NSW Sydney- What went wrong?

[SouthAustralia]

Sydney was at one stage the most enviable city in Australia, indeed you could argue it alway has been since settlemet. But I would say it really hit its pinnacle in 2000. The Olympics, new developements & the world community really accepting Sydney into the big league of cities.



But no less then 10 years later, Sydney is seen as overcrowded, full of many arrogant & snobby individuals, who sit in traffic all day. Not to mention run by a corrupt and hopeless government. Economically NSW is the basketcase of the Australian states.



As I don't live in the eastern states, I wonderwhat exactly went so wrong in those ten years?

 

[Caesar]

Maybe you've changed - grown up or whatever. I don't mean that in a bad way, but as a longtime resident I'm more inclined to say that not much has changed in 10 years at all, rather perception has.

Take a look at your criticisms. Overcrowding - well, that's been the case for decades. Traffic - public transport has been a mess for a very long time, primarily due to the fact that infrastructure's been neglected since the 80s. Corrupt/hopless government - certainly the case, but symptomatic of any government that's been in power a decade and a half.

The economy is not that bad, just poorly managed. It's still something like a third of Australia's GDP which is consistent with the population. In areas such as finance, Sydney has been steadily moving up the world rankings over the last decade.

In summary I don't think that things are that much worse than they were 10 years ago. Thanks to the government they're not really any better, but that's a different matter. To outsiders, the hugely successful Olympics put quite a gloss on Sydney that was probably slightly unrealistic (it remains the only time I can recall trains running on time and smoothly during my lifetime).

As for the perception of the people as snobby and arrogant - I was under the impression that Sydney's stereotype was blinged-up bogans. Snobby and arrogant used to be the preserve of Melbournites, whilst Adelaide and Brisbane inhabitants were regarded as rustic hicks. Everyone from Darwin is Crocodile Dundee, and nobody pays much attention to the sandgropers.

 

[Snag Breac]

As we say on BF - culture.

 

[The Passenger]

i've no doubt violence has escalated in sydney.

sydney really did hit its pick at the 2000 olympics (understandably) and was a fantastic city for the years afterwards, but IMO certainly declined in the latter half of the decade. It really wasn't until i got overseas to Europe to see how unlaid back australian's (and in particularly sydney) are.

everyone says australians are friendly, accommodating, fun and relaxed. first three i agree with, but certainly not the relaxed. maybe as individuals in our own time and space, but it's hard not to notice all the redicolous rules and regulations that are in place - the lack of flexibility in regards to them, and the lack of common sense applied in a lot of cases.

for instance at big day out in melbourne this year i was working the bar in the VIP section, and we had to stop serving alcohol for two hours because the police came around and shut the bar down because the VIP area didn't have a double fenced 6 foot high perimeter - it was only single fenced. For one that is a redicolous licensing law, and two surely some common sense couldn't have been used - keep serving and we'll come back in an hour and make sure you guys have started putting the fence up, and then if you are we'll come back an hour after that and make sure the fence is finished....

can't think of any examples of the top of my head at the moment but sydney is even worse in it's anal-retentiveness, which is why i had to get out of there.

 

[Riggy1]

As I don't live in the eastern states, I wonderwhat exactly went so wrong in those ten years?

It was all going well for the first 7 years
then I left

 

[Illinois Nazi]

They're just stuck in the last century with their antiquated daylight saving.

 

[Caesar]

They're just stuck in the last century with their antiquated daylight saving.

Go back to your farm and milk the cows, lad.

 

[Illinois Nazi]

Go back to your farm and milk the cows, lad.

Look at the facts. We trialled daylight saving for three years and the economy started to go down the tube. We've ditched the daylight saving and now it's boomtime again. Coincidence? I think not.

 

[Riggy1]

Look at the facts. We trialled daylight saving for three years and the economy started to go down the tube. We've ditched the daylight saving and now it's boomtime again. Coincidence? I think not.

it is a coincidence. But daylight savings is still stupid

what does it actually do for a positive on this country?

perhaps it helps out 3-4 test matches a year with a smaller chance of lack of light.

besides that I cant see any positives.

 

[raskolnikov]

I lived in Sydney in the 80s. Believe me it was a shithole even back then.

 

[Bombers_Forever]

Blame the government - the State government has been a basketcase since the 2000 Olympics. No spending, increasing prices on public transport, no improvmenet in transport, and now no money. Any decent road is privately run so they charge tolls which are not value for money.

Compare Sydney to Melbourne - the toll points on motorways work so well, only now is Sydney catching up and replacing the toll gates with those check points. Melbourne Airport might not have a train line, but there is freeway all the way to the city and you can get there in 20 minutes. In Sydney, to get to the CBD you face congested roads or a train ticket which will cost a fortune.

 

[Falchoon]

besides that I cant see any positives.

I get 9 holes in after work

 

[B_GLassi]

Most likely Labor will be voted out this time. We'll see how good the liberals are for Sydney.

 

[Ed_Gein]

Compare Sydney to Melbourne - the toll points on motorways work so well, only now is Sydney catching up and replacing the toll gates with those check points. Melbourne Airport might not have a train line, but there is freeway all the way to the city and you can get there in 20 minutes. In Sydney, to get to the CBD you face congested roads or a train ticket which will cost a fortune.

Yeah the price they are charging for a train ticket from Central to the Airport is absolutely robbery of the highest order.

I live in Penrith man, i think it's like $7 one way to Central which is an hour long journey.

The train ride from Central to the Airport is about 4 stops and 10 minutes if that, they charge $12-13 for it one way. Ridiculous.

 

[Caesar]

Saves a large amount of electricity, and gives me more time to go to the beach/play golf/do other stuff after work in summer.

All win. The bumpkins in QLD and WA should get on board.

 

[_JC_]

Yeah the price they are charging for a train ticket from Central to the Airport is absolutely robbery of the highest order.

I live in Penrith man, i think it's like $7 one way to Central which is an hour long journey.

The train ride from Central to the Airport is about 4 stops and 10 minutes if that, they charge $12-13 for it one way. Ridiculous.

Thats pretty cheap. If thats adult prices. QR is way more expensive than that. Gold coast to brisbane which is about an hour is $9 and the airtrain is which is about an extra 20 minutes on the previous journey is something like $30

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Melbourne Public Transport: Daily Fullfare Zone 1+2 - $10.60

Airport Bus is extra, public transport to the airport is the missing piece of the puzzle.

Hopefully the new operators will start to get the system working better.

 

[SydneyDon]

Most likely Labor will be voted out this time. We'll see how good the liberals are for Sydney.

I think the 4 year term is a big part of the problem here. State politicians seem to get comfortable for the first 3 years doing bugger all then starting fumbling around in the last year of their term trying to get another lucrative 4 year term.

 

[Caesar]

I think the 4 year term is a big part of the problem here. State politicians seem to get comfortable for the first 3 years doing bugger all then starting fumbling around in the last year of their term trying to get another lucrative 4 year term.

It depends on mindset. The certainty can help get things done, compared to something like the federal system where we seem to lurch from election campaign to election campaign. But if you have a weak opposition then governments can get complacent, because they know they won't be held accountable for their full tenure come election time. The Labor government has abused this chronically in the last 15 years.

 

[the_fresh]

Sydney was at one stage the most enviable city in Australia, indeed you could argue it alway has been since settlemet. But I would say it really hit its pinnacle in 2000. The Olympics, new developements & the world community really accepting Sydney into the big league of cities.



But no less then 10 years later, Sydney is seen as overcrowded, full of many arrogant & snobby individuals, who sit in traffic all day. Not to mention run by a corrupt and hopeless government. Economically NSW is the basketcase of the Australian states.


As I don't live in the eastern states, I wonderwhat exactly went so wrong in those ten years?

You forgot the public transport, I was up there last weekend with my girlfriend and we got to the point where the Airport was a better option than the CBD so we spent 6 hours at the Airport.
The city is a hole, I thought we had it bad in Melbourne, but for $3.60 I can get a daily ticket here, use it on all public transport and get from point a to point b very easily. In Sydney the Health care card can only be used for health, we're both full time students and you can only use a NSW student card up there, it costs a min. of $3.60 to go 1 stop, they charge based on where you're going and while I do like the trains, the loop is stuffed as you need to jump on and off too much to get where you're going.

I couldn't believe some of the sites I saw, we were checking into our room when I looked across the road, a bloke taking a piss on a wall in Downtown Sydeny in the middle of morning peak hour, people walking around him like nothing was happening, he then zipped up and walked off.
On the way to the Tunick shoot I saw 2 blokes in a corner giving each other a blowy, fair enough Mardi Gras, but the cops drove straight past it and laughed.
The whole time there anytime time we said we were from Victoria we got the NSW v Vic thing thrown in our face, in the end all I could do was laugh and point out what was wrong with Sydney, at one stage I went on for 5 minutes before my girlfriend told me to shut up.

The weather is shithouse, it rains more than Melbourne, everything cost 10% more than anywhere else. It's the rudest city in Australia, it's the dirtiest.
Apart from the bridge, the house and the harbour you could get rid of the place and it wouldn't be missed on the world stage at all.

 

[the_fresh]

Yeah the price they are charging for a train ticket from Central to the Airport is absolutely robbery of the highest order.

I live in Penrith man, i think it's like $7 one way to Central which is an hour long journey.

The train ride from Central to the Airport is about 4 stops and 10 minutes if that, they charge $12-13 for it one way. Ridiculous.

Did it last weekend, $15 one-way for an adult ticket, in the end we were buying student tickets which were $10 I think.

 

[Caesar]

you can only use a NSW student card up there

That's standard anywhere (including Victoria, last time I checked).

The weather is shithouse, it rains more than Melbourne

As someone who's lived in both places, this is assuredly not the case. I love Melbourne, but in terms of weather/climate Sydney leaves it for dead - far more temperate in summer and winter.

As for the other stuff... well it sounds like you had a pretty bad experience, but I'd quibble with a few things. The accessibility of public transport is pretty good in most places (particularly in the east) and I would probably put your difficulties down to unfamiliarity. Similarly the whole public lewdness/urination thing is probably more down to it being Mardi Gras time than anything else (things get incredibly loose around that weekend). Dirtiness and rude people - well, that's pretty common in all big cities and in my experience not much different between Melbourne and Sydney (been down to the Yarra lately?).

I've lived in both cities and am native to neither - they've both got their pluses and minuses.

 

[the_fresh]

That's standard anywhere (including Victoria, last time I checked).


As someone who's lived in both places, this is assuredly not the case. I love Melbourne, but in terms of weather/climate Sydney leaves it for dead - far more temperate in summer and winter.

As for the other stuff... well it sounds like you had a pretty bad experience, but I'd quibble with a few things. The accessibility of public transport is pretty good in most places (particularly in the east) and I would probably put your difficulties down to unfamiliarity. Similarly the whole public lewdness/urination thing is probably more down to it being Mardi Gras time than anything else (things get incredibly loose around that weekend). Dirtiness and rude people - well, that's pretty common in all big cities and in my experience not much different between Melbourne and Sydney (been down to the Yarra lately?).

I've lived in both cities and am native to neither - they've both got their pluses and minuses.

In Vic you can use a health care card or a student card.
So if you're a student getting austudy you'll be able to get the discount.

As for the yarra being dirty, it's the cleanest its ever been they are saying. The brownest of the water is caused by the mug on the river bed.

Sure they are rude people everywhere but we found Sydney to be shocking, my girlfriend was kicked when we were waiting to get on a train then pushed aside, when I had a go at the bloke he said "she should have got on as soon as the doors opened" I told him he was a f***wit. In Melbourne people wait for others to get off first.

I also know the CBD very well, I've been there a heap of times and its always been the same. I knew what train, bus or ferry to catch but it doesn't matter it's still stuffed. If you need a station in the loop you may have to get off the train you're on and find a second one, the buses are all pre-paid in the CBD yet its hard to find places selling tickets, don't even run for the bus.

For me its the way the place is set up. The Harbour while its a great idea you should never build a city on it.

 

[Caesar]

In Vic you can use a health care card or a student card.
So if you're a student getting austudy you'll be able to get the discount

Technically you're not supposed to be eligible unless you study in Victoria. I've been rejected for having a NSW student card down there (as well as WA and QLD).

 

[B_GLassi]

I think the 4 year term is a big part of the problem here. State politicians seem to get comfortable for the first 3 years doing bugger all then starting fumbling around in the last year of their term trying to get another lucrative 4 year term.

Well in NSW we seem to get 3 premiers in a 4 year term.