Midfield

[Stiffy_18]

This year our midfield has not been performing as well as we expect it to. It has a bit to do with players spending a set amount of time in there and some missing some time with injuries. This year was always going to be about re-energising that midfield and we have seen the likes of Thompson, Reilly, van Berlo and Knights emerge and take greater roles in there that they have in the past. This has also pushed someone like Simon Goodwin to spend less time in the midfield than he has in the past.

My problem is not with the personnel there, it is more with our structure and strategy. No doubt the lack of quality taps has been felt by our midfield. Clarke couldn't get a kick but he was exceptional at finding his midfielders with his taps. However, what I have notices for some time now is that our midfielders are too handball happy at stoppages and especially in center square. When was the last time you saw one of our midfielders get the tap and have a quick kick out to space?!

Every time we go into the center square its to predictable. Over use of handball hoping to find an loose man and go forward. Mixing it up a bit wouldn't hurt.

I get the feeling with Pyke's departure we have lost a lot of midfield nous in the coaches box. Hamilton has been superb defensive coach for 2 years prior but the structure and strategy of our midfield has struggled this year with him in charge.

Is it time for Hamilton to go back to being a defensive coach next year and Jonas to maybe be the forward line coach?! We just seem to lack any sort of variety with our clearence work. It just a number of ill advised handballs to stationary team mates who are in worse position than the player with the ball. Maybe its time to mix it up a bit and take a few chances.

Thoughts?!

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

This year our midfield has not been performing as well as we expect it to. It has a bit to do with players spending a set amount of time in there and some missing some time with injuries. This year was always going to be about re-energising that midfield and we have seen the likes of Thompson, Reilly, van Berlo and Knights emerge and take greater roles in there that they have in the past. This has also pushed someone like Simon Goodwin to spend less time in the midfield than he has in the past.

Agree it is a bit of a waiting game. Thommo, VB, Knights and Reilly will gel and I think there is enough quality there to take us forward. Big shoes to fill I know. Perhaps it is the midfield 'flat spot' we had to have.

My problem is not with the personnel there, it is more with our structure and strategy. No doubt the lack of quality taps has been felt by our midfield. Clarke couldn't get a kick but he was exceptional at finding his midfielders with his taps. However, what I have notices for some time now is that our midfielders are too handball happy at stoppages and especially in center square. When was the last time you saw one of our midfielders get the tap and have a quick kick out to space?!

???

We see the high ball forward all the time. It never works. It has seemed at times the we are having a private competition to see who can kick the ball the highest.

Agree about the handball thing though. Thompson and Edwards are prepared to take some responsibility themselves to break some tackles and get free to deliver a decent pass, others seem to 'sell' the responsibility to a team mate via a quick give.

Every time we go into the center square its to predictable. Over use of handball hoping to find an loose man and go forward. Mixing it up a bit wouldn't hurt.

I don't know how it happens but we often seem to end up with our "B Team" in the middle. It seems to happen when Shirley, VB and/or Doughty are matched up with an opposition midfielder and follow them in for the bounce with one of our "A Team" making way. To me this means we are being dictated to by the opposition. Our run-with players can surely start outside of the square and follow their opponent after that.

 

[Tas]

Where was this under-performing midfield when you flew up to the Gold Coast?

In three weeks you smashed two sides in the middle who are in the top 4 currently which don't have an ordinary midfield. I think the issue this year is one of consistency. There is a much bigger variance in the work rate during games this year which is probably the biggest issue.

 

[Kickin_Goals]

When was the last time you saw one of our midfielders get the tap and have a quick kick out to space?!

Reilly consecutively, sky high floaters or not our forwards do nothing with them they struggle to mark the ball with delivery that is massively in their favour a 50/50 is a turnover with the rest of the mid-field flat footed they just are watching too much not motioning towards the ball often.
What Tas said, the work rate drops off after the first quarter of every game generally.
If they are going to rotate it might as well be then.

 

[Damp Squarie]

When was the last time you saw a ruckmen thump the ball forward like a Torney spoil... Im not saying do that ALL the time but we do need to mix it up in there.

I'd also like to see Hudson throw his weight around in the circle when the ball is negated to the feet of the ruckmen. Provide a sheperd, cover, block.

Let the little blokes get it....they are much likley to get a kick away then someone with a big frame.

Thommo, VB, Knights, Reilly and Porps are doing fine for the long term midfiled rotations but we are predictable.

 

[Markthirtytwo]

Reilly consecutively, sky high floaters or not our forwards do nothing with them they struggle to mark the ball with delivery that is massively in their favour a 50/50 is a turnover with the rest of the mid-field flat footed they just are watching too much not motioning towards the ball often.
What Tas said, the work rate drops off after the first quarter of every game generally.
If they are going to rotate it might as well be then.

Your's takin' the piss right?

Reilly would have to be the most accurate kick consistantly in our club for years. His metre perfect passes brings back memories of bygone eras.

 

[Markthirtytwo]

For mine we do over use the handball because they are probably drilled to use it to get out of trouble (especially in defence during the last two years)and create a loose man. But this year more teams have been tagging us much more closely and putting so much pressure on the midfield we have been coughing it up and it really stands out as something that we owned for two years is now our archilles heel.

 

[Stiffy_18]

I get the feeling that some people didn't quite understand the point I was trying to make.

In centre bounces, we just about always look to handball first, 2nd, 3rd and 4th options. Sometimes a quick little kick forward into space is all thats needed to break up the play a bit and create some run. Topjars is also spot on in saying that sometimes a punch forward from our ruckman could give up a slightly different, somewhat unpredictable look and feel.

This way you pretty much know whats going to happen. A tap to 9 o'clock, a handball, followed by another handball. Then a stoppage again.

I am not against use of the handball to get out of trouble. I think its a good creative tool but we are overusing it and are overly reliant on it. Sometimes breaking up the play a bit catches the opposition out.

Despite what some might think, we have some real good players in the midfield. We can go 6-7 deep without losing much if anything but I feel the structure and set pieces there are too predictable and there is not a great deal of variety there. Maybe its time we revisited that play books and came up with some new plays to implement there to make it a bit easier on ourselves.

 

[Crow Envy]

We need to find ourselves or develop a quality tagger, someone who will wear their player like glue and nag the hell out of them. I said at the start of the season Shirley isnt a premier tagger and I got hailed down for it. The weekends game provided further proof that he isnt.

 

[Cap]

Stiffy - do you think our lack of variety could suggest something about NC thoughts on the midfield ??

i realise you question talks about our gameplans and strategy but i think it comes down to the fact we have a number of younger players and a number of players who aren't as good as your Goodwins and Roos who are capable of playing more than 1 or 2 strategies ??

my points is maybe the answer to your question is personnel.....

 

[Stiffy_18]

Stiffy - do you think our lack of variety could suggest something about NC thoughts on the midfield ??

i realise you question talks about our gameplans and strategy but i think it comes down to the fact we have a number of younger players and a number of players who aren't as good as your Goodwins and Roos who are capable of playing more than 1 or 2 strategies ??

my points is maybe the answer to your question is personnel.....

I don't buy the personnel as a reason. We had pretty much the same players running through the midfield that we did last year. Granted, players like Thompson, Reilly, van Berlo and Knights have been spending a bit more time in there than last year. However, last year and the year before we had a bit of variety in terms of plays we ran there. Now it seems to be pretty much the same every time.

I understand you will get a bit of down time while van Berlo and Knights get more seasoned in these roles but I feel that the personnel hasn't changed much from last year but the structure and set plays is different.

The only way I can see personnel being an issue is in the ruck department where Clarke for all his short comings, was one of the best at directing the taps and giving his midfielders a free ride in that department. This year you don't have that so the plays need to be a bit different to make up for it as Hudson is not great at taps. He negates them well but not great at directing them. But he is an extra midfielder which should help the ground work but for some reason its not!!!!

Something is just not right. Maybe its the work rate. Maybe is the structure. I personally don't think personnel is a major reason here.

 

[Jars458]

I get the feeling that some people didn't quite understand the point I was trying to make.

In centre bounces, we just about always look to handball first, 2nd, 3rd and 4th options. Sometimes a quick little kick forward into space is all thats needed to break up the play a bit and create some run. .

You are correct. Overuse of handball in the midfield and in defence has been horrible this year. Its almost as if is the instruction to handball at all costs.

A good example of this is Goodwin's kick to handball ratio which is much lower this year. Previously he was excellent at getting a quick kick going forward from the stoppages but we havn't seen that this year.

I think its almost as if we are trying more handball to play attacking football but it has the oppostuie result. From memory against the Kangas we were much mroe direct with our kicking nad usd handball less to good effect.

On saturdy though, the problems were in my view lack of any forward line strucutre or effor (other than Burton) and a total lack of defensive midfield pressure.

 

[feenix67]

I think its as much about predictability - how often do you see the handball come out the back of a centre bounce contest, then a series of handballs backwards to players running behind the play, until we either turn it over with poor skills or kick to a contest hurriedly at half forward.

Interestingly that observation backs up your comments about losing rucks, because thats the play to use when you rove the opposition tap. I'd like to see us use our wings a little more creatively to free us up around the contest, instead of all this soccer style backpedalling that sometimes brings us unstuck.

And yeah, I think Pyke's resignation has really hurt our midfield development - apparently he was fantastic and was given almost complete autonomy in developing our midfielders and midfield strategies. I doubt he would have started the last quarter on Sat with Thommo on the pine....