Matchday Coach

[cro_Magnum]

Have been a big supporter of Neil Craig from when he was an assistant coach and hoped he would get the senior job, and has performed well above expectation. He has no peer when it comes to team preparation, player motivation and game plan IMO and no doubt is the man for the job, but no-one is perfect and it's no secret that matchday tactics are not his strongest suit.

As examples, 4 glaring errors that cost us games or the chance to win are

1. Letting Scott West run amok against the Bulldogs round 5 2005
2. Letting Robert Harvey run amok Semi-Final 2005
3. Taking off an in form Clarke for Biglands during a run on because it was the normal rotation late in the Prelim Final 2005 leading to several easy centre clearances and goals to West Coast
4. Leaving on a sadly out of touch Jericho NAB Final 2006

Not that many errors I agree, but 3 of them are 'blind Freddy could see' type situations and the 4th was silly and inflexible. There have probably been others in games we've won but winning hides a multitude of sins as they say. We have a big shot this year and if these simple but serious game changing mistakes continue, it could mean the difference between a flag or bust.

Also, in retrospect his loyalty to Jericho has done the guy no favours in the long run. He's already been labelled by some the as new Mick Lewis, ie never to play again.

 

[Stiffy_18]

I think people are making too much out of Craig not benching Jericho last night. Its was a PS game for goodness sake. Yes it was a PS GF but Criag has always said that this PS is about giving youngsters some serious game time and preparing for round 1. Jericho would have learnt more from last nights debacle than he would have sitting on the bench. Players learn nothing by sitting on the bench. They need game time.

PS is the time when you let players either sink or swim. If it was a proper game, played for 4 points, I would have a different opinion about the Jericho thing but its was a PS game. Benching Jericho teaches him nothing. After Jericho's first couple of mistakes, Craig gave Jericho a chance to redeem himself. Unfortunatly he just couldn't do it. The more he tried to make up for those mistakes the more he ********ed up.

On your first 3 points, you do have a point

 

[Mad Dog]

I think people are making too much out of Craig not benching Jericho last night. Its was a PS game for goodness sake. Yes it was a PS GF but Criag has always said that this PS is about giving youngsters some serious game time and preparing for round 1. Jericho would have learnt more from last nights debacle than he would have sitting on the bench. Players learn nothing by sitting on the bench. They need game time.

PS is the time when you let players either sink or swim. If it was a proper game, played for 4 points, I would have a different opinion about the Jericho thing but its was a PS game. Benching Jericho teaches him nothing. After Jericho's first couple of mistakes, Craig gave Jericho a chance to redeem himself. Unfortunatly he just couldn't do it. The more he tried to make up for those mistakes the more he ********ed up.

On your first 3 points, you do have a point

That's all fine Stiffmeister.....and I agree that 90% of a PS comp is about development....but at some point in the third qtr of a GF....it's about winning for the club...the sponsors...the fans....but more importantly for the playing group. Geelong will take heaps of confidence into round 1....while our tyres will be deflated....if only slightly.
Normally I would agree with developing or teaching a player....but I fear the playing group lost way more in momentum for the season last night than Jericho might have gained in teaching. Sure - I don't mind investment in players...but unfortunately I don't reckon there is much prospect of return in Jericho's case.
Sometimes it's about the greater good...and I reckon Craigy will be rueing his lack of action in the cool light of today.

 

[Stiffy_18]

That's all fine Stiffmeister.....and I agree that 90% of a PS comp is about development....but at some point in the third qtr of a GF....it's about winning for the club...the sponsors...the fans....but more importantly for the playing group. Geelong will take heaps of confidence into round 1....while our tyres will be deflated....if only slightly.
Normally I would agree with developing or teaching a player....but I fear the playing group lost way more in momentum for the season last night than Jericho might have gained in teaching. Sure - I don't mind investment in players...but unfortunately I don't reckon there is much prospect of return in Jericho's case.
Sometimes it's about the greater good...and I reckon Craigy will be rueing his lack of action in the cool light of today.

Thats all fine but personally, I rather we lost last night than in round 1 against Collingwood.

Had we won last night, multitude of our weaknesses would be covered. You learn more from a loss than you would from a win. Especially a close win.

Had we won last night you would have read how it was great to see the boys tough it out, and they would be praised left right and center (rightly or wrongly).

I thin last night loss is better for our preparation for round 1 than if we had won. At least now, cats have exposed some of our flaws that we clearly need to work on. Had we won, I don't think those flaws would we as evident as they are now.

 

[cro_Magnum]

I think people are making too much out of Craig not benching Jericho last night. Its was a PS game for goodness sake. Yes it was a PS GF but Criag has always said that this PS is about giving youngsters some serious game time and preparing for round 1. Jericho would have learnt more from last nights debacle than he would have sitting on the bench. Players learn nothing by sitting on the bench. They need game time.

PS is the time when you let players either sink or swim. If it was a proper game, played for 4 points, I would have a different opinion about the Jericho thing but its was a PS game. Benching Jericho teaches him nothing. After Jericho's first couple of mistakes, Craig gave Jericho a chance to redeem himself. Unfortunatly he just couldn't do it. The more he tried to make up for those mistakes the more he ********ed up.

On your first 3 points, you do have a point

I agree the Jericho case is the least serious of all these and will soon be forgotten (as will Jericho I suspect) but highlights an occasional but ongoing problem of slow or no reaction when the gameplan is not working.

In a way, its a bit like the old "its all about the process" rather than being innovative on the day, although our process has greatly improved . If something is'nt working, isn't it logical to fix it.

 

[Cove Cobra]

TBH I think it could be the best thing that could have happened.

Pre-season Premierships mean nothing. The thing is though, it will stick in the players minds for this season and make better people out of them, the younger players especially.

It is what it is all about, blooding the young players.

Jericho will take A LOT out of that game, believe it. His physique is suited to a wing but Craig chose to play the boy forward. A massive learning curve for the lad. I haven't written him off by a long shot. This boy can take heart that Craigy left him on.

Let's no go over the top people in regards to last night.

A negative can ALWAYS be turned into a positive.

Some posters on this Board are a tad rough sometimes IMO.

 

[macca23]

.

Jericho will take A LOT out of that game, believe it. His physique is suited to a wing but Craig chose to play the boy forward. A massive learning curve for the lad. I haven't written him off by a long shot. This boy can take heart that Craigy left him on.

Thank god for that CC.

He needs to get a heart from somewhere!!

 

[Cove Cobra]

Thank god for that CC.

He needs to get a heart from somewhere!!

A tad rough there IMO Macca23.

Nerves seemed to play a part last night - this is where he will learn from my friend.

I see a lot of potential in the boy, I feel he was played out of position.

Swap Burton from his wing into the forward line. Jericho onto the wing. His aerobic capacity suits the position. He can get the ball and yes, granted sometimes doesn't know what to do with it but I am not at the stage where I would write the young fella off.

 

[cro_Magnum]

A tad rough there IMO Macca23.

Nerves seemed to play a part last night - this is where he will learn from my friend.

I see a lot of potential in the boy, I feel he was played out of position.

Not really worried about Jericho as he won't influence our season much if at all. I'm more worried about NC's and the assistant coaches' abilities to react to what's happening on the field, which will influence our season.

 

[Lefty]

Actually cro_Magnum there's one more match I'd add to your list :-

Brisbane (29.15 189) defeats Adelaide (6.12 48) at the Gabba
Round 17, Saturday, 24th July 2004

I was at this match (sorry debacle) and Neil Craig didn't seem to react quickly enough to some of the match ups.

Simon Black, Jason Ackermanis & Luke Power were doing as they please in this game and no moves were forthcoming.

Also in this match one Fergus Watts gathered 3 disposals and he did spend considerable time on the ground for his modest return.

On the subject of Jericho he played in the middle & on the wing for West Adelaide whenever I watched the games on ABC 2 (digital channel) and did quite well.

 

[Cove Cobra]

On the subject of Jericho he played in the middle & on the wing for West Adelaide whenever I watched the games on ABC 2 (digital channel) and did quite well.

Spot on. That he did. Thats is why I feel he is more suited to a wing rather than a forward position.

MarkThirtyTwo may give a good insight I think.

 

[Cove Cobra]

Can I ask a stupid question??


Why in the hell are you pulling Craig's tactics apart when it is a Pre-Season Competition??

This is the time you try new tactics; some work, some don't. It is the time to blood youngsters in various positions and situations.

But . . . I see you guys picking apart PREVIOUS games. FFS we are in 2006.

The season proper hasn't started yet. I have complete faith in Craig.

I am ashamed to say it but some people will remember me absolutely screaming vitriol at the appointment.


I was wrong.

 

[kirky]

Actually cro_Magnum there's one more match I'd add to your list :-

Brisbane (29.15 189) defeats Adelaide (6.12 48) at the Gabba
Round 17, Saturday, 24th July 2004

I was at this match (sorry debacle) and Neil Craig didn't seem to react quickly enough to some of the match ups.

Just when I got this match out of my mind, someone brings it up again. Its like a recurring nightmare. I saw it live as well and I remember ring 5AA from Brisbane after that match and expressing my disgust but that night we were missing a number of players and at the time Brisbane was at the top of its game.

 

[passamore]

I have not wanted to say it before but now that we are on theme I keep remembering some bad non-reactions v St Kilda in the finals (Scott Thompson) and v West Coast when NC stuck too long with things. Think back to the last quarter when he became reactive. If only he had done so earlier in the game we may have been in the GF.
We were worried at Norwood. Seems the spots don't change after all.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

A tad rough there IMO Macca23.

Nerves seemed to play a part last night - this is where he will learn from my friend.

I see a lot of potential in the boy, I feel he was played out of position.

Swap Burton from his wing into the forward line. Jericho onto the wing. His aerobic capacity suits the position. He can get the ball and yes, granted sometimes doesn't know what to do with it but I am not at the stage where I would write the young fella off.

\

You're probabaly right, wing may be Jerichos spot. But then again Mattner, Burton, Knights, reilly and even Doughty would be better wingman. Why do we feel compelled to try and find a spot for Jericho. It's not as though he's a match winner, far from it.

 

[Stiffy_18]

\

You're probabaly right, wing may be Jerichos spot. But then again Mattner, Burton, Knights, reilly and even Doughty would be better wingman. Why do we feel compelled to try and find a spot for Jericho. It's not as though he's a match winner, far from it.

True but he does have potential to be one and no one can deny that.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

True but he does have potential to be one and no one can deny that.

I agree with you on your comment that Burton has that X factor that can win you games but when has Jericho ever shown he can win a game off his own boot?

 

[Stiffy_18]

I agree with you on your comment that Burton has that X factor that can win you games but when has Jericho ever shown he can win a game off his own boot?

I said he has the potential to be a match winner. I never said he was one.

 

[cro_Magnum]

Can I ask a stupid question??


Why in the hell are you pulling Craig's tactics apart when it is a Pre-Season Competition??

This is the time you try new tactics; some work, some don't. It is the time to blood youngsters in various positions and situations.

But . . . I see you guys picking apart PREVIOUS games. FFS we are in 2006.

The season proper hasn't started yet. I have complete faith in Craig.

I am ashamed to say it but some people will remember me absolutely screaming vitriol at the appointment.


I was wrong.

The previous games were not that long ago in football terms ie last years finals. I'm not too worried about this year ATM but all I'm saying is that there are some similarities.

If you want to argue that those decisions/non-decisions were right then fair enough but to say that we shouldn't offer constructive criticism or scrutiny of Craig's coaching is a bit much no matter how much faith we have in him. I don't think even Neil would say he's above discussion about aspects of his coaching (unlike the previous guy).

Having said that I supported his appointment fully and the faith continues.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

I said he has the potential to be a match winner. I never said he was one.

Fair enough.

 

[Scott Van Persett]

Whilst it is reasonable for NC's Matchday coaching to come under scrutiny, no coaching moves could have has an effect on the disastrous kicking for goal and general fumbling that occurred last night. Numerous goals went begging and we should have won by at leat 3 goals eg 2 Andy McLeod misses that no-one has mentioned.

From a general point of view, NC is developing a CLUB not just a team, we are now respected by all opposition clubs ( but supporters still have their prejudices) and media and his preparation of players is being copied throughout the league.

Whilst coaching on the day is important, if the players do not perform to their ability, the best coaching in the world will not win the match

 

[kirky]

Whilst it is reasonable for NC's Matchday coaching to come under scrutiny, no coaching moves could have has an effect on the disastrous kicking for goal and general fumbling that occurred last night. Numerous goals went begging and we should have won by at leat 3 goals eg 2 Andy McLeod misses that no-one has mentioned.

From a general point of view, NC is developing a CLUB not just a team, we are now respected by all opposition clubs ( but supporters still have their prejudices) and media and his preparation of players is being copied throughout the league.

Whilst coaching on the day is important, if the players do not perform to their ability, the best coaching in the world will not win the match

Right on. Last night we had 8 more scoring shots than the Cats but we missed some sitters we would normally get. Its not as if Geelong had more chances, they made the most of theirs and is reflected in the scoreline 13.5 to Adelaides 11.15. Coach can only do so much, its up to the players to do the rest, ala finishing.

 

[cro_Magnum]

Right on. Last night we had 8 more scoring shots than the Cats but we missed some sitters we would normally get. Its not as if Geelong had more chances, they made the most of theirs and is reflected in the scoreline 13.5 to Adelaides 11.15. Coach can only do so much, its up to the players to do the rest, ala finishing.

Of course you're right, if the players don't play well the coach isn't responsible, and last night was largely irrelevant anyway.

What I'm saying is that to win a premiership every thing has to go right including the players doing their bit as well as the coach. Things like getting someone to man up on a West or Harvey if they're tearing you up, not taking off a ruckman who's dominating during a comeback with 5 minutes to go, giving a full forward whose having a bad night a spell for awhile. Its just footy not rocket science.

 

[drakeyv2]

It's a trial game guys. It's also sport. You don't always win. We were playing against a good side that took their opportunities when they came.

As for Craig's coaching; I haven't had any problems with his match day coaching but lets remember that he is on a learning curve as well.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

That's all fine Stiffmeister.....and I agree that 90% of a PS comp is about development....but at some point in the third qtr of a GF....it's about winning for the club...the sponsors...the fans....but more importantly for the playing group. Geelong will take heaps of confidence into round 1....while our tyres will be deflated....if only slightly.
Normally I would agree with developing or teaching a player....but I fear the playing group lost way more in momentum for the season last night than Jericho might have gained in teaching. Sure - I don't mind investment in players...but unfortunately I don't reckon there is much prospect of return in Jericho's case.
Sometimes it's about the greater good...and I reckon Craigy will be rueing his lack of action in the cool light of today.

I agree with this. I also don't understand why he felt the need to mention Maric, Knights and VB as other youngsters who were panicy on Sat night. If he's stressing development of youngsters as his primary focus then why publically embarrass them when he didn't need to. Not a good night all round for Craigy.