Autopsy Round 23, 2021: St.Kilda v Fremantle

[stavro#4]

What FA compo pick ?

He is referring to Dunstan and Maybe Ross or Billings

 

[CaptainRisky]

He is referring to Dunstan and Maybe Ross or Billings

Yeah but he doesn't even know what pick it would be , if we assed it and got pick say 18-20 you wouldn't give that pick plus pick 19 for the dogs first

 

[The_Snake26]

I understand your point.
But the 3 guys you listed have gone from small forwards to power forwards in the last few years.

that’s a lot less cutting and turning etc. which is what Gresh will be doing a lot of.


a better example is a few of the soccer players who have torn their achilles. Which majority of them get back playing - however there is a considerable lull between return and form.

Pretty sure Achilles come back stronger after they have been surgically repaired. Getting back to his best will be determined by his attitude

 

[stavro#4]

Pretty sure Achilles come back stronger after they have been surgically repaired. Getting back to his best will be determined by his attitude

apparently those that suffer this type of injury have shorter careers.

this isn’t a knee. It’s probably worse.

 

[stavro#4]

Yeah but he doesn't even know what pick it would be , if we assed it and got pick say 18-20 you wouldn't give that pick plus pick 19 for the dogs first

I think assuming it is a late second or early third would be the way to interpret it.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Geez Oscar is a baby giraffe , has to be the most unco footballer i have seen in a long time

 

[CaptainRisky]

I think assuming it is a late second or early third would be the way to interpret it.

I guess that works , would they give us 19 for Battle though ?

 

[BrutThough]

Would pick 19 and a late second early third be worth a 5/6 pick upgrade?

It would just depend on how deep the first round is projected to be.

But based off where our academy players are currently projected, a third round compo pick would be used to bid on them so moving it to improve a first rounder might be something possible without it hurting our overall draft haul.

 

[sammm]

It’s a long time fall out that stems from when he walked out at Carlton and came to us.

Ratten took it really personally because of what Carlton did for Hamill etc.

Hamill thought it would have gotten better over the years and the fact Ratten is more mature now etc.

But apparently this year it’s blown up again and when Hamill made suggestions from a defensive point of view. He was shut down by Ratten time and time again.

oh well

 

[BrutThough]

Yeah but he doesn't even know what pick it would be , if we assed it and got pick say 18-20 you wouldn't give that pick plus pick 19 for the dogs first

IF we got a pick that good, we would be crazy to trade it.

Currently expecting an end of 2nd/3rd round for Dunstan and Ross if they leave.

 

[Saint believer]

So glad to be able to see the saint first hand yesterday to see a great final game for the season. Here are my thoughts on the game...

Freo were faster than us early we defended well but were also aided by their forwards dropping easy marks or kicks to the forwards falling short.

The back group looked really good.

Wilkie was covered his man well and was clever to tap or palm the incoming ball either over the line or to the crumbing defender.
Webster was great early taking great marks and typical run and dash.
Coffield was great in the first half. I was 30 metres from his big tackle in the forward tackle. clever and strong. Took some good marks and some neat passing. On television you forget how close all the players are.
Howard did his job well some great leaps and punches.
Sinclair was super. Clever tough fast and skilled. At one point he thrust his body back into a marking contest to spoil the bigger forward.
Hill was great in the first half both being available for the short pass and making usually really implementing good choices out of the back half that then opened up the forward line. His and Sinclair's dash and passing are critical to the modern game.
Clavarino was good as the third tall defender. Held his space well. defended really well and took some nice marks.

Long did not quite seem up to the standard of others. While he could read the play well, when the ball was there for him he fumbled often. His defensive marking was not that great also.
McKenzie is an interesting one. Let me say he played to his strengths. He ran hard to cover he went in hard to win some contested ball. His delivery of the ball seemed to lack thought but certainly played his roll. His chase of Henry before the Henry goal was fantastic. The bounce of the ball put the Saints defenders out of position but he made up ground and kept the pressure on. he did some good calling out to make sure players were covered at times.

Ross was OK. When he was not rushed he kicked the ball nicely. I just wonder if he is a bit slow to run and respond and a bit low skilled for the saints moving forward.
Bytel still has a lot of work to do and I am not sure if he will make it. He looks strong enough in there but fumbled quite a bit and slow to run and slow to respond to the moment. In fairness to him and Long they have not had that much footy in recent weeks. I wonder whether he has bulked up too much and may benefit from a slight slimming of muscle to become more agile and a bit more pace. I have a feeling that Hird one year bulked up and lots his finesse so maybe a change to running and agility for him in the pre-season may help.

Crouch was good. seemed to have good composure around the ball. is a better hand baller than kick — some times he made the wrong choice sometimes a miss kick.

Butler worked hard. Not sure of his left foot. son one occasion he ran around the back of a pack but used his right which kicked the ball straight across the ground and rolled out of bounds.

Steele was in everything. Pushed around heavily but did not stop. Read the taps really well. only let down for him omg the day was his shots for goal.
Marshal was great. beaten in the tap bu Darcy most of the day but got on top and kicked two goals which made him the more impactful player.

Hunter did his bit for the team.

Higgins is clever and talented. Great vision, strength and movement. A great pick up for the team this year.

Jones was really good in patches.

Hannebery also good in some patches. Great talker out there, which is really important and some of his marks and disposals were first class. Other bits showed he is only recently back in the game.

Membrey was great. So calm, held his marks, reads the play so well and knows how to use the ball.

Byrnes was out on the ground with a staffer and a football at each of the breaks. Came on for the last quarter and showed some real speed and class. Certainly in front of Bytel as the next young mid coming through. I would not be surprised to see a Parish type of improvement to him over the next 2 years.

Kent impressed me. He seems to understand the game well. he is strong over the ball. he is certainly one of the best talkers and directors out there and his best today was A grade. I can see how sometimes hi knows what has to happen but doesn't have the skills but a was quite surprised by his performance.

Leaving the best to last! Wow with Sharman. His running, marking, reading of the play and goal kicking were first class. Should be a deserved winner of a rising star nomination. He possibly could have marked and kicked another in the last but he was so exhausted. he covered so much ground and marked or spoilt in many places. Glad we locked him away for two years.



A really great performance and great way to start preparations for 2022.

 

[stavro#4]

IF we got a pick that good, we would be crazy to trade it.

Currently expecting an end of 2nd/3rd round for Dunstan and Ross if they leave.

Ross just seems so odd.

can you Imagine another club offering him a deal?

 

[BrutThough]

Ross just seems so odd.

can you Imagine another club offering him a deal?

I can't. Maybe someone who needs immediate midfield depth? But I cant work out who it would be.

 

[gringo2011]

apparently those that suffer this type of injury have shorter careers.

this isn’t a knee. It’s probably worse.

I badly tore my ankle playing basketball and had a partial Achilles tear that they suggested I get surgery for which I never did but every time I played afterwards I expected it to snap and never played as freely again. A mate who had the proper snap and roller blind type tear stopped playing all sport afterwards because he just never trusted it again afterwards. I think a heap of it is getting back to 100% trust in your body again.

 

[gringo2011]

I can't. Maybe someone who needs immediate midfield depth? But I cant work out who it would be.

You'd need to find a club that remembers how good his past output was. He was genuinely a high production running mid around 2018 but has been pushed out of the middle. He's a funny type of outside mid that looks like an inside mid. he's been turned into a utility player as favoured mids move in to his turf. For a few years he was right up the top in term of disposal numbers.

His 2020 was his worst year and this year he's playing in low impact roles so looks even worse than he is. He played well in last years finals and is a mature depth player but he's probably a bit wasted as well. I just don't know you'd get enough interest in him and so he probably signs on for a lot less coin.

 

[BrutThough]

You'd need to find a club that remembers how good his past output was. He was genuinely a high production running mid around 2018 but has been pushed out of the middle. He's a funny type of outside mid that looks like an inside mid. he's been turned into a utility player as favoured mids move in to his turf. For a few years he was right up the top in term of disposal numbers.

His 2020 was his worst year and this year he's playing in low impact roles so looks even worse than he is. He played well in last years finals and is a mature depth player but he's probably a bit wasted as well. I just don't know you'd get enough interest in him and so he probably signs on for a lot less coin.

He's a strange one because he is clearly an AFL quality player but he doesn't have that stand out trait to match him with something a club needs.

And I don't see him as that mature player at a rebuilding club either.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

I guess that works , would they give us 19 for Battle though ?

It may work in our favour that there isn't a lot of key position talent in this draft.

If a club is reasonably set for mids but needs a ready to go tall and looks at Battle as someone who could play 100-150 games in a key position then giving up a mid to late 1st isn't beyond the realms of possibility.

 

[malevu]

Still pissy about the Saints pushing them out of a PF all those years ago. Sent him out a loser with a simpleton's grin.

If the Dogs lose next week someone should tell him that since 2017 the Saints have won more finals than they have.

1 zip to us

 

[luca77]

I can't. Maybe someone who needs immediate midfield depth? But I cant work out who it would be.

If he leaves, Ross is either going to be in the 2s as depth at a good club, or a role player at a bottom club, don't you think?
Not sure he'd be keen for the former, so...do North need an experienced role player? (In comes spacey with a pic of an old bugger rolling a d20 in a north guernsey, I know...) Collingwood? Crows?

 

[luca77]

If the Dogs lose next week someone should tell him that since 2017 the Saints have won more finals than they have.

1 zip to us

That's probably the worst advice I've heard in a while

 

[malevu]

Of all the comments on here about possible trades the one I'm dead set against is Battle.

We would be crazy to trade him. The guys just coming into his prime and is a seriously tough unit, something we don't have an abundance of. Sure he's not bedded down a spot in the forward line but that's partly due to our structure down there.

I'm a great believer that you never dump talented players who are struggling forward without first giving them a string of games down back. It's not like we're over burdened with big defenders.

He reminds me of Sam Fisher

Sam Fisher

Age

41

Ht

191cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.3

5star

K

12.3

5star

HB

7.0

4star

M

7.0

5star

T

1.6

4star

MG

220.2

3star

No current season stats available

D

9.0

3star

K

6.6

3star

HB

2.4

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

1.2

3star

who came to us as a forward but couldn't make his mark there. We put him down back and the rest is history.

I've said before that Battle could play like Sicily at the Hawks if we persevered with it. With the same added bonus of being a swingman when required.

In my opinion losing Battle would be another chapter for the Saints poor trading book.

 

[Bill Mohr]

I expect him to be in and out of the side. I think he's going to have some competition next year with new players wanting a run too.

Probably right there, kicked a couple of goals which is more than handy. He got a few games in this year to show us his wares. Byrnes seems to be a player with a bit more composure and might be a better field kick. Hopefully Bytel has a good summer and proves some of us wrong.

 

[Crusty Undies]

A 31 year old Kevin Durant got over his Achilles injury no worries. As did Roughy and Andrew Swallow. I’m sure gresh will be fine as long as he rehabs properly.

And I hate to use more basketball examples but Paul George and Gordon Hayward both had really bad breaks and came back fine. So Pago should be fine, although it may take a him a little while to get his form back.

Season ending injuries aren't career ending injuries in AFL anymore, I think it's taking people quite a while to adjust to that.

 

[Crusty Undies]

Of all the comments on here about possible trades the one I'm dead set against is Battle.

We would be crazy to trade him. The guys just coming into his prime and is a seriously tough unit, something we don't have an abundance of. Sure he's not bedded down a spot in the forward line but that's partly due to our structure down there.

I'm a great believer that you never dump talented players who are struggling forward without first giving them a string of games down back. It's not like we're over burdened with big defenders.

He reminds me of Sam Fisher who came to us as a forward but couldn't make his mark there. We put him down back and the rest is history.

I've said before that Battle could play like Sicily at the Hawks if we persevered with it. With the same added bonus of being a swingman when required.

In my opinion losing Battle would be another chapter for the Saints poor trading book.

I'm still stunned as to why he wasn't getting a game at CHB all year. We tried Frawley and Highmore there ffs but Battle who could've won a rising star award at CHB can't get a look in..? Joyce, Clav, Battle all better options for KPP spots than Frawley this year or Highmore imo.

 

[Crusty Undies]

I understand your point.
But the 3 guys you listed have gone from small forwards to power forwards in the last few years.

that’s a lot less cutting and turning etc. which is what Gresh will be doing a lot of.


a better example is a few of the soccer players who have torn their achilles. Which majority of them get back playing - however there is a considerable lull between return and form.

If you watched KD in the playoffs he was a PF by name only. He could've been a PG the way he moves and wrongfoots defenders. I'd say his achilles is as good as anyones in the NBA.