NAB Cup format

[Silent Alarm]

SO

There's people on the main board who think the NAB Cup is pointless. Of course, it's an AFL HQ cliche that the pre-season comp needs reinvigoration. So, uh, be a cliche and reinvent it.

What's, in your mind, a good blueprint for a near-perfect, month-ish long footy warm up? I mean in terms of fixtures, rather than rule alterations.

 

[Rob]

NAB Cup isn't pointless, but that triangular bullshit is. Just play a normal game.

If the AFL want to make it seem fair with who plays who, then do a random draw.

 

[Matt121]

I hate the trianular draw.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

- Revert to knockout.
- Games in the NAB Cup played at AFL venues, with few experimental rules.
- Games between teams which have been knocked out all in regional centres, including some of the more experimental of the experimental rules.

The rules and venues would then provide some incentive to stay in the Cup. Most teams would prefer to play at an AFL venue under something closer to genuine competition rules than pla under bizarro rules in the bush.


Qualifiers:
15th to 18th from the previous season in a random draw.

Cup proper:
Then the four weeks of knockout, with random draw. Top 14, plus qualifier winners.



Alternative:
Qualifiers could be extended to include representative teams from the SANFL, VFL and WAFL (if that was to happen there would be no AFL listed players in the state rep teams).
eg
qulifiers would be 12th - 18th, plus the three state leagues, in a random draw
I have left out the NEAFL and TSL as they are probably not of the same standard, nor at the point of players pre-seasons, to compete.

 

[hitthepost]

I like the way it is. The Twenty20 matches I think would be more beneficial though if all 3 teams were allowed to use two full squads of 18 players plus 3 interchange per match. Allowed to double-up as many players as desired for the two games (a player needing more match-time in their legs for example) but really allow a fairer set of matches that it's not a team who has played a match already vs a team who hasn't. Clubs can use all listed players and apply to AFL for approval to use players from their recruiting zones who won't be able to play premiership season this year. Gives coaches the chance to see as many players as they like.

 

[hitthepost]

ALSO
Looking ahead to next year. Assuming the format stays the same, who should play where?
Well.
I like having 2 pools at Etihad (maybe one at Simmonds though now it has lights), and one each at Pattersons, AAMI, Blacktown (switch to Skoda?) and Metricon. Non-Vic teams play at "home".
Of the Vic teams, North and Richmond have played all 3 years in Victoria. Carlton, Hawthorn, Melbourne, have only played one year in Melbourne (Carlton not since 2011).
So I'd prioritise that it's time for Richmond and North to go interstate. Then teams who have only been interstate once.

Then with the Non-Victorian teams, they have been alternating which "home" team plays 1st and 3rd and which one plays 2nd and 3rd, which I would continue. I also want to minimise repeat matchups (Collingwood has faced off against the Bulldogs the past 2 years), though this isn't a huge priority as the Non-Victorian clubs have, in the main, played each other every year so far.

So, NAB Cup 2014, hitthepost-style:
Friday Week 1, 7.10: Melbourne v St Kilda, St Kilda v Essendon, Essendon v Melbourne (Etihad)
Saturday Week 1, 7.10: Sydney v North, North v GWS, GWS v Sydney (Skoda/Blacktown)
Sunday Week 1, 6.10: Brisbane v Richmond, Richmond v Gold Coast, Gold Coast v Brisbane (Metricon)

Friday Week 2, 7.10: Carlton v Bulldogs, Bulldogs v Hawthorn, Hawthorn v Carlton (Etihad)
Saturday Week 2, 7.10: Fremantle v Collingwood, Collingwood v West Coast, West Coast v Fremantle
Sunday Week 3, 6.10: Port v Geelong, Geelong v Adelaide, Adelaide v Port (AAMI)

 

[Araluenian]

Six groups of three teams each, playing Triangular as current. Then, Division Winners progress, as do the next two highest ranking teams, to make eight. These eight then play full-length knockout games.

 

[hitthepost]

Six groups of three teams each, playing Triangular as current. Then, Division Winners progress, as do the next two highest ranking teams, to make eight. These eight then play full-length knockout games.

So revert to the 2011 format, except it was just the top 8 ranked teams after round 1?

The problem perceived with this was the inability to plan travel and accommodation in advance, which affected training schedules during a period where everybody was trying to prepare for Round 1 (admittedly or not). On the plus side, it means if Port Adelaide win well in round 1 they could get a game on TV for exposure during weeks 2-3 of NAB Cup, and possibly more games on main venues.

 

[Araluenian]

Fair enough hitthepost, but I do think that the current system of just plucking the two best teams after four matches of varying length could be improved upon. Perhaps we can pool teams into pools of 9, playing each other in the shortened form of matches over three weeks, with Division Winners playing off in the GF?

 

[hitthepost]

Fair enough hitthepost, but I do think that the current system of just plucking the two best teams after four matches of varying length could be improved upon. Perhaps we can pool teams into pools of 9, playing each other in the shortened form of matches over three weeks, with Division Winners playing off in the GF?

The matches are of varying length but everyone plays the same number of matches of each length. Given the main objectives of NAB Cup are (1) get players ready for this season and (2) get kids ready for next season, until you add the almighty $$$ into it you could even just (like say the SANFL) schedule a 4-week program of "trial matches" and not give a rat's about the result. So, if we're keeping the Grand Final and making a competition of it, we have to make sure it still meets the main objectives listed above. It's not like some teams are playing 4 full-length games, some 4 shortened-quarters games, some Twenty20 games and some a mix, then picking a winner.

If anything, maybe the Twenty20 games should only be worth 2 or 3 points, not 4?

 

[Araluenian]

Whether the format needs to be changed or not, the AFL needs to ensure that the NAB Cup stays relevant, and that the Trophy is a prize that is genuinely worth winning. That has to be the main challenge in any NAB Cup reform.

 

[stmookeyj]

Either revert to a knockout tournament or make it a lightning carnival held in each state and territory once every 8 years over 3 days. Then to raise the stakes, make it winner take all in terms of prize money (at least $500K). And in this day and age, to make teams take it seriously each team's injury list will be independently reviewed by a team of AFL appointed doctors, and if in their opinion a player is not sufficiently injured to be prevented from playing in that game the club would forfeit a first round draft pick (which hurts the most in this competition, teams could sell an asset or defer payments on anything to make up fines, and clubs can easily make up a 4 or 8 point deficit on the remainder if it's a points penalty).

 

[Silent Alarm]

The issue with having a full list to choose from is that some clubs have different goals. Sometimes it's about preparing for the season, but other sides can experiment and give kids a run out. That could tilt the contests a little unfairly. I don't mind what they've done now, because it's kind of in a middle ground.

The same thing kind of goes for prize money. The NAB Cup is just a warm-up. Clubs don't have to take it seriously, so why use potential development money for prizes?

For me, I've just changed up hitthepost 's fixture a little... The Giants should play at Blacktown just to penetrate another market. There's, what, seven games at Skoda? Not much for a Perth, Adelaide, or Victorian side, but the demand doesn't really need more Skoda games. I've split the games so each week has a footy state, and non-footy state game. The Sunday is dedicated to the latter, making it a bit more of a family day.

Bit o' nostalgia with Carlton and Western Bulldogs playing at their suburban grounds against the clubs Melburnians don't care about... I tried to keep a few games at Etihad, too. Just so there's footy on the palette in the game's main city.

Week five is the GF, in a main AFL stadium, with non-competing clubs to organise their own teams.

The clubs who finish third and fourth can compete for what I'll call the 'Community Cup,' which is held the opposite day/night of the NAB Cup Grand Final. That game'll be played in a regional town selected by the third place side (obviously Melbs' sides will go to Victoria, Adelaide's to SA, etc.)

Round One, Week One
Friday: Melbourne, St Kilda, Essendon @ Etihad
Saturday: Adelaide Crows, Port Adelaide, North Melbourne @ Adelaide Oval
Sunday: Gold Coast, Brisbane Lions, Western Bulldogs @ Metricon

Week Two
Friday: Carlton, Geelong, Hawthorn @ Etihad
Saturday: Fremantle, West Coast, Richmond @ Subi
Sunday: GWS Giants, Sydney Swans, Collingwood @ Blacktown

Round Two, Week Three
Friday:
Essendon v Collingwood @ Etihad (night game)

Saturday:
Adelaide v Melbourne @ Port Lincoln
West Coast v Hawthorn @ Busselton
Carlton v Fremantle @ Princes Park
Geelong v Brisbane Lions @ Simonds (night game)

Sunday:
Gold Coast v Sydney Swans @ Townsville
North Melbourne v Western Bulldogs @ Bendigo
St Kilda v Port Adelaide @ Frankston
GWS Giants v Richmond @ Wagga Wagga

Round Three, Week Four:
Friday:
Richmond v Adelaide @ Etihad (night game)

Saturday:
Melbourne v Carlton @ Casey
Fremantle v North Melbourne @ Albany
Western Bulldogs v Gold Coast @ Whitten Oval
Collingwood v GWS Giants @ Etihad Stadium (night game)

Sunday:
Brisbane Lions v West Coast @ Ipswich
Sydney Swans v Geelong Cats @ Newcastle
Port Adelaide v Essendon @ Port Augusta
Hawthorn v St Kilda @ Launceston

 

[hitthepost]

Next questions:
1) If Brisbane beat Collingwood tonight, they place top of the NAB Cup ladder going into the Grand Final. That should give them a "home" Grand Final next week. I know the AFL makes the decision (just like Adelaide considers themselves lucky to have hosted last year's GF). From my calculations, the matchup could be Collingwood v Brisbane, Brisbane v Carlton, or possibly Brisbane v Collingwood or Collingwood v Carlton (I say possibly!). Two of those matchups are obvious venue choices - Eithad Stadium. But if Brisbane do finish top, would they play at Metricon or would the AFL use the fact that Brisbane can't use the 'Gabba as a reason to play the game at Etihad anyway?

2) Who plays who next weekend, do we reckon?

 

[Clark G]

Have two rounds of normal matches. At the end of the two rounds, the top four teams on the ladder play off in semi finals with the two winners progressing to the final. Teams that do not make the top four play practice matches during weeks three and four.

 

[damochandler]

first get rid of the 20/20 games, no one wants those and they are just un watchable rubbish

first 3 rounds have a set fixture and whoever is on top of the lader at the end of that play off in the gf. the rest play a scratch match. pretty simple