luciano

[go fullta]

luciano was sold last friday at the inglis sales, and made $23,000!! this son of lion hunter ran over the spring carnival and its most recent start was a unplaced effort at caufield last wednesday!!

this son on lion hunter is still a bull (stallion) and took my eye when he won a race very impressively on seymour cup day over 1300m. he was then favourite in the greys race on oaks day, but failed and hasnt dont anything since!! for $23,000 i think that is a cheap price as, you could geld him and get him going again, the only problem being, i dont know wether he is a 100% sound!! because you have to ask, why are the owners selling him??

thoughts??

 

[Cheech14]

My thoughts are people who spend $23,000 on an animal have more money than sense.

 

[Deej]

My thoughts are people who spend $23,000 on an animal have more money than sense.

It's an expensive hobbie, nobody would argue that. But it's quite a unique experience being part of racing a horse, especially if they can run a bit. I've probably outlaid 50 grand over the last 20 months on upkeep & purchasing shares in 4 different horses, you have to spend that money on the assumption you're pissing it down the drain and will never see a cent of it back. If people live on a tight budget racing probably isn't for them.

 

[Cheech14]

It's an expensive hobbie, nobody would argue that. But it's quite a unique experience being part of racing a horse, especially if they can run a bit. I've probably outlaid 50 grand over the last 20 months on upkeep & purchasing shares in 4 different horses, you have to spend that money on the assumption you're pissing it down the drain and will never see a cent of it back. If people live on a tight budget racing probably isn't for them.

You can get the very same experience but actually better through owning a greyhound and at 1/20th the price.

They both race, just one you are able to be more involved with.

I'd say that's a better experience IMO.

 

[carltonblue]

I'll throw my opinion in!
More thrill with the horses, for me its harness but for most its thoroughbreds. Depends on the person for that. Depends on the budget to. But like Deej said if you get one that can run its even better, more so in the gallops with more prizemoney involved. For 23000 he only has to win 2 or 3 and run a few placings in the country and money back.

 

[Cheech14]

I'll throw my opinion in!
More thrill with the horses, for me its harness but for most its thoroughbreds. Depends on the person for that. Depends on the budget to. But like Deej said if you get one that can run its even better, more so in the gallops with more prizemoney involved. For 23000 he only has to win 2 or 3 and run a few placings in the country and money back.

What difference does it matter what kind of animal wins?

I'd think winning a race in any code would be a thrill for a fair dinkum owner.

As for money, % wise you will make far more money back on your investment with a dog because of the relatively low outlay.

It also means you will take a far lower loss if it's no good.
Having been involved in ownership in a few differenc codes i have to say from my perspective ownign a horse is more about big noting oneself than anything else.

Being able to have some hands of participation with your animal means when they do win there's a far more deep seated sense of pride and achievement than with an animal you only see on race day.

For 23k I'd bet a penny to a pound i'd get more return on it from getting a few pups of star quality breeding than a 23k nag that won't even reach a very high standard.

It's all perspective though.

 

[Deej]

I've had more fun with my pacer than with the galloper (the one that has had a few runs, she's 3yo whilst the other two are yearling and 2yo), but then my pacer is a better pacer than my galloper is at galloping if you know what i mean. So far i must say pacing is more down to earth, i mean you get to talk to the trainer and the other owners are generally there and aren't oil barons living in another country. I've got 3 with David Hayes and i've never seen him at the races let alone met him, to compare the two codes well put it this way i've taken a piss in the harness trainers home toilet one day when i went to see the horse do a few laps. And he always comes over for a chat if he can (eg.hasnt got a horse running in the next to prepare) after the race. It's a totally different experience and yes so far better bang for your buck in harness, but I want to win a cox plate or caulfield guineas one day with 40,000 people roaring your horse home, and as slim a chance as that is for me, it's infinitely more chance than I'll ever have in dogs and to a lesser extent harness (a miracle mile might be comparable). Thus why i will still get involved in gallopers for as long as i can afford to. Not sure but would you say that is me bignoting myself? I dont think so.

 

[Deej]

I'd think winning a race in any code would be a thrill for a fair dinkum owner.

I agree in principle with your sentiments but I would find it hard to believe you wouldn't get a bigger thrill out of winning the melbourne cup as opposed to winning the top gun.

 

[go fullta]

I agree in principle with your sentiments but I would find it hard to believe you wouldn't get a bigger thrill out of winning the melbourne cup as opposed to winning the top gun.

spot on!! and if you hit the big time in horse racing, which is what we are all striving for...you are laughing $$$ wise, whereas the likes of slater who has the won the most prizemoney over the last 2 years has only something like $400,000 which is unreal for a dog...haha

for me, i get more out of winning a maiden at hamilton with a horse, rather then owning a dog that wins on a wednesday night at wannon park!!

 

[go fullta]

o and what about luciano?? know one has said anything about him...

 

[Tim56]

If you have horses with David Hayes, then sure, you are probably never going to see him. That's nothing against him, but he has hundreds of horses and doesn't have the time to be gladhanding everyone. Other trainers with smaller teams you will get a lot more personal experience.

As for Luciano, at $23,000 he looks a reasonable buy but he has had injuries, and with tried horses you are usually buying other peoples problems. As Takeover Target showed though, you can sometimes get lucky. Definitely a city class horse if he is right.

 

[Cheech14]

I've had more fun with my pacer than with the galloper (the one that has had a few runs, she's 3yo whilst the other two are yearling and 2yo), but then my pacer is a better pacer than my galloper is at galloping if you know what i mean. So far i must say pacing is more down to earth, i mean you get to talk to the trainer and the other owners are generally there and aren't oil barons living in another country. I've got 3 with David Hayes and i've never seen him at the races let alone met him, to compare the two codes well put it this way i've taken a piss in the harness trainers home toilet one day when i went to see the horse do a few laps. And he always comes over for a chat if he can (eg.hasnt got a horse running in the next to prepare) after the race. It's a totally different experience and yes so far better bang for your buck in harness, but I want to win a cox plate or caulfield guineas one day with 40,000 people roaring your horse home, and as slim a chance as that is for me, it's infinitely more chance than I'll ever have in dogs and to a lesser extent harness (a miracle mile might be comparable). Thus why i will still get involved in gallopers for as long as i can afford to. Not sure but would you say that is me bignoting myself? I dont think so.

Of course alot of horse racing is about big noting oneself.

People are always saying "I own a horse" to which my reply is always "and how many times have you actually seen the animal up close".

And not surprisingly most say iv'e never seen it anywhere but the races.

Compare that to a dog where by you are able to able to teach it to walk on a lead, at a young age, and build a bond with it, actually get to know this blue blooded animal up close.

Ok an example.

A person buys a horse for a fair bit of cash because no horses are really cheap.

A person buys a pup so he might spend a couple of grand if he's keen.

But this is where each animals path takes a different route.

Horse gets shipped off to where ever and an owner might occasionally see it but has very little to do with it other than paying expenses.

Dog gets shipped of to rearing farm, but owner is involved and teaches pup to walk on lead, get used to wearing a muzzle.
Owner actually gets to know his animal and it's individual personality.


Fast forward their careers and both animals win a group 1 race.

But once again the scenarios will differ.

The difference is the horse owner will think of the $ and the glory that comes with it.

Yes the dog owner will also get that, but he'll get something different and much more special that the horse owner won't get.

He'll get a sense of overwhelming pride in this beautiful animal he helped mould and teach along the way.

Owning a horse is a fun hobby and one iv'e been involved in, but there's no emotion to the attachment.

Owning a dog even if its only in a average grade 5 race provides more of a thrill as having played a part in its being there the emotional attachment is far greater.

But that's just my opinion, and i guess it does come back to dogs having more personality and more of an overall affinity with humans than horses.

As for the pacing industry it very much is more like the dog industry than the thoroughbreds in it's down to earth and affordability.

 

[carltonblue]

Dont know much about the dogs but seems like owning a dog also makes you trainer. As Cheech said He'll get a sense of overwhelming pride in this beautiful animal he helped mould and teach along the way - the trainer of horses will get that!
But from what I do see from the dogs there heads are screwed on, as just about all harness people, exemptions of course apply to everything but most involved with the gallopers have their finger so far stuck up there bum its not funny, again exemptions apply!
Really for me Im back at square one. Depends on the budget, and really what you personally would enjoy the most.

And GoFullta as for Luciano i have nothing

 

[Deej]

If you guys were earning 30, 40, maybe even 100-200 grand a week, would you still think spending 23 grand on a horse as outlandish? And before you say more money than sense, you dont usually see dills earning that sort of coin do you. Well not often anyway.

 

[Punter_22]

Owning a horse is a fun hobby and one iv'e been involved in, but there's no emotion to the attachment.

That is a ridiculous statement. The racehorses I own are what really bring out my emotions. It is a roller coaster ride and you feel every high and low.

Look at that lady in the stands when Tears I Cry won the Emirates or ask the connections of Mummify if there is any emotion to the attachment and then tell me you stick by that statement.

 

[Cheech14]

That is a ridiculous statement. The racehorses I own are what really bring out my emotions. It is a roller coaster ride and you feel every high and low.

Look at that lady in the stands when Tears I Cry won the Emirates or ask the connections of Mummify if there is any emotion to the attachment and then tell me you stick by that statement.

For a far larger % of horse owners I'll stick by my statement.

An owner of a dog easily has more of a bond with their racer than someone who owns a horse.

Any dog owner can go and visit their animal, take it out for a walk, pat it, bring it a special treat.

You saying you can do that with horses weekly?

You can't build a bond with a horse like you can with a dog.


Who will you have more of a bond with?, the guy you play football alongside each week with, or the footballer you watch on tv each week?

 

[go fullta]

Of course alot of horse racing is about big noting oneself.

People are always saying "I own a horse" to which my reply is always "and how many times have you actually seen the animal up close".

And not surprisingly most say iv'e never seen it anywhere but the races.

Compare that to a dog where by you are able to able to teach it to walk on a lead, at a young age, and build a bond with it, actually get to know this blue blooded animal up close.

Ok an example.

A person buys a horse for a fair bit of cash because no horses are really cheap.

A person buys a pup so he might spend a couple of grand if he's keen.

But this is where each animals path takes a different route.

Horse gets shipped off to where ever and an owner might occasionally see it but has very little to do with it other than paying expenses.

Dog gets shipped of to rearing farm, but owner is involved and teaches pup to walk on lead, get used to wearing a muzzle.
Owner actually gets to know his animal and it's individual personality.


Fast forward their careers and both animals win a group 1 race.

But once again the scenarios will differ.

The difference is the horse owner will think of the $ and the glory that comes with it.

Yes the dog owner will also get that, but he'll get something different and much more special that the horse owner won't get.

He'll get a sense of overwhelming pride in this beautiful animal he helped mould and teach along the way.

Owning a horse is a fun hobby and one iv'e been involved in, but there's no emotion to the attachment.

Owning a dog even if its only in a average grade 5 race provides more of a thrill as having played a part in its being there the emotional attachment is far greater.

But that's just my opinion, and i guess it does come back to dogs having more personality and more of an overall affinity with humans than horses.

As for the pacing industry it very much is more like the dog industry than the thoroughbreds in it's down to earth and affordability.

absolute bullcrap mate!! we foal down our mares at home, on the farm and watch them develop from the time they are born, to the day they make the track, so dont start that dribble about no emotional attachment to it!!

get that picture out of your head, that not every horse owner lives in the city, has heaps of money and has there horses trained by the biggest trainers!!

 

[Deej]

Why is it bignoting if you live in the city and dont see the horse much? How else am i supposed to win the caulfield guineas if i dont invest in horses who are placed with the best trainers? Most of the big races are won by the big trainers, what should i do try to hit the jackpot with a cheap horse trained by a bush trainer? I might as well play tatts. I just want to win a big race one day, and you gotta be in it to win it. Tell me a cheaper way to win the guineas and i'll get involved no worries.

 

[Long Sleep Stud]

Of course alot of horse racing is about big noting oneself.

People are always saying "I own a horse" to which my reply is always "and how many times have you actually seen the animal up close".

And not surprisingly most say iv'e never seen it anywhere but the races.

Compare that to a dog where by you are able to able to teach it to walk on a lead, at a young age, and build a bond with it, actually get to know this blue blooded animal up close.

Ok an example.

A person buys a horse for a fair bit of cash because no horses are really cheap.

A person buys a pup so he might spend a couple of grand if he's keen.

But this is where each animals path takes a different route.

Horse gets shipped off to where ever and an owner might occasionally see it but has very little to do with it other than paying expenses.

Dog gets shipped of to rearing farm, but owner is involved and teaches pup to walk on lead, get used to wearing a muzzle.
Owner actually gets to know his animal and it's individual personality.


Fast forward their careers and both animals win a group 1 race.

But once again the scenarios will differ.

The difference is the horse owner will think of the $ and the glory that comes with it.

Yes the dog owner will also get that, but he'll get something different and much more special that the horse owner won't get.

He'll get a sense of overwhelming pride in this beautiful animal he helped mould and teach along the way.

Owning a horse is a fun hobby and one iv'e been involved in, but there's no emotion to the attachment.

Owning a dog even if its only in a average grade 5 race provides more of a thrill as having played a part in its being there the emotional attachment is far greater.

But that's just my opinion, and i guess it does come back to dogs having more personality and more of an overall affinity with humans than horses.

As for the pacing industry it very much is more like the dog industry than the thoroughbreds in it's down to earth and affordability.

Dude...wtf?

I like dogs too mate...but a horse is a horse when it comes to racing!
And the interest I take into it. Each to his own i suppose but the...
"...sense of overwhelming emotional pride etc..." Oh Puhlease ! I get that too in a horse

 

[Long Sleep Stud]

ps...If I was ever to get a horse good enough to win a cox, after the investment, hard work and fees...tghe misus giving me shit about spending $ on that particular horse...
"I would be guilty of bignotting it bcause I would deserve it "

 

[Lockyer24]

Luciano is a pretty inconsistent thing but I recall a commentator once saying he had some niggles in the past? Like most Lion Hunters Id stick to running him over 1200m max. Id love to have a Lion Hunter stallion just for the bloodline. Id cough up 23k for him if I was rich.
He won a MV race night long ago I think?

 

[True Bluebagger]

o and what about luciano?? know one has said anything about him...

Fullta I know one of his owners personally and from what I gather from him about Luciano is that he hasn't fully recovered from the wind operation he had recently.

This is quite evident if you look at some of his recent runs as he has been in a winning position but has failed to run out the trip. According to the jock. Winks he doesn't put in as he is hurting too much.

Weighing all that up I wouldn't touch him with a 20 foot barge pole and I will make a big prediction that the new owners will be flat out getting any where near their money back on him.

 

[go fullta]

Fullta I know one of his owners personally and from what I gather from him about Luciano is that he hasn't fully recovered from the wind operation he had recently.

This is quite evident if you look at some of his recent runs as he has been in a winning position but has failed to run out the trip. According to the jock. Winks he doesn't put in as he is hurting too much.

Weighing all that up I wouldn't touch him with a 20 foot barge pole and I will make a big prediction that the new owners will be flat out getting any where near their money back on him.

yeah your spot on then...hence the reason he was in an inglis used horse sale!! your right about winning position, i thought he was ready to let loose a few times, but it never happened!! although he looked super at seymour that day he won...