List Mgmt. New List Manager

[Rosscoe]

Duran just gave up.

This.......

What is the point???

Lol..Duran would rather give up a world title than tango for 10 odd rounds on the worlds largest dance floor.

 

[Stig O'Hara]

Lol..Duran would rather give up a world title than tango for 10 odd rounds on the worlds largest dance floor.

I’ll keep an eye out.

 

[Aphrodite]

He's a membership sales whiz; the auto renewals idea was brilliant. A true sales star. Sell Sell.

Auto renewals have been around for years.

 

[Opine]

Auto renewals have been around for years.

I meant the upgrade

 

[Stig O'Hara]

It’s outta sight.

 

[Skull Face]

I look at facts -
56K to 65K = 16% growth
65K to 75K = 15.5% growth

Liddle outlined what he'd do when he joined us and I don't reside in Liddle's office to be able to tell you how he did it - but he's doing it.
What else do you need to know. You don't think it's luck do you? Looks like good business to me but you say it's a scam.

How did we increase numbers by 25% in 2007 of the back of 5 worse years then we have ever had before or 11% in 2018 when we won 2 games for the year?

The playing list is where 99% of this membership growth is coming from, blind freddie could be in charge of our membership department right now and the numbers would be going up.

 

[HARKER]

How did we increase numbers by 25% in 2007 of the back of 5 worse years then we have ever had before or 11% in 2018 when we won 2 games for the year?

The playing list is where 99% of this membership growth is coming from, blind freddie could be in charge of our membership department right now and the numbers would be going up.

Everything is easy when you write it down quickly

Liddle expressed his view in regards to our membership when he joined us and is likely surpassing his own vision but what? It has nothing to do with him and all to do with our list? The list that has given him an 18th and a 16th finish in that time?

Not sure what else to say but if you think blind Freddie could have done as well then that's what you see.
What else do you think should happen as a matter of course, requiring no input?

 

[Azzurro]

How did we increase numbers by 25% in 2007 of the back of 5 worse years then we have ever had before or 11% in 2018 when we won 2 games for the year?

The playing list is where 99% of this membership growth is coming from, blind freddie could be in charge of our membership department right now and the numbers would be going up.

I agree that our playing list (and the promise of improved performance) is our biggest drawcard. Following this, actual improved performance will drive further increases. All of it must be underpinned by a unified message from a club putting fans first. Teague has done an amazing job at this for instance - talking about how good our supporters are ("the best in the league" etc) and the players have done it too. Clearly media training (the narrative we are selling to the masses) has changed direction, for the better - assumption is that this is Liddle at play, but who can be sure?

All of this can only be realised as a growth in memberships if the membership department harness these selling points and sell to the latent fan base (including previous members who have not renewed).

Anyone with a sales background and half a strategic brain could come up with a plan to drive membership growth with the above foundations in place.

This is not to downplay Liddle's influence, but I think the board deserve most of the credit as since loGiudice took over they have done a solid job of making very tough calls at the right time to maximise our performance on and off field.

Liddle is the right man for right now, to boost our memberships and commercial performance. Prendergast looms as a potential "right man" for the next phase, once our finances are strong, to help us deliver sustained on field success with a football focus (when money is not the main focus as it's flowing in hand over fist).

SOS was the right man to setup the list, to execute a plan and not be tempted to stuff us up by taking all his IP with him afterwards. Keen to see what the board does next, but unlike years gone by I have confidence they will choose the right person for right now.

 

[Skull Face]

Everything is easy when you write it down quickly

Liddle expressed his view in regards to our membership when he joined us and is likely surpassing his own vision but what? It has nothing to do with him and all to do with our list? The list that has given him an 18th and a 16th finish in that time?

Not sure what else to say but if you think blind Freddie could have done as well then that's what you see.
What else do you think should happen as a matter of course, requiring no input?

You didn't answer anything and repeated yourself, I am done.

 

[JustaBattler]

This is the whole crux of the matter. On field and list building is all but done.

I am sure it would have become strained around the upper management circles mid year.
Bolton playing the kids in the engine room for the sake of it. Fasolo, Garlett, Lang getting games ahead of JSOS, who was at that stage our best "pressure forward" Ed and Gibbo being made in to forwards. Murph on the periphery. Simmo next door to out the door being "managed" in turbulent times. McGovern treated like a messiah when he was treading water (to put it kindly).

SOS had Caro at him like a dog with a bone, and suddenly his department and role are under (public) internal review. Blokes like Liddle and Lloyd if worth their salt as footy administrators should have had the foresight and nous to read the situation. Suggests grabbing at the opportunity to install their own team as the only alternative to lack of footy acumen.

Jack may have been a point of contention SOS had trouble stomaching, but add some other names and decisions to that list. No doubt the Italian Stallion could become a bit abrasive, but I reckon there was plenty of fuel thrown on the fire. Like him or not. the bloke did a great job with the build. He was either intentionally or "inadvertantly" undermined

First a call out to those who are genuinely interested in the discussion about this 'stuff' - it is a discussion and yes there are some polarised views.

I guess everyone brings to forum discussions what their personal experience is and this colours everything they write or think. Some people aren't interested in discussions like this Coona - people like you and me are.

Some people have attention spans of less than a day on any issue and some people are on here for some kind of reach around mutual hugging grope for likes society - I wish they would just stop reading and whining and screaching about how 'wrong' people are about wanting to talk about this SOS thing and the future LM thing and what it might mean re quality of management Carlton is stuck with or blessed with - instead of smart arsery why dont they just pizz orf to some thread that interests them.

I enjoy HARKER 'take' on things ( even though I disagree with his peculiar way of beating around the bushness) I enjoy blokes like DangerousD and BlueJet and teagueyubeauty - because their views are so different but rational and consistent - I enjoy Opine 's dogged determination to reject what has been delivered, same for Skull Face - there have been plenty of people who have contributed by putting their views out there

As for your post I quoted above - yeah I reckon it all makes 'sense' - the turmoil that Bolton's dysfunctional team structures created by pretty much ceding games to opposition by giving up between the arcs competitiveness was too much even for the most stubborn of supporters (like me) to accept. Ed as HFF and Murph shoved aside - yeah right....and yet there were people 'criticizing' any commentary on this obvious dis-functionality ....same personality types who think they occupy the high moral high ground on - EVERYTHING

SOS wouldn't have been alone in getting more and more frustrated at match day stoopids - on display magnificent fashion against hawthorn - a game I'll never forget.

I reckon the Club had had enough of the 'green shoots' stuff about 5-6 games in....by the time things got to 1-10 ....blokes like Liddle - whose career was being threatened by diabolically poor on field performances would have had the knives out well and truly - and SOS would not have been above internal criticism - no one is perfect.

Too many numbers against the 4-41 loss record for El President to keep a lid on - simple as that.

At the end of the day - I reckon SOS has no interest in working with Liddle and Co - for whatever reason(s) - he does have some blame in the whole matter of how he has left - no doubt because it always takes two to tango.

For me the real shame of it is that a Carlton legend has been exited in unsavory manner - and I do have question marks over the competency of what remains.

 

[HARKER]

You didn't answer anything and repeated yourself, I am done.

Skull Face I look at it this way - If someone is hitting the projected targets, I can't bag them for it.
Do you think the CFC would be happy should we click over 75K next year? They wouldn't have dreamt of that given our recent rate of increase.





Here are the numbers and in answer to your question - You can figure it out. Just look at the 2005 numbers and you'll see what I see.
The level of growth under Liddles watch is like nothing we've seen before. The numbers are in clear sight and to suggest that anyone could have done it, is just a little disingenuous....maybe a lot, actually.

 

[Aphrodite]

What an odd thread!

 

[Tony Lynn 15]

How did we increase numbers by 25% in 2007 of the back of 5 worse years then we have ever had before or 11% in 2018 when we won 2 games for the year?

The playing list is where 99% of this membership growth is coming from, blind freddie could be in charge of our membership department right now and the numbers would be going up.

Jeannie Pratt.

 

[Opine]

Skull Face I look at it this way - If someone is hitting the projected targets, I can't bag them for it... [unless that someone is SOS or MLG; or both]

EFA

 

[Benaly28]

Nearly 2020 and we’re still talking about Sos’s Departure.How about we focus on the excitement of our playing group and coaching staff.

 

[Benaly28]

How did we increase numbers by 25% in 2007 of the back of 5 worse years then we have ever had before or 11% in 2018 when we won 2 games for the year?

The playing list is where 99% of this membership growth is coming from, blind freddie could be in charge of our membership department right now and the numbers would be going up.

Would’ve blind Freddie recruited Eddie to boost membership?

 

[HARKER]

EFA

More of the same - No content, but let's just attack the poster....and then add some....let's just call it fabrication, shall we?

I have posts littered through here, as to what I thought about the good and bad per SOS.
Much more good than bad though and I thought the not-so-good component of his List Management was fixable.

MLG? I applauded him when I had cause to and won't applaud him when there's no cause to.......but somehow this is an agenda.

Ponder on this -
Versed football people say that there are five key pillars in an AFL environment. 1. President 2. CEO 3. Coach 4. List Manager 5. Head of Football
Through the course of our rebuild, only one of those key pillars remain and look who it is. We can make of that what we will.

Richmond on the other hand have had their 5 pillars intact since 2014 and only added one component albeit an important component - Neil Balme.

Probably just more coincidence right?
I just don't see it that way.....so I have the odd shot at our club for being what they are - There may just be a reason for it...but you just keep EFA'ing.

 

[Opine]

More of the same - No content, but let's just attack the poster....and then add some....let's just call it fabrication, shall we?

I have posts littered through here, as to what I thought about the good and bad per SOS.
Much more good than bad though and I thought the not-so-good component of his List Management was fixable.

MLG? I applauded him when I had cause to and won't applaud him when there's no cause to.......but somehow this is an agenda.

Ponder on this -
Versed football people say that there are five key pillars in an AFL environment. 1. President 2. CEO 3. Coach 4. List Manager 5. Head of Football
Through the course of our rebuild, only one of those key pillars remain and look who it is. We can make of that what we will.

Richmond on the other hand have had their 5 pillars intact since 2014 and only added one component albeit an important component - Neil Balme.

Probably just more coincidence right?
I just don't see it that way.....so I have the odd shot at our club for being what they are - There may just be a reason for it...but you just keep EFA'ing.

Then quit with the qualifying statements. Just say it; say “SOS has done a superb job rebuilding this list, as has MLG in appointing him to do it” Go on just say it with few words.

 

[HARKER]

Then quit with the qualifying statements. Just say it; say “SOS has done a superb job rebuilding this list, as has MLG in appointing him to do it” Go on just say it with few words.

That would be wrong though. Why would I lie? Why would you lie?
Now we have people telling you what to say and how to think. It doesn't get any more arrogant nor better than that.

 

[Aphrodite]

Here we go again.


Play nice thanks folks!

 

[HARKER]

Here we go again.
Play nice thanks folks!

It's not always easy to play nice and there isn't a lot wrong with a little heat, but as long as there's a view being put forward.

Saying nothing gets way too much of a say though.

 

[DangerousD]

I agree that our playing list (and the promise of improved performance) is our biggest drawcard. Following this, actual improved performance will drive further increases. All of it must be underpinned by a unified message from a club putting fans first. Teague has done an amazing job at this for instance - talking about how good our supporters are ("the best in the league" etc) and the players have done it too. Clearly media training (the narrative we are selling to the masses) has changed direction, for the better - assumption is that this is Liddle at play, but who can be sure?

All of this can only be realised as a growth in memberships if the membership department harness these selling points and sell to the latent fan base (including previous members who have not renewed).

Anyone with a sales background and half a strategic brain could come up with a plan to drive membership growth with the above foundations in place.

This is not to downplay Liddle's influence, but I think the board deserve most of the credit as since loGiudice took over they have done a solid job of making very tough calls at the right time to maximise our performance on and off field.

Liddle is the right man for right now, to boost our memberships and commercial performance. Prendergast looms as a potential "right man" for the next phase, once our finances are strong, to help us deliver sustained on field success with a football focus (when money is not the main focus as it's flowing in hand over fist).

SOS was the right man to setup the list, to execute a plan and not be tempted to stuff us up by taking all his IP with him afterwards. Keen to see what the board does next, but unlike years gone by I have confidence they will choose the right person for right now.

I have always struggled to decide who to give credit, for certain aspects of improvement. Is the financial turnaround due to the CEO or is it the board? Does Lloyd get the credit for getting Russel, Power? Who got Prendergast?

I agree with a lot in your post, i still think you're underestimating the difficulty in continually growing your membership base. Our last period of good footy where we played finals and had a very exciting list, with the leagues best player, didn't deliver strong membership growth, im not sure what our financial position was though for that time.

Im just saying, if it was so easy, every club playing finals or every club who is rebuilding (like us) would be increasing every year at a record pace, which isn't the case. I see our club as having a very large supporter base thats largely been dormant, as in, hasn't translated to people signing up. I don't know why that is, but hopefully the big increase in members is because people at the club do.

Our on field performance in the last 4 years has been diabolical, Fitzroy levels bad, yet our of field growth has been fantastic, not just in members, this in itself, is something we should all be proud of.

 

[Azzurro]

I have always struggled to decide who to give credit, for certain aspects of improvement. Is the financial turnaround due to the CEO or is it the board? Does Lloyd get the credit for getting Russel, Power? Who got Prendergast?

I agree with a lot in your post, i still think you're underestimating the difficulty in continually growing your membership base. Our last period of good footy where we played finals and had a very exciting list, with the leagues best player, didn't deliver strong membership growth, im not sure what our financial position was though for that time.

Im just saying, if it was so easy, every club playing finals or every club who is rebuilding (like us) would be increasing every year at a record pace, which isn't the case. I see our club as having a very large supporter base thats largely been dormant, as in, hasn't translated to people signing up. I don't know why that is, but hopefully the big increase in members is because people at the club do.

Our on field performance in the last 4 years has been diabolical, Fitzroy levels bad, yet our of field growth has been fantastic, not just in members, this in itself, is something we should all be proud of.

Yep - I think that the credit goes to all, starting at the top. Put the right people in the right job at the right time, and watch the magic unfold. Make the tough calls when they need to be made, not after it's too late. Lay the foundations for internal growth and development for all areas, not just certain parts of the club, and watch the organic and substantial growth that will come about as a result of the many ambitious individuals who are united behind a common cause.

 

[thylacine60]

Here we go again.


Play nice thanks folks!

no you!

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Nearly 2020 and we’re still talking about Sos’s Departure.How about we focus on the excitement of our playing group and coaching staff.

We have separate threads to talk about those things.