Autopsy Round 13, 2026: Hawks get leashed

[HedgeFund]

Well, in the setting of a footy field, fans may hope that what they say negatively influences the opposition. Of course it can backfire too. As long as not going against vilification speech (racist, homophobic etc) I have no issue

How is calling someone a weak c*** after they have already won the game going to “negatively influence the opposition?”

They’ve already beaten your team.

Pathetic argument.

 

[Sixpence]

Buddy ol pal.

I wanted a discussion, not an argument. I have zero interest in being correct, just in seeing what people think of our second halves and if there’s a pattern developing from our losses.

An argument is a discussion. You discuss something and make arguments one way or another.

 

[RCAB]

How is calling someone a weak c*** after they have already won the game going to “negatively influence the opposition?”

They’ve already beaten your team.

Pathetic argument.

Forget that poster, they have no clue.

 

[TazHawk15]

I hope that Sammy has told Sicily and Watson to pull their heads in and just play footy.

He hasn't, literally told them the opposite.

Unless you are Sammy Mitchell, how could you possibly know this?

 

[CHUBBSS]

We should be greatful we get these lessons in June, hopefully that means we have time to get many parts of our game right come finals.

Time and time again it all comes down to who has the best form going into finals and not who won the most games in winter.

Every game our biggest issue is generally ourselves, whether coaching, inaccuracy or just not controlling the last few minutes of a quarter with a lead. If we can’t fix this we just go into games always giving the opposition a pretty good chance.

 

[Sixpence]

Hawthorn v Western Bulldogs​

10 Jai Newcombe (HAW)
7 Jarman Impey (HAW)
6 Bailey Dale

31

Bailey Dale

Age

29

Ht

188cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.2

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

5.6

4star

M

3.1

3star

T

1.6

4star

MG

117.4

2star

D

9.0

2star

K

5.1

2star

HB

3.9

3star

M

2.3

2star

T

1.7

3star

MG

117.4

2star

D

8.0

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.4

2star

T

2.0

4star

(WB)
5 Marcus Bontempelli

4

Marcus Bontempelli

Age

30

Ht

194cm

Wt

96kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

22.5

5star

K

12.3

5star

HB

10.3

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

4.8

5star

CL

4.4

5star

D

18.4

4star

K

9.7

4star

HB

8.8

4star

M

2.6

3star

T

4.1

5star

CL

4.0

5star

D

12.0

3star

K

5.8

3star

HB

6.2

4star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.8

5star

CL

1.8

4star

(WB)
1 Michael Sellwood (WB)
1 Josh Ward (HAW)


Michael Selwood gets a vote?! WTF? Wiz torched him in the first half and didn't do anything specifically to curb him in the second half. Khamis and O'Donnell were far more worthy of votes!

Finally, my boy Wardy got a vote! Long overdue.

Nuke BoG from both coaches.

 

[BigTonkaTroy]

Hawthorn v Western Bulldogs​

10 Jai Newcombe (HAW)
7 Jarman Impey (HAW)
6 Bailey Dale (WB)
5 Marcus Bontempelli (WB)
1 Michael Sellwood (WB)
1 Josh Ward (HAW)


Michael Selwood gets a vote?! WTF? Wiz torched him in the first half and didn't do anything specifically to curb him in the second half. Khamis and O'Donnell were far more worthy of votes!

Finally, my boy Wardy got a vote! Long overdue.

Nuke BoG from both coaches.

Except for keeping Watson to 2 touches in a half of footy with 0 touches in the fourth after kicking 3 in the first half. But yeah somehow didn’t do anything to curb him.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

I'm normally quite accepting of a loss, I certainly don't blame umpires, etc. Losing is part of the package and if you can't accept it, then find something else to do. I'm disappointed, but philosophical.

Having said that, there's been one thing gnawing at me since Friday night. It's the way some sections of the media have been carrying on about the Bulldogs' comeback and how "brave" they were. Sorry, but if the Hawks' kicking for goal was a little less pathetic, we should have won that game by 6 goals. Bulldogs didn't win it, we lost it.

As a former goalkicker myself, the one thing that will rattle my cage, make me more annoyed than any dropped mark or umpiring error, is so-called professional footballers missing easy shots at goal. Any time we kick more behinds than goals I become annoyed .... 9 goals, 17 behinds drives me nuts, especially when the opposition has kicked 12 goals, 5 behinds.

People keep telling me how much more professional the contemporary game is and how more skilled players are. Sorry, but I see very little evidence to support that argument.

Rant over.

 

[Sixpence]

Except for keeping Watson to 2 touches in a half of footy with 0 touches in the fourth after kicking 3 in the first half. But yeah somehow didn’t do anything to curb him.

Because he didn't do that at all. We were smashed in the midfield and our forward entries were terrible. Like I said, Khamis and O'Donnell did more to stop us than Selwood did. You're just looking at the stats and deducing that it was because of Selwood rather than looking at what went on in the game.

 

[Crankyhawk]

How is calling someone a weak c*** after they have already won the game going to “negatively influence the opposition?”

They’ve already beaten your team.

Pathetic argument.

Sorry thought it occurred in game.
Yes agree no point post game, unless directed at someone who did say a king hit etc.

 

[Brownbird]

me too because I think we've pissed our whole season away. Our only hope is we finish 3rd and can find a way to beat Sydney in week 1 of finals. We need to make a statement and drop Meek. We have to go for every game now and not rest players who are pretty much fully fit, and we need to learn to kick ****ing straight at goal.

i thought Meek was back to much more like his better self - more possessions more intent and did give himself 3 opportunities to kick goals...... except he missed.

 

[Elhawko]

I'm normally quite accepting of a loss, I certainly don't blame umpires, etc. Losing is part of the package and if you can't accept it, then find something else to do. I'm disappointed, but philosophical.

Having said that, there's been one thing gnawing at me since Friday night. It's the way some sections of the media have been carrying on about the Bulldogs' comeback and how "brave" they were. Sorry, but if the Hawks' kicking for goal was a little less pathetic, we should have won that game by 6 goals. Bulldogs didn't win it, we lost it.

As a former goalkicker myself, the one thing that will rattle my cage, make me more annoyed than any dropped mark or umpiring error, is so-called professional footballers missing easy shots at goal. Any time we kick more behinds than goals I become annoyed .... 9 goals, 17 behinds drives me nuts, especially when the opposition has kicked 12 goals, 5 behinds.

People keep telling me how much more professional the contemporary game is and how more skilled players are. Sorry, but I see very little evidence to support that argument.

Rant over.

I wholeheartedly agree! I can wear most losses with reasonable equanimity but this one is just so hard to swallow. We had so much riding on it and all we had to do was kick 3.9 and three out of bounds rather than 1.11 and three out of bounds and we win. 3.9 and three OOBs is garbage kicking and it still would have been enough.

Between this game and the Pies draw, we had 19 extra shots at goal (not counting OOF) than our opponents and didn't win either game! We should be sitting pretty in the four rather than just hanging on. I've rarely he this frustrated with our team.

The only positive I can salvage is if the players feel as angry as you and me then maybe they'll go up a gear from here on in.

Rant over, also!

 

[ImCheatingToWin]

Have the AFL come out and ticked off the "spoil" on the Lewis mark yet?

 

[kazzooka]

No offence but I certainly hope Sam Mitchell isn't looking at these stats in the same way. Team keeps dominating the stats but with not much in return. That first quarter was a prime example of this problem which has persisted all season. There was complete domination in every stat yet we were only a couple of points up. If Mitchell keeps looking at games in this way he isn't going to be around for much longer.

Looking at it in what way?

These stats point to the clear problem being goal kicking conversion. We had 10 shots that were behinds or no score from positions that should be 80% conversion. That's 8.2 we left out there.

That doesn't even begin to cover the next kick back that we also blew repeatedly.

I don't know how we improve that as a lot of it is mental but practice and consistency is what builds that confidence. Players miss easy shots because they get nervous knowing how embarrassing it would be to miss it, but they actually never practice from those easy locations. If they did, they wouldn't be nervous because they know that they kick goals from there 95/100 times and just do what they always do from there. But you see Chol and Meek missing those easy shots because they are not used to kicking from those easy spots so while conversion is simple as it's close and no angle, they don't have the muscle memory to execute it confidently so do silly stutter steps and stuff before kicking.

 

[kazzooka]

Any team playing without their first choice full forward and first choice full back will struggle when opponents get a run on.

Just disappointed. We threw that away.

Any team with as such a small injury list as our should be expected to cope with only 3 best 23 players out (gunston, barrass, nash)

 

[kazzooka]

If he'd kicked those three goals he'd have had a great game (and yes that is a big if).

It shouldn't be a big if. As an experienced AFL player, kicking all 3 of those shots should be an expectation.

Missing 1 and scoring 2.1 would be forgivable but kicking 0.1 from 3 relatively easy shots is far below the expected standard.

 

[kazzooka]

The interesting part is in the opposition expected score if it is lower than their actual, we made them kick goals from more difficult angles and positions than the scoreline would suggest. But some people struggle with logic.

No, expected score evaluates if the kick is difficult or easy. It's blind spot is pressure on the kick. e.g key moment in a game, or kicks in general play with defensive pressure applied.

But difficulty in kicking location IS factored into expected score.

In it's intended interpretation:
Scoring higher than xscore = better than average conversion.
lower than xscore = worse than average conversion.

Expected score provides more context than just goals, behinds and no score.

You can kick 5.11 and have a +xscore and kick 11.5 and have a -xscore. In the past that's all sides could go off and it was misleading.

 

[ReturningHawk]

An argument is a discussion. You discuss something and make arguments one way or another.

My wife and I had a discussion.

My wife and I had an argument.

Synonyms, are they?

 

[Sixpence]

My wife and I had a discussion.

My wife and I had an argument.

Synonyms, are they?

They can be, yes, depending on the context. If you said "My wife and I had a heated discussion", then you're quite clearly having an argument.

 

[ReturningHawk]

They can be, yes, depending on the context. If you said "My wife and I had a heated discussion", then you're quite clearly having an argument.

That’s a very creative way of saying no.

 

[Sixpence]

That’s a very creative way of saying no.

No, it's a yes.

Whichever way you use the word argument, it's either part of a discussion or it is a discussion. Every argument is a discussion, but not every discussion is an argument.

 

[ReturningHawk]

Every argument is a discussion, but not every discussion is an argument.

So when I said I only wanted a discussion - and not an argument - there was in fact nothing at all problematic about that statement. Got there in the end.

 

[Sixpence]

So when I said I only wanted a discussion - and not an argument - there was in fact nothing at all problematic about that statement. Got there in the end.

You still haven't. You've missed Roby's point.

 

[TONYC3163]

We are now arguing about arguing. LOL.

 

[grumbleguts]

No, expected score evaluates if the kick is difficult or easy. It's blind spot is pressure on the kick. e.g key moment in a game, or kicks in general play with defensive pressure applied.

But difficulty in kicking location IS factored into expected score.

In it's intended interpretation:
Scoring higher than xscore = better than average conversion.
lower than xscore = worse than average conversion.

Expected score provides more context than just goals, behinds and no score.

You can kick 5.11 and have a +xscore and kick 11.5 and have a -xscore. In the past that's all sides could go off and it was misleading.

Haha! You said "No" and then described exactly what I was saying, just in better words, because just didn't care enough to elucidate.
All I was trying to say was that the opponents expected score is more interesting to me than our own.