Owners

[SM]

Value for money? Depends if asking prices have decreased by say 30 to 40% I suppose.

Where's the value when they don't know when football will resume and what sort of revenue will be associated (no crowds potentially, reduced TV revenue potentially, etc.)

 

[DBAH0]

Where's the value when they don't know when football will resume and what sort of revenue will be associated (no crowds potentially, reduced TV revenue potentially, etc.)

Calculated gamble then I guess.

All depends on how much asking prices may have dropped by as I said. Definitely not value for money if they remain the same etc.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

 

[Zidane98]

We're going to be seeing more and more of this with regimes and those linked to regimes buying up clubs for the purpose of sportswashing. It's in Saudi Arabia's interests for them to be more known for the all conquering football club owned by them instead of their atrocities / appalling human rights record.

Not sure I could continue as a Liverpool fan if the Saudis came onboard myself personally.

 

[Zidane98]

Anyone heard anything re: Newcastle Utd sale? Seems to have gone very quiet for such a high profile deal.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

 

[Zidane98]

Qatar were having a serious moan about Saudi Arabia televising Bein streams illegally but surely that shouldn't preclude a club sale. Other club's owners have been involved in far worse and were able to purchase a premier league club without too much scrutiny.

 

[WealstoneRaider]

Not sure I could continue as a Liverpool fan if the Saudis came onboard myself personally.

This guy though



talks constant shit

 

[BronCrow]

Petrol is 1.30 a gallon at the Servo here ATM, I can fill up my car here for around $12 or so, I remember my Uni days in Melbourne I'd be paying $60 - $70 instead.

You'll enjoy this also as a Liverpool fan, wonder how Tom Hicks is doing these days on the back of this.....

As a Liverpool fan, I feel no sympathy for him at all. If you look him up, he has form. Both Cruzeiro and Corinthians in Brazil were ruined by him, as were the Dallas Stars in the NHL and the Texas Rangers in MLB.

 

[The_Flying_Egg]

It “harms” the teams who get oil money cheque book owners, no one else. And when those teams are getting significant boosts from their new found cash anyway it’s hardly harming them

It doesn’t harm them though, it just puts some restraint on them crashing the top table immediately. They can still get there in time it will just ensure they have to build their club more slowly and supporters of FFP would argue in a more sustained and fairer fashion. Everton will get there at some point, Leicester you could argue have and Wolves are well on their way. While Spurs and Arsenal who have tight owners are heading in the opposite direction

All FFP does is protect the so called elite clubs who were already rich and successful. They don't care about the health of other clubs, they hate the idea of other clubs joining them at the top of the table. It's also so selectively enforced its a joke. If you go for a club like Man U or Liverpool I can see why you'd like it. Can't have other clubs challenging for titles and Champions League spots. What Arsene Wenger recently said about it was spot on.

 

[WealstoneRaider]

All FFP does is protect the so called elite clubs who were already rich and successful. They don't care about the health of other clubs, they hate the idea of other clubs joining them at the top of the table. It's also so selectively enforced its a joke. If you go for a club like Man U or Liverpool I can see why you'd like it. Can't have other clubs challenging for titles and Champions League spots. What Arsene Wenger recently said about it was spot on.

Leicester, Tottenham, and now Sheff Utd all proves your theory wrong.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

All FFP does is protect the so called elite clubs who were already rich and successful. They don't care about the health of other clubs, they hate the idea of other clubs joining them at the top of the table. It's also so selectively enforced its a joke. If you go for a club like Man U or Liverpool I can see why you'd like it. Can't have other clubs challenging for titles and Champions League spots. What Arsene Wenger recently said about it was spot on.

Correct.

Leicester, Tottenham, and now Sheff Utd all proves your theory wrong.

Not correct.
FFP in its current iteration needs to go

 

[WealstoneRaider]

Correct.

Not correct.
FFP in its current iteration needs to go

So any ideas what you would set in place as a replacement then?

 

[moomba]

All FFP does is protect the so called elite clubs who were already rich and successful. They don't care about the health of other clubs, they hate the idea of other clubs joining them at the top of the table. It's also so selectively enforced its a joke. If you go for a club like Man U or Liverpool I can see why you'd like it. Can't have other clubs challenging for titles and Champions League spots. What Arsene Wenger recently said about it was spot on.

Wenger was one of the biggest advocates of FFP before.

His turnaround suggests he's either seen the light, or self interest formed a large part of his previous views on the topic.

 

[Zidane98]

Wenger was one of the biggest advocates of FFP before.

His turnaround suggests he's either seen the light, or self interest formed a large part of his previous views on the topic.

His turnaround is due to Qatar lining his pockets as a Bein pundit.

FFP is needed and will continue to evolve. European club finamces have benefiited from it hugely.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

So any ideas what you would set in place as a replacement then?

Something that doesn't encircle the established and make it easier for them to maintain an arms reach to those wishing to join them, us included.
UEFA should also abolish the historical performance element to Club Co-efficients. Clubs like Milan for instance shouldn't receive a boost to their co-efficient (which could affect what pot they get) purely because they won trophies in decades prior.

 

[WealstoneRaider]

Something that doesn't encircle the established and make it easier for them to maintain an arms reach to those wishing to join them, us included.
UEFA should also abolish the historical performance element to Club Co-efficients. Clubs like Milan for instance shouldn't receive a boost to their co-efficient (which could affect what pot they get) purely because they won trophies in decades prior.

You need to do that but at the same time stop more Man City type situations as that situation makes it harder for more clubs. City have basically locked down a top four position making it harder for the likes of spurs, everton and a whole host of others to progress. Newcastle could about to make that progress even harder

 

[moomba]

His turnaround is due to Qatar lining his pockets as a Bein pundit.

FFP is needed and will continue to evolve. European club finamces have benefiited from it hugely.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

You need to do that but at the same time stop more Man City type situations as that situation makes it harder for more clubs. City have basically locked down a top four position making it harder for the likes of spurs, everton and a whole host of others to progress. Newcastle could about to make that progress even harder

You baffle me sometimes.

Openly criticise our owner for not spending, when he made his money betting against the pound and lives in tax exile yet in the same breath have huge issues with the way City spend money.

As you know, I want us to be a self sufficient club that can join the super wealthy by ourselves. FFP as it stands makes that harder.

 

[WealstoneRaider]

You baffle me sometimes.

Openly criticise our owner for not spending, when he made his money betting against the pound and lives in tax exile yet in the same breath have huge issues with the way City spend money.

As you know, I want us to be a self sufficient club that can join the super wealthy by ourselves. FFP as it stands makes that harder.

There’s a massive difference between spending zero over two windows and spending the way City do. Stop being a Sith.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

There’s a massive difference between spending zero over two windows and spending the way City do. Stop being a Sith.

Come on pal, we’ve gone around in circles on this. More than just owner and chairman at fault for that season, and it far too much fixated on.

Come a long way since Lord Sugar sold in 2001 but we’ve seemingly hit our ceiling. FFP is one constraint and seemingly the only way to break through the ceiling is for the owner to go gangbusters, something I don’t want but you seem to. To me just seems a contradiction.

I have no issue with City’s spending, just like Chelsea’s. Their source of cash is the problem, but I don’t want that for us. I want us to get back to our former glory under our own steam. Not a chequebook

 

[Bulldog1954]

Man U, Bayern and Real Madrid were some of the first clubs to endorse financial fair play. Are we meant to think that was because they were worried about the financial future of other clubs?

 

[Zidane98]

Man U, Bayern and Real Madrid were some of the first clubs to endorse financial fair play. Are we meant to think that was because they were worried about the financial future of other clubs?

I prefer to look at factual information. A study of Italian clubs big and small:

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/16184742.2019.1674896

FFP has had a positive effect on all clubs regardless of their financial position. It promotes resposible management, promoties long term investment in club infrastructure and youth programs (unlimited spending is allowed on those two things).

It discourages short term spending on transfer fees and excessive wages. Thats a good thing for the market IMO.

 

[The_Flying_Egg]

Its interesting that FFP doesn't include debt. Its apparently fine for Man U to have £492,000,000 in gross debt, but if a smaller club gets rich owners we have to cap their spending. So under current rules mountains of debt is fine, but wealthy owners investing lots of money that they can afford isn't fine.

 

[Bulldog1954]

I prefer to look at factual information. A study of Italian clubs big and small:

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/16184742.2019.1674896

FFP has had a positive effect on all clubs regardless of their financial position. It promotes resposible management, promoties long term investment in club infrastructure and youth programs (unlimited spending is allowed on those two things).

It discourages short term spending on transfer fees and excessive wages. Thats a good thing for the market IMO.

As someone who prefers to "look at factual information", there was another pretty interesting study on the same website you might have missed.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/16184742.2019.1588344?src=recsys "Breakeven regulations reduce the joint sporting and financial efficiency of regulated clubs, with the efficiency loss positively related to the severity of the breakeven constraint. The Financial Fair Play regulations further entrench the financial and sporting power of elite clubs and potentially undermine league competitive intensity by shifting the relative focus of clubs away from sporting productivity toward financial productivity".

Or there's this study: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjAJegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw3jfRuapEGW0MJfYAvKOa62 - In 2010, the UEFA approved new financial fair play (FFP) regulations to improve the financial health of European football clubs. In this paper, however, we show that there may be unintended consequences of the new FFP regulations. Based on a novel dataset of European football clubs, we find results that are consistent with the view that FFP has further amplified competitive imbalance. This is likely because FFP may raise some barriers against the entrance of new investors. Accordingly, we present evidence that, after the introduction of FFP, former season’s winners are correlated with greater budget shares in the upcoming season. Also, the positive correlation between the presence of football investors and competition is lower after the introduction of FFP. Overall, our results are consistent with the view that FFP tends to make European football leagues less equilibrated and to freeze current hierarchies. It fits into this picture that according to some authors FFP rules may be violating European Union antitrust.