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Malthouse Megathread

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Peter Sidorkiewicz said:
To be honest, I don't blame him.

The whole coaching succession plan was a major fail by Eddie.

Think about it logically, would you replace one of the best coaches in the game, whom has taken you to the past 3 grand finals, winning 1 premiership with an untried assistant coach?

Their is no way it would happen if the coach in question was Robert Harvey and not Nathan Buckley.
Unfortunately, Eddie couldn't stomach Nathan coaching another AFL team, like North Melbourne and therefore drove out Malthouse to ensure 'his favourite son' would be coaching the magpies, even though a better alternative who still was willing coach wanted to stay on (and hence do not sign the so called sucession plan agreement that was drawn up and paraded in front of the media with a press conference).
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Well Before 2010 We where a Good Side and we just in 2010 Everything went to Plan and we had a Gameplan that no at that time knew to Counter
 
TradeDraft said:
He is Just Pissed off at Eddie and Would love to Piss Him off and go to Carlton
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Are you suggesting MM's motives for going to Carlton (if he does) is purely out of vindictiveness towards his previous employer?

Do you think his desire to coach again could be a factor?
 

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76woodenspooners said:
Are you suggesting MM's motives for going to Carlton (if he does) is purely out of vindictiveness towards his previous employer?

Do you think his desire to coach again could be a factor?
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I'd put it at 50/50. Reckon he wants to coach but is still very dark at Collingwood. Better to smell the roes Mick.
 
He will take his boundary line gameplan to Carlton and it will be destroyed. If they are missing a father figure mentor then he is the man. If they are missing a better gameplan, then why would you go to him? He served us well with the boundary friendly and press gameplan but it got dissected and smashed.
The bloke doesn't know how to shut his gob. His ego controlled his mouth last year and it's doing the same now. On one hand, 'no there's a coach, coaching and I won't be dancing on Ratten's grave' and on the other hand, 'I'll be discussing my future with my manager.'
I this case it would be easier to say 'No, not dancing on anyone's grave, sick of all the questions, we'll leave it at that.'
I think he's shuffling on Ratten's grave right now.
 
Well said Spice, in one of your posts in here...
MM is not contracted to us, he can do as he pleases. Like you Spice, i support Collingwood, not MM not Clokes management team or any other outsider. I have great respect for anyone connected to the club, especially those that have worn the strip!!!
Reverence even for precious few.

Clokes wears the strip, is contracted to us, until this changes or we know it is changing, i am with him.

FWIW, like Snoop, as each day goes by, i think him re signing with us becomes less of a chance.
 
Stripes B and W said:
Well said Spice, in one of your posts in here...
MM is not contracted to us, he can do as he pleases. Like you Spice, i support Collingwood, not MM not Clokes management team or any other outsider. I have great respect for anyone connected to the club, especially those that have worn the strip!!!
Reverence even for precious few.

Clokes wears the strip, is contracted to us, until this changes or we know it is changing, i am with him.

FWIW, like Snoop, as each day goes by, i think him re signing with us becomes less of a chance.
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They said the deal won't be done either way until after the season, so really nothing would change each day.
 
SS17 , i realise we are not coming back to the negotiation table until season end, the mood and landscape is constantly changing on this issue. It's this change i am reading as not favouring the big 32 staying.

MM, health being ticked off, ego in check, was always going to coach again
 
I don't care if MM coaches again, good luck to him. I do care though, about Carlton being shit. While Ratten coaches them, they'll be shit so i'd hate Mick to replace him and remove their shitness
 
Peter Sidorkiewicz said:
To be honest, I don't blame him.

The whole coaching succession plan was a major fail by Eddie.
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I disagree. I think the plan was a reasonably good one. But there were a few mistakes made.

Firstly, the contract should not have been signed without a job description. The fact that MM said 18 months into the deal that he didn't really understand what the Director of Coaching entailed was an indictment on the process. Especially as there had been no precidents before (in footy).

Secondly, I'm not sure about whether it's best to have the previous Head Coach going into a mentoring role. It's hardly going to inspire innovation. It could work with the right person, especially one who is choosing to retire of their own accord. But it was clear all along that Mick hadn't come to terms with any retirement plans.

Think about it logically, would you replace one of the best coaches in the game, whom has taken you to the past 3 grand finals, winning 1 premiership with an untried assistant coach?
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The Geelong Football club did it and it worked for them. (admittedly, in their case it was out of necessity, but all the same, it happened)

"The Best Coach in the game" doesn't stay that way forever. Football changes, tactics change, personnel get stale. If a team waits until "The Best Coach in the Game" is obviously no longer that before parting with them, then they've probably left the decision 2 or 3 seasons too late.

MM was with us for 11 seasons - that's a fair innings. We don't know now whether it was the right plan, but I'm confident that in years to come when we look back on this period then it'll seem like the correct decision.

Their is no way it would happen if the coach in question was Robert Harvey and not Nathan Buckley.
Unfortunately, Eddie couldn't stomach Nathan coaching another AFL team, like North Melbourne and therefore drove out Malthouse to ensure 'his favourite son' would be coaching the magpies, even though a better alternative who still was willing coach wanted to stay on (and hence do not sign the so called sucession plan agreement that was drawn up and paraded in front of the media with a press conference).
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Hang on a minute - it's not for the President of the footy club to decide who can and who can't coach. This wasn't a case of Eddie simply recruiting somebody who he thought would make a good coach. He would have relied on technical advisors who know about this stuff (eg: Walsh and Mick, and likely a whole host of others). The board reviewed the decision and (if our board has any nous and I'm sure they do) they would have asked the tough questions. Sure, Eddie probably came up with the idea and negotiated the deal, but there is no way Bucks would have come to Collingwood if our head of the football department (Walsh) didn't think he could coach.
 
There is no way we can possibly know how things would have turned out if the deal hadn't have been done. Tbh I'm getting tired of the "we sacked the best coach in the league", "Eddie is an idiot" and "Bucks is a shit coach" calls that are going around. I will back the club and what they did, and there is nothing anyone can do about it. It is gone. Move on. Mick was great for us for 12 years, and Bucks has been great this year as well. There is no proving anything.
 

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Old Spice said:
So you think the discussions start on November 1st after Cloke's contract ends? Time to get real.
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Obviously not. The state of Cloke staying right now is the same state we will be in when our season ends sometime in September. Hence, nothing changes day by day. There is no chance of him signing in that time.
 
No SPIN said:
Fortunately he can't poach any of his old assistants as they have all gone. But he will throw money at dislodging our support staff that are good friends with him such as Buttifant, Walsh and possibly even Hine.
He could lure some favourite players such as Thomas when he is out of contract next year as it Swan from memory.
Poaching staff and players is therefore the real worry, I have less concern about his tactical and strategic nous. And now that we have deserted Arizona I suspect that he will rush back there, which is highly predictable but harmless.
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If Mick went to Carlton then he would be reunited with some of his assistants (Gavin Brown and Richardson).

I don't think he'd try to poach anybody from Collingwood with the possible exception of Buttifant. Walsh was Mick's boss, not part of his posse. As for Hine, what would make him want to leave to recruit for Mick? I don't see the motivation for Hine there.
 
Old Spice said:
So you think the discussions start on November 1st after Cloke's contract ends? Time to get real.
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They're talking to him as we speak and will continue talking to him, so I agree. If the contract talks are the reason for his lack of form, drop him now and hope it galvanises the group. Ok, back into the real world now......Dunno what the hell to do with him. :D
 
I honestly don't care, MM is the one taking on the worst job. If Cloke goes as well, we get some good picks. What better way to get back at them by getting Fev (cue whinging).
 
How dare him wanting to coach again!!!

FFS, don't we have other things to worry about ATM? who cares what mick does, it's out of our control, and if Carlton want Cloke they can have him.
 

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Peter Sidorkiewicz said:
To be honest, I don't blame him.

Think about it logically, would you replace one of the best coaches in the game, whom has taken you to the past 3 grand finals, winning 1 premiership with an untried assistant coach?

.
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Yes, if that untried coach is Buckley
 
76woodenspooners said:
I disagree. I think the plan was a reasonably good one. But there were a few mistakes made.

Firstly, the contract should not have been signed without a job description. The fact that MM said 18 months into the deal that he didn't really understand what the Director of Coaching entailed was an indictment on the process. Especially as there had been no precidents before (in footy).

Secondly, I'm not sure about whether it's best to have the previous Head Coach going into a mentoring role. It's hardly going to inspire innovation. It could work with the right person, especially one who is choosing to retire of their own accord. But it was clear all along that Mick hadn't come to terms with any retirement plans.

The Geelong Football club did it and it worked for them. (admittedly, in their case it was out of necessity, but all the same, it happened)

"The Best Coach in the game" doesn't stay that way forever. Football changes, tactics change, personnel get stale. If a team waits until "The Best Coach in the Game" is obviously no longer that before parting with them, then they've probably left the decision 2 or 3 seasons too late.

MM was with us for 11 seasons - that's a fair innings. We don't know now whether it was the right plan, but I'm confident that in years to come when we look back on this period then it'll seem like the correct decision.



Hang on a minute - it's not for the President of the footy club to decide who can and who can't coach. This wasn't a case of Eddie simply recruiting somebody who he thought would make a good coach. He would have relied on technical advisors who know about this stuff (eg: Walsh and Mick, and likely a whole host of others). The board reviewed the decision and (if our board has any nous and I'm sure they do) they would have asked the tough questions. Sure, Eddie probably came up with the idea and negotiated the deal, but there is no way Bucks would have come to Collingwood if our head of the football department (Walsh) didn't think he could coach.
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Gavin Brown is a favorite son of Collingwood and has better coaching creditials and experience to date than Nathan Buckley. On paper he has a better coaching resume than Buckley. Why would Nathan Buckley be chosen over him? The only answer is Eddie is close mates with Buckley and as a result Brown left to go to Carlton after being overlooked.
 
Peter Sidorkiewicz said:
Gavin Brown is a favorite son of Collingwood and has better coaching creditials and experience to date than Nathan Buckley. On paper he has a better coaching resume than Buckley. Why would Nathan Buckley be chosen over him? The only answer is Eddie is close mates with Buckley and as a result Brown left to go to Carlton after being overlooked.
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Word was that Rowdy was serviceable at best. Even MM that he was ok but wouldn't be able to cut it at senior level.
 
SuperSub17 said:
Obviously not. The state of Cloke staying right now is the same state we will be in when our season ends sometime in September. Hence, nothing changes day by day. There is no chance of him signing in that time.
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We don't know what the end result will be, but this suggestion that nothing is happening behind the scenes because contracts are not ended is pretty naive to say the least. i'd venture to say as an intelligent man or woman, you couldn't possibly believe this scenario you've concocted. It's fine to punt either way, but let's not be silly and suggest no ripples are happening before Cloke's contract expires.
 
Peter Sidorkiewicz said:
Gavin Brown is a favorite son of Collingwood and has better coaching creditials and experience to date than Nathan Buckley. On paper he has a better coaching resume than Buckley. Why would Nathan Buckley be chosen over him? The only answer is Eddie is close mates with Buckley and as a result Brown left to go to Carlton after being overlooked.
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It's not the only answer and I don't think it's even a plausible answer. If it was simply a 'Job for a mate' then how would he have got it past Walsh and the Collingwood board? If Buckley was merely an Eddie stooge then why did Buttifant and Hine re-sign at the end of last year?

Make no mistake, Eddie would hire Jeff the Purple Wiggle to be our Senior Coach if it meant winning Premierships.
 
Old Spice said:
We don't know what the end result will be, but this suggestion that nothing is happening behind the scenes because contracts are not ended is pretty naive to say the least. i'd venture to say as an intelligent man or woman, you couldn't possibly believe this scenario you've concocted. It's fine to punt either way, but let's not be silly and suggest no ripples are happening before Cloke's contract expires.
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Fair point, I just don't necessarily agree that the chances of keeping him are going down by the day. We are not going to sign him now, anything going on behind the scenes is anyone's guess as to whether its positive or negative.
 

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