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Preview NAB Cup 2013

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The footy is fast approaching, and we now have just 3 weeks until our first appearances in the NAB Cup. That being the case, I thought it might be a good idea to start this thread now to generate a little discussion.

Our fixture is as follows:

Round 1: Sunday February 24 vs Sydney & GWS (Blacktown)
Round 2: Saturday March 2 vs Fremantle (Etihad Stadium)
Round 3: Friday March 8 vs Adelaide (AAMI Stadium)

Our results in these matches don't particularly faze me, as results in the NAB Cup are relatively insignificant and don't necessarily translate to the season proper. Of course the preference would be to win, however no doubt I'll be far more interested in seeing how we gel as a unit under the new game plan, than what we produce in terms of wins and losses.

How would you all like to see the club structure up during the competition? Personally, I feel the round 1 format in particular is garbage and would like to see the club give an opportunity to our depth and younger players. I wouldn't bother sending some of our more experienced players up to Sydney. That will have the two-fold effect of giving them the extra weeks rest, and it will also hand our other players more responsibility and opportunity to step up and show their wares.

Normal games resume in round 2 and 3, and that's when I think we should start escalating our our play, both in terms of personnel as well as intensity. That's when I feel we should look at putting a relatively full-strength team out on the park as we head towards round 1 of the Home & Away season against Richmond.

In terms of playing personnel, at this stage the only player we can absolutely rule out is McInnes. If it were up to me, I wouldn't take Judd, Waite, Scotland or Jamison to Sydney. I just don't see a need to put them under any sort of risk in what is, essentially, an absolutely meaningless series of games. I'm tempted to add Carrazzo to that group but I feel that with him a candidate for the captaincy, we'll probably see him in all preseason games.

The other aspect worth discussing is whether we may see some experimentation from the coaches, with regards to player positioning. Will we see some unexpected player positioning, as the coaches attempt to gauge the versatility of some of the players? Or will the coaches already be fairly set on where they want each player to spend most of their time on the field, and not deviate from that, in the name of continuity? I'm not too sure which way we'll go with that, but I don't mind the idea of throwing a few things around to trial, after all that's one of the primary uses of the NAB series.

So what do you all think? Will we go all out to win the competition, or will we use it to ease into the swing of things and focus not on the result but rather on the method? Will we see an inexperienced lineup or will Mick be keen to put out a relatively experienced lineup from the get go? Will we see some experimentation in the positions of some of the boys, or will we not deviate too much from what we know and have seen previously?

Discuss away. And bring on the footy.
 
Good thread and about time. Do we treat the first game with disdain - probably. Cotton-wool the guns and veterans, blood the newbies, lots of changes, lots of positional experimentation. Win or lose, we want minimal injuries, as much time as possible for the younguns and establishment of the game-plan.
 
Does anyone know how Malthouse usually handles the NAB Cup?

I imagine it will be to try out his tactics and get guys used to his system.

Being his first NAB Cup with the team, it will be interesting to watch.
 

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Apparently it's virtually impossible to stop Scotland playing in these games as well, he just likes to be in everything. Seems to have worked for him the last few years.

I agree about not taking Waite and Judd to Sydney, they're too important to risk.

Pretty keen to see how Simon White's impressive training form translates into performance, same goes for Curnow. Guess we'll get a bit of an idea in these next few intra-club matches as well.

Also looking/hoping to see someone maybe unexpected step up, would love to see a Bootsma, Watson, Lucas, Graham, Buckley or Davies just come out and star.

Looking forward to seeing a toughened up, defensive minded and bloody hard to play against Blues team out there.
 
To be honest I'd prefer us to take the NAB Cup more seriously than we have the last couple of seasons.

Malthouse's game-plan isn't going to click into place overnight and I think it will be important for the boys to have confidence in each other to carry it out successfully. I'm more than happy to rest the more senior guys for most of the NAB Cup but I would prefer us to show some genuine intensity and aggression, which can hopefully set the tone for a strong start to the season proper.

Player wise, I'm really looking forward to seeing what ROK can do in the NAB Cup (and what role he is assigned). Also hoping to see Casboult put in a strong showing and lock in his spot for Round 1. I genuinely believe Casboult's presence inside 50 will cause opposition teams a lot of problems this year, so hopefully Levi can hit the ground running and force Mick to play him from the get-go.
 
I'd like to see Malthouse decide who the 32 players that are likely to see get regular or somewhat regular games this season are and play them exclusively, or close to, in the NAB Cup. That still leaves you room to keep stars out of games (Judd, Waite not flying to Sydney, etc.) but stops you from playing others who are unlikely to see more than one or two games (except through forced injuries). It's an opportunity to get the major collective group on the same level, game plan understood, primed and pumped ready to go in the home and away season.

My only addition to the 32 would be if someone is showing a heap on the training track who wasn't in original contention then you give them an opportunity for you to decide if they deserve reconsideration.
 
vs Sydney & GWS


Laidler Jamison Temay
Touhy Watson* Scotland^
*Solid young kid, blood him a bit, will do fine
^Missing the first two of the real time, give him a run here


Robinson Bell Yarran*
Warnock^ McLean Gibbs
*Give Yarran a more midfield role see how he plays it
^ Lets see if Robbie has picked up his game

Armfield Casboult Menzel*
Betts Mitchell^ Walker
*Unleash the beast
^Get more game time into Mitchell he has to compete with Caz, lets see if he can

Grayham Kreuzer Cachia Sub: Murphy*
Give Grayham and Cachia a chance to run around, toss Krooze wherever he's needed, ruck forward line, maybe even defence, test him out

*Unleash Murphy for a quick burst, he's too good to be playing these Sydney siders in Round 1 of a NAB cup game but not old enough to be wrapped up completely, super sub it is
 
Firstly, I would like to see pretty much everyone except our "locks" given a chance to show what they can do, with particular focus on "the next tier" of players coming through that haven't necessary had a great deal of game time yet or that have put their hand up over the pre-season such as White, Watson, Casboult, Mitchell, O'Keeffe, Bootsma, Buckley, Warnock, McCarthy, Dale, Bell and Cachia.

Secondly, I'd like to see us have a crack at every game. I feel the trend of 10 years ago of form in the NAB Cup not really being carried through to the main season has dissipated somewhat and these days, NAB Cup form does indeed seem to carry on through to some degree.

Thirdly, NO INJURIES PLEASE!
 
MM is going to want to get as much of a look at players competing for spots as he can so expect a few of these sorts to get a game but all the same he will want to get as much practice into his regulars to enforce the fundamentals of how he wants the team to play. So likely see a group of fringe players and a lot of the best 22 out there I think. All eyes on guys like Mitchell, Lucas, Rowe, Buckley, Menzel and the three rucks who will likely be looking to push into the best 22. Then the Rookies, Bell, Curnow etc who will be looking to break onto the main list.
 

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I'd like to see Malthouse decide who the 32 players that are likely to see get regular or somewhat regular games this season are

I'm curious to know how your arrived at the number 32 - a statistical analysis of the # of players Sydney used in 2013?

At this stage I'd only exclude the following from calculations for Round 1 (against Richmond): McInness (recovery), Rowe (getting on the park is the priority) and 5 teenage kids - Dale (others ahead on rookie list), Menzel (softly, softly after knee trauma), Buckley, Temay and Graham.

The rest are all fair game. Malthouse might well mothball Bootsma, Mitchell and McCarthy for another 12 months but a strong NAB cup might propel each up the pecking order. Davies, Joseph, White, Ellard, Collins, O'Keeffe and Cachia are the usual suspects for delisting but again, a new coach won't have preconceived ideas written in stone.
 
Wouldn't mind seeing Casboult at CHF and Mitchell at FF for at least one of these games.
Players lining up in their natural positions, ¡ what a revolutionary idea ! :p

Aside from Gibbs, Yarran and Garlett on the ball, Kruezer at CHB and Watson at FF - don't expect too many positional surprises.
 
How well we go is dependent, to a large degree, on how much the opposition turn up to play. Under Roos the Swans never took the pre-season comp seriously and IIRC it was only in his last year as a coach that the Swans won a pre-season game at all. Longmire has taken it a bit more seriously but would not sacrifice preparation for the main season. Sheedy is ever-enigmatic. He might "go for the wins" to build self-belief or, alternatively, go easy on the basis that his side will have a long 6 months of second year blues ahead of them.

I could not care less about the results. What I will be hoping to see is real fluidity and certainty in movement of the ball forward when we have it and real determination and purpose in our efforts to strip the other side of possession of the ball when we don't. If we can achieve this it will indicate that everyone on the list understands the game-plan and can execute it (at least not under maximum pressure).

The flip side of this observation is that I will not care about the 1-on-1 contests. (Well, maybe just get a little bit excited when Caz waxes with Mitchell in taking towering marks on the forward line.)
 
I'm curious to know how your arrived at the number 32 - a statistical analysis of the # of players Sydney used in 2013?.

According to http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/2012.html#top - number of players who played five games or more last year, sorted by 2012 AFL ladder position (for teams inside the eight it includes finals)

1. Hawthorn - 29
2. Adelaide - 30
3. Sydney - 27
4. Collingwood - 31
5. West Coast - 28
6. Geelong - 28
7. Fremantle - 28
8. North Melbourne - 30
---
9. St. Kilda - 30
10. Carlton - 35
11. Essendon - 32
12. Richmond -30
13. Brisbane - 31
14. Port Adelaide - 30
15. Western Bulldogs - 32
16. Melbourne - 32
17. Gold Coast - 36
18. GW Sydney - 36

Top 8 average: 28.875
Bottom 10 average: 32.4

My theory is you want to blood a few players in the NAB Cup but you predominantly want to be playing your better players especially given that we have a new coach with a new system. If we were to play 32 players over the minimum 4 games it allows you to play those 28-29 guys who will be locks to play five or more games in the upcoming season while also allowing you to blood a few kids who you think or hope will feature during the season. Perhaps you up that 32 to 33 or 34 but no more because then that means that at least a few of those 28-29 guys wont be getting as much match preparation as what you'd want. While that may be fine for guys carrying niggles it also leads to not completely understanding what is expected of you in the new coaching system in genuine match conditions.

The above table also blows the "total list depth" theory out of window. It's really the top 30 list depth that determines premierships. It's also why I believe we're a much stronger team than what the media will give us credit for. No team other than the two new teams came remotely close to the 35 players we had to play five or more times last season. It shows just how horrific our injuries were.

Of teams that made the finals I dare suggest that the bulk of Collingwood's depth was played early in the season as they came into the year with a heap of injuries that were able to be healed. North's would have come with their inconsistency in the first half of the year creating chop changes to their weekly list. That Adelaide were the only team with 30+ that cannot be explained shows how good they were last year but that could also be because of their weaker schedule.
 
Kreuzer : We have a lot to prove


Matthew Kreuzer says the Blues have "a lot to prove" and are determined to start their 2013 campaign with "a few" pre-season victories.

Carlton was the AFL's worst-performed club last pre-season and then produced a below-par premiership season that ultimately cost former coach Brett Ratten his job.
The Blues last year lost all five of their pre-season matches – NAB Cup clashes against Port Adelaide (six points), Adelaide (nine), Western Bulldogs (four) and the Brisbane Lions (64), along with a practice match against North Melbourne (16).

Admittedly, the Blues were under-strength and underdone with several key players missing and others lacking fitness



Kreuzer : We have a lot to prove
 
Normal games resume in round 2 and 3, and that's when I think we should start escalating our our play, both in terms of personnel as well as intensity. That's when I feel we should look at putting a relatively full-strength team out on the park as we head towards round 1 of the Home & Away season against Richmond.

Agreed. Don't care about the first rnd other than giving young players/rookies a run so Mick can get a look at the list and hopefully no injuries.

With normal games resuming I definitely want to see a substantially 1st choice side on the park.

Intensity doesn't have to be crazy so much but with a new coach in place and a new/adjusted game plan the sooner the players try it out in 'match' conditions the sooner they'll come to terms with it. Regardless of our recent record against the Tigers and the Pies I want to hit the ground running from game 1. WC away and Geelong as followups will not be easy matches.

If the list is in good nick injury wise come rnd 1 I believe the team has an excellent opportunity to set up their season, earn some much needed respect and take a spot in the eight.
 

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Blues will go a long way in the NAB cup.

Odds are shortening and they could easily win in, setting them up for a serious crack at the real one
 
It won't happen, but I'd love to see a team like this taken to Sydney.

B: Simon White - Matthew Watson - Jeremy Laidler
HB: Zach Tuohy - Lachie Henderson - Josh Bootsma
C: Chris Yarran - Brock McLean - Kane Lucas
HF: Andrew Walker - Levi Casboult - Bryce Gibbs
F: Jeff Garlett - Luke Mitchell - Eddie Betts
R: Matthew Kreuzer - Mitch Robinson - Marc Murphy
INT (from): Troy Menzel - Rhys O'Keeffe - Shaun Hampson - Patrick McCarthy - Tom Bell - Nick Graham - Robbie Warnock - Frazer Dale - Jaryd Cachia - Tom Temay - Dylan Buckley

Would fap.
 
It won't happen, but I'd love to see a team like this taken to Sydney.

B: Simon White - Matthew Watson - Jeremy Laidler
HB: Zach Tuohy - Lachie Henderson - Josh Bootsma
C: Chris Yarran - Brock McLean - Kane Lucas
HF: Andrew Walker - Levi Casboult - Bryce Gibbs
F: Jeff Garlett - Luke Mitchell - Eddie Betts
R: Matthew Kreuzer - Mitch Robinson - Marc Murphy
INT (from): Troy Menzel - Rhys O'Keeffe - Shaun Hampson - Patrick McCarthy - Tom Bell - Nick Graham - Robbie Warnock - Frazer Dale - Jaryd Cachia - Tom Temay - Dylan Buckley

Would fap.
This makes sense to me in the first week. Would want to get more serious in the full length games.

Im not saying it was the be all and end all, but our poor performances in the NAB cup last year were a sign of things to come. I wanna see us win a few games (although not at the expense of any injuries).
 
This makes sense to me in the first week. Would want to get more serious in the full length games.

Oh, absolutely. That team was only for the games against Sydney and GWS up there. 2 x 20 minute halves is a rubbish format and IMO should be treated as an opportunity to give the younger and depth players a go.

Im not saying it was the be all and end all, but our poor performances in the NAB cup last year were a sign of things to come. I wanna see us win a few games (although not at the expense of any injuries).

The NAB Cup last year wasn't a sign of things to come at all. We didn't win a game in preseason last year, but that was quickly forgotten when we were 3-0, flying and considered premiership favourites. Other factors contributed to our subsequent downhill spiral, it wasn't because of what happened through the NAB series.
 
The NAB Cup last year wasn't a sign of things to come at all. We didn't win a game in preseason last year, but that was quickly forgotten when we were 3-0, flying and considered premiership favourites. Other factors contributed to our subsequent downhill spiral, it wasn't because of what happened through the NAB series.
Just felt like we didnt try in those nab cup games, and that mentality stayed with us when the chips were down.
 
Hi guy's, just visiting trying to get some inside info on some dark horses for dreamteam but have something to add as an outside observer.

I will be looking forward to seeing your new game plan and movement of the footy in the NAB and season proper.

Last year watching your games there were a number of times you were actually winning the ball and play by a fair bit but then it would just come to a halt and a turnover would occur resulting in a goal. It struck me that at points in play the players got confused and didn't know what to do and ended up rushing into a turnover because the actual game plan was either not solid enough or too confusing.

That won't happen this year so you can start getting a little excited if you want. The talent in your list is going to shine through and don't be surprised if a few guy's play in positions and roles you didn't expect.

Good luck for the season and I definitely predict finals and probable top 5.
 

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