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Lets Get Excited

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Santa's assessment of the future of our 22 positions after we win a premiership.

FB * * *
HB * * deledio
C * cotchin *
HF * * *
FF * reiwoldt *
FOLL * martin *
INT * * *
 
Ruanaidh said:
A reality check was well and truly overdue. A few puff-pieces in the Hun is serving to encourage some mass-delusion methinks. A 10-12 finish for the year would be about right.
Click to expand...
I can assure you that my opinion has nothing to do with a few puff pieces in the paper this weekend.
 
RT73 said:
Its been 10 years since out last finals appearance and over that period we have spent nearly every year talking down our chances of having success.

Its like we seem to be afraid of anything that talks up our chances, even the article in todays paper has posters asking why we're pumping up our tyres.

The question I have to ask is what are we so afraid of?
Click to expand...

Were you afraid of anything in particular when you talked us down all 2011?

You even went as far as to make the argument that it would have been bad for us to play finals because we might get beaten badly. That doesn't apply for 2012?

RT73 said:
So what if we get excited about our chances and it blows up in our faces. Its got to be better than expecting us to fail all the time.
Click to expand...

We should aim to play finals every year and walk in with that attitude.
I'm wondering why people aren't unhappy that our captain is STILL afraid to say "we want to play finals this year, we think we're good enough and anything else is unacceptable."
 

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Madtiger2006 said:
Santa's assessment of the future of our 22 positions after we win a premiership.

FB * * *
HB * * deledio
C * cotchin *
HF * * *
FF * reiwoldt *
FOLL * martin *
INT * * *
Click to expand...

lol madtigs. im excited about lots of things to do with the club.and i agree there is no harm in being excited about the direction we are headed in just so long as its not over the top and people dont end up cutting up membership cards and the media rip into us when things dont pan out the way we want them to.

you want a positive

b/ morris - rance maybe. - grimes
hb/ batchelor - post maybe - ellis.
c/ deledio - cotchin - conca
hf/ macdonald - riewoldt - houli
f/ elton - griffiths - connors maybe.
r/ vickery if hes a ruckman - martin - foley.
int/ helbig - astbury - dea - arnott -browne maybe.
emg/ derickx maybe.

thats the longer term future it has promise. but it is still only what? 25 players. of which a lot are unproven. there is lots of questions about the talls and the short term says we are very young and inexperienced.
there are more each yr we can pencil in as certs but clearly the road is long and we have a way to go.

to me its more of the same no expectations but get games into kids and find out asap who is up to standard and who is not.

for me ruck chf chb and fb is up in the air we may not have the future on the list even.sml med forwards are a problem and midfield depth is still a problem.
unlike most im patient and i think realistic about where exactly we are at.
are we heading in the right direction yep i think we are to me thats should be a given and nothing to get excited about.

we are at a stage where we do need to value add where possible bring in mature players. we also need to keep on targeting kids in the nd we sure could do with another 4 picks inside the top 30 40 next yr. we likely have 3 already 1st rnd 2nd rnd and krakouer compensation pick.some more real genuine quality please.

just want to add theres about 18 on that list who are not established consistent afl players but it is our future. it seems most rate them as if theyhave already made it. me i will wait for them to consitently show they up to it and rate them accordingly.
all clubs have a list as long as your arm of potential future players.
promise or potential does not mean you have made it.
 
Rayzorwire said:
Were you afraid of anything in particular when you talked us down all 2011?

You even went as far as to make the argument that it would have been bad for us to play finals because we might get beaten badly. That doesn't apply for 2012?
Click to expand...
Yes I talked our chances down last year, I don't hide from that. The reason I did that was there were too many unanswered questions like who would step up and support Jack? Would Foley and Cotchin get through the season? Who was going to step up and lead the backline?

This time around I have less questions to be answered. In fact the only one I can think of at the moment is who will fill the void at CHB? For mine its either Astbury or Post, either one of them has a Rance type breakout year and we're on our way to the 8.


We should aim to play finals every year and walk in with that attitude.
I'm wondering why people aren't unhappy that our captain is STILL afraid to say "we want to play finals this year, we think we're good enough and anything else is unacceptable."
Click to expand...
Little point walking in with that attitude when you know deep down inside its not true. As for Newman being afraid to say we want to play finals this year. He has been around long enough to know how any official from our club saying that is used by the media. They will wheel it out after the first poor performance and use it to put pressure on the club to do something like sack the coach.

Judging by what has been said by the club without actually coming out and saying it I reckon they feel confident that this year will be the year we take the next step.
 
santa claws said:
lol madtigs. im excited about lots of things to do with the club.and i agree there is no harm in being excited about the direction we are headed in just so long as its not over the top and people dont end up cutting up membership cards and the media rip into us when things dont pan out the way we want them to.

you want a positive

b/ morris - rance maybe. - grimes
hb/ batchelor - post maybe - ellis.
c/ deledio - cotchin - conca
hf/ macdonald - riewoldt - houli
f/ elton - griffiths - connors maybe.
r/ vickery if hes a ruckman - martin - foley.
int/ helbig - astbury - dea - arnott -browne maybe.
emg/ derickx maybe.

thats the longer term future it has promise. but it is still only what? 25 players. of which a lot are unproven. there is lots of questions about the talls and the short term says we are very young and inexperienced.
there are more each yr we can pencil in as certs but clearly the road is long and we have a way to go.

to me its more of the same no expectations but get games into kids and find out asap who is up to standard and who is not.

for me ruck chf chb and fb is up in the air we may not have the future on the list even.sml med forwards are a problem and midfield depth is still a problem.
unlike most im patient and i think realistic about where exactly we are at.
are we heading in the right direction yep i think we are to me thats should be a given and nothing to get excited about.

we are at a stage where we do need to value add where possible bring in mature players. we also need to keep on targeting kids in the nd we sure could do with another 4 picks inside the top 30 40 next yr. we likely have 3 already 1st rnd 2nd rnd and krakouer compensation pick.some more real genuine quality please.

just want to add theres about 18 on that list who are not established consistent afl players but it is our future. it seems most rate them as if theyhave already made it. me i will wait for them to consitently show they up to it and rate them accordingly.
all clubs have a list as long as your arm of potential future players.
promise or potential does not mean you have made it.
Click to expand...
Thats more like it Claws. :thumbsu::D

Don't you feel better for that little outburst of enthusiasm
 
santa claws said:
lol madtigs. im excited about lots of things to do with the club.and i agree there is no harm in being excited about the direction we are headed in just so long as its not over the top and people dont end up cutting up membership cards and the media rip into us when things dont pan out the way we want them to.

you want a positive

b/ morris - rance maybe. - grimes
hb/ batchelor - post maybe - ellis.
c/ deledio - cotchin - conca
hf/ macdonald - riewoldt - houli
f/ elton - griffiths - connors maybe.
r/ vickery if hes a ruckman - martin - foley.
int/ helbig - astbury - dea - arnott -browne maybe.
emg/ derickx maybe.

thats the longer term future it has promise. but it is still only what? 25 players. of which a lot are unproven. there is lots of questions about the talls and the short term says we are very young and inexperienced.
there are more each yr we can pencil in as certs but clearly the road is long and we have a way to go.

to me its more of the same no expectations but get games into kids and find out asap who is up to standard and who is not.

for me ruck chf chb and fb is up in the air we may not have the future on the list even.sml med forwards are a problem and midfield depth is still a problem.
unlike most im patient and i think realistic about where exactly we are at.
are we heading in the right direction yep i think we are to me thats should be a given and nothing to get excited about.

we are at a stage where we do need to value add where possible bring in mature players. we also need to keep on targeting kids in the nd we sure could do with another 4 picks inside the top 30 40 next yr. we likely have 3 already 1st rnd 2nd rnd and krakouer compensation pick.some more real genuine quality please.

just want to add theres about 18 on that list who are not established consistent afl players but it is our future. it seems most rate them as if theyhave already made it. me i will wait for them to consitently show they up to it and rate them accordingly.
all clubs have a list as long as your arm of potential future players.
promise or potential does not mean you have made it.
Click to expand...

You're getting warmer :eek::thumbsu:
 
RT73 said:
When it comes to the draft you're all for taking a gamble and saying what have we got to lose by taking a chance, but when it comes to talking up the clubs chances of making finals, you seem less inclined to show the same what have we got to lose attitude.
Click to expand...

I think you nailed SC fair and square there RT... :thumbsu: ...
 
RT73 said:
Yes I talked our chances down last year, I don't hide from that. The reason I did that was there were too many unanswered questions like who would step up and support Jack? Would Foley and Cotchin get through the season? Who was going to step up and lead the backline?

This time around I have less questions to be answered. In fact the only one I can think of at the moment is who will fill the void at CHB? For mine its either Astbury or Post, either one of them has a Rance type breakout year and we're on our way to the 8.
Click to expand...

I'd say there's very nearly as many question marks as last year, but I don't think they're things to be 'afraid of' in terms of not expecting a finals experience.

You didn't answer the second question.

RT73 said:
Little point walking in with that attitude when you know deep down inside its not true. As for Newman being afraid to say we want to play finals this year. He has been around long enough to know how any official from our club saying that is used by the media. They will wheel it out after the first poor performance and use it to put pressure on the club to do something like sack the coach.
Click to expand...

They will wheel it out all year anyway - it's his 3rd season as coach, the honeymoon was over after the 2nd Carlton game last year and the losses to Port and GC. The solution is, don't fail (again).

You're hopeful that supporters here won't talk down our season and will get excited about finals, but our captain runs from the mere mention of finals because he's frightened of the consequences of failure and clearly believes there's a significant chance we will fail (again).

Call me old fashioned, but I'd like a leader who refuses to fail this time around, talks like it when questioned on the subject and instills that same refusal to fail in the rest of his teammates.
 
Rayzorwire said:
I'd say there's very nearly as many question marks as last year, but I don't think they're things to be 'afraid of' in terms of not expecting a finals experience.

You didn't answer the second question.
Click to expand...
Thought I answered the 2 questions with the 1 answer. But to satisfy you no it doesn't.



They will wheel it out all year anyway - it's his 3rd season as coach, the honeymoon was over after the 2nd Carlton game last year and the losses to Port and GC. The solution is, don't fail (again).

You're hopeful that supporters here won't talk down our season and will get excited about finals, but our captain runs from the mere mention of finals because he's frightened of the consequences of failure and clearly believes there's a significant chance we will fail (again).

Call me old fashioned, but I'd like a leader who refuses to fail this time around, talks like it when questioned on the subject and instills that same refusal to fail in the rest of his teammates.
Click to expand...
I would suggest Newmans response was more to do with him and the club not wanting to be seen to be getting ahead of himself/themselves. As I said from what I have heard there is a quiet confidence amongst the group that this year is the start of something special.
 

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peejay said:
Depends. Did we get the best two in the draft again?
Click to expand...

Not that I am across the draft prospects, but I would suggest no 1 pick this year is a name thats going to pretty much take the comp by storm in the next decade. So no we didnt, but tipping we didnt do to badly either.
Would suggest that Ellis is going to be the Brent Guerra type that we need patrolling HB.
Would have loved having no 1 this year, that Patton kid is a monster with presence, that has Jonno Brown written all over him. ;)
 
RT73 said:
Thought I answered the 2 questions with the 1 answer. But to satisfy you no it doesn't.
Click to expand...

What's the difference between last season and the coming one?

And no, you didn't answer the question, that would involve typing something along the lines of "yes, I did think that making finals would be destructive for our side in 2011, because they would certainly get badly beaten, it would shatter their confidence and hinder their development, but this year, for [insert unfathomable reasons] I think it's a totally different situation, therefore I'm arguing the exact opposite."

Just trying to be helpful. ;)
 
Rayzorwire said:
I'd say there's very nearly as many question marks as last year, but I don't think they're things to be 'afraid of' in terms of not expecting a finals experience.

You didn't answer the second question.



They will wheel it out all year anyway - it's his 3rd season as coach, the honeymoon was over after the 2nd Carlton game last year and the losses to Port and GC. The solution is, don't fail (again).

You're hopeful that supporters here won't talk down our season and will get excited about finals, but our captain runs from the mere mention of finals because he's frightened of the consequences of failure and clearly believes there's a significant chance we will fail (again).

Call me old fashioned, but I'd like a leader who refuses to fail this time around, talks like it when questioned on the subject and instills that same refusal to fail in the rest of his teammates.
Click to expand...

on a rare occasion I wholeheartedly agree rayz....Not sure what book of success comes the failure to commit chapter. id much prefer our club be bullish about what our immediate goals are rather than sheepishly dance around it like we almost need an invite to play finals football. Come out and make a stance I say...use any great leader in HISTORY as a precedent
 
I expect finals in 2012 and so would the team quietly. This is the best tigers team on paper i have seen in a long time and only getting better each year. Forget the last 2 decades this is a new Richmond plenty to look forward to. :thumbsu:
 

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Your strike rate of being proven correct would go through the roof if you agreed with me more often Bo. ;)

Bojangles17 said:
id much prefer our club be bullish about what our immediate goals are rather than sheepishly dance around it like we almost need an invite to play finals football.
Click to expand...

It's fear IMO, from the top down, they're always so frightened of the consequences of failure.

You need to short circuit that kind of thinking, really believe in your ability and have no fear, or it comes out in games at the worst possible times. The famous 'oh no, here we go again' Richmond moments when nobody wants to lead by example, they all go into their shells and no coach on earth could drag them back from that terrible place where their fear and lack of belief has taken them.

Bojangles17 said:
Come out and make a stance I say...use any great leader in HISTORY as a precedent
Click to expand...

And of course, we have our own special history of great leaders. I often think to myself on club issues...'what would Jack think/say?'...and then the right course of action and the wrong course of action to become successful are often pretty obvious. IMO, he'd read that article and the statements from our captain and wonder why the hell even the captain of the club doesn't have the balls, courage and leadership to just commit and deliver.

There's nothing wrong with taking a stance like the Roos did this year - say we always aim for and expect to play finals, anything else is considered unacceptable, and if you do fall short (as they did this year) then you commit to go fix it over the pre-season.
 
Anyone over the age of 35 should know better than to start threads like this

Rhetoric .. based on ?

Most of our "Guns" have nothing more then a season or 2 of good footy behind them .

Putting players up on pedastals with barely any proven miles in them has worked so well for us before hasnt it :thumbsu:

Quietly confident and optimistic is a much wiser approach IMHO
 
Rayzorwire said:
What's the difference between last season and the coming one?

And no, you didn't answer the question, that would involve typing something along the lines of "yes, I did think that making finals would be destructive for our side in 2011, because they would certainly get badly beaten, it would shatter their confidence and hinder their development, but this year, for [insert unfathomable reasons] I think it's a totally different situation, therefore I'm arguing the exact opposite."

Just trying to be helpful. ;)
Click to expand...
As I said in my initial response, last year I had a lot more concerns about our list last year than I do this year. Therefore I don't think we will get beaten badly. In fact I'm quite confident that we'll be able to match it with most of the top 8, outside say Geelong and Collingwood.
 

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