Discussion Random Discussion

[Yawkey way]

I'm fully aware of it, and much of the history is shameful, particularly empire. Was it my fault? What's your point?

My point is let's stick with facts and the present not denigrate two great nations for past mistakes or political battles that come and go.

As for your other points well you lost me at the mention of greens however.

No Europe doesn't have a problem with unchecked immigration but we have all seen and read of the refugee problems in Italy, Greece, Germany, hungry and Poland among others. That looks pretty unchecked and from here appears to be a huge problem.

Yes many parts of Britain are sparsely populated even more so in Australia. The facts as I understand them are that you can't regulate where people live once you accept them as citizens. Most immigrants have no wish to live in isolated infrastructure poor locations, they prefer the major population centres and the jobs, services and expat diaspora they provide. That is becoming a problem in Australia as our current population growth is at or near record levels.

Showing a guardian report has as much credibility as holding up the new York times.

I would have loved to see the US adopt universal heath care and I couldn't believe the rubbish Obama served up, a great opportunity missed.

Australia has student loans as well, it's not the same as the US nor as expensive but its not free by any means.

Reports of the failings of the US welfare system are often exaggerated and confused.

I respect the rights and opinions of my family and friends who do live in the US, I only vote in the place I reside regardless of my rights.

Their political leanings and opinions are varied and I respect their rights to express them whether I agree with them or not.

Personally I think we are seeing an assault on democracy and the truth. So many attempts to silence others, such intolerance and so many lies from both sides of the aisle.

Fact check everything if you have the time and care enough to be bothered.

Depending on reports the US economy is picking up, lowest unemployment in decades etc.

I think I will Wait and see how his 4 years play out before I pass judgement.

PS. Sorry typing on a phone with one finger.

 

[MUFKilda]

My point is let's stick with facts and the present not denigrate two great nations for past mistakes or political battles that come and go.

As for your other points well you lost me at the mention of greens however.

No Europe doesn't have a problem with unchecked immigration but we have all seen and read of the refugee problems in Italy, Greece, Germany, hungry and Poland among others. That looks pretty unchecked and from here appears to be a huge problem.

Yes many parts of Britain are sparsely populated even more so in Australia. The facts as I understand them are that you can't regulate where people live once you accept them as citizens. Most immigrants have no wish to live in isolated infrastructure poor locations, they prefer the major population centres and the jobs, services and expat diaspora they provide. That is becoming a problem in Australia as our current population growth is at or near record levels.

Showing a guardian report has as much credibility as holding up the new York times.

I would have loved to see the US adopt universal heath care and I couldn't believe the rubbish Obama served up, a great opportunity missed.

Australia has student loans as well, it's not the same as the US nor as expensive but its not free by any means.

Reports of the failings of the US welfare system are often exaggerated and confused.

I respect the rights and opinions of my family and friends who do live in the US, I only vote in the place I reside regardless of my rights.

Their political leanings and opinions are varied and I respect their rights to express them whether I agree with them or not.

Personally I think we are seeing an assault on democracy and the truth. So many attempts to silence others, such intolerance and so many lies from both sides of the aisle.

Fact check everything if you have the time and care enough to be bothered.

Depending on reports the US economy is picking up, lowest unemployment in decades etc.


I think I will Wait and see how his 4 years play out before I pass judgement.

PS. Sorry typing on a phone with one finger.

Highlight one - I am sticking with facts of what the Trump administration has done. I'm also aware of the past misconduct of both America and my own country, but I'm not responsible for it, any more than Germans born post 1945 are responsible for the Nazis. America, as today's major global power has supplanted Britain as the pre-eminent 'policeman ( and sometimes criminal, sadly) of the world'. As a Briton I still have the right to criticise any government, including my own, which I often do at the moment.

Highlight two - I'm a member of the Green Party here and am very proud of it.

Highlight three - regardless of sources (and The Guardian is a very good one) there have been children in cages and there are presently 2300 forcibly removed from their parents. That's child abuse. You can't just pull a Trump and try to make the problem disappear by screaming 'fake news'.

Highlight four - England now also has student loans (university education remains free in Scotland) but they are capped and not as prohibitively expensive as the American system. Social mobility is a thing of the past for millions in America and also here in the UK, as we also embraced neo-liberalism in a way much of Europe did not. America is on a faster track towards feudalism, but we in the UK seem to mimic their actions and Brexit will accelerate that.

Highlight five - I do fact check and, for example, don't just swallow the right wing propaganda which dominates the British press and discourse - Mail, Express, Telegraph, Times, Sun, Star. Their lies about Brexit and the EU, for example, were the shabbiest form of politics. As Socrates said, 'challenge everything'.

Highlight six - Lower unemployment in America. Much of that is the lag effect of the Obama administration, but even that is very misleading. Millions of Americans aren't counted in the unemployment figures because they've dropped out of the labour market completely, after being removed from welfare. Also, what type of jobs are they - are they well paid and secure or are they temporary/seasonal with no benefits? This begs the far deeper question of what is the purpose of work and a meaningful life, which political philosophers used to regularly ponder but which seems to have disappeared completely from the discourse.

Highlight seven - I won't need four years to understand what an incompetent, venal individual Trump is, nor the domestic and international damage his administration is doing e.g. massive tax cut for the top 1 per cent, to be paid for by enormous spending cuts. Reaganomics revisited. Trump analysed by a top REPUBLICAN just this week: borderline evil.







​

 

[DGontheQT]

born and raised in Perth so only a short 3,441km's away from Moorabbin
my saints link is from my dad who in the late 60's with his family moved from India to Melbourne, eventually settling in Malvern in the first year of the being in australia my dads work mates dragged him to a game at Moorabbin it was a Collingwood vs St Kilda game that Cowboy kicked 4 goals for us to win by a goal.. had that game gone the other way he would have prob followed Collingwood... in the 80's after the death of my older brother the family re-located to Perth and i was then born.. through the 90's my dad turned to the WCE as when they won their first flag it was hard not to be.. around about 1993 on a family holiday i had a chance meeting in an airport lounge of big Stewie Loewe, the big fella was just awesome to me as a pesky kid asking 1001 questions mostly about how big his hands were he could have easily told me to rack off but he didnt... that planted the seed , in 95 when freo came to exist i flirted with supporting them (mainly off the back of the rumors that the dockers were trying to lure Stewie Loewe over) but that was short lived as i was more basketball obsessed but i always had the following of the saints and while not going to games or anything i did always check on the scores ect. come 2000's i for some unknown reason got really into footy and for some even stranger reason got really pasionate about the saints , 2004 i purchased my first membership that year while chasing robert Harvey for an autograph at perth airport i came across a guy struggling with the 100s of bags from the team , me being ever helpful helped lug the bags to the baggage area.. this started a 12 year run of helping the club when they came to Perth, initially holding the banner at qtr and 3qtr time, then setting up the changerooms, being boot studder,ice bath maker, powerade mixer, general "go grab this"person, footy fetcher and on one occasion kicking out in the warm up... 12 years of hard work but really really rewarding work helping my club.. about 2007 i joined the western saints committee as member liason basically being the contact for the WA members and the link between the club and the Western Saints in 2017 our president Helen Creed retired from the Western Saints and i became President ...
honestly now i reckon St Kilda makes up the majority of my thoughts be it watching game talking about games or trying to organise something for the WA members to say im obsessed is prob an understatment ...

Cowboy beating up on Collingwood , didn't he have any other hobbies ! Great piece by the way.

 

[Yawkey way]

Some of that we will never agree on such as Obamas role in the current economic recovery.

Yes children are separated from their parents, when their parents have been detained for illegally entering the US. The question is why is this law such an issue now.

The ABC have zero credibility, anybody can find a dial a quote to support their view.

The cost of a college education in the US can vary wildly depending of several factors, you should look at the range of in state options.

No question at all that the gap between the rich and poor has increased and social mobility has decreased. There's plenty of research to back this up. It's not confined to the US or Britain interestingly opinions on success being merit based vary from country to country.

My son studied and worked as a researcher in this field until recently taking a job with the Australian bureau of stats.

The greens here IMO are a joke, plenty of righteous indignation and single issue candidates.

Mostly with no answers other than rainbow's and candy drops. One example coal fired power plants must close now, except wind and solar can't meet base load requirements. A plant has closed in SA and Vic prices are souring and blackouts have occurred, there are other factors at play but that hasn't helped.

Tax cuts for business and disproportionate gains for the wealthy. Well everything old is new again we have just passed legislation for similar tax cuts here.

I don't believe in the sins of the father's and never have. I also don't believe in throwing out the baby with the bathwater, western democracies beat the crap out of the alternatives.

I'm still giving trump an unbiased four years, then Americans can judge after all that's who elected him to represent their interests.

If others don't like it well I guess that's bad luck.

 

[gringo2011]

Some of that we will never agree on such as Obamas role in the current economic recovery.

Yes children are separated from their parents, when their parents have been detained for illegally entering the US. The question is why is this law such an issue now.

The ABC have zero credibility, anybody can find a dial a quote to support their view.

The cost of a college education in the US can vary wildly depending of several factors, you should look at the range of in state options.

No question at all that the gap between the rich and poor has increased and social mobility has decreased. There's plenty of research to back this up. It's not confined to the US or Britain interestingly opinions on success being merit based vary from country to country.

My son studied and worked as a researcher in this field until recently taking a job with the Australian bureau of stats.

The greens here IMO are a joke, plenty of righteous indignation and single issue candidates.

Mostly with no answers other than rainbow's and candy drops. One example coal fired power plants must close now, except wind and solar can't meet base load requirements. A plant has closed in SA and Vic prices are souring and blackouts have occurred, there are other factors at play but that hasn't helped.

Tax cuts for business and disproportionate gains for the wealthy. Well everything old is new again we have just passed legislation for similar tax cuts here.

I don't believe in the sins of the father's and never have. I also don't believe in throwing out the baby with the bathwater, western democracies beat the crap out of the alternatives.

I'm still giving trump an unbiased four years, then Americans can judge after all that's who elected him to represent their interests.

If others don't like it well I guess that's bad luck.

That's probably a sane way to look at it. He's there regardless and getting worked up about him won't do anyone any good. He's making plenty of people who are already very disengaged with politics even more disengaged. It's interesting times, like everyone he probably has some good and bad elements, the bad are that he's making a few decisions that could accelerate the decline of the US as the world economy and give China a free run at it.

He could be the end of the empire figure or he might just be another in a long line of US power brokers that are reaping money from pillaging other economies. The world's wealth divide has been opening up for a long time and Trump certainly didn't cause it. I think he's probably done very little to improve it though.

On renewables, the governments have failed to encourage investment and now have a situation where coal fired power stations are all ready for decommissioning and it's not worth building new infrastructure that will be phased out quickly but we failed to build the renewables up to a point where they could carry much more of the load. I have a friend that was working for a company that built turbines and they were sent out of business waiting for the governments to legislate. He now works for a traditional energy company so I get lots of information on the ridiculousness of politics interfering with energy production.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Some of that we will never agree on such as Obamas role in the current economic recovery.

Yes children are separated from their parents, when their parents have been detained for illegally entering the US. The question is why is this law such an issue now.

The ABC have zero credibility, anybody can find a dial a quote to support their view.

The cost of a college education in the US can vary wildly depending of several factors, you should look at the range of in state options.

No question at all that the gap between the rich and poor has increased and social mobility has decreased. There's plenty of research to back this up. It's not confined to the US or Britain interestingly opinions on success being merit based vary from country to country.

My son studied and worked as a researcher in this field until recently taking a job with the Australian bureau of stats.

The greens here IMO are a joke, plenty of righteous indignation and single issue candidates.

Mostly with no answers other than rainbow's and candy drops. One example coal fired power plants must close now, except wind and solar can't meet base load requirements. A plant has closed in SA and Vic prices are souring and blackouts have occurred, there are other factors at play but that hasn't helped.

Tax cuts for business and disproportionate gains for the wealthy. Well everything old is new again we have just passed legislation for similar tax cuts here.

I don't believe in the sins of the father's and never have. I also don't believe in throwing out the baby with the bathwater, western democracies beat the crap out of the alternatives.

I'm still giving trump an unbiased four years, then Americans can judge after all that's who elected him to represent their interests.

If others don't like it well I guess that's bad luck.

Solar electricity farms using PV cells are a dumb solution for base load power.

If PV makes sense, it makes more sense to have them on your roof than on a farm somewhere hundreds of km away , where you get to suffer huge transmission losses and have to pay some corporate flog a huge markup. ( while they offer to pay you way less than the wholesale rate to buy your solar power to put back into the grid ).

Solar on roof + Gas Fuel Cell + big battery ( call it a powerwall if you must, seems a dumb place to put a battery to me though ) = Piss off AGL.

Don't waste your money on an electric car, if you charge it you are back to burning coal or gas.

 

[Yawkey way]

That's probably a sane way to look at it. He's there regardless and getting worked up about him won't do anyone any good. He's making plenty of people who are already very disengaged with politics even more disengaged. It's interesting times, like everyone he probably has some good and bad elements, the bad are that he's making a few decisions that could accelerate the decline of the US as the world economy and give China a free run at it.

He could be the end of the empire figure or he might just be another in a long line of US power brokers that are reaping money from pillaging other economies. The world's wealth divide has been opening up for a long time and Trump certainly didn't cause it. I think he's probably done very little to improve it though.

On renewables, the governments have failed to encourage investment and now have a situation where coal fired power stations are all ready for decommissioning and it's not worth building new infrastructure that will be phased out quickly but we failed to build the renewables up to a point where they could carry much more of the load. I have a friend that was working for a company that built turbines and they were sent out of business waiting for the governments to legislate. He now works for a traditional energy company so I get lots of information on the ridiculousness of politics interfering with energy production.

Yes it's one of those times I think when people can sense change on the wind.

You know we can't just keep going on like this and several historical indicators are there to suggest we're overdue.

What will be the catalyst, who knows.

Yeah power generation and supply has become a bad joke, someone's making a pile of cash.

Strange fact if true, I saw a show that said the cost in carbon to produce a wind turbine from start to scratch producing power including concrete base etc exceeded any saving over the normal working life of a turbine.

So the ugly things are a carbon producer over there life.

Seems criminal that we haven't costed gas turbine, clean coal and nuclear, especially given our resources.

Forty foot tides in some remote parts of the country, probably not cost effective. We can't keep shoe horning people in at this rate and do nothing.

I know we'll build an nbn.

 

[gringo2011]

Yes it's one of those times I think when people can sense change on the wind.

You know we can't just keep going on like this and several historical indicators are there to suggest we're overdue.

What will be the catalyst, who knows.

Yeah power generation and supply has become a bad joke, someone's making a pile of cash.

Strange fact if true, I saw a show that said the cost in carbon to produce a wind turbine from start to scratch producing power including concrete base etc exceeded any saving over the normal working life of a turbine.

So the ugly things are a carbon producer over there life.

Seems criminal that we haven't costed gas turbine, clean coal and nuclear, especially given our resources.

Forty foot tides in some remote parts of the country, probably not cost effective. We can't keep shoe horning people in at this rate and do nothing.

I know we'll build an nbn.

I think that carbon thing for the turbines was a scam.

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-true-th...ubstituting-wind-power-for-carbon-based-power

 

[gringo2011]

Yes it's one of those times I think when people can sense change on the wind.

You know we can't just keep going on like this and several historical indicators are there to suggest we're overdue.

What will be the catalyst, who knows.

Yeah power generation and supply has become a bad joke, someone's making a pile of cash.

Strange fact if true, I saw a show that said the cost in carbon to produce a wind turbine from start to scratch producing power including concrete base etc exceeded any saving over the normal working life of a turbine.

So the ugly things are a carbon producer over there life.

Seems criminal that we haven't costed gas turbine, clean coal and nuclear, especially given our resources.

Forty foot tides in some remote parts of the country, probably not cost effective. We can't keep shoe horning people in at this rate and do nothing.

I know we'll build an nbn.

We have a family friend who was until recently at KPMG as a senior partner. He was talking to me about how insane the politicians failing to tax and legislate gas policy in Australia. It looks like corruption. It's cheaper for us to buy Australian gas retail in Japan that was extracted in Australia, than it is to buy it wholesale in Australia. They refuse to legislate still and say it's up to the companies to set the price and that competition will send prices down.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Yes it's one of those times I think when people can sense change on the wind.

You know we can't just keep going on like this and several historical indicators are there to suggest we're overdue.

What will be the catalyst, who knows.

Yeah power generation and supply has become a bad joke, someone's making a pile of cash.

Strange fact if true, I saw a show that said the cost in carbon to produce a wind turbine from start to scratch producing power including concrete base etc exceeded any saving over the normal working life of a turbine.

So the ugly things are a carbon producer over there life.

Seems criminal that we haven't costed gas turbine, clean coal and nuclear, especially given our resources.

Forty foot tides in some remote parts of the country, probably not cost effective. We can't keep shoe horning people in at this rate and do nothing.

I know we'll build an nbn.

you might need to fact check there ... the wind turbine story is not factual ..
the fact is renewable energy stands to make a lot of very rich and powerful people loose a lot of money and power thats why its not effective at the moment ...

you coments before about the greens is a pretty outdated view as well , those days of the greens being a one trick pony are behind them yes they are idealistic but hey maybe the world needs a bit of idealism something to give hope instead our using fear to maintain power ??

 

[Yawkey way]

We have a family friend who was until recently at KPMG as a senior partner. He was talking to me about how insane the politicians failing to tax and legislate gas policy in Australia. It looks like corruption. It's cheaper for us to buy Australian gas retail in Japan that was extracted in Australia, than it is to buy it wholesale in Australia. They refuse to legislate still and say it's up to the companies to set the price and that competition will send prices down.

Well there you go that was interesting reading, I saw that ages ago and didn't really bother as they were a non starter back then.

Yeah this country has been worked over for so long its a joke. Every time someone suggests a change out comes the boogy man of sovereign risk.

 

[Yawkey way]

you might need to fact check there ... the wind turbine story is not factual ..
the fact is renewable energy stands to make a lot of very rich and powerful people loose a lot of money and power thats why its not effective at the moment ...

you coments before about the greens is a pretty outdated view as well , those days of the greens being a one trick pony are behind them yes they are idealistic but hey maybe the world needs a bit of idealism something to give hope instead our using fear to maintain power ??

Yes it was an interesting read, you will note that I said if true because I hadn't checked it.

I can't agree on the greens they are bad news here from local council up. I admire a bit of idealism but it just borders on dishonest sometimes the rubbish I hear.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Well there you go that was interesting reading, I saw that ages ago and didn't really bother as they were a non starter back then.

Yeah this country has been worked over for so long its a joke. Every time someone suggests a change out comes the boogy man of sovereign risk.

This is where i think its funny how people in Australia bag out Trump.
At least he's representing the needs of the USA.
Here we are wanting cheaper gas, and it seems like we are screaming out, "won't someone think of the poor Japanese "

 

[SaintsSeptember]

That's probably a sane way to look at it. He's there regardless and getting worked up about him won't do anyone any good. He's making plenty of people who are already very disengaged with politics even more disengaged. It's interesting times, like everyone he probably has some good and bad elements, the bad are that he's making a few decisions that could accelerate the decline of the US as the world economy and give China a free run at it.

He could be the end of the empire figure or he might just be another in a long line of US power brokers that are reaping money from pillaging other economies. The world's wealth divide has been opening up for a long time and Trump certainly didn't cause it. I think he's probably done very little to improve it though.

On renewables, the governments have failed to encourage investment and now have a situation where coal fired power stations are all ready for decommissioning and it's not worth building new infrastructure that will be phased out quickly but we failed to build the renewables up to a point where they could carry much more of the load. I have a friend that was working for a company that built turbines and they were sent out of business waiting for the governments to legislate. He now works for a traditional energy company so I get lots of information on the ridiculousness of politics interfering with energy production.

Decades ago it had been observed that privatisation of California's energy had resulted in less "Capital Intensive Large Scale, but Efficient ( from a cost per kw of view ) " power stations, and more of the cheap to build, but expensive to produce electricity, gas turbines.
We are still in the process of copying them.

The burning issue is that if we want reliable power and to use wind or solar, we need to capitalise and maintain 2 power stations.
1: Solar / Wind power stations.
2: A power station that can sit there doing nothing until that day when its raining and the wind aint blowing.
( Sorry Elron your oversized powerwall is still stuff all capacity in the scheme of things).

Properly utilised Hydro could potentially go towards this. Ie ... don't use your hydro power until the day the wind isn't blowing.

 

[mightymalaka]

This is where i think its funny how people in Australia bag out Trump.
At least he's representing the needs of the USA.
Here we are wanting cheaper gas, and it seems like we are screaming out, "won't someone think of the poor Japanese "

Representing the needs of the USA?

Surely you are taking the piss!

 

[VDS66]

Both sides of politics in the pockets of the elite who fund them to maintain the status quo and protect their interests.

Democracy is a myth my friends.

Divide and conquer. Keep the workers in their place and give them just enough to keep them happy... And put the fear of God into them to stop them getting organised.

I am i talking BS? Have a look at global inequality... Have a look at how few control over 90% of the wealth.

Neo Liberal ideology and trickle down economics has failed us.

It's no coincidence that the best countries to live in have a leaning towards leftist policies and a strong social safety net.

Dont let an over inflated property market fool you into believing you're getting ahead...

 

[mightymalaka]

Both sides of politics in the pockets of the elite who fund them to maintain the status quo and protect their interests.

Democracy is a myth my friends.

Divide and conquer. Keep the workers in their place and give them just enough to keep them happy... And put the fear of God into them to stop them getting organised.

I am i talking BS? Have a look at global inequality... Have a look at how few control over 90% of the wealth.

Neo Liberal ideology and trickle down economics has failed us.

It's no coincidence that the best countries to live in have a leaning towards leftist policies and a strong social safety net.

Dont let an over inflated property market fool you into believing you're getting ahead...

Bang!

And that IS the way things are!

Sadly...

 

[Yawkey way]

This is where i think its funny how people in Australia bag out Trump.
At least he's representing the needs of the USA.
Here we are wanting cheaper gas, and it seems like we are screaming out, "won't someone think of the poor Japanese "

Exactly they are our elected representatives.

Now they have to do some juggling no doubt but essentially these resources should deliver massive benefits to Australians.

Instead they deliver profits to god knows who, outrageous prices to us and cheap gas to Japan.

Now call me stupid but there's something wrong with that picture.

 

[gringo2011]

Decades ago it had been observed that privatisation of California's energy had resulted in less "Capital Intensive Large Scale, but Efficient ( from a cost per kw of view ) " power stations, and more of the cheap to build, but expensive to produce electricity, gas turbines.
We are still in the process of copying them.

The burning issue is that if we want reliable power and to use wind or solar, we need to capitalise and maintain 2 power stations.
1: Solar / Wind power stations.
2: A power station that can sit there doing nothing until that day when its raining and the wind aint blowing.
( Sorry Elron your oversized powerwall is still stuff all capacity in the scheme of things).

Properly utilised Hydro could potentially go towards this. Ie ... don't use your hydro power until the day the wind isn't blowing.

I actually know another guy who is in energy, he's from New York and he does hydro power overseas. He's had a heap of them cancelled last minute in the last decade. He had a few scheduled in SE Asia that collapsed after sinking lots of money into them. Hydro is actually pretty bad for ecosystems and isn't that great either. He's done a lot of work in ground heat recapture that generates power as well, again not ideal. there are lots of ways to generate power. Gas is ideal because it's low carbon. Unfortunately we support the people who extract gas by not taxing it so giving it away free then buying it back for massive overs. If people knew what was going on they'd rip down the walls.

Having a minimum amount of gas held for local generation and then any extra sold off would be ideal. Then we run our baseload from gas and if we'd put in much more solar and wind and we have all we need. Some legislation deficiencies here are absolutely disgraceful. Look at what Qatar will earn from their gas compared to us. It's embarrassing. Governments have ben bringing in mass immigration to get house prices up and prolong growth. It's a ponzi scheme though and at some point we will run our infrastructure down and private enterprise won't build it. The government will....which means us. I'm not anti immigration just anti stupidity and our governments are good at cooking the books.


https://www.smh.com.au/politics/fed...hore-gas-wealth-is-going-20161009-gryaoi.html

 

[Yawkey way]

Both sides of politics in the pockets of the elite who fund them to maintain the status quo and protect their interests.

Democracy is a myth my friends.

Divide and conquer. Keep the workers in their place and give them just enough to keep them happy... And put the fear of God into them to stop them getting organised.

I am i talking BS? Have a look at global inequality... Have a look at how few control over 90% of the wealth.

Neo Liberal ideology and trickle down economics has failed us.

It's no coincidence that the best countries to live in have a leaning towards leftist policies and a strong social safety net.

Dont let an over inflated property market fool you into believing you're getting ahead...

The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate,
God made them high and lowly,
And ordered their estate.

All things bright and beautiful.

Cecil Frances Alexander 1848.

My dad used to say that unless you had serious intergenerational wealth you were a fool to vote Republican/liberal.

He said that generally none of them cared except when their interests aligned with yours but workers got a better deal under dems/labor.

His definition of a worker as you can see was fairly broad but also quite accurate IMO.

I can't see how much has changed.

 

[gringo2011]

Both sides of politics in the pockets of the elite who fund them to maintain the status quo and protect their interests.

Democracy is a myth my friends.

Divide and conquer. Keep the workers in their place and give them just enough to keep them happy... And put the fear of God into them to stop them getting organised.

I am i talking BS? Have a look at global inequality... Have a look at how few control over 90% of the wealth.

Neo Liberal ideology and trickle down economics has failed us.

It's no coincidence that the best countries to live in have a leaning towards leftist policies and a strong social safety net.

Dont let an over inflated property market fool you into believing you're getting ahead...

My wife was listening to Yiannis Varofakis on a pod cast with Russell Brand so I bought her his book on his dealings with the EU elites. Pretty depressing reading. The America guy I now who's in power generation has worked for the world bank and met the Clinton's on several occasions. He's pretty cynical about politics after seeing it up close, still is a lefty and a fan of Bernie Sanders though.

Major parties are pretty much running on rails. One is horrifically against people's interests and the other is more discretely working against our interests. The Greens are shit because they are special interest zealots and most of our independents are awful. I say that knowing a few politicians and a few are definitely working in the public interest but are hand tied because they follow the parties decision makers.

People like Sanders and Corbin mean well but are hamstrung by their parties.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Highlight one - I am sticking with facts of what the Trump administration has done. I'm also aware of the past misconduct of both America and my own country, but I'm not responsible for it, any more than Germans born post 1945 are responsible for the Nazis. America, as today's major global power has supplanted Britain as the pre-eminent 'policeman ( and sometimes criminal, sadly) of the world'. As a Briton I still have the right to criticise any government, including my own, which I often do at the moment.

Highlight two - I'm a member of the Green Party here and am very proud of it.

Highlight three - regardless of sources (and The Guardian is a very good one) there have been children in cages and there are presently 2300 forcibly removed from their parents. That's child abuse. You can't just pull a Trump and try to make the problem disappear by screaming 'fake news'.

Highlight four - England now also has student loans (university education remains free in Scotland) but they are capped and not as prohibitively expensive as the American system. Social mobility is a thing of the past for millions in America and also here in the UK, as we also embraced neo-liberalism in a way much of Europe did not. America is on a faster track towards feudalism, but we in the UK seem to mimic their actions and Brexit will accelerate that.

Highlight five - I do fact check and, for example, don't just swallow the right wing propaganda which dominates the British press and discourse - Mail, Express, Telegraph, Times, Sun, Star. Their lies about Brexit and the EU, for example, were the shabbiest form of politics. As Socrates said, 'challenge everything'.

Highlight six - Lower unemployment in America. Much of that is the lag effect of the Obama administration, but even that is very misleading. Millions of Americans aren't counted in the unemployment figures because they've dropped out of the labour market completely, after being removed from welfare. Also, what type of jobs are they - are they well paid and secure or are they temporary/seasonal with no benefits? This begs the far deeper question of what is the purpose of work and a meaningful life, which political philosophers used to regularly ponder but which seems to have disappeared completely from the discourse.

Highlight seven - I won't need four years to understand what an incompetent, venal individual Trump is, nor the domestic and international damage his administration is doing e.g. massive tax cut for the top 1 per cent, to be paid for by enormous spending cuts. Reaganomics revisited. Trump analysed by a top REPUBLICAN just this week: borderline evil.







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Just one note. Please don't confuse the Greens where you are with the Greens in Australia. ( or any other political party for that matter ). They have a similar name.
Maybe they both like to wear the glasses with the plain glass lenses i don't know, but they are NOT the same.

 

[gringo2011]

The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate,
God made them high and lowly,
And ordered their estate.

All things bright and beautiful.

Cecil Frances Alexander 1848.

My dad used to say that unless you had serious intergenerational wealth you were a fool to vote Republican/liberal.

He said that generally none of them cared except when their interests aligned with yours but workers got a better deal under dems/labor.

His definition of a worker as you can see was fairly broad but also quite accurate IMO.

I can't see how much has changed.

My family had intergeneration wealth and wasted it, now I'm firmly on the left. Says it all really. If I need a meal ticket I'm jumping off the campaigners with the cash, they like to keep it.

 

[CursingFijian]

Oh please you are just taking the mickey.

The British pontificating on slavery, the interference in other countries affairs etc.

People would do well to examine their colonial past and role the British and others played in the old league of nations.

British did a good job in Fiji. Not perfect but they demonstrated a real desire to learn from past mistakes with other colonies and implement a more caring policy. On the whole we are grateful for their contribution to our nation.

 

[CursingFijian]

Yes it's one of those times I think when people can sense change on the wind.

You know we can't just keep going on like this and several historical indicators are there to suggest we're overdue.

What will be the catalyst, who knows.

Yeah power generation and supply has become a bad joke, someone's making a pile of cash.

Strange fact if true, I saw a show that said the cost in carbon to produce a wind turbine from start to scratch producing power including concrete base etc exceeded any saving over the normal working life of a turbine.

So the ugly things are a carbon producer over there life.

Seems criminal that we haven't costed gas turbine, clean coal and nuclear, especially given our resources.

Forty foot tides in some remote parts of the country, probably not cost effective. We can't keep shoe horning people in at this rate and do nothing.

I know we'll build an nbn.

What about future turbines built with the energy of the first turbine?


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