Player Review

[Snoop Dog]

Wanted to post last night but decided against it and looks like I may have to keep that policy all year.

Overall was poor. What bothered me most was had all summer to work on getting through their defensive set up and we couldn't. What also bothered me was we free wheeled against Mitchell and JOM. For mine locking down Mitchell was a must. Beat him / win clearances and you would have to have gone a long way to winning but between he and JOM they won the clearance battle early and were a lot more effective than we were.

Having said that can't blame Buckley as overall the stats weren't bad for us but we get hurt by blokes who can't take a mark or can't kick. We have a lot of each. We get momentum in games but don't capitalise.


Grundy - We won the hit out battle off the back of him which was good but he hardly dominated the game and at some stage you want to see him marking the ball around the ground and forward.

Treloar - Won a lot of footy but wow we pay a lot of money to a bloke who is a poor user of the ball. The other thing with this bloke is he takes a while to get into the groove of the game. He got outworked badly early from what I could see. Finishes well but he aint a fast starter.

Langdon - Less said the better. Awful. His only go is to intercept and he only did that once from memory. Scharenberg pls and ASAP.

Murray - One of only 2-3 things that worked for us. Took the game on and used it pretty well. Would have to think will get better and better.

Pendles - I said in the JLT is he doesn't looked like he is fully engaged. For mine something looks a bit off. Missed goal was bad as we needed to take advantage of the momentum we had. Was another at the early stoppages who was guilty of free wheeling a bit I thought.

Adams - Take that mark and we go 2 goals up. Didn't get enough of it for mine and when sent to Mitchell didn't work. To his credit 15 of his 20 were contested.

Aish - Don't have huge expectations of him but thought he tried. He is clearly keen to do more inside whereas actually think he is a better outside player. Also playing him HF. Will be interesting to watch as you can see the effort is there.

Dunn - Played on Roughead most of night and did a good job.

Varcoe - Like them to see him left forward as he speed and run down was good he just didn't do enough offensively. Will need to improve on that effort.

Reid - Started well and if held his marks could have dominated and arguably won us the game. Sicily continually able to spoil him. He's 10cm shorter???? He is better than that.

Phillips - Is the sort of player that needs to win 25-30 touches a week to have an influence. I think he is a poor man's Gaff. Got to persist with him but he needs to have more influence on a game than last night.

Sidebottom - Our best by a mile. Work rate fantastic.

Thomas - You got to love the effort but he just uses it poorly and I would rather others come in such as Daicos bc just can't win with to many blokes that can't kick.

Crisp - 13 of his 17 were contested but he just didn't get enough ball outside to break the lines. Thats his go for mine. When he plays that style we usually go well. I'd like to see him free wheel a bit more.

Moore - Looked good down back. Few errors but looks like will dominate that spot pretty soon.

Hoskin-Elliott - Frustrating how talented he is but have to question the work rate and how hard he wants to go. 16 touches for a bloke who has speed / plays wing / HF on a big ground like the G not good enough.

Stephenson - He looks the goods doesn't he. Made some mistakes but was rapt with him.

Maynard - Was no influence on the game.

Howe - He looked like he was on Cyril. What was that all about?

Crocker - Another one who I thought went well. 2.3 should have been 4.1. Competitive / worked hard and will go better when some better players around him.

Cox - Shocker. If can clunk them he will dominate so got to persist with it.

Smith - He tries but he aint a forward. Play him back as a small run with or not at all. Why you wouldn't play Daicos over him in that role is beyond me.

 

[Leviathan Pie]

Wanted to post last night but decided against it and looks like I may have to keep that policy all year.

Overall was poor. What bothered me most was had all summer to work on getting through their defensive set up and we couldn't. What also bothered me was we free wheeled against Mitchell and JOM. For mine locking down Mitchell was a must. Beat him / win clearances and you would have to have gone a long way to winning but between he and JOM they won the clearance battle early and were a lot more effective than we were.

Having said that can't blame Buckley as overall the stats weren't bad for us but we get hurt by blokes who can't take a mark or can't kick. We have a lot of each. We get momentum in games but don't capitalise.


Grundy - We won the hit out battle off the back of him which was good but he hardly dominated the game and at some stage you want to see him marking the ball around the ground and forward.

Treloar - Won a lot of footy but wow we pay a lot of money to a bloke who is a poor user of the ball. The other thing with this bloke is he takes a while to get into the groove of the game. He got outworked badly early from what I could see. Finishes well but he aint a fast starter.

Langdon - Less said the better. Awful. His only go is to intercept and he only did that once from memory. Scharenberg pls and ASAP.

Murray - One of only 2-3 things that worked for us. Took the game on and used it pretty well. Would have to think will get better and better.

Pendles - I said in the JLT is he doesn't looked like he is fully engaged. For mine something looks a bit off. Missed goal was bad as we needed to take advantage of the momentum we had. Was another at the early stoppages who was guilty of free wheeling a bit I thought.

Adams - Take that mark and we go 2 goals up. Didn't get enough of it for mine and when sent to Mitchell didn't work. To his credit 15 of his 20 were contested.

Aish - Don't have huge expectations of him but thought he tried. He is clearly keen to do more inside whereas actually think he is a better outside player. Also playing him HF. Will be interesting to watch as you can see the effort is there.

Dunn - Played on Roughead most of night and did a good job.

Varcoe - Like them to see him left forward as he speed and run down was good he just didn't do enough offensively. Will need to improve on that effort.

Reid - Started well and if held his marks could have dominated and arguably won us the game. Sicily continually able to spoil him. He's 10cm shorter???? He is better than that.

Phillips - Is the sort of player that needs to win 25-30 touches a week to have an influence. I think he is a poor man's Gaff. Got to persist with him but he needs to have more influence on a game than last night.

Sidebottom - Our best by a mile. Work rate fantastic.

Thomas - You got to love the effort but he just uses it poorly and I would rather others come in such as Daicos bc just can't win with to many blokes that can't kick.

Crisp - 13 of his 17 were contested but he just didn't get enough ball outside to break the lines. Thats his go for mine. When he plays that style we usually go well. I'd like to see him free wheel a bit more.

Moore - Looked good down back. Few errors but looks like will dominate that spot pretty soon.

Hoskin-Elliott - Frustrating how talented he is but have to question the work rate and how hard he wants to go. 16 touches for a bloke who has speed / plays wing / HF on a big ground like the G not good enough.

Stephenson - He looks the goods doesn't he. Made some mistakes but was rapt with him.

Maynard - Was no influence on the game.

Howe - He looked like he was on Cyril. What was that all about?

Crocker - Another one who I thought went well. 2.3 should have been 4.1. Competitive / worked hard and will go better when some better players around him.

Cox - Shocker. If can clunk them he will dominate so got to persist with it.

Smith - He tries but he aint a forward. Play him back as a small run with or not at all. Why you wouldn't play Daicos over him in that role is beyond me.

Far too generous to both Treloar & Adams, IMO.

 

[parvey]

Overrated, Pendles, sidebottom, grundy, treloar, adams, degoey

No impact players, WHE, varcoe, phillips, thomas, maynard, langdon, crisp

Useless, smith, cox, crocker, aish daicos, brown, reid

Should never play again, blair, broomhead, mayne

I know it looks bad but with a good coach we might be able to turn some of these guys around, someone like a Beverage and Clarkson, there must be others around, our coach just can't seem to improve our side

 

[Go Pies!!!!!]

Wanted to post last night but decided against it and looks like I may have to keep that policy all year.

Overall was poor. What bothered me most was had all summer to work on getting through their defensive set up and we couldn't. What also bothered me was we free wheeled against Mitchell and JOM. For mine locking down Mitchell was a must. Beat him / win clearances and you would have to have gone a long way to winning but between he and JOM they won the clearance battle early and were a lot more effective than we were.

Having said that can't blame Buckley as overall the stats weren't bad for us but we get hurt by blokes who can't take a mark or can't kick. We have a lot of each. We get momentum in games but don't capitalise.


Grundy - We won the hit out battle off the back of him which was good but he hardly dominated the game and at some stage you want to see him marking the ball around the ground and forward.

Treloar - Won a lot of footy but wow we pay a lot of money to a bloke who is a poor user of the ball. The other thing with this bloke is he takes a while to get into the groove of the game. He got outworked badly early from what I could see. Finishes well but he aint a fast starter.

Langdon - Less said the better. Awful. His only go is to intercept and he only did that once from memory. Scharenberg pls and ASAP.

Murray - One of only 2-3 things that worked for us. Took the game on and used it pretty well. Would have to think will get better and better.

Pendles - I said in the JLT is he doesn't looked like he is fully engaged. For mine something looks a bit off. Missed goal was bad as we needed to take advantage of the momentum we had. Was another at the early stoppages who was guilty of free wheeling a bit I thought.

Adams - Take that mark and we go 2 goals up. Didn't get enough of it for mine and when sent to Mitchell didn't work. To his credit 15 of his 20 were contested.

Aish - Don't have huge expectations of him but thought he tried. He is clearly keen to do more inside whereas actually think he is a better outside player. Also playing him HF. Will be interesting to watch as you can see the effort is there.

Dunn - Played on Roughead most of night and did a good job.

Varcoe - Like them to see him left forward as he speed and run down was good he just didn't do enough offensively. Will need to improve on that effort.

Reid - Started well and if held his marks could have dominated and arguably won us the game. Sicily continually able to spoil him. He's 10cm shorter???? He is better than that.

Phillips - Is the sort of player that needs to win 25-30 touches a week to have an influence. I think he is a poor man's Gaff. Got to persist with him but he needs to have more influence on a game than last night.

Sidebottom - Our best by a mile. Work rate fantastic.

Thomas - You got to love the effort but he just uses it poorly and I would rather others come in such as Daicos bc just can't win with to many blokes that can't kick.

Crisp - 13 of his 17 were contested but he just didn't get enough ball outside to break the lines. Thats his go for mine. When he plays that style we usually go well. I'd like to see him free wheel a bit more.

Moore - Looked good down back. Few errors but looks like will dominate that spot pretty soon.

Hoskin-Elliott - Frustrating how talented he is but have to question the work rate and how hard he wants to go. 16 touches for a bloke who has speed / plays wing / HF on a big ground like the G not good enough.

Stephenson - He looks the goods doesn't he. Made some mistakes but was rapt with him.

Maynard - Was no influence on the game.

Howe - He looked like he was on Cyril. What was that all about?

Crocker - Another one who I thought went well. 2.3 should have been 4.1. Competitive / worked hard and will go better when some better players around him.

Cox - Shocker. If can clunk them he will dominate so got to persist with it.

Smith - He tries but he aint a forward. Play him back as a small run with or not at all. Why you wouldn't play Daicos over him in that role is beyond me.

good write up mate, was at the game early and Pendles was having shots at goal and i would say he kicked maybe 4/10. was pretty surprised in warm up no pressure that he would miss that many.

Murray & Stephenson positives for a pretty poor night.

 

[TradeDraft]

Grundy - We won the hit out battle off the back of him which was good but he hardly dominated the game and at some stage you want to see him marking the ball around the ground and forward.

Problem we put Grundy on the Bench instead of Forward when Cox goes to the Ruck. So No wonder he does not do much Forward

Treloar - Won a lot of footy but wow we pay a lot of money to a bloke who is a poor user of the ball. The other thing with this bloke is he takes a while to get into the groove of the game. He got outworked badly early from what I could see. Finishes well but he aint a fast starter.

Bucks love to get Players that are Turnover Merchants. Looking Back now maybe we shouldn't done the Trade. Does not Help Sier has not come on as that who we Picked with the Pick we got back from GWS in the Treloar Trade

Pendles - I said in the JLT is he doesn't looked like he is fully engaged. For mine something looks a bit off. Missed goal was bad as we needed to take advantage of the momentum we had. Was another at the early stoppages who was guilty of free wheeling a bit I thought.

Been a Shocking Captain and looks like he Barley Trying this Year or He is Playing Hurt

Hoskin-Elliott - Frustrating how talented he is but have to question the work rate and how hard he wants to go. 16 touches for a bloke who has speed / plays wing / HF on a big ground like the G not good enough.

His Problem could be with the lack of Culture at the Club

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Wanted to post last night but decided against it and looks like I may have to keep that policy all year.

Overall was poor. What bothered me most was had all summer to work on getting through their defensive set up and we couldn't. What also bothered me was we free wheeled against Mitchell and JOM. For mine locking down Mitchell was a must. Beat him / win clearances and you would have to have gone a long way to winning but between he and JOM they won the clearance battle early and were a lot more effective than we were.

Having said that can't blame Buckley as overall the stats weren't bad for us but we get hurt by blokes who can't take a mark or can't kick. We have a lot of each. We get momentum in games but don't capitalise.


Grundy - We won the hit out battle off the back of him which was good but he hardly dominated the game and at some stage you want to see him marking the ball around the ground and forward.

Treloar - Won a lot of footy but wow we pay a lot of money to a bloke who is a poor user of the ball. The other thing with this bloke is he takes a while to get into the groove of the game. He got outworked badly early from what I could see. Finishes well but he aint a fast starter.

Langdon - Less said the better. Awful. His only go is to intercept and he only did that once from memory. Scharenberg pls and ASAP.

Murray - One of only 2-3 things that worked for us. Took the game on and used it pretty well. Would have to think will get better and better.

Pendles - I said in the JLT is he doesn't looked like he is fully engaged. For mine something looks a bit off. Missed goal was bad as we needed to take advantage of the momentum we had. Was another at the early stoppages who was guilty of free wheeling a bit I thought.

Adams - Take that mark and we go 2 goals up. Didn't get enough of it for mine and when sent to Mitchell didn't work. To his credit 15 of his 20 were contested.

Aish - Don't have huge expectations of him but thought he tried. He is clearly keen to do more inside whereas actually think he is a better outside player. Also playing him HF. Will be interesting to watch as you can see the effort is there.

Dunn - Played on Roughead most of night and did a good job.

Varcoe - Like them to see him left forward as he speed and run down was good he just didn't do enough offensively. Will need to improve on that effort.

Reid - Started well and if held his marks could have dominated and arguably won us the game. Sicily continually able to spoil him. He's 10cm shorter???? He is better than that.

Phillips - Is the sort of player that needs to win 25-30 touches a week to have an influence. I think he is a poor man's Gaff. Got to persist with him but he needs to have more influence on a game than last night.

Sidebottom - Our best by a mile. Work rate fantastic.

Thomas - You got to love the effort but he just uses it poorly and I would rather others come in such as Daicos bc just can't win with to many blokes that can't kick.

Crisp - 13 of his 17 were contested but he just didn't get enough ball outside to break the lines. Thats his go for mine. When he plays that style we usually go well. I'd like to see him free wheel a bit more.

Moore - Looked good down back. Few errors but looks like will dominate that spot pretty soon.

Hoskin-Elliott - Frustrating how talented he is but have to question the work rate and how hard he wants to go. 16 touches for a bloke who has speed / plays wing / HF on a big ground like the G not good enough.

Stephenson - He looks the goods doesn't he. Made some mistakes but was rapt with him.

Maynard - Was no influence on the game.

Howe - He looked like he was on Cyril. What was that all about?

Crocker - Another one who I thought went well. 2.3 should have been 4.1. Competitive / worked hard and will go better when some better players around him.

Cox - Shocker. If can clunk them he will dominate so got to persist with it.

Smith - He tries but he aint a forward. Play him back as a small run with or not at all. Why you wouldn't play Daicos over him in that role is beyond me.

Good summary. I can only put down the inability of the talls to take anything resembling a mark down to the slippery conditions. At least I hope thats the reason otherwise we are in a world of pain.

 

[Carringbush2010]

We have players? Going on last night I'd say we have pretenders not players

 

[BoxMatrix]

Why anyone would want to persist with Cox is beyond me. Absolutely awful last night. Has gone backwards.

 

[surfer1]

Snoop Dog on Langdon if we are to persist with Moore down back then he and Howe are both excellent intercept markers. Moore tried to mark like a forward but will improve.

So if Langdon is also perceived as an intercept marker for mine he is not needed. I would prefer a cool head positional player like Shazz. What do you think?

 

[lenny20]

Game Review

I think that's a worse opening than the Freo 2014 or Sydney 2016 thumpings. Both those sides were good teams. The Hawks are middle of the road, didn't play particularly well, and yet we never threatened them.

Our style of play was depressingly similar to the confused, structureless shambles we've seen developing under the Buckley era. The mistakes were catastrophically bad, as they always are. Cox's fumbles. Phillips' calamitous goal line error. The centre clearance domination. The bizarre decision to let Tom Mitchell roam free. Every second piece of play involving Langdon. Terrible all over.

We leaked soft goals like a sieve while struggling to move the ball with any meaning the other way. We were embarrassingly afraid of the slightest physical contact across the board. We played our outside mids on the inside where they got dominated, and we played our inside mids on the outside where they turned the ball over with regularity. We refused to place a man behind the marking contest, despite the fact that the wet conditions allowed the ball to skid out the back on 90% of occasions. We refused to give ourselves a chance by playing an even number of players forward. We couldn't win a 50/50 contest all night long.

And most frustrating component: most of the above could be said about any Collingwood game over the past four years.

Onto the players...

Player Review

The best:

1. Steele Sidebottom
2. Darcy Moore
3. Lynden Dunn
4. Sam Murray
5. I don't think any other player won their position. Damning.

The worst (I'll limit this to five, but in reality, 17 players make a strong case here):

5. Tom Phillips
4. James Aish
3. Josh Smith
2. Mason Cox
1. Tom Langdon


Steele Sidebottom - clean hands, good physicality, exemplary effort all game long. Unlike his teammates, can win a contest, run hard, and hit a target with above average skills. Legitimately our only real threat moving the ball forward. Has comfortably surpassed Pendlebury as a player. He's the spiritual captain now - a fair chunk of our wins last season came under his watch. Wouldn't be averse to him taking the reigns sooner rather than later.

Darcy Moore - killed them down back in the first quarter, marking everything that came his way and forcing the Hawks to change their gameplan to work around him. Moved forward late and looked our only genuine target. One dropped grab which led to the Gunston goal was his only blemish, and even then, a "good" mistake - it came from his taking the game on. Teammates could do worse than following his example.

Lynden Dunn - typically gutsy and dour job on Roughy, who was just about the only Hawks forward who didn't threaten. Our best pure stopper, and much like Presti, leaves everything he has out on the field, even in the face of overwhelming adversity. Held up well all game, will be a good matchup for any slower forwards.

Sam Murray - made mistakes, but again, "positive" ones borne of taking the game on. Looks almost out of place in our side with his willingness to break lines and run at the opposition. One of the better debut games we've seen in the past seven years from what looks like a good recruit. Certainly didn't look like his first game of AFL.

Jaiden Stephenson - a solid enough debut, and certainly not disgraced. Would like to see him take on the game more, but with his teammates constantly panicking and refusing to take any physical contact, you can't blame him for following suit. Got better as the game wore on. Probably not ready for AFL yet, but something to work with at least.

Scott Pendlebury - the sort of game which has become the norm for Pendles: just okay. Did a few nice things. Got enough possessions. Fired off a couple of great releasing handballs. And yet failed to really influence the contest. Missed an easy, crucial goal, which has become a habit of his - has wilted under pressure more often than shining over the last two-three years. Pretty average two-way running, setting the tone for his teammates to take it easy on the defensive side of things. His nine tackles were a case of being beaten to the ball on the inside moreso than a desperate intensity. In all honesty, I'm not loving his play of late, and actually think we played better last year without him in the side. I'd park him in the forward line and take 15 decent possessions up front rather than 25 cheap possies in the mids and a lack of accountability. He's become less of a captain as his career has progressed. A real shame.

Tom Langdon - wow. He just continues to regress and regress and regress. He's actually a really decent intercept mark, but the opposition knows this, so they just make sure they either (a) play through his man and force him to defend, which he's terrible at, (b) bring the ball to ground and force him to defend at ground level, which he's even more terrible at, or (c) force him to dispose of the ball under pressure, which he's really terrible at. Last night he was directly responsible for five goals through awful defence or awful disposal. He's genuinely the weak link of a backline which otherwise isn't that terrible. He has shown no signs of correcting the monumental brainfades and general lack of concentration which has plagued his game since his second season. Symptomatic of our awful player development: his best game for the club was his first ever game against Freo in 2014.

Mason Cox - just about the worst game I've seen from an AFL player, but he drags himself off the bottom of the list simply by virtue of the fact that he at least put in the effort. Don't get me wrong, he was embarrassingly bad and should never play in even the slightest of wet conditions ever, ever again. He's a dry, sunny, day footballer only. Zero marks (and truth be told, didn't look like taking one clean). But hey, at least he got his hands to the ball and wasn't out-marked all night long. Sadly, that game likely destroys any confidence he'd built over the preseason, and it's hard to see him bouncing back any time soon. It was very Dawes-ian / White-ian / Q-Stick-ian / late career Cloke-ian. We just find a way of annihilating our tall forwards, don't we?

Josh Smith - not his fault he was selected, but he just poses no threat at AFL level whatsoever. It's like playing one short when he's in the side. Two handballs to half time... but because he has a good tank, he's somehow more valuable on a forward flank than somebody like a Daicos, or a slightly underdone Fasolo? Even Kirby, Wells or a hobbled Elliott are better options. Our obsession with picking duds who can run a decent two kilometre time trial is baffling. Speaking of which...

Tom Phillips - another who gets a game on the back of a strong time trial performance. Never mind that he's slow as treacle, an average kick, a bad decision maker and an absolute liability in a contest. I don't see a heck of a lot of upside to him. Like Smith, I don't think he's worth more than a Daicos, Brown or half-fit Wells type who might actually influence the contest, rather than rack up cheap outside possessions before burning them with substandard foot skills.

James Aish - add his name to the time trial heroes. I was hoping that this was the turning point for Aish, that it had finally clicked for him - we were told the penny had dropped and he'd put in a memorable preseason. And yet much like the team as a whole, what we got was a repeat of the last three years. Another testament to our non-existent player development - his best season was without a doubt his debut year with the Lions. Has gone backwards at an alarming rate since then, and shows no signs of arresting the slide. Between carrying he, Smith, Phillips and Langdon last night, were we ever any chance at a win?

Adam Treloar - again, has regressed ever since joining the Pies. Are we noticing a theme? His first season in black and white was good, but wasn't quite as good as his GWS efforts. His second season in black and white wasn't quite as good as his first. His first game in his third campaign puts him on track for another dip in output. Tried hard but butchered it pretty badly. Should be taking the long and direct option 100% of the time by foot, and looking to use his speed and quick hands more often than not. Must be a metres-gained type player, as his skills are, sadly, just not up to standard.

Brody Grundy - won the ruck duel, but to what effect? We were comfortably outpointed in centre clearances, and had no advantage in clearances around the ground. This was the bad Brody, the one who can't direct a tap to save himself. I swear he put it directly down Tom Mitchell's throat more often than he teed up a teammate. Maybe this was more a symptom of our impotent midfield, though. Wasn't his usual self around the ground. Tough night for big men, but he struggled.

Josh Thomas - pretty standard game from Josh. Racked up his 15-20 possessions and kicked a goal. Made some diabolical mistakes by hand and foot. Good and bad. Overall a breakeven. Which puts him amongst the better players on the night. Which is a shame.

Jeremy Howe - was one of the few with the ability to win a contest! Seriously, the number of times we're outpointed in one-on-one situations is just insane. Jez did some good things, just not enough. Was more quiet than usual. If Moore's presence in defence is going to limit Howe's output, I'd question whether it's a worthwhile move.

Brayden Maynard - looked like he was improving considerably last year, but last night was a step backwards. That limp-wristed effort to tackle Bruest on the goal line was an indictment. He likes to try and rough up players behind the play, but more often than not fails to stick the tackle, or put his head over the ball, or win the vital contest. So for all his bluster, he's not tough. Tough means impacting the contest when it matters, not letting small forwards waltz past you into an open goal.

Jack Crisp - was okay, but didn't provide the dash and rebound we needed from him in the backline. At least he doesn't shirk any contests and will legitimately put his body on the line for his teammates. He'll never be a superstar, but he plays a part. Not a great game from him, but probably amongst our best, which is a real shame.

Will Hoskin-Elliott - his lack of contested ability, and indeed fear of physical contact, really came to the fore last night. He's lost on the wing and really shouldn't be played anywhere other than forward, where his pace and sticky hands can shine, and his gutlessness is less evident. Won't ever win a hard ball for us or stick a crucial tackle, but does at least have some skill. Still, a bad game, and his lack of intensity was symptomatic of a general team-wide malaise that we never managed to snap out of. He, like his teammates, just didn't want to do the hard stuff. They didn't want it enough.

Ben Reid - another who tried but ultimately failed. He's lost more than a yard of pace and hasn't taken a clean mark for years - he double-grabs at everything these days. His agility has abandoned him so now at best he's a big body who can occasionally juggle a mark, and a worst a fumbler who has no ground-level presence. I think he's a defender only from here on out. Would love to be proved wrong, but I fear time and injury have caught up to him faster than anybody was expecting.

Taylor Adams - probably his worst game for the club? Played hopelessly out of position, especially as we were being creamed on the inside of the midfield battle. Why on earth he started out of the goalsquare is beyond me. Even so, he struggled to find the pill, dropped crucial marks, and slaughtered the ball on at least three occasions going inside fifty. I actually like Taylor a lot, but like Treloar, he should be looking to use his hands more often than his feet. Any kick from his boot should be a territory-first bomb to a contest. The clangers on the short passes are killing us.

Travis Varcoe - on reflection, how do I not have him in my bottom five? I guess because most of the team was actively terrible. Trav was just invisible. Worryingly, seems to have slowed down a fraction this season, and struggled to put on enough pressure up front. But let's be honest, it's an unenviable task playing up front for this team. It's usually four-versus-eight, and two of those four are Cox and Reid, who have the combined agility of an arthritic rhinoceros. Still think his best footy has come on a wing/HBF, where his clean hands and contested ball ability have allowed him to set up play and get the ball rolling forward. He's wasted as a defensive forward who relies on non-existent delivery. Let him be the one to win and deliver it.

Ben Crocker - I've seen a bit of praise for this bloke, but I wasn't blown away. Two goals, and one came from a free kick for deliberate out of bounds which he just happened to be closest to. He doesn't impact at ground level - he's a small, lead-up forward who lacks pace, strength and skill. It's like watching an U-12's kid run around against the U-16's. He was nowhere to be found on the dozen-or-so occasions where Cox forced the ball to ground. There's just something about him which screams self-interest. I'd sooner give a genuine crumber a run at it.

 

[mike123]

Game Review

I think that's a worse opening than the Freo 2014 or Sydney 2016 thumpings. Both those sides were good teams. The Hawks are middle of the road, didn't play particularly well, and yet we never threatened them.

Our style of play was depressingly similar to the confused, structureless shambles we've seen developing under the Buckley era. The mistakes were catastrophically bad, as they always are. Cox's fumbles. Phillips' calamitous goal line error. The centre clearance domination. The bizarre decision to let Tom Mitchell roam free. Every second piece of play involving Langdon. Terrible all over.

We leaked soft goals like a sieve while struggling to move the ball with any meaning the other way. We were embarrassingly afraid of the slightest physical contact across the board. We played our outside mids on the inside where they got dominated, and we played our inside mids on the outside where they turned the ball over with regularity. We refused to place a man behind the marking contest, despite the fact that the wet conditions allowed the ball to skid out the back on 90% of occasions. We refused to give ourselves a chance by playing an even number of players forward. We couldn't win a 50/50 contest all night long.

And most frustrating component: most of the above could be said about any Collingwood game over the past four years.

Onto the players...

Player Review

The best:

1. Steele Sidebottom
2. Darcy Moore
3. Lynden Dunn
4. Sam Murray
5. I don't think any other player won their position. Damning.

The worst (I'll limit this to five, but in reality, 17 players make a strong case here):

5. Tom Phillips
4. James Aish
3. Josh Smith
2. Mason Cox
1. Tom Langdon


Steele Sidebottom - clean hands, good physicality, exemplary effort all game long. Unlike his teammates, can win a contest, run hard, and hit a target with above average skills. Legitimately our only real threat moving the ball forward. Has comfortably surpassed Pendlebury as a player. He's the spiritual captain now - a fair chunk of our wins last season came under his watch. Wouldn't be averse to him taking the reigns sooner rather than later.

Darcy Moore - killed them down back in the first quarter, marking everything that came his way and forcing the Hawks to change their gameplan to work around him. Moved forward late and looked our only genuine target. One dropped grab which led to the Gunston goal was his only blemish, and even then, a "good" mistake - it came from his taking the game on. Teammates could do worse than following his example.

Lynden Dunn - typically gutsy and dour job on Roughy, who was just about the only Hawks forward who didn't threaten. Our best pure stopper, and much like Presti, leaves everything he has out on the field, even in the face of overwhelming adversity. Held up well all game, will be a good matchup for any slower forwards.

Sam Murray - made mistakes, but again, "positive" ones borne of taking the game on. Looks almost out of place in our side with his willingness to break lines and run at the opposition. One of the better debut games we've seen in the past seven years from what looks like a good recruit. Certainly didn't look like his first game of AFL.

Jaiden Stephenson - a solid enough debut, and certainly not disgraced. Would like to see him take on the game more, but with his teammates constantly panicking and refusing to take any physical contact, you can't blame him for following suit. Got better as the game wore on. Probably not ready for AFL yet, but something to work with at least.

Scott Pendlebury - the sort of game which has become the norm for Pendles: just okay. Did a few nice things. Got enough possessions. Fired off a couple of great releasing handballs. And yet failed to really influence the contest. Missed an easy, crucial goal, which has become a habit of his - has wilted under pressure more often than shining over the last two-three years. Pretty average two-way running, setting the tone for his teammates to take it easy on the defensive side of things. His nine tackles were a case of being beaten to the ball on the inside moreso than a desperate intensity. In all honesty, I'm not loving his play of late, and actually think we played better last year without him in the side. I'd park him in the forward line and take 15 decent possessions up front rather than 25 cheap possies in the mids and a lack of accountability. He's become less of a captain as his career has progressed. A real shame.

Tom Langdon - wow. He just continues to regress and regress and regress. He's actually a really decent intercept mark, but the opposition knows this, so they just make sure they either (a) play through his man and force him to defend, which he's terrible at, (b) bring the ball to ground and force him to defend at ground level, which he's even more terrible at, or (c) force him to dispose of the ball under pressure, which he's really terrible at. Last night he was directly responsible for five goals through awful defence or awful disposal. He's genuinely the weak link of a backline which otherwise isn't that terrible. He has shown no signs of correcting the monumental brainfades and general lack of concentration which has plagued his game since his second season. Symptomatic of our awful player development: his best game for the club was his first ever game against Freo in 2014.

Mason Cox - just about the worst game I've seen from an AFL player, but he drags himself off the bottom of the list simply by virtue of the fact that he at least put in the effort. Don't get me wrong, he was embarrassingly bad and should never play in even the slightest of wet conditions ever, ever again. He's a dry, sunny, day footballer only. Zero marks (and truth be told, didn't look like taking one clean). But hey, at least he got his hands to the ball and wasn't out-marked all night long. Sadly, that game likely destroys any confidence he'd built over the preseason, and it's hard to see him bouncing back any time soon. It was very Dawes-ian / White-ian / Q-Stick-ian / late career Cloke-ian. We just find a way of annihilating our tall forwards, don't we?

Josh Smith - not his fault he was selected, but he just poses no threat at AFL level whatsoever. It's like playing one short when he's in the side. Two handballs to half time... but because he has a good tank, he's somehow more valuable on a forward flank than somebody like a Daicos, or a slightly underdone Fasolo? Even Kirby, Wells or a hobbled Elliott are better options. Our obsession with picking duds who can run a decent two kilometre time trial is baffling. Speaking of which...

Tom Phillips - another who gets a game on the back of a strong time trial performance. Never mind that he's slow as treacle, an average kick, a bad decision maker and an absolute liability in a contest. I don't see a heck of a lot of upside to him. Like Smith, I don't think he's worth more than a Daicos, Brown or half-fit Wells type who might actually influence the contest, rather than rack up cheap outside possessions before burning them with substandard foot skills.

James Aish - add his name to the time trial heroes. I was hoping that this was the turning point for Aish, that it had finally clicked for him - we were told the penny had dropped and he'd put in a memorable preseason. And yet much like the team as a whole, what we got was a repeat of the last three years. Another testament to our non-existent player development - his best season was without a doubt his debut year with the Lions. Has gone backwards at an alarming rate since then, and shows no signs of arresting the slide. Between carrying he, Smith, Phillips and Langdon last night, were we ever any chance at a win?

Adam Treloar - again, has regressed ever since joining the Pies. Are we noticing a theme? His first season in black and white was good, but wasn't quite as good as his GWS efforts. His second season in black and white wasn't quite as good as his first. His first game in his third campaign puts him on track for another dip in output. Tried hard but butchered it pretty badly. Should be taking the long and direct option 100% of the time by foot, and looking to use his speed and quick hands more often than not. Must be a metres-gained type player, as his skills are, sadly, just not up to standard.

Brody Grundy - won the ruck duel, but to what effect? We were comfortably outpointed in centre clearances, and had no advantage in clearances around the ground. This was the bad Brody, the one who can't direct a tap to save himself. I swear he put it directly down Tom Mitchell's throat more often than he teed up a teammate. Maybe this was more a symptom of our impotent midfield, though. Wasn't his usual self around the ground. Tough night for big men, but he struggled.

Josh Thomas - pretty standard game from Josh. Racked up his 15-20 possessions and kicked a goal. Made some diabolical mistakes by hand and foot. Good and bad. Overall a breakeven. Which puts him amongst the better players on the night. Which is a shame.

Jeremy Howe - was one of the few with the ability to win a contest! Seriously, the number of times we're outpointed in one-on-one situations is just insane. Jez did some good things, just not enough. Was more quiet than usual. If Moore's presence in defence is going to limit Howe's output, I'd question whether it's a worthwhile move.

Brayden Maynard - looked like he was improving considerably last year, but last night was a step backwards. That limp-wristed effort to tackle Bruest on the goal line was an indictment. He likes to try and rough up players behind the play, but more often than not fails to stick the tackle, or put his head over the ball, or win the vital contest. So for all his bluster, he's not tough. Tough means impacting the contest when it matters, not letting small forwards waltz past you into an open goal.

Jack Crisp - was okay, but didn't provide the dash and rebound we needed from him in the backline. At least he doesn't shirk any contests and will legitimately put his body on the line for his teammates. He'll never be a superstar, but he plays a part. Not a great game from him, but probably amongst our best, which is a real shame.

Will Hoskin-Elliott - his lack of contested ability, and indeed fear of physical contact, really came to the fore last night. He's lost on the wing and really shouldn't be played anywhere other than forward, where his pace and sticky hands can shine, and his gutlessness is less evident. Won't ever win a hard ball for us or stick a crucial tackle, but does at least have some skill. Still, a bad game, and his lack of intensity was symptomatic of a general team-wide malaise that we never managed to snap out of. He, like his teammates, just didn't want to do the hard stuff. They didn't want it enough.

Ben Reid - another who tried but ultimately failed. He's lost more than a yard of pace and hasn't taken a clean mark for years - he double-grabs at everything these days. His agility has abandoned him so now at best he's a big body who can occasionally juggle a mark, and a worst a fumbler who has no ground-level presence. I think he's a defender only from here on out. Would love to be proved wrong, but I fear time and injury have caught up to him faster than anybody was expecting.

Taylor Adams - probably his worst game for the club? Played hopelessly out of position, especially as we were being creamed on the inside of the midfield battle. Why on earth he started out of the goalsquare is beyond me. Even so, he struggled to find the pill, dropped crucial marks, and slaughtered the ball on at least three occasions going inside fifty. I actually like Taylor a lot, but like Treloar, he should be looking to use his hands more often than his feet. Any kick from his boot should be a territory-first bomb to a contest. The clangers on the short passes are killing us.

Travis Varcoe - on reflection, how do I not have him in my bottom five? I guess because most of the team was actively terrible. Trav was just invisible. Worryingly, seems to have slowed down a fraction this season, and struggled to put on enough pressure up front. But let's be honest, it's an unenviable task playing up front for this team. It's usually four-versus-eight, and two of those four are Cox and Reid, who have the combined agility of an arthritic rhinoceros. Still think his best footy has come on a wing/HBF, where his clean hands and contested ball ability have allowed him to set up play and get the ball rolling forward. He's wasted as a defensive forward who relies on non-existent delivery. Let him be the one to win and deliver it.

Ben Crocker - I've seen a bit of praise for this bloke, but I wasn't blown away. Two goals, and one came from a free kick for deliberate out of bounds which he just happened to be closest to. He doesn't impact at ground level - he's a small, lead-up forward who lacks pace, strength and skill. It's like watching an U-12's kid run around against the U-16's. He was nowhere to be found on the dozen-or-so occasions where Cox forced the ball to ground. There's just something about him which screams self-interest. I'd sooner give a genuine crumber a run at it.

I agree with except WHE isn't a pure forward IMO, he needs to time on the wing to get involved in the game otherwise he gets lost.

I'm worried though that he's going to turn into what Seedsman was for us in the last year, a soft, mistake ridden, vanilla outside mid who doesn't use his pace. He's capable of much better.

 

[Snoop Dog]

Far too generous to both Treloar & Adams, IMO.

Thought was reasonably. Would have rated Treloar about a 5/10. He won a lot of contested footy just didn’t use it or make good decisions

 

[Leviathan Pie]

Thought was reasonably. Would have rated Treloar about a 5/10. He won a lot of contested footy just didn’t use it or make good decisions

5/10 to kick off the season for a bloke who's on $700k and we coughed up two top 10 picks for is totally unacceptable.

 

[Snoop Dog]

Snoop Dog on Langdon if we are to persist with Moore down back then he and Howe are both excellent intercept markers. Moore tried to mark like a forward but will improve.

So if Langdon is also perceived as an intercept marker for mine he is not needed. I would prefer a cool head positional player like Shazz. What do you think?

I agree completely. He is slow and get is always behind is man so the lead up hit is always on against him. If he gets it he is a slow decision maker and a slow kick. He use to take the game on but he has lost his ability to do it

 

[Snoop Dog]

5/10 to kick off the season for a bloke who's on $700k and we coughed up two top 10 picks for is totally unacceptable.

That’s what I wrote. 700k for that.

 

[Seedsfan]

Overrated, Pendles, sidebottom, grundy, treloar, adams, degoey

No impact players, WHE, varcoe, phillips, thomas, maynard, langdon, crisp

Useless, smith, cox, crocker, aish daicos, brown, reid

Should never play again, blair, broomhead, mayne

I know it looks bad but with a good coach we might be able to turn some of these guys around, someone like a Beverage and Clarkson, there must be others around, our coach just can't seem to improve our side

Pendlebury 5 times BnF winner 4 time all Australian premiership player and norm smith medal winner but his over rated. Yeah.......

 

[parvey]

Pendlebury 5 times BnF winner 4 time all Australian premiership player and norm smith medal winner but his over rated. Yeah.......

I actually think he is almost finished in today's footy, was good in the past as you have pointed out but going by his last couple years he is overrated

 

[TradeDraft]

Pendlebury 5 times BnF winner 4 time all Australian premiership player and norm smith medal winner but his over rated. Yeah.......

Done next to nothing so far in 2018

 

[Seedsfan]

Done next to nothing so far in 2018

Lol 1 game get a grip

 

[parvey]

Lol 1 game get a grip

Would love to agree with you but when you see the same thing happening over the last 4 or 5 years then there is nothing to get a grip of, love your enthusiasm but I think most people see the writing on the wall already

 

[parvey]

Game Review

I think that's a worse opening than the Freo 2014 or Sydney 2016 thumpings. Both those sides were good teams. The Hawks are middle of the road, didn't play particularly well, and yet we never threatened them.

Our style of play was depressingly similar to the confused, structureless shambles we've seen developing under the Buckley era. The mistakes were catastrophically bad, as they always are. Cox's fumbles. Phillips' calamitous goal line error. The centre clearance domination. The bizarre decision to let Tom Mitchell roam free. Every second piece of play involving Langdon. Terrible all over.

We leaked soft goals like a sieve while struggling to move the ball with any meaning the other way. We were embarrassingly afraid of the slightest physical contact across the board. We played our outside mids on the inside where they got dominated, and we played our inside mids on the outside where they turned the ball over with regularity. We refused to place a man behind the marking contest, despite the fact that the wet conditions allowed the ball to skid out the back on 90% of occasions. We refused to give ourselves a chance by playing an even number of players forward. We couldn't win a 50/50 contest all night long.

And most frustrating component: most of the above could be said about any Collingwood game over the past four years.

Onto the players...

Player Review

The best:

1. Steele Sidebottom
2. Darcy Moore
3. Lynden Dunn
4. Sam Murray
5. I don't think any other player won their position. Damning.

The worst (I'll limit this to five, but in reality, 17 players make a strong case here):

5. Tom Phillips
4. James Aish
3. Josh Smith
2. Mason Cox
1. Tom Langdon


Steele Sidebottom - clean hands, good physicality, exemplary effort all game long. Unlike his teammates, can win a contest, run hard, and hit a target with above average skills. Legitimately our only real threat moving the ball forward. Has comfortably surpassed Pendlebury as a player. He's the spiritual captain now - a fair chunk of our wins last season came under his watch. Wouldn't be averse to him taking the reigns sooner rather than later.

Darcy Moore - killed them down back in the first quarter, marking everything that came his way and forcing the Hawks to change their gameplan to work around him. Moved forward late and looked our only genuine target. One dropped grab which led to the Gunston goal was his only blemish, and even then, a "good" mistake - it came from his taking the game on. Teammates could do worse than following his example.

Lynden Dunn - typically gutsy and dour job on Roughy, who was just about the only Hawks forward who didn't threaten. Our best pure stopper, and much like Presti, leaves everything he has out on the field, even in the face of overwhelming adversity. Held up well all game, will be a good matchup for any slower forwards.

Sam Murray - made mistakes, but again, "positive" ones borne of taking the game on. Looks almost out of place in our side with his willingness to break lines and run at the opposition. One of the better debut games we've seen in the past seven years from what looks like a good recruit. Certainly didn't look like his first game of AFL.

Jaiden Stephenson - a solid enough debut, and certainly not disgraced. Would like to see him take on the game more, but with his teammates constantly panicking and refusing to take any physical contact, you can't blame him for following suit. Got better as the game wore on. Probably not ready for AFL yet, but something to work with at least.

Scott Pendlebury - the sort of game which has become the norm for Pendles: just okay. Did a few nice things. Got enough possessions. Fired off a couple of great releasing handballs. And yet failed to really influence the contest. Missed an easy, crucial goal, which has become a habit of his - has wilted under pressure more often than shining over the last two-three years. Pretty average two-way running, setting the tone for his teammates to take it easy on the defensive side of things. His nine tackles were a case of being beaten to the ball on the inside moreso than a desperate intensity. In all honesty, I'm not loving his play of late, and actually think we played better last year without him in the side. I'd park him in the forward line and take 15 decent possessions up front rather than 25 cheap possies in the mids and a lack of accountability. He's become less of a captain as his career has progressed. A real shame.

Tom Langdon - wow. He just continues to regress and regress and regress. He's actually a really decent intercept mark, but the opposition knows this, so they just make sure they either (a) play through his man and force him to defend, which he's terrible at, (b) bring the ball to ground and force him to defend at ground level, which he's even more terrible at, or (c) force him to dispose of the ball under pressure, which he's really terrible at. Last night he was directly responsible for five goals through awful defence or awful disposal. He's genuinely the weak link of a backline which otherwise isn't that terrible. He has shown no signs of correcting the monumental brainfades and general lack of concentration which has plagued his game since his second season. Symptomatic of our awful player development: his best game for the club was his first ever game against Freo in 2014.

Mason Cox - just about the worst game I've seen from an AFL player, but he drags himself off the bottom of the list simply by virtue of the fact that he at least put in the effort. Don't get me wrong, he was embarrassingly bad and should never play in even the slightest of wet conditions ever, ever again. He's a dry, sunny, day footballer only. Zero marks (and truth be told, didn't look like taking one clean). But hey, at least he got his hands to the ball and wasn't out-marked all night long. Sadly, that game likely destroys any confidence he'd built over the preseason, and it's hard to see him bouncing back any time soon. It was very Dawes-ian / White-ian / Q-Stick-ian / late career Cloke-ian. We just find a way of annihilating our tall forwards, don't we?

Josh Smith - not his fault he was selected, but he just poses no threat at AFL level whatsoever. It's like playing one short when he's in the side. Two handballs to half time... but because he has a good tank, he's somehow more valuable on a forward flank than somebody like a Daicos, or a slightly underdone Fasolo? Even Kirby, Wells or a hobbled Elliott are better options. Our obsession with picking duds who can run a decent two kilometre time trial is baffling. Speaking of which...

Tom Phillips - another who gets a game on the back of a strong time trial performance. Never mind that he's slow as treacle, an average kick, a bad decision maker and an absolute liability in a contest. I don't see a heck of a lot of upside to him. Like Smith, I don't think he's worth more than a Daicos, Brown or half-fit Wells type who might actually influence the contest, rather than rack up cheap outside possessions before burning them with substandard foot skills.

James Aish - add his name to the time trial heroes. I was hoping that this was the turning point for Aish, that it had finally clicked for him - we were told the penny had dropped and he'd put in a memorable preseason. And yet much like the team as a whole, what we got was a repeat of the last three years. Another testament to our non-existent player development - his best season was without a doubt his debut year with the Lions. Has gone backwards at an alarming rate since then, and shows no signs of arresting the slide. Between carrying he, Smith, Phillips and Langdon last night, were we ever any chance at a win?

Adam Treloar - again, has regressed ever since joining the Pies. Are we noticing a theme? His first season in black and white was good, but wasn't quite as good as his GWS efforts. His second season in black and white wasn't quite as good as his first. His first game in his third campaign puts him on track for another dip in output. Tried hard but butchered it pretty badly. Should be taking the long and direct option 100% of the time by foot, and looking to use his speed and quick hands more often than not. Must be a metres-gained type player, as his skills are, sadly, just not up to standard.

Brody Grundy - won the ruck duel, but to what effect? We were comfortably outpointed in centre clearances, and had no advantage in clearances around the ground. This was the bad Brody, the one who can't direct a tap to save himself. I swear he put it directly down Tom Mitchell's throat more often than he teed up a teammate. Maybe this was more a symptom of our impotent midfield, though. Wasn't his usual self around the ground. Tough night for big men, but he struggled.

Josh Thomas - pretty standard game from Josh. Racked up his 15-20 possessions and kicked a goal. Made some diabolical mistakes by hand and foot. Good and bad. Overall a breakeven. Which puts him amongst the better players on the night. Which is a shame.

Jeremy Howe - was one of the few with the ability to win a contest! Seriously, the number of times we're outpointed in one-on-one situations is just insane. Jez did some good things, just not enough. Was more quiet than usual. If Moore's presence in defence is going to limit Howe's output, I'd question whether it's a worthwhile move.

Brayden Maynard - looked like he was improving considerably last year, but last night was a step backwards. That limp-wristed effort to tackle Bruest on the goal line was an indictment. He likes to try and rough up players behind the play, but more often than not fails to stick the tackle, or put his head over the ball, or win the vital contest. So for all his bluster, he's not tough. Tough means impacting the contest when it matters, not letting small forwards waltz past you into an open goal.

Jack Crisp - was okay, but didn't provide the dash and rebound we needed from him in the backline. At least he doesn't shirk any contests and will legitimately put his body on the line for his teammates. He'll never be a superstar, but he plays a part. Not a great game from him, but probably amongst our best, which is a real shame.

Will Hoskin-Elliott - his lack of contested ability, and indeed fear of physical contact, really came to the fore last night. He's lost on the wing and really shouldn't be played anywhere other than forward, where his pace and sticky hands can shine, and his gutlessness is less evident. Won't ever win a hard ball for us or stick a crucial tackle, but does at least have some skill. Still, a bad game, and his lack of intensity was symptomatic of a general team-wide malaise that we never managed to snap out of. He, like his teammates, just didn't want to do the hard stuff. They didn't want it enough.

Ben Reid - another who tried but ultimately failed. He's lost more than a yard of pace and hasn't taken a clean mark for years - he double-grabs at everything these days. His agility has abandoned him so now at best he's a big body who can occasionally juggle a mark, and a worst a fumbler who has no ground-level presence. I think he's a defender only from here on out. Would love to be proved wrong, but I fear time and injury have caught up to him faster than anybody was expecting.

Taylor Adams - probably his worst game for the club? Played hopelessly out of position, especially as we were being creamed on the inside of the midfield battle. Why on earth he started out of the goalsquare is beyond me. Even so, he struggled to find the pill, dropped crucial marks, and slaughtered the ball on at least three occasions going inside fifty. I actually like Taylor a lot, but like Treloar, he should be looking to use his hands more often than his feet. Any kick from his boot should be a territory-first bomb to a contest. The clangers on the short passes are killing us.

Travis Varcoe - on reflection, how do I not have him in my bottom five? I guess because most of the team was actively terrible. Trav was just invisible. Worryingly, seems to have slowed down a fraction this season, and struggled to put on enough pressure up front. But let's be honest, it's an unenviable task playing up front for this team. It's usually four-versus-eight, and two of those four are Cox and Reid, who have the combined agility of an arthritic rhinoceros. Still think his best footy has come on a wing/HBF, where his clean hands and contested ball ability have allowed him to set up play and get the ball rolling forward. He's wasted as a defensive forward who relies on non-existent delivery. Let him be the one to win and deliver it.

Ben Crocker - I've seen a bit of praise for this bloke, but I wasn't blown away. Two goals, and one came from a free kick for deliberate out of bounds which he just happened to be closest to. He doesn't impact at ground level - he's a small, lead-up forward who lacks pace, strength and skill. It's like watching an U-12's kid run around against the U-16's. He was nowhere to be found on the dozen-or-so occasions where Cox forced the ball to ground. There's just something about him which screams self-interest. I'd sooner give a genuine crumber a run at it.

You really know your stuff, could not agree more

 

[TradeDraft]

Lol 1 game get a grip

Pendles had a Terrible JLT hard to be Confident

 

[Seedsfan]

Would love to agree with you but when you see the same thing happening over the last 4 or 5 years then there is nothing to get a grip of, love your enthusiasm but I think most people see the writing on the wall already

I am talking about one player here who has won 4 BnFs in the past 5 years and come second once. To write him off on the back of one bad game well **** me. That’s even stupider than what the Aussie cricketers got up to

 

[parvey]

I am talking about one player here who has won 4 BnFs in the past 5 years and come second once. To write him off on the back of one bad game well **** me. That’s even stupider than what the Aussie cricketers got up to

If only it were just one bad game, he has been steadily loosing his effectiveness for the last few years, doen't say much for our list if he is constantly 1st or second in the BnF for the last couple years, I reckon he is almost washed up, sorry you don't agree but that's the beauty of opinions

 

[Finnishpie]

Game Review

I think that's a worse opening than the Freo 2014 or Sydney 2016 thumpings. Both those sides were good teams. The Hawks are middle of the road, didn't play particularly well, and yet we never threatened them.

Our style of play was depressingly similar to the confused, structureless shambles we've seen developing under the Buckley era. The mistakes were catastrophically bad, as they always are. Cox's fumbles. Phillips' calamitous goal line error. The centre clearance domination. The bizarre decision to let Tom Mitchell roam free. Every second piece of play involving Langdon. Terrible all over.

We leaked soft goals like a sieve while struggling to move the ball with any meaning the other way. We were embarrassingly afraid of the slightest physical contact across the board. We played our outside mids on the inside where they got dominated, and we played our inside mids on the outside where they turned the ball over with regularity. We refused to place a man behind the marking contest, despite the fact that the wet conditions allowed the ball to skid out the back on 90% of occasions. We refused to give ourselves a chance by playing an even number of players forward. We couldn't win a 50/50 contest all night long.

And most frustrating component: most of the above could be said about any Collingwood game over the past four years.

Onto the players...

Player Review

The best:

1. Steele Sidebottom
2. Darcy Moore
3. Lynden Dunn
4. Sam Murray
5. I don't think any other player won their position. Damning.

The worst (I'll limit this to five, but in reality, 17 players make a strong case here):

5. Tom Phillips
4. James Aish
3. Josh Smith
2. Mason Cox
1. Tom Langdon


Steele Sidebottom - clean hands, good physicality, exemplary effort all game long. Unlike his teammates, can win a contest, run hard, and hit a target with above average skills. Legitimately our only real threat moving the ball forward. Has comfortably surpassed Pendlebury as a player. He's the spiritual captain now - a fair chunk of our wins last season came under his watch. Wouldn't be averse to him taking the reigns sooner rather than later.

Darcy Moore - killed them down back in the first quarter, marking everything that came his way and forcing the Hawks to change their gameplan to work around him. Moved forward late and looked our only genuine target. One dropped grab which led to the Gunston goal was his only blemish, and even then, a "good" mistake - it came from his taking the game on. Teammates could do worse than following his example.

Lynden Dunn - typically gutsy and dour job on Roughy, who was just about the only Hawks forward who didn't threaten. Our best pure stopper, and much like Presti, leaves everything he has out on the field, even in the face of overwhelming adversity. Held up well all game, will be a good matchup for any slower forwards.

Sam Murray - made mistakes, but again, "positive" ones borne of taking the game on. Looks almost out of place in our side with his willingness to break lines and run at the opposition. One of the better debut games we've seen in the past seven years from what looks like a good recruit. Certainly didn't look like his first game of AFL.

Jaiden Stephenson - a solid enough debut, and certainly not disgraced. Would like to see him take on the game more, but with his teammates constantly panicking and refusing to take any physical contact, you can't blame him for following suit. Got better as the game wore on. Probably not ready for AFL yet, but something to work with at least.

Scott Pendlebury - the sort of game which has become the norm for Pendles: just okay. Did a few nice things. Got enough possessions. Fired off a couple of great releasing handballs. And yet failed to really influence the contest. Missed an easy, crucial goal, which has become a habit of his - has wilted under pressure more often than shining over the last two-three years. Pretty average two-way running, setting the tone for his teammates to take it easy on the defensive side of things. His nine tackles were a case of being beaten to the ball on the inside moreso than a desperate intensity. In all honesty, I'm not loving his play of late, and actually think we played better last year without him in the side. I'd park him in the forward line and take 15 decent possessions up front rather than 25 cheap possies in the mids and a lack of accountability. He's become less of a captain as his career has progressed. A real shame.

Tom Langdon - wow. He just continues to regress and regress and regress. He's actually a really decent intercept mark, but the opposition knows this, so they just make sure they either (a) play through his man and force him to defend, which he's terrible at, (b) bring the ball to ground and force him to defend at ground level, which he's even more terrible at, or (c) force him to dispose of the ball under pressure, which he's really terrible at. Last night he was directly responsible for five goals through awful defence or awful disposal. He's genuinely the weak link of a backline which otherwise isn't that terrible. He has shown no signs of correcting the monumental brainfades and general lack of concentration which has plagued his game since his second season. Symptomatic of our awful player development: his best game for the club was his first ever game against Freo in 2014.

Mason Cox - just about the worst game I've seen from an AFL player, but he drags himself off the bottom of the list simply by virtue of the fact that he at least put in the effort. Don't get me wrong, he was embarrassingly bad and should never play in even the slightest of wet conditions ever, ever again. He's a dry, sunny, day footballer only. Zero marks (and truth be told, didn't look like taking one clean). But hey, at least he got his hands to the ball and wasn't out-marked all night long. Sadly, that game likely destroys any confidence he'd built over the preseason, and it's hard to see him bouncing back any time soon. It was very Dawes-ian / White-ian / Q-Stick-ian / late career Cloke-ian. We just find a way of annihilating our tall forwards, don't we?

Josh Smith - not his fault he was selected, but he just poses no threat at AFL level whatsoever. It's like playing one short when he's in the side. Two handballs to half time... but because he has a good tank, he's somehow more valuable on a forward flank than somebody like a Daicos, or a slightly underdone Fasolo? Even Kirby, Wells or a hobbled Elliott are better options. Our obsession with picking duds who can run a decent two kilometre time trial is baffling. Speaking of which...

Tom Phillips - another who gets a game on the back of a strong time trial performance. Never mind that he's slow as treacle, an average kick, a bad decision maker and an absolute liability in a contest. I don't see a heck of a lot of upside to him. Like Smith, I don't think he's worth more than a Daicos, Brown or half-fit Wells type who might actually influence the contest, rather than rack up cheap outside possessions before burning them with substandard foot skills.

James Aish - add his name to the time trial heroes. I was hoping that this was the turning point for Aish, that it had finally clicked for him - we were told the penny had dropped and he'd put in a memorable preseason. And yet much like the team as a whole, what we got was a repeat of the last three years. Another testament to our non-existent player development - his best season was without a doubt his debut year with the Lions. Has gone backwards at an alarming rate since then, and shows no signs of arresting the slide. Between carrying he, Smith, Phillips and Langdon last night, were we ever any chance at a win?

Adam Treloar - again, has regressed ever since joining the Pies. Are we noticing a theme? His first season in black and white was good, but wasn't quite as good as his GWS efforts. His second season in black and white wasn't quite as good as his first. His first game in his third campaign puts him on track for another dip in output. Tried hard but butchered it pretty badly. Should be taking the long and direct option 100% of the time by foot, and looking to use his speed and quick hands more often than not. Must be a metres-gained type player, as his skills are, sadly, just not up to standard.

Brody Grundy - won the ruck duel, but to what effect? We were comfortably outpointed in centre clearances, and had no advantage in clearances around the ground. This was the bad Brody, the one who can't direct a tap to save himself. I swear he put it directly down Tom Mitchell's throat more often than he teed up a teammate. Maybe this was more a symptom of our impotent midfield, though. Wasn't his usual self around the ground. Tough night for big men, but he struggled.

Josh Thomas - pretty standard game from Josh. Racked up his 15-20 possessions and kicked a goal. Made some diabolical mistakes by hand and foot. Good and bad. Overall a breakeven. Which puts him amongst the better players on the night. Which is a shame.

Jeremy Howe - was one of the few with the ability to win a contest! Seriously, the number of times we're outpointed in one-on-one situations is just insane. Jez did some good things, just not enough. Was more quiet than usual. If Moore's presence in defence is going to limit Howe's output, I'd question whether it's a worthwhile move.

Brayden Maynard - looked like he was improving considerably last year, but last night was a step backwards. That limp-wristed effort to tackle Bruest on the goal line was an indictment. He likes to try and rough up players behind the play, but more often than not fails to stick the tackle, or put his head over the ball, or win the vital contest. So for all his bluster, he's not tough. Tough means impacting the contest when it matters, not letting small forwards waltz past you into an open goal.

Jack Crisp - was okay, but didn't provide the dash and rebound we needed from him in the backline. At least he doesn't shirk any contests and will legitimately put his body on the line for his teammates. He'll never be a superstar, but he plays a part. Not a great game from him, but probably amongst our best, which is a real shame.

Will Hoskin-Elliott - his lack of contested ability, and indeed fear of physical contact, really came to the fore last night. He's lost on the wing and really shouldn't be played anywhere other than forward, where his pace and sticky hands can shine, and his gutlessness is less evident. Won't ever win a hard ball for us or stick a crucial tackle, but does at least have some skill. Still, a bad game, and his lack of intensity was symptomatic of a general team-wide malaise that we never managed to snap out of. He, like his teammates, just didn't want to do the hard stuff. They didn't want it enough.

Ben Reid - another who tried but ultimately failed. He's lost more than a yard of pace and hasn't taken a clean mark for years - he double-grabs at everything these days. His agility has abandoned him so now at best he's a big body who can occasionally juggle a mark, and a worst a fumbler who has no ground-level presence. I think he's a defender only from here on out. Would love to be proved wrong, but I fear time and injury have caught up to him faster than anybody was expecting.

Taylor Adams - probably his worst game for the club? Played hopelessly out of position, especially as we were being creamed on the inside of the midfield battle. Why on earth he started out of the goalsquare is beyond me. Even so, he struggled to find the pill, dropped crucial marks, and slaughtered the ball on at least three occasions going inside fifty. I actually like Taylor a lot, but like Treloar, he should be looking to use his hands more often than his feet. Any kick from his boot should be a territory-first bomb to a contest. The clangers on the short passes are killing us.

Travis Varcoe - on reflection, how do I not have him in my bottom five? I guess because most of the team was actively terrible. Trav was just invisible. Worryingly, seems to have slowed down a fraction this season, and struggled to put on enough pressure up front. But let's be honest, it's an unenviable task playing up front for this team. It's usually four-versus-eight, and two of those four are Cox and Reid, who have the combined agility of an arthritic rhinoceros. Still think his best footy has come on a wing/HBF, where his clean hands and contested ball ability have allowed him to set up play and get the ball rolling forward. He's wasted as a defensive forward who relies on non-existent delivery. Let him be the one to win and deliver it.

Ben Crocker - I've seen a bit of praise for this bloke, but I wasn't blown away. Two goals, and one came from a free kick for deliberate out of bounds which he just happened to be closest to. He doesn't impact at ground level - he's a small, lead-up forward who lacks pace, strength and skill. It's like watching an U-12's kid run around against the U-16's. He was nowhere to be found on the dozen-or-so occasions where Cox forced the ball to ground. There's just something about him which screams self-interest. I'd sooner give a genuine crumber a run at it.

"on reflection, how do I not have him in my bottom five?" -- because your bottom 5 isn't right. Aish wasn't too bad. Varcoe was way worse.