Autopsy Round 02 Swans defeated by Hawthorn

[SwansProudly]

A hard fought contest against the Hawks at the MCG but we go down by 17-points.

 

[troyjones2525]

We need to play Mills in the midfield now that Errol is out. We dont have many decent rotation players as it is, so losing him really kills us in that area. Why not play Serong in the position I thought we recruited him for, as an intercepting defender to release Mills? He was a B&F player in the VFL for 2 years straight in that role from what I believe, so train him there over the next fortnight and ease him in against WC and let Mills loose as a midfielder again, God knows, Chad and Juzzy showed they need the help...

 

[ashep]

Heeney and Gulden would have absolutely feasted at Grundy's feet given the way he was dominating the ruck contest. Frustrating that we didn't get Warner and perhaps Papley in there. Sheldrick and Rowy are better at locking the ball in but the way Grundy was getting first use was begging for our smalls to get on the move.

There are no excuses, but given the way the game went, I think with either of those boys playing tonight, we win.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

Certainly not a disaster, even though every loss feels disappointing.

For me, the biggest issue was our inability to compete in the air. I thought our tall forwards were thrashed - both inside 50 & when we were forced down the line.

Curnow - poor
Armatey - poor
Logan - just ok-ish

Wicks’ brain explosions didn’t help.
JJ seems to have lost his purpose.

And I felt sorry for Cleary. Cox kept him benched for the entire Q1 & when he finally got on, he performed like a player who knew his coach lacked faith.

Ultimately, it was a 6/10 type performance.

The jury remains out on the “no Errol, no Swans” theory.

 

[Jack Lord]

Teams are still trying to hold back their 23rd player and inject them as a sort of explosive sub option. As others have suggested, we need a second ruck ... not some sort of game changing wonder sub.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Our two outs would have crippled any other team, we did well considering. In the end, home team and home ground got the win.

Can't fault effort.

We have issues but those two outs are arguably both top 10 in the league.

 

[The King!]

Felt like we made the mcg look huge

 

[mcs095]

Strange game.

We got absolutely reamed by the umpires. It may have been a very different contest late had we had a reasonable run of umpiring earlier in the second half. And missing blatant calls like that Ginnivan one near the end is absolutely infuriating - it isn't hard to get simple ones like that right. It isn't good enough. If it was the other way round, the Royal Commission would already have been appointed. The 5 minutes of dribbling on after the 50 goal for McDonald shows just how one way the views can be. Yes it may have been touched, but the 50 was absolutely there once the call was made. Yet for the next 5 minutes, the Channel 7 team were having a wank competition to see who could make the bigger crap on about it. Yet outside of idiot Cornes, the rest of the commentators barely wanted to mention how horrendous that Ginnivan call was. And that's all before the multiple calls missed all night, the two versions of the HTB rule that seemed to be in play, and the return of the 2012 version of the handball for the Hawks - anything goes it seems.

But all in all, we should have been beaten by a fair bit more too. They wasted some good chances, and should actually be concerned by how many chances they needed to create to win that game by effectively a couple of kicks. I thought our defence held up stoically in the face of immense pressure, our midfield was bog average, and our forward line had horrendous service all night (outside those few bursts) - so to be as close as we were comes with both some good signs and some warning signs.

Gosh I do worry about our depth however. Cleary was anonymous, and Corey Warner got a decent amount of it, but his disposal going forward was woeful. Burnt 3 or 4 great chances for goal in the first half that meant we didn't take as much advantage of our momentum as we might have. We looked lost going forward without Gulden and Heeney, and we could have 5 prime form Pluggers down front and they won't kick goals if that is how we are going to kick it in there most of the night.

We were also very fumbly under pressure tonight I feel - which is another huge warning sign. I love how we are trying to play, and I've seen nothing in the first 3 weeks to temper my view that our 'best' footy is only going to be matched by the very best teams. But equally, there isn't near enough evidence to suggest that we can achieve enough of it against really good teams to win the big games.

It is only early in the season and a long way to go - and there was a lot to take from tonight that we can build on. But there are clear warning signs that unless we have a miracle run injury wise (from here), that we don't currently have the depth to challenge for a flag. It may well change - things develop a lot across a season. But it wasn't encouraging tonight.

 

[Kbroome]

Edwards you can’t be serious! Lloyd was fine by the way. Did his job.

Lloyd 6 turnovers from 19 disposals and was so horrific defensively. If you can't see that he was a net neutral if not a negative in a "good" game then thats on you.

Lloyd's best games have now become when he sneaks into the top 15 players for the Swans and it has tipped over to the point that I would rather a rookie play and go through some of that pain because they can produce a top 5 perform every so often.

Also we need some height in the backline to defend some of the forwards in the league because our defenders are tiny just like the rest of the bloody team

 

[caesar88]

A bit of a shellacking really. It's hard to think it an honourable loss when the opposition must've had about 15 more scoring shots than us.

Earlier in the week Dean Cox

Dean Cox

Age

44

Ht

203cm

Wt

107kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.9

4star

K

8.9

3star

HB

6.9

4star

M

5.3

5star

T

1.5

3star

G

0.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

13.0

4star

K

5.8

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

1.4

4star

G

0.0

1star

said that we needed to be system-based and he thought we had the system and he backed us in. But really, what is the system? It's just run and gun. It's been that way for years. Things like effort and defence haven't been valued at this club for too long, so it's not surprising we look rudderless whenever we have to activate any of these aspects of the game instead of just running and kicking to uncontested targets.

I thought Grundy was good. Serong is impressive. The rest... every portion of the ground was dysfunctional really, and that's the disappointing thing. The media will latch onto the "no Gulden & Heeney" thing, but they don't make a lick of difference to whether our defenders have any composure with the ball deep in defence or not, or whether our talls compete in contests ahead of the ball or not. That's the most disappointing thing. All three parts of the ground felt very underwhelming tonight.

Onto the next one.

 

[melbournehammer]

overall a fairly even team effort. Which is a bit of a pit because many of our best players on paper were all down. McCartin, Rowbottom, Curnow.

Grundy continues to be beaten in the air and to win on the ground. He fought hard all game.

Chad was knackered by the end. Could barely muster a gallop in either direction. Same with Rowbottom. Maybe the lack of faith in the second tier was really evident in not spelling the two in the middle.

Our left footers coming out of defence all went to left centre wing and turned it over repeatedly. Partly their fault mostly our lack of presence at centre wing. Our main avenue of exiting the ball successfully was actually a little dinky handpass to the middle of our defensive fifty and then running. If we cant get more help on the wings we are going to need more pace and run because without gulden as well we really only have mcinerney who can run games out.

Our depth is poor. Corey started well but like a lot of almost players when he makes an error the head drops and he disappears. Playing him against sicily was a brainless move. I think Cleary should be given more of a run in the middle. SHeldrick played his first game where i genuinely thought he was in our top half dozen so kudos.

Curnow had a good first quarter - a lot of soft drops and the ball ending with ground level players able to compete. After quarter time i think there was just too much space between forwards and mids and we never looked likely to use him successfully. McDonald kicked three but they were essentially three that hayward would also have kicked. Hes got to mark some of those balls where he is being marked by ginnivan or hardwick (by the way ginnivan is a straight out cheat - he is now reoutinely grabbing the arm if the defender as a way of showing umpires he is being held p- when he is doing the holding. I hate everything about the guy because it would be nice if he didnt get half of his contest possessions from free kicks

Overall Im not disappointed - I didnt expect to win but i think theres a lot of work that needs to be done if curnows contract doesnt end up being a millstone. as i said at the time i really wish wed gone for petracca because i think footy is actually made for the medium sized player not the tall, so wed better start working out to use him quickly

 

[Big Blood]

Smashed in the last quarter. Out on our feet. 58 to 108 disposals. Contesteds down by 14. If you play off a five-day break you shouldn't have to travel.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Felt like we made the mcg look huge

We lost the outside play badly

 

[Bonz]

Gulden, Heeney, Cunningham and Campbell are all best 23 players for us and out of the side.

5 day break, with travel against a potential top 4 side this year.

To be right in it to the end is a fantastic effort, I'm not concerned about this loss at all.

Felt like we stopped attacking the middle as we got tired, so that will be something to work on.

 

[The King!]

Rowbottom is such a limited player, just a professional tackler , and half those don't stick . Get him out of the middle, can see why they wanted to trade him.

Forward half pressure would be a good role

 

[The King!]

Rosas jr - not sold yet

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Lloyd 6 turnovers from 19 disposals and was so horrific defensively. If you can't see that he was a net neutral if not a negative in a "good" game then thats on you.

Lloyd's best games have now become when he sneaks into the top 15 players for the Swans and it has tipped over to the point that I would rather a rookie play and go through some of that pain because they can produce a top 5 perform every so often.

Also we need some height in the backline to defend some of the forwards in the league because our defenders are tiny just like the rest of the bloody team

Again we don’t the next game so no we don’t need “height”. Play the game each week and select accordingly. Edwards isn’t close to being ready. You are pushing playing a guy that’s not ready.

Lloyd being neutral was sure better than Rowbottom at least around a few others too

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Rosas jr - not sold yet

Pressured well just didn’t get the goal opportunities

 

[killablood]

We need more from Rowy, he needed to stand up tonight with our two big outs. Tackled his guts out after the poor one he missed early but he needed to get the ball.
I think you can throw Jordan into the same basket. If he isn't tagging is he doing enough?
Hopping into Cleary and Co Warner but do we really expect much from them? Chad needs some Fn grippo.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Rowbottom is such a limited player, just a professional tackler , and half those don't stick . Get him out of the middle, can see why they wanted to trade him.

Forward half pressure would be a good role

I can see why Cox wanted to try him at half forward. Having a full mid barely getting it 15 times is a massive issue

 

[Maddo11]

Lloyd 6 turnovers from 19 disposals and was so horrific defensively. If you can't see that he was a net neutral if not a negative in a "good" game then thats on you.

Lloyd's best games have now become when he sneaks into the top 15 players for the Swans and it has tipped over to the point that I would rather a rookie play and go through some of that pain because they can produce a top 5 perform every so often.

Also we need some height in the backline to defend some of the forwards in the league because our defenders are tiny just like the rest of the bloody team

Lloyd was wearing brown and gold and kicking it straight to Sicily and Barrass every single time.

The kids can learn, but Lloyd should already know better. The game has gone past him unfortunately

 

[LukeParkerno1]

We need more from Rowy, he needed to stand up tonight with our two big outs. Tackled his guts out after the poor one he missed early but he needed to get the ball.
I think you can throw Jordan into the same basket. If he isn't tagging is he doing enough?
Hopping into Cleary and Co Warner but do we really expect much from them? Chad needs some Fn grippo.

Jordan was better than Rowbottom not that the bar is set high there. Both need to be way better

 

[The King!]

Pressured well just didn’t get the goal opportunities

You forget he’s playing

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Strange game.

We got absolutely reamed by the umpires. It may have been a very different contest late had we had a reasonable run of umpiring earlier in the second half. And missing blatant calls like that Ginnivan one near the end is absolutely infuriating - it isn't hard to get simple ones like that right. It isn't good enough. If it was the other way round, the Royal Commission would already have been appointed. The 5 minutes of dribbling on after the 50 goal for McDonald shows just how one way the views can be. Yes it may have been touched, but the 50 was absolutely there once the call was made. Yet for the next 5 minutes, the Channel 7 team were having a wank competition to see who could make the bigger crap on about it. Yet outside of idiot Cornes, the rest of the commentators barely wanted to mention how horrendous that Ginnivan call was. And that's all before the multiple calls missed all night, the two versions of the HTB rule that seemed to be in play, and the return of the 2012 version of the handball for the Hawks - anything goes it seems.

But all in all, we should have been beaten by a fair bit more too. They wasted some good chances, and should actually be concerned by how many chances they needed to create to win that game by effectively a couple of kicks. I thought our defence held up stoically in the face of immense pressure, our midfield was bog average, and our forward line had horrendous service all night (outside those few bursts) - so to be as close as we were comes with both some good signs and some warning signs.

Gosh I do worry about our depth however. Cleary was anonymous, and Corey Warner got a decent amount of it, but his disposal going forward was woeful. Burnt 3 or 4 great chances for goal in the first half that meant we didn't take as much advantage of our momentum as we might have. We looked lost going forward without Gulden and Heeney, and we could have 5 prime form Pluggers down front and they won't kick goals if that is how we are going to kick it in there most of the night.

We were also very fumbly under pressure tonight I feel - which is another huge warning sign. I love how we are trying to play, and I've seen nothing in the first 3 weeks to temper my view that our 'best' footy is only going to be matched by the very best teams. But equally, there isn't near enough evidence to suggest that we can achieve enough of it against really good teams to win the big games.

It is only early in the season and a long way to go - and there was a lot to take from tonight that we can build on. But there are clear warning signs that unless we have a miracle run injury wise (from here), that we don't currently have the depth to challenge for a flag. It may well change - things develop a lot across a season. But it wasn't encouraging tonight.

Best to not think about depth and hope that Gulden is the only long term injury

Lost count but i think Gunston had 10 shots at goal? commentary was unwatchable but i cringed through it as sitting in silence is worse lol.

Much to early to get a read of anything definite but the first 3 games are very much the best and worst of 2024

 

[kickthething]

Thought our kick in plays were infuriating, just kept handing possession back every time. Some run and short options would have helped

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Lloyd was wearing brown and gold and kicking it straight to Sicily and Barrass every single time.

The kids can learn, but Lloyd should already know better. The game has gone past him unfortunately

I can’t believe I’m sticking up for Lloyd who I wish we delisted but he was solid, be nice if our half forwards would lead to the ball for once