Small Forwards

[smallfooty]

With Didak, Krakouer and Maccaffer having injury interupted seasons last year the role of small forward was played by others such as Mooney, Elliot, Fasolo and Sinclair....Now that those previously mentioned players are closing in on full fitness who gets the gig for round one?

For mine Elliot has been super impressive in the pre season and must be a red hot chance to start round one as a small forward.....his marking and attack on the defender are first rate as is his goal sense, i think he'll be a great player longterm.
But where does that leave Maccaffer and Fasolo who also play that leading small forward role?

Sinclair is great at applying forward pressure and with coaches more than ever placing importance on that aspect of the game where does that leave guys like Didak and Krakouer who dont have the leg speed to lock rebounding defenders up?

Mooney is still on the rookie list and for mine has a little way to go but he has shown that he has the tools to make the grade in the not too distant future. So thats 7 guys fighting it out for maybe 2 or 3 spots up forward and thats not even mentioning guys like Swan, Goldsack and Sidebottom who might be spending time up that end of the ground in 2013.

Its a great problem to have and shows the depth of the current squad but who do you think deserves first crack at the small forward role in 2013?

 

[Gone Critical]

I think Elliot has push himself up the order esp after his effort v WCE. Took on the game a few times with good dividends, is developing quickly so should start round 1. Krak will play also. Didak wont be match fir so VFL start but should be AFL ready soon after. Sinclair is behind Elliot and Caff had a good 1st NAB round but needs some more good performances to be in round 1. Fas is a lock and will have a big year I reckon. Mooney is the wildcard. Think he may get the final rookie elevation so a possibility

My Guess for round 1 - Elliot, Krak, Fas +/- Caff

 

[Jelly Bean]

It is a great discussion topic, smallfooty.

I think the best mix for our small forwards is Elliott, Krakouer, Fasolo, and Didak.

Elliott - defensive deep forward who is a capable third marking target as well. Probably in main competition for this role with Macaffer and Goldsack. Isn't a great crumber, and doesn't have terrific finishing skills, but I think he is still ahead of Goldy and Caff in these areas.

Krakouer - We need a small forward who can be at the fall of the ball and get possession (rather than just attacking the opposition player who gets that posession) and convert half chances. This role HAS TO be in the mix of small forwards - no point just picking the defensive small forwards. Krakouer is the best at converting (or setting up) goals.

Fasolo - I think he has more of an ability to get involved up the ground than the likes of Sinclair and Mooney, and therefore think he is in the side as a higher small forward around the half forward line. His disposal into the F50 and at goal from long range is a genuine weapon.

Didak - The controversial one, but I have him in the side (when fit). His ability, not only to covert on goal, but to set up our players with his excellent footskills is not to be underrated, and there is still a definite need for him in the side. Can also go a bit higher through a wing and set up our half forward line. Still has a season left in him (fingers crossed).

On the others - I think we will still see a lot of them. Sinclair and Mooney have the defensive side of the game down, but need to work on the offensive component. Sinclair is ahead of Mooney for this. Goldsack and Macaffer are really competing for that third marking option / defensive forward. The challenge for them is that Elliott is probably close to them in terms of marking ability, slightly ahead in terms of defensive ability, and a fair way ahead in terms of his offensive (crumbing and converting) ability, so he takes it at this point.

All in all, I think we have excellent options for these roles, especially if you throw the likes of Kennedy and Broomhead into the mix around half forward as well, as well as the likes of Blair, Sidebottom, and Beams who will get time in the small forward roles throughout the year. Probably one area that we have considerable depth.

 

[Primetime Pricey]

looking fwd to when Kennedy is the number 1 small fwd at the club in 2 years time. Gonna be a beautiful thing

 

[Dale_Thomas]

I think the team for round 1 will have Elliott (fantastic pre-season form), Sinclair (speed, good pressure, and fully fit) and Krakouer (perhaps not 100% fit, but still a great finisher and proven goal scorer) taking up the small forward spots.

Mooney is still a long way off. Don't rate him much personally.

Fasolo, Didak and Macaffer need to play VFL for a few weeks to make sure they are cherry ripe.

 

[Quicky]

There's a lot of love for Elliot and Sinclair right now.

I wonder if their improvement has been great enough to earn them a position in the side?

Our forward line was a basket case last year and I felt their inexperience was a big contributer to that.

I think Elliot is really pushing for a place. I still think Sinclair is a bit off, but suspect the coaches see that differently.

It'll be interesting where Fasolo fits actually. One paces medium type marking forward. I think we might go for a pacier player. He is a goal kicker though.

 

[mattys123]

Interesting topic, because I see our forward line as probably being the area that has to improve most in 2013 for us to take that next step and make the Grand Final again.

Our talls are pretty much covered as long as Cloke stays fit, with Lynch, Paine and even the youngsters in Witts, Ceglar and Gault chances to play up forward at times this year.

Then there's our medium and defensive players, and I put Sinclair, Goldsack and MaCaffer in this category, because all are not just forwards but bring a defensive aspect to the forward line which is much needed by us.

But as this thread suggests, the interesting area is with our smalls, I see Fasolo as a certainty in the best 22 when fit, because I think he's got a future in the midfield, as he showed a little towards the end of last year in that area. Next is Krakouer and Didak, both in the same boat in that if they are fit they just play, which doesn't really leave a lot of room for Jamie Elliott, although with Didak, Paine and Fasolo all unlikely for round 1 at this stage, Elliott may get a berth, and may be hard to displace.

 

[jonbe54]

I'm worried about Dids, he seems to be getting to that stage of his career where his body isn't handling the knocks as well as it used to which shows in more injuries and longer rehab. I love what he brings to the team in that X factor but no amount of X can help if you're mobility is compromised enough to allow you to get caught too often

 

[forwardflanker]

Can't have Didak and Krakouer in the same forwardline imo - you give away to much in defensive pressure and also the physical parts of the game. I'd take Krakouer but also bear in mind that Didak can still play an important role as a midfielder if he can stay fit.

Think Macaffer will be best 22 by the end of the year. Is a good height and size, can take a mark and can crumb which makes him a difficult match up. He should play a similar role for us that Crameri plays for Essendon who I rate as a very good player and really tough match up.

Elliot and Sinclair look to have improved a lot in the preseason and are probably fighting for the same spot. I Hope Fasolo spends more time in the midfield this season, if not he is an auto selection as a forward probably in Macaffers spot although I don't rate his defensive pressure to highly.

 

[SnakePlisskin]

Also with Luke Ball coming back that squeezes more midfielders into those spots as well , Steele , Dale , Dane , Dayne among others.

 

[Knightmare]

The small forward group is that curious group for this year.

I get the sense Sinclair is Buckley's favourite and he'll look to keep him inside the best 22. I can only imagine he is a hard working, high character guy then obviously does those pressure aspects well as a forward though if given the choice isn't someone I would select because even more than Mooney I view him limited.

As the forwards personally I'd be playing:
HF: Alex Fasolo Travis Cloke *Rotational mid
F: Brent Macaffer Quinten Lynch Jamie Elliott
Bench fwd: Mooney (over Krakouer/Sinclair) *Though likely Sinclair plays instead.
Rotation mids: Jarry Blair/Luke Ball/Steele Sidebottom with lesser forward minutes to Beams/Swan/Thomas/Pendles.

Krakouer I'm starting to lose my enthusiasm for despite being our only true crumber and I'm increasingly keen to see what Mooney can do for this team as an instead of Sinclair and Krakouer. These guys are 8/9 years younger and playing the better footballer at this point, so no reason to play a 30 year old first when he's probably not better.

Buckley when talking about the forwards is always in his post match press conferences red hot on the tackling and pressure in that front half. Mooney while clearly still developing in other aspects of his game is the best pure pressure player on our list and one of the best going around at this one aspect of his role. He won't get those same tackle numbers as Elliott who naturally gets to where the ball is, tackling the guy who gets his hands on it but Mooney can strike fear into the opposition and force as many opposition turnovers as anyone and despite it not showing up on the stats sheet it was very evident v West Coast just how much he influenced the game. The more I review that game v West Coast the more I want to see Mooney play alongside Elliott and Macaffer every week as those deeper small/mediums with Fasolo as that high half forward/playmaker.

 

[Gone Critical]

Krakouer I'm starting to lose my enthusiasm for despite being our only true crumber and I'm increasingly keen to see what Mooney can do for this team as an instead of Sinclair and Krakouer. These guys are 8/9 years younger and playing the better footballer at this point, so no reason to play a 30 year old first when he's probably not better.

Unless you know something that's not out in the public why have you gone off Krak. He made a great recovery from an ACL to be important finals player off a limited preperation. He has had 1 NAB game where he didn't play that well but did a few small cameos. How can you say Mooney and Sinclair are playing better when Krak played well in finals matches in his most recent games, There has to be some carry over from 2012.

He is clearly ahead of everyone on our list bar Dids as a goal creator. We need someone on our list doing that and he has always created defensive pressure even if pace isn't a virtue. You are writing him off too soon

 

[mattys123]

As the forwards personally I'd be playing:
HF: Alex Fasolo Travis Cloke *Rotational mid
F: Brent Macaffer Quinten Lynch Jamie Elliott
Bench fwd: Mooney (over Krakouer/Sinclair) *Though likely Sinclair plays instead.
Rotation mids: Jarry Blair/Luke Ball/Steele Sidebottom with lesser forward minutes to Beams/Swan/Thomas/Pendles.

Krakouer I'm starting to lose my enthusiasm for despite being our only true crumber and I'm increasingly keen to see what Mooney can do for this team as an instead of Sinclair and Krakouer. These guys are 8/9 years younger and playing the better footballer at this point, so no reason to play a 30 year old first when he's probably not better.

Buckley when talking about the forwards is always in his post match press conferences red hot on the tackling and pressure in that front half. Mooney while clearly still developing in other aspects of his game is the best pure pressure player on our list and one of the best going around at this one aspect of his role. He won't get those same tackle numbers as Elliott who naturally gets to where the ball is, tackling the guy who gets his hands on it but Mooney can strike fear into the opposition and force as many opposition turnovers as anyone and despite it not showing up on the stats sheet it was very evident v West Coast just how much he influenced the game. The more I review that game v West Coast the more I want to see Mooney play alongside Elliott and Macaffer every week as those deeper small/mediums with Fasolo as that high half forward/playmaker.

I can't agree on Mooney, at least not yet, he isn't up to the finals level of football that we need our best 22 to be at come September, but he may well improve enough to be there. His awareness and "footy smarts" at the moment aren't high enough to be in our best 22, but I agree on his defensive pressure, he is elite already in terms of both tackling and pressuring the ball carrier, does that get him a gig round 1 though? I doubt it, especially if everyone else (small forward wise) is fit and eligible.

 

[Knightmare]

Unless you know something that's not out in the public why have you gone off Krak. He made a great recovery from an ACL to be important finals player off a limited preperation. He has had 1 NAB game where he didn't play that well but did a few small cameos. How can you say Mooney and Sinclair are playing better when Krak played well in finals matches in his most recent games, There has to be some carry over from 2012.

He is clearly ahead of everyone on our list bar Dids as a goal creator. We need someone on our list doing that and he has always created defensive pressure even if pace isn't a virtue. You are writing him off too soon

It depends on what you are looking for in a forward.

Krakouer isn't nearly that same level pressure player as any of Mooney/Sinclair/Elliott/Macaffer.

But then with ball in hand he is that more dangerous and the better crumber of the group so a case can be made for him but looking at just how good our pressure was v West Coast I want more Mooney instead of Krakouer if picking a team for this week. While it's only one aspect of the game Mooney does it at such a high level that he may well better influence winning than Krakouer and it's that, that I'm keen to discover that and want to see it for an extended stretch to give him more than just a taste.

At this stage it's wrong to write anyone off and I'd like to think I'm just more open seeing all of our options before deciding who deserves to be in the team. At this stage I see those final 4-6 positions in the best side open, and one of those positions I view as being open is Krakouer's. With the depth clearly there up forward this year (for the first time in a long time) and with that depth of younger players in that position who may well have improved (Elliott for one certainly seems to have come back a year more mature in his play) so I'm interesting in seeing some different and perhaps unorthodox combinations tried first before settling on a best team. As we saw in 2010 somtimes the younger players just need to be played. Giving young players a stretch of games in an established team has worked out well before and I can see with a number of our younger players that it could work out very well again. No reason why a group of our younger players can't take their games beyond the veterans.

In any case I'd like to see Krakouer on edge at the selection table. Why should he be an automatic inclusion? Everyone should be made to work for their position in the team and Krakouer I don't feel is that far ahead, if indeed he is ahead of that group of young pressure first forwards.

 

[Pendles!]

Fasolo has to be in on a HFF, he is the best of the group. Elliott, Macaffer and Didak also in with probably one starting as the sub.

Not a massive fan of Sinclair as I feel the others are better with their ball use around goal, but I suspect Buckley has other plans.

 

[Knightmare]

I can't agree on Mooney, at least not yet, he isn't up to the finals level of football that we need our best 22 to be at come September, but he may well improve enough to be there. His awareness and "footy smarts" at the moment aren't high enough to be in our best 22, but I agree on his defensive pressure, he is elite already in terms of both tackling and pressuring the ball carrier, does that get him a gig round 1 though? I doubt it, especially if everyone else (small forward wise) is fit and eligible.

And I probably wouldn't expect too many to agree on Mooney either.

I also agree with your analysis of his game. The awareness and footy smarts are absolutely not there at this stage.

Call it an intuitive sense (it may be right, it may be wrong), until proven/disproven it is neither right or wrong but if given a stretch of games I can see Mooney perhaps late season, or perhaps next season take that next step and really become something.

The advantage of giving Mooney that extended taste in the seniors is really getting that clear feel of exactly where he needs to take his game to, to succeed at senior level. Seedsman early late season received that and many of us would say "he wasn't ready" and they would be right. But looking at him now my feel with Seedsman is that being exposed to the pace of senior footy for that extended stretch has really helped him become the player he is looking like this NAB cup and taught him just how far he needs to develop before he can become the player he wants to be. With Mooney being that raw, new to the game product while he may not take that same step it likely in a similar way benefits his football in a big way over the long run to really teach him where he needs to improve and what he needs to do to get there better than playing every week at VFL level against lower level talent.

 

[Quicky]

Krakouer is our best crumber. He is good defensively. This debate around "pressure" seems to refer to pace. There is a need for pace in our forward line. But that doesn't mean there isn't room for a player of Kraks obvious talents, especially considering he is hardly a defensive liability. You just need to get the balance right. He is undoubtedly best 22. Maybe not for round 1, but thats a fitness rather than ability and "fit" issue.

 

[Go_Brad_Dick]

Not a fan of Sinclair. Not interested in him at all. when he learns to compose himself when he has the footy he might be useful but till then he's a liability and far better options available. Elliot is kinda in the same boat as Seedsman, both players had quite a few games last year, and while both showed glimpses of stardom occasionally, neither really made much of an impact. Both look primed to go this year though and it wouldn't surprise me if they cemented top22 spots this year. Krak is a lock. Caff could be, he's a tricky one, his first half of 2010 was ordinary, he finished the season with a bang though and was instrumental in the finals campaign. Since then he's barely played so his reputation is based pretty much on half a season 2years ago.
Fas geez space is running out, hate to see him get dropped but there's only so much save and he might have to sit out occasionally.

 

[SwanBet]

Round 1
HF: A.Fasolo, T.Cloke, J.Elliott
F: A.Krakouer, Q.Lynch, B.Macaffer

would like to see how this forward line goes. Its a little new look, but what i love is that all the players have exceptional hands, elliott and fasolo are so good overhead for little guys, while krak is not shy of a pack mark. Caff is that work horse, who applies pressure and plays as the defensive forward.

Didak is still best 22 when fit, however i think elliott deserves a round 1 spot and if his form continues he will be staying there for a long time. I think its really goldsack vs macaffer for the third tall, maybe goldy will have to go back to defense who knows.
Sinclair has looked better in pre season, but i think is still a little bit down the pecking order in terms of small forwards.

 

[Hagla]

Do you guys think there is room for both Goldy and Macaffer in the same team (both playing forward)? Before seeing any NAB form I was hoping to see Bucks experiment with them both in there but it seems with our smalls looking so good at the moment we might have to go one or the other. Then again Macaffer looked great in NAB round 1 and Goldy looked great as a forward last year so I'd like to at least tinker with the idea of playing them both.

 

[Dale_Thomas]

Round 1
HF: A.Fasolo, T.Cloke, J.Elliott
F: A.Krakouer, Q.Lynch, B.Macaffer

Not sure how Fasolo can make it into the round 1 team despite not playing a pre-season game thus far. With one intra-club game under his belt, I can't see him being chosen above the likes of Sinclair or Mooney.

 

[Jelly Bean]

Do you guys think there is room for both Goldy and Macaffer in the same team (both playing forward)? Before seeing any NAB form I was hoping to see Bucks experiment with them both in there but it seems with our smalls looking so good at the moment we might have to go one or the other. Then again Macaffer looked great in NAB round 1 and Goldy looked great as a forward last year so I'd like to at least tinker with the idea of playing them both.

Only in the situation (like this week) where either Lynch or Cloke are missing.

If Lynch and Cloke are playing, then we can only have one (if any).

 

[ipswichpies]

Great thread and well worth discussing,Lynch and Cloke a must every week that is what the club recruited Lynch for that means we can only have 1 more tall forward option we will not be able to fit both Goldie and Caff in the same team.

I think the same thing may well happen to the smaller forwards they will be rotated on a match to match basis. Really looking at the squad as a whole unit I think unless a players form absolutely mean he cannot be dropped there will only 8 to 10 players who play all games.

Also I think the squeeze will be on over nearly all positions as to who plays this year not just the small forwards.

This is a great situation for the club to be in and I am really looking forward to next season,competition for spots can only make the club stronger.

 

[CLUBMEDhurst]

Fasolo - I think he has more of an ability to get involved up the ground than the likes of Sinclair and Mooney, and therefore think he is in the side as a higher small forward around the half forward line. His disposal into the F50 and at goal from long range is a genuine weapon.

But as this thread suggests, the interesting area is with our smalls, I see Fasolo as a certainty in the best 22 when fit, because I think he's got a future in the midfield, as he showed a little towards the end of last year in that area.

I see Fasolo's longterm future in the midfield, and agree with the above that he showed promise playing high half-forward and through the middle of the ground

 

[speedytiger]

With so many small forwards to pick from any chance one of them will be sent back Leon Davis style? Who would be best suited for that?