

So Scott Wade wants a team at Kingborough? Then Kingborough has to demonstrate it will support a team at the highest level. They are only an also-ran in the SFL at the moment. Hobart has decades of tradition and if it hadn't been for the idiot leadership they been saddled with in the last 10-20 years, then this topic wouldn't even exist.

 

[madmug]

I agree.

Given the change in North Hobart's demographics, the decline in NHO's usage for football now that the TSL is using Bellerive as HQ for big matches, then surely the HCC should sell NHO and use the money to redevelop the TCA. NHO is prime real estate now given North Hobart's trendy inner-city vibe. Then the North Hobart club can choose between Kingborough and the TCA as a home.

I love NHO as much as anyone and have incredibly fond memories of the place but it has become a white elephant. It's time to bite the bullet and make the domain a true sporting precinct worthy of hosting a Commonwealth Games one day. Unfortunately, Tasmanian governments are not known for their vision ....

So Scott Wade wants a team at Kingborough? Then Kingborough has to demonstrate it will support a team at the highest level. They are only an also-ran in the SFL at the moment. Hobart has decades of tradition and if it hadn't been for the idiot leadership they been saddled with in the last 10-20 years, then this topic wouldn't even exist.

Its obvious that the HCC cant spend the necessary money on both the TCA & NHO. The HCC are full of Latte sippers, they hate sport (footy anyway) Certainly they cant sell NHO as their is already a shortage of sports grounds in the NH area & its zoned for sport/recreation Also the current infrastructure is worth millions of $$ to replace or build somewhere else. It would need $10million to upgrade the TCA to replace the NHO. I cant see that happening.
So what do we do? Is it doomsday for Hobart. Will NH & HFC amalgamate? If so, where would they play out of?
The real footy disaster will be if AFL Tas try to start some new unloved club at the new Kingston oval.

 

[frankly]

I agree.

Given the change in North Hobart's demographics, the decline in NHO's usage for football now that the TSL is using Bellerive as HQ for big matches, then surely the HCC should sell NHO and use the money to redevelop the TCA. NHO is prime real estate now given North Hobart's trendy inner-city vibe. Then the North Hobart club can choose between Kingborough and the TCA as a home.

I love NHO as much as anyone and have incredibly fond memories of the place but it has become a white elephant. It's time to bite the bullet and make the domain a true sporting precinct worthy of hosting a Commonwealth Games one day. Unfortunately, Tasmanian governments are not known for their vision ....

So Scott Wade wants a team at Kingborough? Then Kingborough has to demonstrate it will support a team at the highest level. They are only an also-ran in the SFL at the moment. Hobart has decades of tradition and if it hadn't been for the idiot leadership they been saddled with in the last 10-20 years, then this topic wouldn't even exist.

you must be taking the piss. this present government can't build a little bridge at brighton. and you think they can underwrite a commonwealth games.
i think you might find the leasing of north hobart oval to the footy club is the sticking point with selling it. you sell a property to someone whilst its leased the new owner takes responsibility for the lease. that means by law the footy club can stay on til the lease runs out.

 

[brutus67]

Have they had the covers on the centre wicket at all this week? that is half the problem up there, the ground is not managed properly.

 

[Cure]

I don’t think that the upgrading of the TCA would be as expensive as $10 million dollars, but substantial money does need to be spent. I suppose it just depends on what you want to upgrade to whether you want just a state league ground that could comfortably host about 5-6000 people or something much bigger. Regardless of what you read in the paper’s the lights look like a lock in, whilst they won’t be to Bellerive and Aurora standard they should be pretty decent non-the-less. The biggest expense would be a facility like Glenorchy’s new grandstand which should be built where the roofless area now sits as the football and cricket clubs and the Hobart City Band need a large function centre. Because a 2 story structure would only be approximately the same height as the current structure there wouldn’t be as many planning issues as you would think. The home change rooms can be built underneath with a gym plus male and female toilets. The opposition change rooms could relocate to the current bar area underneath the Powell, Pascoe, Payne Stand which is a big area and could make good change rooms if retrofitted correctly (included stopping the leaking), the plumbing is already there for showers and toilets so it wouldn’t take much. The ground also needs a fair bit of work levelling out but on the plus side it is a wide enough surface (unlike NHO) and could easily be extended by going into the grass bank at the top end. The ground also needs a proper scoreboard but it only really needs to about the standard of the one at South Launceston. The heritage stands could remain, but a fixing up of the Powell, Pascoe Payne Stand would be required as it needs a new roof, it needs to be made watertight and perhaps the seating could be changed over from bench to buckets. It provides a pretty good vantage point so it wouldn’t need to be demolished and replaced. I think coaches boxes are going to be installed on the present Hobart change rooms this year so that would take care of that issue. Perhaps some terracing on one of the grass banks might provide better spectator amenity but apart from that I’m not too sure what else would be required to take the ground up to a reasonable (non-final) facility. It’s not like you have to build a ground capable of hosting 20,000 people. I’m not sure of any of these figures but just for example I think Glenorchy’s Grandstand cost $3 million, if you put another $1 million extending and fixing up the playing surface, and spend $1million fixing up the other facilities (e.g. $175,000 converting bar to visitor change rooms, $275,000 fixing grandstand roof and replacing seats, $150,000 on new scoreboard, $100,000 for new terracing on either western or northern bank and $300,000 for other various things such as a new ground announce system, updated and extended kiosk, etc) you could get it all done for half of the $10 million which whilst sounds a lot could be achievable.

 

[WestClub]

I agree Cure. While most of the facilities look to be outdated there is enough there to build over the existing sub-structure and create a reasonable quality ground.

 

[JM71]

(included stopping the leaking)

Definitely agree with all of your points here. In regards to the leaks in the Tiger Den, the HCC is supposed to be fixing the leaking in the next few weeks.

 

[Kingpin]

...Or Hobart could sit down with North Hobart, DOSA and the Council and find out once and for all exactly which ground is likely to have the most money spent on it.
According to Daryn Perry today, the North Hobart Oval 'is getting closer to getting lights' (how many years has this been going on for?).
I believe Hobart should work with rather than against the Council and if it's proven that North Hobart will receive the bulk of the capital being spent on it, then the Tigers should look seriously at relocating their offices and social facilities to North Hobart Oval in the Plaister Stand.
North Hobart and DOSA seem to be getting on well, so perhaps DOSA could be relocated around to the disused former Devils Bar in the upper-southern end of the Horrie Gorringe Stand, another sporting organisation could use the office facilities at the other end and North Hobart would remain in the pavilion on the ground floor.
Hobart does have an image problem of extreme unprofessionalism and the facts are that playing up the TCA is somewhat of a hindrance to getting good quality recruits to play and coach the club and it's not a ground looked on by many players or spectators all that favourably either, so having a better facility to be based in at North Hobart would go a long way towards increasing our professionalism.
Imagine having the sponsorship hoardings on the front of our stand with our club emblem on it and a sign on the back saying "Welcome to North Hobart Oval - Home of the Hobart Football Club Inc. The 'Optus' Tigers"
Looks neat, tidy, credible and certainly more inviting than that ugly grey breeze block building that the club's currently in and where we can't plug our sponsors adequately because of heritage issues.
Of course, that's not the club's only problem but it would be a good start and given that the Council controls who does what at the ground, it would be easier to make sure no club undercuts each other with misuse of kiosks and bars like what used to happen in the 1990's.
The fact is, for all the ranting Hobart has done at the Council, the Council's only owned the ground for 12 years and they most definitely have done a fair bit of work to the ground in the time they've owned it, just that the previous owner of the ground (State Government) had let the ground fall to pieces and the amount of work required to fix the problems ran well into the millions.
I remember what the ground looked like in 1998, it is a far better facility now than it was then.

Certainly a better idea than this peanut thought of moving to Kingborough.

 

[whisper...]

...
North Hobart and DOSA seem to be getting on well, so perhaps DOSA could be relocated around to the disused former Devils Bar in the upper-southern end of the Horrie Gorringe Stand,.

And why should DOSA relocate??

They've taken the initiative and got themselves based at North Hobart. Why should they move for Hobart FC?

 

[Kingpin]

And why should DOSA relocate??

They've taken the initiative and got themselves based at North Hobart. Why should they move for Hobart FC?

Three clubs (two of them State League ones) based at the one venue would hold greater power at getting works done at the ground.
I can see your argument yes, but do you seriously think it would be a great idea having North Hobart and Hobart sharing the one stand?
At least DOSA and North have a partnership in someways and work well together, and they would still have very good facilities.
Also, DOSA has no say in it, they don't own the stand or building, they lease it off the Hobart City Council and if they're told to move up the other end then to make way for another club, then they'd have too.
Hobart can virtually kiss goodbye any real chance of having the TCA restored to suitable standard after Philip Baker's on-air run-in with Rob Valentine the other week.
The Council were apparently extremely unimpressed with that whole episode.

The time's come where it needs to be spelt out, which ground is going to have major works done? TCA or North Hobart?
It may end up that the TCA is the one that gets renovated (wouldn't hold your breath mind you) because of residential complaints over lights, parking issues and noise at North Hobart and it'll need to be sorted out so as all clubs can work out where they want to be.
Bit pointless having two State League clubs playing 1.5 kms apart with both grounds needing improvements.
Better off to centralise it all, make the necessary improvements, put stringent rules in place and get things moving forward.

Or we could just sit there playing politics, nitpicking over every little issue and go nowhere....

 

[whisper...]

How long is DOSAs arrangement in place for to play games at NHO?

Not going to work with 3 teams wanting to play home games there every alternate week!

What needs to be done at NHO?
Playing field looked pretty damn good on tele after a weeks rain!!

Can see where your coming from, but I can't see it working with 2 TSL teams using same venue.
Both teams as far as I know train Mon, Tues and Thurs

 

[Kingpin]

How long is DOSAs arrangement in place for to play games at NHO?

I'm not quite sure to be honest mate, Ummm I know they were desperate to get away from totally substandard facilities at Cadbury's and it was a good move for them and their supporters to go to North Hobart, I can't see them wanting to go anywhere else and it's really good to hear that they have a good relationship with North too.

Not going to work with 3 teams wanting to play home games there every alternate week!

It used to have North Hobart, Hobart and Sandy Bay playing there as late as 14 years ago.
Obviously there'd need to be some good planning done with rosters etc, but it could work well. Having said that, the playing surface would need to be watched carefully if the weather got like it did this week.
Don't think anyone trained on North Hobart this week after the huge downpour, the TCA had a 70m pool of water stretching along the wing to the pocket in front of the Powell-Pascoe-Payne Stand and almost to the square after that rain so that was off limits.
But there'd have to be some good planning done (yeah I hear ya already, it's Tassie - no such thing as good planning ).

What needs to be done at NHO?
Playing field looked pretty damn good on tele after a weeks rain!!

Looks fantastic doesn't it? Best I've ever seen North Hobart looking.
New scoreboard will be up and running shortly, probably just a few minor touchups and of course, lights.

Can see where your coming from, but I can't see it working with 2 TSL teams using same venue.
Both teams as far as I know train Mon, Tues and Thurs

Yeah like I say, it'd need working out as to who trains where, when etc, but I just wonder if they all went in together to get the job done, whether things would progress quicker than Hobart's rather ill-fated approach in fighting with the Council. Bit like biting the hands that's feeds them so-to-speak.
Took KGV 25 years to get lights, wonder how long it'll take to do that in the inner-city?

 

[whisper...]

Took KGV 25 years to get lights, wonder how long it'll take to do that in the inner-city?

How long has it been in the pipeline already?? I know it was promised by Gov in run in too the last election, but have heard pretty much nothing since

Whats the TCA going to be like for Fridays game Kp?
Suppose to rain most of next week, and i imagine after the rain we've had already, there would be a lot of water still on the ground?