Mark Seaby

[eagleskickass]

hey, i had to start it Every other player under the sun is getting a thread!. After last nights effort could it be worthwhile playing gardiner at CHF, having Cox as #1 Ruck(hes starting to be like Gardiner was last year) and Seaby as backup? We all know how potent Gardiner can be up forward, plus it may just keep him fitter taking out the whole centre ruck knock bit, and if we are losing in the middle Seabs or Coxy could swap with him and he has a ruck hit

Thoughts? Can we play with all 3 in the side? Is it a waste of a bench space having Seabs sit there(although he could also play as a 3rd tall or rotate the 3 through the middle)

 

[DanielKerr4]

Originally posted by eagleskickass

Thoughts? Can we play with all 3 in the side? Is it a waste of a bench space having Seabs sit there(although he could also play as a 3rd tall or rotate the 3 through the middle)

Nope they can't all play. Gardy is too good a ruckman to be thrown into the forward line especially if there is Doogs and Johnno there. I don't think Cox would be good enough to beat some of the comps best ruckman, sure he may break even, but is that all we want? I dont think so. I think wait until Seaby takes over Cox(which i am sure he will do eventually) or just wait until Gardy gets injured(which probably will happen knowing our luck).

 

[steve_rat]

trust you to bring this guy up middsy.. well as much as he was good last nite.. all our youngsters did really well and the thing is we have plenty of tall guys who are early-middle of their careers.. so unless he can be slotted into a kp, then i think hes gonna hafta wait for a few injuries.. but i must admit i was impressed with him.. and everyone else.. i mean its a bit hard to judge who's really up to it on such an easy win.. we'll see in maybe the next few weeks if they get a run how they go

 

[Mead]

I think we're going to have to start using Gardiner up forward a lot more this year, partly to beef up our forward line, and partly just because his knees simply cannot stand up to 4 quarters of ruckwork, 22 games a year.

On the basis of Cox's effort last night and throughout the preseason, I'm reasonably happy with that prospect- Cox has improved considerably, not necessarily in the number of ruck knocks he gets, but certainly in how well he directs them. I am confident that he's still got a fair amount of improvement left in him, but by the time he is fully developed, he'll be very classy indeed- I think its very likely that we might at least begin this year with Gardiner starting games in the forward line, and Cox rucking. That way, we have Cox getting first crack at opposition ruckmen and hopefully tiring them out- if he's on top and we're winning, then Gardiner can have an easy game of it up forward, and but if we get into trouble, then Cox is benched and a fresh Gardiner is thrown into the ruck to turn the game. That way, we limit our use of Gardiner to what is absolutely necessary, give Cox experience, gain a bloody talented CHF in Gardiner, and most importantly, save Gardies knees, and ensure we've got him fit and firing for the business end of the season, at which point we can start to give him more time in the ruck if we're not happy with Coxxy.

As for Seaby, I don't think there's a place for him in our figurative best 22- Aside from Cox and Gardiner, McDougall, Lynch and Gaspar and Johnson can all offer a decent contest in the ruck, so I don't think that a case can be made for a third specialist ruckman- assuming Gardie and Cox both started on the ground, I think the one tall utility on the bench should be able to play at either end of the ground as well as in the ruck- Lynch and Jako are the guys who fit that bill. Barring injuries I think we can only afford to have Seabs in the side if, over the next two or three weeks, he proves himself to be a better forward option than someone like Johnson.

 

[The Passenger]

As i've said and still maintain I believe that Mark Seaby is going to be crucial in the how this club goes over this era and whether we go from being a good team just not quite good enough or whether we are premiership material team......(and he may not even end up playing his career out at the club)

And Gardiner must still be our number 1 ruck until Cox proves (if he ever does) that he can ruck to their standard Gardiner did last year - there is still the question of whether Gardy can go back to how good he was last year, or whether he reverts back to the inconsistent player he was in previous years.....

But our game plan revolves around a dominant ruckman, which Gardiner was exactly that last year, and i don't think Cox will quite reach those levels this year (he may in the future).

But the reason i believe Seaby will determine how good our club is in the near future is becuase if he comes on to be good enough to be a backup ruckman and a pretty good tall forward, it would put us in a good trading position at a point in the future.....

We'd than have three AFL standard ruckman (no side needs that many esepcially when you've got Doogs and a cpl of others who can pinch hit quickly), and it would allow us to pick up a good KPP for either Cox or Seaby which would help plug our problems with our KPP across the park......

 

[Streaker]

I think we should be using Johnson as our 3rd ruck. Gardiner and Johnson could share CHF with Cox as the number one ruckman. We seem to be in a position where our talls are to tall to be KPP.

Us
Cox 204cm
Seaby 200cm
Johnson 199cm
Gardiner 199cm
Hansen 198cm
Gaspar 197cm
McDougall 197cm
Beeck 197cm
Staker 196cm
Lynch 194cm
Jakovich 193cm
Glass 192cm
Hunter 190cm

Essendon
Lloyd 191cm
Lucas 192cm
Fletcher 197cm

Brisbane
Lynch 193cm
Brown 195cm
Leppitsh 191cm

Port
Tredrea 194cm
Wakelin 192cm

Collingwood
Rocca 195cm
Tarrant 193cm
Presti 193cm
Wakelin 191cm

Lynch, Glass and Jakovich are more your average KPP with the rest above normal in height. Like the old saying goes "you don't get any shorter"

 

[coasting]

Originally posted by West Coast Stre


Us
Cox 204cm
Seaby 200cm
Johnson 199cm
Gardiner 199cm
Hansen 198cm
Gaspar 197cm
McDougall 197cm
Beeck 197cm
Staker 196cm
Lynch 194cm
Jakovich 193cm
Glass 192cm
Hunter 190cm

May I ask, where did you get those stats? Didn't realise they were all so tall.

 

[Streaker]

Originally posted by coasting
May I ask, where did you get those stats? Didn't realise they were all so tall.

afl.com.au

 

[eagleskickass]

Originally posted by Black Thunder
As i've said and still maintain I believe that Mark Seaby is going to be crucial in the how this club goes over this era and whether we go from being a good team just not quite good enough or whether we are premiership material team......(and he may not even end up playing his career out at the club)

And Gardiner must still be our number 1 ruck until Cox proves (if he ever does) that he can ruck to their standard Gardiner did last year - there is still the question of whether Gardy can go back to how good he was last year, or whether he reverts back to the inconsistent player he was in previous years.....

But our game plan revolves around a dominant ruckman, which Gardiner was exactly that last year, and i don't think Cox will quite reach those levels this year (he may in the future).

But the reason i believe Seaby will determine how good our club is in the near future is becuase if he comes on to be good enough to be a backup ruckman and a pretty good tall forward, it would put us in a good trading position at a point in the future.....

We'd than have three AFL standard ruckman (no side needs that many esepcially when you've got Doogs and a cpl of others who can pinch hit quickly), and it would allow us to pick up a good KPP for either Cox or Seaby which would help plug our problems with our KPP across the park......

Yeah, thats right i reckon.

One thing i will add is Seaby couldnt be traded. He would honestly go back to Mukka and work on the farm before he played for anyone other than WCE. Even if he did wanna his whole family(and theres a heck of a lot of them) would lynch him even if he was traded to freo

 

[jod23]

Im totally against Gardiner playing up forward, particularly at the start of games. The start of a game is extremely important, like we saw on the weekend with the Eagles and Collingwood. The woods started Bucks on the bench and by the time they managed to get there best player into the game, it was already over.

Gardiner must start games in the ruck for us to win games. No resting in the forward line either, that is ok for Cuz but Gardy needs a full rest so when Cox goes on, Gardy must come to the bench.

If were completely on top then bring Gardiner back onto the ground but up forward, no reason to tire him and risk injury in the ruck. But at the start of games and close games our biggest advantage is our midfield and ruck. They are at their best when Gardiner is rucking, simple as that.

On Seaby...not ready. Played alright on saturday night but still has a fair way to go before supplanting Cox as our second ruckman.

 

[Thrawn666]

Although I agree that playing Gardiner as No 1 ruck is the best way to go, I can see him being eased in this season at CHF, particularly since his hammy interrupted what was already a short pre-season.

More than likely Cox will do the bulk of the ruckwork for the first few games Gardy plays while Gardy works on building up his match-fitness gradually until he is ready to ruck out most of the game.

Whether this leaves room for Seaby or not I dont know. Although good, Cox is clearly better at this stage.

 

[jod23]

Originally posted by Thrawn666
Although I agree that playing Gardiner as No 1 ruck is the best way to go, I can see him being eased in this season at CHF, particularly since his hammy interrupted what was already a short pre-season.

More than likely Cox will do the bulk of the ruckwork for the first few games Gardy plays while Gardy works on building up his match-fitness gradually until he is ready to ruck out most of the game.

Whether this leaves room for Seaby or not I dont know. Although good, Cox is clearly better at this stage.

That in itself is going to be a problem considering our pretty difficult start to the season. We will need Gardiner fit and rucking.

 

[Juddamania]

I thought Seaby had a good debut, though he's not on Cox's level as of yet. But then, if Gardy does get injured (which will probably happen ) he'll come in handy to share the ruck with Cox. Was it my imagination, or was Seabs playing down back at some time in the game?

Gardiner's obviously the number 1 choice for ruckman, but it would be a good idea to move him down to CHF in some of the games. In the second scratchy, he was quite a dominant force down there (and that was against our Rocca-slayer, Lynch ), but then it leaves Johnno on the bench. I actually think we have more key fowards than we know what to do with (though most are injured).

 

[The Passenger]

If it were up to me i'd sought've use these guidelines for how to use our talls up forward and in the ruck (at least for the start of the season with Gaspar out - hopefully Lynch turns out to be good at CHB because that will enable us to use Gaspar in the forward line without fear of being weak in the backline).

Start:
Ruck: Gardiner
CHF: MacDougall
FF: Cox (we gotta work hard to turn him into a ruck/forward because he's ruck time will be limited while Gardiner is fit)

on the bench would be Jakovich (used as a tall either down back or up forward were required) and probably Seaby although i can't say he's quite upto AFL standard yet.......but where abit stuck at the moment for talls and he was impressive last year. maybe worth a gamble for round one.

Gardiner would ruck for probably 2 - 2.5 Qrtrs (even up to 3 if Cox is having an off game). Cox would ruck for pretty much the other part of the game with Seaby getting a bit of time in there......

If Gardiner's not in the ruck, he'd usually be on the bench, although he could pinch hit for a little bit of time at either CHF/FF.

MacDougall would play most of the game at CHF (I think he's a better FF than CHF, but he's much more suited to playing CHF than Cox is) with maybe a bit of time at FF and would get a few quick rests on the bench.

Cox would ruck for most of the game Gardy's not, the rest of the time he'd spend pretty much at FF with a bit of time at CHF and a bit of rest time on the bench.

Seaby's game time would be limited (probably maximum half a game unless he's playing out of his skin) and he'd soughta move all over the shop - CHF/FF/Ruck and even down back perhaps.

Jakovich would be used as a pinch hitter in the similar role to Seaby except he wouldn't play in the ruck and he'd probably spend more than half a game on the field....

So this would be a kinda guideline to where they'd be spending their time (remembering it's 80 minutes playing time a match): *bk = down in the backline

player......rk...FF...CHF..int...bk..total
Gardiner....50...10...00....20...00..80
Cox.........20...40...00....20...00..80
MacDougall..00...10...60....10...00..80
Seaby.......10...10...10....40...10..80
Jakovich....00...10...10....30...30..80
............80...80...80

obviousbly these aren't some sought of set in stone thing (if Gardiner went down to FF and kicked 3 goals in 10 minutes and the opposition just had no match up on him your not gonna put him onto the bench because he's 10 minutes at FF are up), but this would be a general idea of where'd i'd like to see guys given a run.........