Preview Round 7 2024 - GWS Giants vs Brisbane Lions, Thursday 25 April, 7.30 pm AEST @ Manuka Oval

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twhowler said:
Don't worry me and my crew are all still going. We are lions fans does that matter? :)

Interesting game. Giants still seem the clear flag faves for me. Taylor was a massive out v Blues. You did seem lacklustre in the midfield.

I suspect Hogan will get the one game ban. Not in it but afl hates the combo of head high with off the ball.

I suspect Greene will get off but it's line ball. Question will be did he at some point decide not to contest the ball?

Anyway who bloody knows.

Assuming giants without Taylor, Hogan, Coniglio.

Lions still without Coleman, Ashcroft, Doedee, Bailey.

Your outs are tricky to manage because they are structural. Neale is pretty proppy too for us.

But i just think you have had a great start to the year aside from the Carlton game. Playing for your coach, great game plan, play attacking footy, and will be a lot more confident than us. Really we have played one genuinely good game all year.

Greene out would give the lions a bit of a look in as the one thing the giants do allow sides to do is score, so if you are missing your two best goal kickers that makes it hard.

As long as one gets off, and especially two, i think right now you are are a better drilled side that should get the job done in the freezing cold.

One interesting factor, can't remember who but i recall an afl player saying that really wet games were actually easier to recover from because they run a lot less. Guess we'll see

Would not be unhappy at all if you won the flag btw. such entertaining footy. more credit should go to that. imagine if every team was coached by ross lyon???
Click to expand...

Everyone is welcome here mate


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
Danny88 said:
Imagine if on GF day teams used the team photo before bounce as an excuse for a loss
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Happy to disagree, but that statement is just silly.

Comparing a traditional, planned photo to being taken aside and posing for a 'fun' photo pre-game is not the same.
 
Id be arguing Greene didn't make high contact. The rule change made in the off season after the Maynard incident, to grade that incident as careless may not apply here also, as it wasn't a smother. So I'd also challenge the grading because this isn't careless, it's a marking contest. He should rightly get off but the backlash if that happens will be insane.
 

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It's just ridiculous. It's a legitimate contest for the ball between two players, both entitled to contest it. Once the two players have taken off in their leap into the air, there's precious little they can do to change their trajectory. Essentially, the MRO (never a fan of GWS, nor especially Toby) wants to hang Toby for deciding to protect himself at the last second from the impending airborne clash.
 
Section226 said:
Happy to disagree, but that statement is just silly.

Comparing a traditional, planned photo to being taken aside and posing for a 'fun' photo pre-game is not the same.
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To think a photo taken hours before a game impacts performance is almost in the realm of conspiracy theories

Wild

We are definitely going to need to disagree
 
Danny88 said:
To think a photo taken hours before a game impacts performance is almost in the realm of conspiracy theories
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Again - if you want to build an argument, stick with facts.

The photo of Tom Green posing in warm-up gear was posted on X at 3.53pm (therefore safe to assume it was posted soon after it was taken).

Game started at 4.35pm.

Not "hours before" as you claim.

Happy to disagree, but please, don't make up facts.

You can make yourself look silly when caught out.
 
Last edited:
Section226 said:
Again - if you want to build an argument, stick with facts.

The photo of Tom Green posing in training gear was posted on X at 3.53pm (therefore safe to assume it was posted soon after it was taken).

Game started at 4.35pm.

Not "hours before" as you claim.

Happy to disagree, but please, don't make up facts.

You can make yourself look silly when caught out.
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It’s not a reasonable assumption at all

If you have worked in social media there are a whole bunch of hoops to go through before posting to represent a company

You wouldn’t be making up facts would you? 😉

Ps I’m done with this conversation
 
www.smh.com.au

Simply not Wright: Why Toby Greene should be cleared

While Toby Greene’s action was right on the edge of acceptable, the bump we saw a month earlier from Peter Wright was different on several fronts.
www.smh.com.au www.smh.com.au

Simply not Wright: Why Toby Greene should be cleared

April 23, 2024 — 5.00am

First, forget that the player who collided with Carlton’s Jordan Boyd was Toby Greene, whose mug shot would have adorned posters for the past decade if AFL had a “most wanted” list.

Consider only the actions of the player, not his identity and reputation. If makes it easier, imagine that it’s Marcus Bontempelli, or Bambi, in Greene’s position.

Then replay the incident, which has been on higher rotation since Saturday than Taylor Swift’s latest offering.

Here’s a shorthand version: Giant veteran Callan Ward boots forward with a half-mongrel punt. Facing the play on the half-forward flank, Toby Greene is in best position to attempt to mark or contest the ball.

But, in that instant as the ball leaves Ward’s boot, Boyd changes the equation. The Carlton player abruptly decides to run with the flight of the ball to impact the contest or even attempt a Jonathan Brown-style mark.

Toby Greene collects Carlton’s Jordan Boyd.
Toby Greene collects Carlton’s Jordan Boyd.Credit: Fox Footy/AFL.com.au

The pair arrive at the aerial contest almost at the same time. In that moment, Greene turns his body in apparent self-protection, the ball actually striking his left shoulder before he collects Boyd, whose eyes have been trained on the footy. Boyd’s actions are beyond courageous.

The close-up replay, which looks a lot worse in slow motion, shows that Toby had his eyes on the ball as he left the ground, before turning to brace for impact.

He collects Boyd high.

Operation free Toby: Giants to fight Greene suspension at tribunal

The pair land. Lachie Cowan remonstrates with Toby by grabbing his jumper, as does Nic Newman. But on the remonstration Richter scale, their objections are only rumbles.

In the commentary, Fox Footy expert Jason Dunstall’s first focus is on Boyd’s “brilliant” bravery. Dunstall then addresses Greene’s efforts. “He chooses to protect himself, his eyes are on the ball when he leaves the ground, but ...”

But it’s going to be looked at by the MRO.

It is an incident right on the edge of acceptable. Greene was contesting the ball in the first instance, but he doesn’t finish his action with his eyes on the ball.

The question that the AFL tribunal must address is whether Greene contested the ball in a reasonable manner.

This column’s view is that if Greene’s actions were just on the side of reasonable, and that the tribunal should acquit him, that the case is too borderline to warrant a suspension and – not least – that Boyd’s reckless courage narrowed Toby’s choices in that second or so.

The odds, however, are against Toby. Most suspensions are upheld, rather than reversed, by the AFL tribunal. Lucky Lion Charlie Cameron was the beneficiary of a superb, Perry Mason-level defence by ex-AFL football boss Adrian Anderson when he overturned a one-match ban for a sling tackle.

Unlike Cameron, Greene cannot expect his good name and character to be factored in to the judgment, either.

Peter Wright’s high bump on Sydney’s Harry Cunningham is the case that has drawn comparison with Greene’s. Both were marking/aerial contests in which one player was collected by the other, with the bumper turning at the point of impact.

The bump from “Two-Metre Peter” was different to Greene’s on a few fronts. The first is the sheer force – evident in Cunningham’s concussion. Essendon coach Brad Scott observed on Monday that the AFL is heavily influenced by outcomes – implicitly, whether a bumpee is knocked out – rather than merely assessing actions on their merits. This is true, given that the grading of “severe” is assured when a player is stretchered off.

Greene’s force was much less than that of Wright and, in my view, he entered the contest with a far more realistic prospect of marking and with much less risk to his opponent.

Further, Wright did not really contest the ball and his eyes did not appear to be as trained on it as Toby’s when he took off. His actions were worse than “careless” – the AFL’s imprecise grading for such incidents.

Greene, conversely, was one or two out of ten on the careless scale, which should be insufficient for a week’s suspension.

Greene’s turn came later in the play and his decision was influenced by Boyd’s insane courage. Toby’s lawyer can contend that Boyd’s actions put Greene in a position where he was entitled to turn his body to protect himself.

This case underscores that the AFL must think carefully about the dangers of aerial contests (which accounted for 42 per cent of known concussions in 2023), mindful that the onus is not entirely on the player in Greene’s position.

Footy’s macho culture lionises running with the flight, as much as Pamplona does running with the bulls. It is a mindset that must change.
Click to expand...
 
What i posted on the Lions site
i think Hogan will lose his appeal.
I think Toby should get off, but it will be 50/50 decision in the end.
Separate post for both

Hogan's charge: Striking - Intentional, Low impact & High contact.

Hogan clearly hit a player behind play in the head area.
Anything behind play is automatically "intentional" so that won't be downgraded.
Low impact - you can't go any lower on the scale.
High - Clearly hit him high with what looks like an open hand.

The delayed Carlton player reaction should not come into discussions, but it will on appeal.
 
I think Green should get off, but it will be a 50/50 decision, i think.

A very recent AFL report into player concussion highlighted most concussions happen in marking contests.
How will the AFL handle this going forward, as they really do want to reduce players concussions.
The players should also want to reduce the incidence of concussion too.

For many years (way back to Brown & Riewoldt MOTY) i have thought that players going back with the flight of the ball, not only put themselves in danger but also their teammates and opposition players.
Commentators and past players and lots of fans always say how brave that action is and shows huge courage.
I believe the players are just stupid and should adjust how they approach that "instant few moments" before putting everyone at risk of injury.
At some stage you need to turn around and have eyes for the ball facing the same direction of where the ball is coming from.
Could just be to get a touch on the ball, this happens a fair bit. Or just not put yourself in that position in the first place.
I am not talking about players coming in from the side.

IMAGE ONE
Green leading out from the forward pocket area facing the ball in the direction it is coming from.
Both players have their eyes on the ball.
IMAGE 2
I believe players need to change their mindset and that Boyd if he still decides to continue must change momentum and turn his back to contest facing the direction of the incoming ball. That action gives both players a fair shot at contesting.
Or, as a lot of players do now, turn and try to get a touch or spoil the ball and not commit to a dangerous mark practice.
However, at this stage both players have lifted off the ground and a collision is inevitable.
IMAGE 3 & 4
Both players momentum has them off the ground and they both brace for impact.
Greens trajectory is in more of an upward direction, he braces, they both close their eyes IMAGE 5 taken from the side and collects Boyd high.
Umpires correctly pays a high free kick as that is what the umpire sees from their position.

Some people will say this MRO report is why the AFL changed the rules in regard to the Maynard incident.
Bur Maynard was running towards a player already in clear possession of the ball. A completely different situation.

IMAGE 1
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IMAGE 2
1713748957596.png

IMAGE 3
1713749403589.png

IMAGE 4
1713749822066.png

IMAGE 5

1713750768333.png
 
The howls of injustice if Toby gets off....

Looking forward to it.

The AFL has really cornered itself. They have to make a hard and fast rule because even if you have eyes on the ball and arms out ready to mark just moments before the ball is within reach, that no longer counts.
 
Section 5 said:
I think Green should get off, but it will be a 50/50 decision, i think.

A very recent AFL report into player concussion highlighted most concussions happen in marking contests.
How will the AFL handle this going forward, as they really do want to reduce players concussions.
The players should also want to reduce the incidence of concussion too.

For many years (way back to Brown & Riewoldt MOTY) i have thought that players going back with the flight of the ball, not only put themselves in danger but also their teammates and opposition players.
Commentators and past players and lots of fans always say how brave that action is and shows huge courage.
I believe the players are just stupid and should adjust how they approach that "instant few moments" before putting everyone at risk of injury.
At some stage you need to turn around and have eyes for the ball facing the same direction of where the ball is coming from.
Could just be to get a touch on the ball, this happens a fair bit. Or just not put yourself in that position in the first place.
I am not talking about players coming in from the side.

IMAGE ONE
Green leading out from the forward pocket area facing the ball in the direction it is coming from.
Both players have their eyes on the ball.
IMAGE 2
I believe players need to change their mindset and that Boyd if he still decides to continue must change momentum and turn his back to contest facing the direction of the incoming ball. That action gives both players a fair shot at contesting.
Or, as a lot of players do now, turn and try to get a touch or spoil the ball and not commit to a dangerous mark practice.
However, at this stage both players have lifted off the ground and a collision is inevitable.
IMAGE 3 & 4
Both players momentum has them off the ground and they both brace for impact.
Greens trajectory is in more of an upward direction, he braces, they both close their eyes IMAGE 5 taken from the side and collects Boyd high.
Umpires correctly pays a high free kick as that is what the umpire sees from their position.

Some people will say this MRO report is why the AFL changed the rules in regard to the Maynard incident.
Bur Maynard was running towards a player already in clear possession of the ball. A completely different situation.

IMAGE 1
1713748827604.png

IMAGE 2
1713748957596.png

IMAGE 3
1713749403589.png

IMAGE 4
1713749822066.png

IMAGE 5

1713750768333.png
Click to expand...
Good analysis. Thanks for posting it here.
 
If Hogan and Greene are both out that leaves us incredibly young up forward

Bedford Riccardi Daniels
Thomas Cadman Brown
Gruz/Darcy
 

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The AFL has to make it a rule:

If you leave the ground and brace, any contact to the head starts at 1 week suspension.

Doesn't matter whether you were going for a mark. Doesn't matter if it was self preservation.

Too much grey at the moment - like many rules in the AFL.

Toby out = narrow win for Brisbane.

Unfortunately.
 
Section 5 said:
I think Green should get off, but it will be a 50/50 decision, i think.

A very recent AFL report into player concussion highlighted most concussions happen in marking contests.
How will the AFL handle this going forward, as they really do want to reduce players concussions.
The players should also want to reduce the incidence of concussion too.

For many years (way back to Brown & Riewoldt MOTY) i have thought that players going back with the flight of the ball, not only put themselves in danger but also their teammates and opposition players.
Commentators and past players and lots of fans always say how brave that action is and shows huge courage.
I believe the players are just stupid and should adjust how they approach that "instant few moments" before putting everyone at risk of injury.
At some stage you need to turn around and have eyes for the ball facing the same direction of where the ball is coming from.
Could just be to get a touch on the ball, this happens a fair bit. Or just not put yourself in that position in the first place.
I am not talking about players coming in from the side.

IMAGE ONE
Green leading out from the forward pocket area facing the ball in the direction it is coming from.
Both players have their eyes on the ball.
IMAGE 2
I believe players need to change their mindset and that Boyd if he still decides to continue must change momentum and turn his back to contest facing the direction of the incoming ball. That action gives both players a fair shot at contesting.
Or, as a lot of players do now, turn and try to get a touch or spoil the ball and not commit to a dangerous mark practice.
However, at this stage both players have lifted off the ground and a collision is inevitable.
IMAGE 3 & 4
Both players momentum has them off the ground and they both brace for impact.
Greens trajectory is in more of an upward direction, he braces, they both close their eyes IMAGE 5 taken from the side and collects Boyd high.
Umpires correctly pays a high free kick as that is what the umpire sees from their position.

Some people will say this MRO report is why the AFL changed the rules in regard to the Maynard incident.
Bur Maynard was running towards a player already in clear possession of the ball. A completely different situation.

IMAGE 1
1713748827604.png

IMAGE 2
1713748957596.png

IMAGE 3
1713749403589.png

IMAGE 4
1713749822066.png

IMAGE 5

1713750768333.png
Click to expand...
I agree with you on both Hogan and Toby.
I think we might be contesting Hogan to improve our chances with Toby
 
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