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Stats questions

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According to the report of the 1929 semi-final between Collingwood and Richmond every Collingwood player received at least one free kick.
(Seven Collingwood players received 5 free kicks each)

When last did every player in a team get at least one free kick and what has been the frequency of it happening in more recent times if it has?
 
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*Paul* said:
I have 39 instances, the last one in 1993.
http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/games/1993/061619930424.html

Only 8 from 1981 to date.
Click to expand...

Thanks for satisfying my curiosity on that one. The report in 1929 gave no indication that every player in one team receiving a free kick was that unusual, maybe it happened more in the past. A factor at the time of the 1929 match might have been the kicking out of bounds rule at the time which was not limited to just going out on the full. I think around a dozen of Collingwood's frees were from Richmond kicking out of bounds.

Here's another one that might be of interest to all.

Last night, Essendon had 410 to Geelong's 298 disposals yet the final margin was only 4 points and Geelong had more scoring shots. What other games that close have had an over 100 difference in disposals between winner and loser?
 
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RogersResults said:
Thanks for satisfying my curiosity on that one. The report in 1929 gave no indication that every player in one team receiving a free kick was that unusual, maybe it happened more in the past. A factor at the time of the 1929 match might have been the kicking out of bounds rule at the time which was not limited to just going out on the full. I think around a dozen of Collingwood's frees were from Richmond kicking out of bounds.
Click to expand...

It may not have been unusual. In the 1933 GF the frees were 45-37, with all but four players receiving at least one free (Richmond's Ray Martin got 10).
 

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This has probably been asked many times; there is probably even a thread about it. But why does the AFL, in their "Season Guide" statistics books, group the Brisbane Bears and Lions in the same category? They are completely different clubs.
 
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Gibbsy. said:
This has probably been asked many times; there is probably even a thread about it. But why does the AFL, in their "Season Guide" statistics books, group the Brisbane Bears and Lions in the same category? They are completely different clubs.
Click to expand...

You could argue that on a technicality. But the club was essentially the same 'Brisbane', playing out of Brisbane. Marcus Ashcroft (club games record holder) didn't play 152 + 166 games at two different clubs.

Brisbane retained 34 players from its 1996 list and merely swallowed up some of Fitzroy's better players, while others (Pike, Primus, Paxman, Baldwin, Dent, Cummings, Rombotis, Mellington, Cassidy, Manfield, Cook, Warfe, Chandler) were scattered to the four winds.

Obviously, Paul's AFL Tables site considers them separate entities, but I'd be uncomfortable with the official records relecting this.
 
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Thanks for that Ron. It's an interesting proposition.

Here's another question - who was the first 200cm player to play VFL/AFL? Also, which VFL/AFL player had the biggest differential between height and weight?
 
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In the AFL Record Season Guide (2005) they first acknowledge the merger, then state it will be ignored for statistical purposes without giving any further rationale.

The Lions' site is less vague - "So, the Brisbane Lions officially joined the AFL competition in 1997."

So since there was a merger rather than Fitzroy simply just ceasing to be, and the club and AFL acknowledges it, I decided to go that way also.

RogersResults said:
Last night, Essendon had 410 to Geelong's 298 disposals yet the final margin was only 4 points and Geelong had more scoring shots. What other games that close have had an over 100 difference in disposals between winner and loser?
Click to expand...
http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/games/1991/011819910804.html
Deficit of 111 and lost, there's a couple other 100+
 
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Gibbsy. said:
Here's another question - who was the first 200cm player to play VFL/AFL? Also, which VFL/AFL player had the biggest differential between height and weight?
Click to expand...

Not exactly a precise science this, but Len Mills of St Kilda who debuted in 1929 is listed as 203cm

Tony Notte, 2 games for WC in 2008, 194cm & 71kg.

Though he's now listed at the AFL site as 78kgs, so my data might need a bit of a tweak.
 
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McCrann said:
When was the last time St Kilda / any team won a match without scoring in the last quarter?

Surely this doesn't happen often!
Click to expand...

2004 R20, Syd def. Mel. The Demons only kicked 1.0 themselves.
Today's was 77th time, but only 8 in the last 30 years.
 
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*Paul* said:
2004 R20, Syd def. Mel. The Demons only kicked 1.0 themselves.
Today's was 77th time, but only 8 in the last 30 years.
Click to expand...

Kangaroos 1.4 not much better. Can you identify the last time the Saints did this? I'm wondering if I've seen it and forgotten. Certainly don't recall....
 

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Re: Post your stats questions here

*Paul* said:
Not exactly a precise science this, but Len Mills of St Kilda who debuted in 1929 is listed as 203cm

Tony Notte, 2 games for WC in 2008, 194cm & 71kg.

Though he's now listed at the AFL site as 78kgs, so my data might need a bit of a tweak.
Click to expand...

The Bulldogs' Ayce Cordy was listed in 2009 at 202cm/77kg (now 202/99).
 
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*Paul* said:
http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/games/1978/091519780425.html

Very, very strangely the last 14 times it's happened, St Kilda have been involved in 12, on the winning side 6 times.

Happened twice on the same day in 1963
http://stats.rleague.com/afl/seas/1963.html#8
Click to expand...

Cheers - certainly wasn't around then, not a twinkle in the old man's eye. Guess that means I witnessed history tonight then - well that's something to take out of that pathetic last quarter I suppose - and walking home in the rain!
 
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Gibbsy. said:
This has probably been asked many times; there is probably even a thread about it. But why does the AFL, in their "Season Guide" statistics books, group the Brisbane Bears and Lions in the same category? They are completely different clubs.
Click to expand...

Official AFL policy regarding records and statistics is that the Brisbane Bears and Brisbane Lions are the same club with continuous records. Fitzroy as a club ceased in 1996 and the records of the club 1897-1996 are separate from the Brisbane Lions with whom they nominally merged. The Brisbane Lions are 'custodians' of some Fitzroy Football Club memorabilia.

The AFL Record Season Guide as an official AFL publication accordingly treats Brisbane as one continuous entity from 1987.

Some people are of the opinion that the Brisbane Bears went extinct with Fitzroy in 1996 but this is just an opinion not a fact.

The non AFL site most in direct contact with senior AFL statisticians and record keepers, Footystats also deals with Brisbane Bears/Lions as the one club.
 
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*Paul* said:
This the tricky bit. As I alluded to, the AFL Record of 2005 (and presumably this line of thinking is still in vogue) acknowledges the merger then ignores it, without further explanation.
Click to expand...

I don't think they wanted to say "Fitzroy has been wound-up and Brisbane has first choice of their playing list". The 'merger' solution was in the hope that Brisbane would get some Victorian members from amongst the old Fitzroy supporters.

Somewhere I've seen in writing the decision to keep Brisbane records as continuous from 1987 and separate from Fitzroy.
 

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*Paul* said:
Heh. I'll do 'em a deal - when they come out and say that, I'll glue my Brisbane's together :)
Click to expand...

Every time I use your estimable site for a cross-reference check, I have to 'glue' the B.Bears and B.Lions together. :)

We won't get the AFL to admit for a while that the 'merger' was a con, but if I can get something from them regarding the status of Brisbane stats and records might you consider a 'merger'?
 
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There's no question of the official position so that doesn't need confirmation... but the unvarnished reasoning would perhaps be enlightening, should they be so inclined to divulge it.

And to further muddy the waters, the Lions themselves seem to have a clear opinion
http://www.lions.com.au/Default.aspx?tabid=17429
except their stats section, which would've emanated form the AFL, contradicts their own stance.

Then there's this
http://www.lions.com.au/Default.aspx?tabid=5164
which counts BB games as BL games, but also Fitzroy games as BL games - but only for Fitzroy players who then went on to play for BL.
 
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UpForGrabs said:
Here's (hopefully) a doozy:

Which pair of teammates have scored 5 goals or more in the same game on the most occasions?

Which trio of teammates have done the same?
Click to expand...

13 - Dick Harris/Jack Titus
9 - Leigh Matthews/Michael Moncrieff
7 - Dermott Brereton/Jason Dunstall
6 - Laurie Nash/Bob Pratt
5 - Kevin Bartlett/Michael Roach
5 - Mick Conlan/Bernie Quinlan
5 - Jason Dunstall/Paul Hudson
4 - Gary Ablett snr/Paul Brown
4 - Daniel Bradshaw/Jonathan Brown
4 - Wayne Carey/John Longmire
4 - Bill Findlay/Sel Murray
4 - Des Fothergill/Ron Todd
4 - Peter Hudson/Leigh Matthews
4 - John Longmire/Adrian McAdam
4 - Roy Moore/Bob Pratt
4 - Alby Pannam/Ron Todd
4 - Bill Ryan/Doug Wade

On the 57 times three players have scored 5+, and two occasions of four players, no combination of three players has been repeated.
 
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Ron The Bear said:
13 - Dick Harris/Jack Titus
9 - Leigh Matthews/Michael Moncrieff
7 - Dermott Brereton/Jason Dunstall
6 - Laurie Nash/Bob Pratt
5 - Kevin Bartlett/Michael Roach
5 - Mick Conlan/Bernie Quinlan
5 - Jason Dunstall/Paul Hudson
4 - Gary Ablett snr/Paul Brown
4 - Daniel Bradshaw/Jonathan Brown
4 - Wayne Carey/John Longmire
4 - Bill Findlay/Sel Murray
4 - Des Fothergill/Ron Todd
4 - Peter Hudson/Leigh Matthews
4 - John Longmire/Adrian McAdam
4 - Roy Moore/Bob Pratt
4 - Alby Pannam/Ron Todd
4 - Bill Ryan/Doug Wade

On the 57 times three players have scored 5+, and two occasions of four players, no combination of three players has been repeated.
Click to expand...

There you go, Cheers Ron!

As always, I'm relating them to WAFL stats and I'd seen that the Murray Couper/Peter Bosustow/Robert Wiley have had at least two games for Perth in the late 70s where all three have scored 5 plus and wondered if there was a VFL/AFL equivalent.
 

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