Lloyd!

[Simon_Nesbit]

I'd just like to say, that the game this week was the most impressive I've seen from Lloyd in a LOOOONG time. (My dad's a Bombers supporter, so I probably see 10-12 of your games a year).

Admittadly I didn't watch the whole game intently like I would a Hawks game, but I saw him go for contested pack marks, even splitting packs open. He went for the hard-ball, and didn't just give up when the ball went to ground.

If I didn't know better I would have thought I was watching the late 90's model - when he was close to (if not the) best FF in the game.

I guess my questions are these:

When/why/how did the diving/umpire-look thing start? It has been (certainly from my perspective) something that has dramatically held him back in my regards for him (not that it would matter to him) as a player. He was a good (3+ per week) goal-kicker before that, and if anything, I think he has deteriorated over the last 5 years or so (around the same time his 'acting' has become more noticeable).

Has he been carrying a long-term injury? (thinking lower back, groin, OP, etc - something affecting mobility and core-strength?) or is it simply a case of the 'easy option' in a player who might not have the 'edge' to battle through minor injury/stronger opponent/greater willpower/etc?

And finally, is this the Lloyd we will see from now on? (Working harder up the field, contesting for ball, not diving and staring at the ump (as much)?

I hope so. Especially given the likelihood of a new coach requiring internal leadership (something he doesn't exactly exude on the field - admittadly pretty hard from FF), do you think the Lloyd we saw on the weekend is the 'real' Lloyd, or was it a fluke/coincidence/one-off match?

PS: This is not a troll, so please don't take it as such. FWIW I'm a hawks fan (so of course have to hate Essendon), but I'd like to feel I can appreciate a good footballer when I see one.

 

[Kaiser Powser]

I'd just like to say, that the game this week was the most impressive I've seen from Lloyd in a LOOOONG time. (My dad's a Bombers supporter, so I probably see 10-12 of your games a year).

Admittadly I didn't watch the whole game intently like I would a Hawks game, but I saw him go for contested pack marks, even splitting packs open. He went for the hard-ball, and didn't just give up when the ball went to ground.

If I didn't know better I would have thought I was watching the late 90's model - when he was close to (if not the) best FF in the game.

I guess my questions are these:

When/why/how did the diving/umpire-look thing start? It has been (certainly from my perspective) something that has dramatically held him back in my regards for him (not that it would matter to him) as a player. He was a good (3+ per week) goal-kicker before that, and if anything, I think he has deteriorated over the last 5 years or so (around the same time his 'acting' has become more noticeable).

Has he been carrying a long-term injury? (thinking lower back, groin, OP, etc - something affecting mobility and core-strength?) or is it simply a case of the 'easy option' in a player who might not have the 'edge' to battle through minor injury/stronger opponent/greater willpower/etc?

And finally, is this the Lloyd we will see from now on? (Working harder up the field, contesting for ball, not diving and staring at the ump (as much)?

I hope so. Especially given the likelihood of a new coach requiring internal leadership (something he doesn't exactly exude on the field - admittadly pretty hard from FF), do you think the Lloyd we saw on the weekend is the 'real' Lloyd, or was it a fluke/coincidence/one-off match?

PS: This is not a troll, so please don't take it as such. FWIW I'm a hawks fan (so of course have to hate Essendon), but I'd like to feel I can appreciate a good footballer when I see one.

Not sure when the 'diving' issue was raised. I think it was by Robert Walls in the early 00's. Once it was raised Lloyd went for a couple of seasons without getting any free kicks for 'in the back'.

As for his fitness/form, his last few years have been badly effected. He broke his arm at the start of 05, and I think that affected his confidence. He tore his hammy from the bone early last year which he hasn't, and may not fully recover from.

So from when he missed the Coleman by a goal in 04, he has been in a slump due to injuries and confidence.

 

[Don Envy]

I think Lloyd works harder than he ever has in his career at doing the 'team' things, which as captain you would expect him to do, however I do think that his effectiveness as a FF has gone backwards.

Admittingly, the supply coming his way is not what it used to be, but I've noticed that he doesn't hold as many marks when on a hard lead as he used to. Also, his accuracy isn't as good as it has been, especially when playing on and he kicks those bouncing, end over end snap shots.

I also have noticed that he is mistiming his leads and going way too early as a lot of kicks are going over his head and he's having to double back. This could also be the sh1t delivery our midfielders dish up

 

[bomberstomake8]

I'd just like to say, that the game this week was the most impressive I've seen from Lloyd in a LOOOONG time. (My dad's a Bombers supporter, so I probably see 10-12 of your games a year).

Admittadly I didn't watch the whole game intently like I would a Hawks game, but I saw him go for contested pack marks, even splitting packs open. He went for the hard-ball, and didn't just give up when the ball went to ground.

If I didn't know better I would have thought I was watching the late 90's model - when he was close to (if not the) best FF in the game.

I guess my questions are these:

When/why/how did the diving/umpire-look thing start? It has been (certainly from my perspective) something that has dramatically held him back in my regards for him (not that it would matter to him) as a player. He was a good (3+ per week) goal-kicker before that, and if anything, I think he has deteriorated over the last 5 years or so (around the same time his 'acting' has become more noticeable).

Has he been carrying a long-term injury? (thinking lower back, groin, OP, etc - something affecting mobility and core-strength?) or is it simply a case of the 'easy option' in a player who might not have the 'edge' to battle through minor injury/stronger opponent/greater willpower/etc?

And finally, is this the Lloyd we will see from now on? (Working harder up the field, contesting for ball, not diving and staring at the ump (as much)?

I hope so. Especially given the likelihood of a new coach requiring internal leadership (something he doesn't exactly exude on the field - admittadly pretty hard from FF), do you think the Lloyd we saw on the weekend is the 'real' Lloyd, or was it a fluke/coincidence/one-off match?

PS: This is not a troll, so please don't take it as such. FWIW I'm a hawks fan (so of course have to hate Essendon), but I'd like to feel I can appreciate a good footballer when I see one.

everyone is saying this is lloyds worst year. shows how good he is, in his worst year he has still kicked 51.24... the diving this is so greatley exagerated... people just hate lloyd, always have, it stems from jeolously.. its exactly the same as what he was critisised for in 2005... everyone thought he was by far the longest player in the league in terms of time when taking a set shot at goal.. but when they took the averages fevola took like an extra 6 seconds on average... everyone hates lloyd so the whole diving thing is exagerated. every FF dives from time to time. lloyd probably still does it too much but nowhere near the amount people think he does... if you watch lloyd 75% of the time the ball will go over his head because our midfeild cant kick... and yet if you watch nearly everytime he is beating his opponent back to the ball. if he dives constantly how come he is more often then not beating his opponent to the ball when it goes over his head?

the midfeild thing is embarassing, we have no1 that can run and caryr, our forwards get very limited opportunities and when they are given one more often then not its a shithouse kick... its easy to kick a lot of goals when your midfeild is the best in the league eg franklin but whats difficult is kicking a lot of goals with the worst midfeild in the league kicking it to you eg lloyd

 

[Barwick17]

everyone is saying this is lloyds worst year. shows how good he is, in his worst year he has still kicked 51.24... the diving this is so greatley exagerated... people just hate lloyd, always have, it stems from jeolously.. its exactly the same as what he was critisised for in 2005... everyone thought he was by far the longest player in the league in terms of time when taking a set shot at goal.. but when they took the averages fevola took like an extra 6 seconds on average... everyone hates lloyd so the whole diving thing is exagerated. every FF dives from time to time. lloyd probably still does it too much but nowhere near the amount people think he does... if you watch lloyd 75% of the time the ball will go over his head because our midfeild cant kick... and yet if you watch nearly everytime he is beating his opponent back to the ball. if he dives constantly how come he is more often then not beating his opponent to the ball when it goes over his head?

the midfeild thing is embarassing, we have no1 that can run and caryr, our forwards get very limited opportunities and when they are given one more often then not its a shithouse kick... its easy to kick a lot of goals when your midfeild is the best in the league eg franklin but whats difficult is kicking a lot of goals with the worst midfeild in the league kicking it to you eg lloyd

Your comments are spot on except for the "exaggerated diving". I watch a lot of Essendon games and he can become preoccupied with free kicks, i think usually because he gets a bad call once or twice so he then fakes often believe that he is owed a few. It takes great FF to kick goals in good and bad times, he is great but needs to be bull at a gate type in his demeanour.

 

[Minglis]

It all went to crap when he broke his arm. Ever since he has been iffy about putting his arms out to take a strong pack mark.

I dont think weve seen the end of "the best of Lloyd" yet. If his injury run from hell is over, 08-09 are going to be 80+ seasons.

 

[retroparty]

It all went to crap when he broke his arm. Ever since he has been iffy about putting his arms out to take a strong pack mark.

I dont think weve seen the end of "the best of Lloyd" yet. If his injury run from hell is over, 08-09 are going to be 80+ seasons.

Only if we get the quality delivery into the forward line

 

[Bomber4eva]

Had a good game on the weekend, probably his best for the season which is great. Definitely a diver but imo it's more often a result of the way he jumps (forward) than him appealing to the umpire.

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

Kinda went off on a tangent, I wasn't criticizing his diving (well actually I was, but it wasn't the point of my post - I think everyone accepts he dives more than the average player?).

If I can call on another unsuitable player (first one springs to mind) is Campbell Brown (hawthorn). He's 5'10, and is currently playing CHB for our mob. He's quick, but not the quickest, got a good leap, and reasonably strong, but he honestly doesn't have any right to stand next to Pavlich, Riewoldt, Lucas, etc, etc. The fact that he does (and then genuinely beats them) is proof of an extremely high determination, he literally wills himself to succeed. He'd be close to top-50 (and AA) this season, yet purely on talent, he'd be lucky to make any teams 22.

My opinion (fwiw) is that Lloyd has lacked that particular ingredient in his career. Not every player needs it of course (Lloyd's done pretty well for himself regardless), and it's not always displayed in a direct way (competing for the ball - instead it might be the gut-busting 100m leads late in the last quarter) - but it is something that all 'Great' players seem to have. Lloyd has/(had) the potential to be 'Great', but seemed to have become stuck in the 'Good/V.Good' range.

The weekend was a revelation to me in that it didn't appear to be his 'normal' self. The question I ask is, is this the 'old' Lloyd returning? (confidence/fitness back), or is this a 'new' Lloyd (maturing perhaps?) - Or just a flash in the pan?

 

[mxett]

Of course I might be biased, because I like Lloydy, but I think he occasionally becomes disheartened by the lack of frees coming his way, and then does look at the umpires on occasion to see if they will pay a free. BUT the diving issue is rubbish and always has been.

The fact is that one of the reasons he is such a great FF is that he can run full speed at a ball coming his way, and at the last minute he dives at the ball to gain a distance advantage over his opponent.
This is a great skill and means he can outmark a backman even when they are with him on the lead. Problem is when he drops the ball or is spoilt. Then people start screaming "dived!!" They are right, he has dived, not for the free, but for the ball. Its not Lloyds fault that occasionally umpires see this as a push in the back when it isnt. These diving accusations are just from jealous and frustrated opposition fans.

 

[wazzabp]

Played very well, this should be the way he plays every week, not just because hes been crucified by the media.

 

[evs05]

Not sure when the 'diving' issue was raised. I think it was by Robert Walls in the early 00's.

I think it was actually the oxygen thief Gieschen. He instructed the umpires that Lloyd "stages" for free kicks and to watch out for it, which of course they interpreted as "do not give him any free kicks".

I've been disappointed with Lloyd's attitude this year. Particularly against Adelaide and the Hawks - the ump glaring was appauling behaviour for a captain. Didn't see the game on Sunday but hopefully a new coach can set him back on the right path and he can get back to his best in 2008.