Our back half

[Tiger67]

Interesting to put this list of players together to form a pretty solid back 6

B. Newman(17) Grimes(7) Moore(0)
HB. Connors(3) Astbury(5) Batchelor(16)

The six players above played a total of 48 games between (33 between Batch and Newie) them and none played in the last 5 rounds. Astbury was the only one to be dropped for the year.
The group includes two of our best performed players in 2010, Moore, who missed the entire season and Connors who didn't reappear after he got injured in the round 3 game against Hawthorn.
Compare this with our back 6 in round 24
There would be a solid argument to say that the missing six listed above would be a better combination than the group who took the field in round 24

B.Thursfield Rance Houli
HB. Delidio Post Dea

Others who have spent considrable time in our back half this year include
Conca, McGuane, Farmer and to a lesser degree Gourdis and Webberley

There has been a lot of talk on here about the need for a KPD but looikng at this list I think we need to concentrate on ruck stocks and maybe another hard nut mid
As for the rest I think time will see the improvement that we have been waiting so long for to see us return to regular finals action.

 

[Hipster Doofus]

I think if we can get this Steven Morris, he could take the back-pocket pretty easily and become our lock down for slippery small forwards.

Next year i want the Back 6 to look like this

FB Morris Rance Grimes
HB Batchelor Astbury Houli

3 mobile talls in Rance, Grimes and Astbury
2 solid medium sized 'general' types in Batch and Morris
1 rebounding good user of the pill in Houli

Then you can have Newman and Lids resting in the backline if they need to, with Dea on the bench as insurance

 

[_RT_]

Interesting to put this list of players together to form a pretty solid back 6

B. Newman(17) Grimes(7) Moore(0)
HB. Connors(3) Astbury(5) Batchelor(16)

The six players above played a total of 48 games between (33 between Batch and Newie) them and none played in the last 5 rounds. Astbury was the only one to be dropped for the year.
The group includes two of our best performed players in 2010, Moore, who missed the entire season and Connors who didn't reappear after he got injured in the round 3 game against Hawthorn.
Compare this with our back 6 in round 24
There would be a solid argument to say that the missing six listed above would be a better combination than the group who took the field in round 24

B.Thursfield Rance Houli
HB. Delidio Post Dea

Others who have spent considrable time in our back half this year include
Conca, McGuane, Farmer and to a lesser degree Gourdis and Webberley

There has been a lot of talk on here about the need for a KPD but looikng at this list I think we need to concentrate on ruck stocks and maybe another hard nut mid
As for the rest I think time will see the improvement that we have been waiting so long for to see us return to regular finals action.

Would much prefer to see the following:

B: Dea Rance Grimes
HB: Batchelor Post Houli

 

[ize_]

Exactly. Our backline is fine, I think all of those players mentioned have something to add. There is a golden combination somewhere in there, it's just going to take another 6-12 months to find it.

 

[Tiger67]

I think if we can get this Steven Morris, he could take the back-pocket pretty easily and become our lock down for slippery small forwards.

Next year i want the Back 6 to look like this

FB Morris Rance Grimes
HB Batchelor Astbury Houli

3 mobile talls in Rance, Grimes and Astbury
2 solid medium sized 'general' types in Batch and Morris
1 rebounding good user of the pill in Houli

Then you can have Newman and Lids resting in the backline if they need to, with Dea on the bench as insurance

I don't think ther is much chance of us getting Morris and even if we did he would be behind both Moore and Connors. I also think that Newman will continue in his role in defence and I will also be surprised if Astbury ends up in the defensive half of the ground as he career progresses.

I think a back 6 of
FB Newman Grimes Moore
HB Batchelor Rance Houli/Connors

Lids up the ground and Astbury and Post as your taller swingmen who can play either end of the ground
The one thing that seems certain is that both McGuane and Thursfield have no real value other than insurance.
Is a shame as both really do put in despite obvious deficencies

 

[Tiger67]

Would much prefer to see the following:

B: Dea Rance Grimes
HB: Batchelor Post Houli

I don't agree with Dea at this stage and actually think that he will be a player who develops into someone who rotates through the midfield
If fit I still think that Moore is our most valuable defender

 

[Bazzar]

Dea Grimes Rance
Houli Moore Batch


Newman HFF (could kick ass in his twilight years up front... My tip for next year)

 

[juss]

Dea Grimes Rance
Houli Moore Batch


Newman HFF (could kick ass in his twilight years up front... My tip for next year)

I like the move. But do the coaches?

I still think we are a preseason or two away from being able to move both Deledio and Newman up the ground. If I had to choose between them I'd rather keep Newman back and move Deledio to a roaming half forward role.

 

[_RT_]

I don't agree with Dea at this stage and actually think that he will be a player who develops into someone who rotates through the midfield
If fit I still think that Moore is our most valuable defender

Unfortunately the rumours keep suggesting that Moore will be retiring soon due to the chronic hip complaint.

As for Dea, he might end up rotating through the middle at some stage in his career, but for now I feel quite comfortable having him lining up deep in defence. Seems more an opponent first possessions second type of player and when you want a lockdown mid sized defender that is perfect.

 

[Heisenberg_]

Holding on to Justin Leppitsch to help the young boys out is crucial we all saw what he did with Rance last pre season, went from a real struggler to number 1 and most important defender. We have the jigsaw pieces just need to put them in place correctly.
Still wouldn't complain if we got another KPD in as long as they are A grade players.
Unfortunately Moore is looking unlikely to get back and if he does he won't be the player he was.
Rance is our FB locked in injuries permitting. Between Astbury and Post one of them should be able to make CHB there own. I see a lot of Nathan Bock in Astbury. Then we chuck in Dylan Grimes who looks to be able to take smalls and talks.
Batchelor has looked at home on the HBF from day 1 as well as Houli as well as plenty of other options. Then we just need to find a good BP who can stop the small forwards who may have fallen straight into our pocket in Morris. Newman needs a new role because he has shown time and time again the really good small forwards have no problem with him.

 

[El Tigre]

Would much prefer to see the following:

B: Dea Rance Grimes
HB: Batchelor Post Houli

I second that list.
Could go into the reasons, but its a good balance between height, strength and agility, with definitely enough grunt and toughness. Decision making is the only question, as Batch is the only one that i would say has natural good decision making. Rance has improved, Houli questionable if under pressure, Dea and Grimes haven't really played enough games, and Post needs more time.
I would tend to have Lids in place of Dea, and have Dea on the bench, but the list is effectively the same.

 

[Varicho]

I second that list.
Could go into the reasons, but its a good balance between height, strength and agility, with definitely enough grunt and toughness. Decision making is the only question, as Batch is the only one that i would say has natural good decision making. Rance has improved, Houli questionable if under pressure, Dea and Grimes haven't really played enough games, and Post needs more time.
I would tend to have Lids in place of Dea, and have Dea on the bench, but the list is effectively the same.

I see this as our back 6 going forward. I really like the looks of Dea, but he does still look a little uncertain back there. For next year, I think Newman must still be a massive part of our backline. He ads so much class, experience and poise. But if Post can come on next year - I think our backline is looking good.

 

[TigerTime88]

I don't think ther is much chance of us getting Morris and even if we did he would be behind both Moore and Connors. I also think that Newman will continue in his role in defence and I will also be surprised if Astbury ends up in the defensive half of the ground as he career progresses.

I think a back 6 of
FB Newman Grimes Moore
HB Batchelor Rance Houli/Connors

Lids up the ground and Astbury and Post as your taller swingmen who can play either end of the ground
The one thing that seems certain is that both McGuane and Thursfield have no real value other than insurance.
Is a shame as both really do put in despite obvious deficencies

Why would you say there is a much chance. He is training with us and we can take him as a F/S selection. Seems a pretty straight forward transaction to me.

Newman Rance Grimes

Batchelor Post/Astbury Houli

I like this defense. Connors/Dea could always replace one of the smalls. I don;t think they have any plans to move Newman after 10 years back there. Plus we need some experience.

Connors to go into a midfield/HF role.

I would like to see Matty Dea tried in the midfield. His huge body and decent pace could make him a great clearance player.

 

[El Tigre]

I would like to see Matty Dea tried in the midfield. His huge body and decent pace could make him a great clearance player.

He's gotta learn how to play footy first. And this will give some time to develop a tank. He really should have a couples years in the HB / B line, before potentially being rotated thru the middle.

 

[Dr Tigris]

The thing I like is that we have depth in backmen with some decent quality about them. We will get a real backline out of them on a year or two. This year our backline was decimated by injuries, and we just kept putting Ok young guys in to get the feel of the AFL. We have hight, speed and skill. Lets see if it gells over time. But good development and we are OK in that mix of players.

 

[Mr Magic]

Interesting to put this list of players together to form a pretty solid back 6

B. Newman(17) Grimes(7) Moore(0)
HB. Connors(3) Astbury(5) Batchelor(16)

The six players above played a total of 48 games between (33 between Batch and Newie) them and none played in the last 5 rounds. Astbury was the only one to be dropped for the year.
The group includes two of our best performed players in 2010, Moore, who missed the entire season and Connors who didn't reappear after he got injured in the round 3 game against Hawthorn.
Compare this with our back 6 in round 24
There would be a solid argument to say that the missing six listed above would be a better combination than the group who took the field in round 24

B.Thursfield Rance Houli
HB. Delidio Post Dea

Others who have spent considrable time in our back half this year include
Conca, McGuane, Farmer and to a lesser degree Gourdis and Webberley

There has been a lot of talk on here about the need for a KPD but looikng at this list I think we need to concentrate on ruck stocks and maybe another hard nut mid
As for the rest I think time will see the improvement that we have been waiting so long for to see us return to regular finals action.

Nice blurb.

Couple of problems

1 2010 was a shit year defensively!!

2, Connors is an unproven back, who has he stopped???

3. Moore has injury issues

4. Who has Houli stopped????, The positives appear to be link play and his long boot

5. Grimes I read was one of the best spoilers in the AFL in the game when playing his few games.

5. Rance stopped numerous quality forwards.

6. Batchelors kicking is high quality, he is tough, and a good height who can spoil and take a mark.

7. Newman will be retired for our next premiership- premierships is what we are supporting for.

8. Dea has shown a bit defensively aerially

On this basis backline would be:

Morris Rance Grimes

Batchelor ????(Astbury/Post) Docherty

Dea back up, Houli/Newman up the ground and backup rotations


The strong argument for your first back 6 is what????

 

[santa claws]

to me the only holes we have down back are in the key posts. we need fb and chb to anchor deledio grimes dea and batchelor. i suppose fb and chb are two pretty big holes but all other defensive positions are covered
i am probably the only poster on here who is not sold on any of rance post or astbury as key defenders.

other big holes in the list is quality small to medium genuine forwards. and finding a genuine kpf to partner jack.i can hear it now what about vickery to me he is a ruckman forward who should spend his fair share of time in the ruck to me hes the sometimes third tall.

we also need to find two genuine ruckmen of quality if vickery is not to be a ruckman.

to finish off we lack for well rounded mids big time.

 

[Hipster Doofus]

^^
I think Rance has done enough to be our 10+ year FB, just wait til he gets some solid assistance and we could have an AA FB

Grimes also showed plenty of potential in his 7 games for the year, will get a gig rd 1

Astbury should be better for another pre-season, we just have to persist with him and Post

 

[Tiger67]

Nice blurb.

Couple of problems

2, Connors is an unproven back, who has he stopped???
4. Who has Houli stopped????, The positives appear to be link play and his long boot

On this basis backline would be:

Morris Rance Grimes

Batchelor ????(Astbury/Post) Docherty

Dea back up, Houli/Newman up the ground and backup rotations


The strong argument for your first back 6 is what????

And how is life on your high horse??????????

I don't recall suggesting that either of the backlines I listed was our best.
One was stated as the six players that played in round 24 and the other was a list of players that were unavailable due to injury in round 24, and this was stated to demonstrate that we have finally got a bit of defensive depth.
I'm also a bit bemused as to how someone can bag someone else and then list a group of players that includes 2 names that are not yet, and may never be, on our list.
In relation to Houli and Connors and who have they stopped........ Have you ever heard of Heath Shaw, Reece Shaw, Jason Gram or David Wojcinski, even Hodge Gilbee and goddard would all qualify as top end running half backs and none of them would be recognised as being stoppers or even true defenders.
I don't mind solid debate but if you want to start your own version of a character asasination at least make sure you have a decent argument.

 

[Madtiger2006]

fb batchelor rance newman
hb grimes post deledio

 

[Madtiger2006]

to me the only holes we have down back are in the key posts. we need fb and chb to anchor deledio grimes dea and batchelor. i suppose fb and chb are two pretty big holes but all other defensive positions are covered
i am probably the only poster on here who is not sold on any of rance post or astbury as key defenders.

other big holes in the list is quality small to medium genuine forwards. and finding a genuine kpf to partner jack.i can hear it now what about vickery to me he is a ruckman forward who should spend his fair share of time in the ruck to me hes the sometimes third tall.

we also need to find two genuine ruckmen of quality if vickery is not to be a ruckman.

to finish off we lack for well rounded mids big time.

Rance and Post have been playing if you haven't noticed

 

[tigs2010]

Rance and Post have been playing if you haven't noticed

Not sure if Post is a certianty there. But definately needs to be persisted with. Astbury IMO will be better provided his knee is ok. And u are correct, Rance is the least of our problems back there.

On another note, good to see McGuane is no longer in your best backline.

 

[santa claws]

Rance and Post have been playing if you haven't noticed

yep ive noticed
.
not saying they are no good mad one. post has only just been given a go down back. he was always a backman and i have called for this to happen since he came to the club.
time will tell with him but he has a fair bit of work to do to make it.

rance has improved a lot i just dont think him as good as most on hear claim he is.
i have given my reasons for this and i stand by them.
hes the best option we have for fb ATM but i believe we should be aiming for much better.
the difference between me and most supporters is i think him just a passable player while most think hes an a grader.if he can continue to improve and eliminate poor aspects of his game i will gladly apologise to you and any poster who has supported him

i have no doubt we are yet to find the big quality lynch pin in the back line.it seems with the noises coming from the club they dont think so either.

rance and post may go on to become very good players for many yrs but i have to in all honesty voice my doubts about them.

will also say even if rance and post prove to be very good what cover do we have.
the way i look at it is we have grimes, moore, thursfield as third tall options. to me moore, injury permitting and grimes have this gig.if moore does retire the gig goes to grimes and thursfield.
long term this role should be grimes.i place grimes here because he has all the attributes to play as a tall running defender and i dont believe he will have the size to play kp regularly.

at fb we only have rance and gourdis. gourdis looks how likely to make it.
both have serious weakness in their games.but people just want to ignore them.
rance in particular is very frustrating will do something really well and then throw away what hes done well by doing something similar really poorly.

people will scoff at this but to me he lacks assurance in the air and judgement. he regularly misjudges spoils or is in the wrong position. im hoping this is an area he can improve markedly.

at chb we have astbury post and mcguane . imo post is the backman and astbury the forward. mcguane well very ordinary. while post and astbury may become very good players at this stage id take just decent again i think we should be aiming higher and we should be covering our bases.

imo and i have held it for yrs we need to find one big bodied kpd of quality.

he should be quick, really strong in the core, good size, agile, very good in the air and read the play well. they dont grow on trees and we may have to target a few to get one or trade for one if possible.

in all likelyhood over the next yr or so all of thursfield mcguane and moore will go, gourdis may get the chop as well.
we should be targeting as their replacement that big stong quick agile good in the air quality player.
im sorry if voicing my doubts upsets you and others like you. i hope im wrong but i will stick by my convictions for now.

 

[tigs2010]

yep ive noticed
.
not saying they are no good mad one. post has only just been given a go down back. he was always a backman and i have called for this to happen since he came to the club.
time will tell with him but he has a fair bit of work to do to make it.

rance has improved a lot i just dont think him as good as most on hear claim he is.
i have given my reasons for this and i stand by them.
hes the best option we have for fb ATM but i believe we should be aiming for much better.
the difference between me and most supporters is i think him just a passable player while most think hes an a grader.if he can continue to improve and eliminate poor aspects of his game i will gladly apologise to you and any poster who has supported him

i have no doubt we are yet to find the big quality lynch pin in the back line.it seems with the noises coming from the club they dont think so either.

rance and post may go on to become very good players for many yrs but i have to in all honesty voice my doubts about them.

will also say even if rance and post prove to be very good what cover do we have.
the way i look at it is we have grimes, moore, thursfield as third tall options. to me moore, injury permitting and grimes have this gig.if moore does retire the gig goes to grimes and thursfield.
long term this role should be grimes.i place grimes here because he has all the attributes to play as a tall running defender and i dont believe he will have the size to play kp regularly.

at fb we only have rance and gourdis. gourdis looks how likely to make it.
both have serious weakness in their games.but people just want to ignore them.
rance in particular is very frustrating will do something really well and then throw away what hes done well by doing something similar really poorly.

people will scoff at this but to me he lacks assurance in the air and judgement. he regularly misjudges spoils or is in the wrong position. im hoping this is an area he can improve markedly.

at chb we have astbury post and mcguane . imo post is the backman and astbury the forward. mcguane well very ordinary. while post and astbury may become very good players at this stage id take just decent again i think we should be aiming higher and we should be covering our bases.

imo and i have held it for yrs we need to find one big bodied kpd of quality.

he should be quick, really strong in the core, good size, agile, very good in the air and read the play well. they dont grow on trees and we may have to target a few to get one or trade for one if possible.

in all likelyhood over the next yr or so all of thursfield mcguane and moore will go, gourdis may get the chop as well.
we should be targeting as their replacement that big stong quick agile good in the air quality player.
im sorry if voicing my doubts upsets you and others like you. i hope im wrong but i will stick by my convictions for now.

Agree. We need depth. Thats why i wouldnt mind us goin for S.Thompson from North. Big upgrade on our depth players like Thursty, McGuane, Gourdis and would probably allow us to develop Astbury/Post properly.

However, i disagree a bit with the second part. Think he has improved a lot in this area firstly since last year to start of this year and then again throughout the year.

 

[LuKe2428]

Who do people rate better out of Post and Astbury? I think Astbury was much better last season although Post didn't get many chances. This season it's been Post to stand up and CHB possie for the last few games and didn't okay.