Revisionism The extent of the Holocaust

[Boston tiger]

backtracking like mofo

you already said there was a difference sorry too late

Did I say there wasn’t a difference? One is about the evil of mankind the other is about our technological advance.
Read up about the fire bombing of Tokyo and you may get some idea what was going on in Japan.

 

[Werewolf]

Open. Can we keep this discussion civil and REPORT offensive posts rather than launching into personal attacks?

Replying to a post with "nonsense" is fair enough, but calling posters "dickheads" or "morons" crosses the line!

 

[Exe Gesis]

Open. Can we keep this discussion civil and REPORT offensive posts rather than launching into personal attacks?

Replying to a post with "nonsense" is fair enough, but calling posters "dickheads" or "morons" crosses the line!

C'mon, guys. Werewolf is a truly great mod, so let's not make his life harder.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Interesting doco here by an actual Jewish persons first-hand tour of Auschwitz.....Most of the Zyklon B gas (95%) was actually used to de-lice the prisoners upon arrival, in a de-infestation chamber, so as to minimize the occurrence of typhoid, which was the biggest killer in the concentration camps during the War....The piles of human hair & clothes are due to prisoners being shaved & their clothes changed for issued uniforms immediately upon arrival, so as to stave off the spread of lice & the incidence of typhus....Original estimation of 4 million deaths at Auschwitz, now known to be an anti-Nazi, Soviet Communist exaggeration, & that a max of 1 million is now universally accepted as fact....Many other Soviet exaggerations & anti-Nazi propaganda have been exposed & proven as false, including using the bodies of cadavers for soap & the existence of electro-death chambers at Treblinka....It was also initially claimed that gas chambers existed at the Dachau camp, which have since proven to be utterly false....Mere post war-time propaganda.

The cyanide residue & discoloration of high Zyklon gas-use is quite marked in the de-infestation chambers, but almost non-existent in what is claimed to be the supposed 'gas-chamber.'....The gas was also used to disinfect all the buildings routinely as admitted by the camps current-day superintendent, a Dr Frank Piper....The supposed gas-chambers at Auschwicz was in fact, routinely used as an air-raid shelter & was hardly used at all for prisoner extermination (30-40 minutes per day) even admitted to by Dr Piper himself.

All the supposed evidence for a mass exterminating gas-chambers at Auschwitz appears to be lacking.

 

[Messenger]

You can't use hydrogen cyanide to "delouse" a person. It is fatal in fairly low doses.

First of all, this is an interesting article about David Cole.

Second, here is a detailed refutation of Cole's video.

And finally, an interesting article on testing for hydrogen cyanide, the active ingredient of Zyklon B. One of the chambers has been partially demolished and exposed to significant rainfall, hence the lower concentrations.

The conclusion:

The present study shows that in spite of the passage of a considerable period of time (over 45 years) in the walls of the facilities which once were in contact with hydrogen cyanide the vestigial amounts of the combinations of this constituent of Zyklon B have been preserved. This is also true of the ruins of the former gas chambers. The cyanide compounds occur in the building materials only locally, in the places where the conditions arose for their formation and persistence for such a long time. In his reasoning Leuchter (2) claims that the vestigial amounts of cyanide combinations detected by him in the materials from the chamber ruins are residues left after fumigations carried out in the Camp "once, long ago"(Item 14.004 of the Report). This is refuted by the negative results of the examination of the control samples from living quarters, which are said to have been subjected to a single gassing, and the fact that in the period of fumigation of the Camp in connection with a typhoid epidemic in mid-1942 there were still no crematoria in the Birkenau Camp. The first crematorium (Crematorium II) was put to use as late as 15 March 1943 and the others several months later.

 

[Procrastinator35]

You can't use hydrogen cyanide to "delouse" a person. It is fatal in fairly low doses.

First of all, this is an interesting article about David Cole.

Second, here is a detailed refutation of Cole's video.

And finally, an interesting article on testing for hydrogen cyanide, the active ingredient of Zyklon B. One of the chambers has been partially demolished and exposed to significant rainfall, hence the lower concentrations.

The conclusion:

The present study shows that in spite of the passage of a considerable period of time (over 45 years) in the walls of the facilities which once were in contact with hydrogen cyanide the vestigial amounts of the combinations of this constituent of Zyklon B have been preserved. This is also true of the ruins of the former gas chambers. The cyanide compounds occur in the building materials only locally, in the places where the conditions arose for their formation and persistence for such a long time. In his reasoning Leuchter (2) claims that the vestigial amounts of cyanide combinations detected by him in the materials from the chamber ruins are residues left after fumigations carried out in the Camp "once, long ago"(Item 14.004 of the Report). This is refuted by the negative results of the examination of the control samples from living quarters, which are said to have been subjected to a single gassing, and the fact that in the period of fumigation of the Camp in connection with a typhoid epidemic in mid-1942 there were still no crematoria in the Birkenau Camp. The first crematorium (Crematorium II) was put to use as late as 15 March 1943 and the others several months later.

So I'm gathering from the gist of both Cole & your debunking article, that the maximum amount of people supposedly 'gassed' at Auschwitz does not exceed 10, 000.....And that thereafter Birkenau served as the principle camp for mass extermination via gassing in 2 converted 'peasant-houses' from 1942 onward & then in large, newly built crematorium from 1943.

If this is so, then the entire story & history of Auschwitz being the epicenter for the Holocaust is fraudulent, as is the accepted wisdom in popular culture.

I'll now move my concentrated, though sporadic studies over to Birkenau then.....I sure hope the facts marry-up with the prevailing wisdom there Messenger....To suggest that this 6 million Holacaust number is beginning to look very shaky indeed, is to state the bleeding obvious at this point.

 

[Messenger]

So I'm gathering from the gist of both Cole & your debunking article, that the maximum amount of people supposedly 'gassed' at Auschwitz does not exceed 10, 000.....And that thereafter Birkenau served as the principle camp for mass extermination via gassing in 2 converted 'peasant-houses' from 1942 onward & then in large, newly built crematorium from 1943.

If this is so, then the entire story & history of Auschwitz being the epicenter for the Holocaust is fraudulent, as is the accepted wisdom in popular culture.

I'll now move my concentrated, though sporadic studies over to Birkenau then.....I sure hope the facts marry-up with the prevailing wisdom there Messenger....To suggest that this 6 million Holacaust number is beginning to look very shaky indeed, is to state the bleeding obvious at this point.

No, that facility killed 10,000 people (why that should be satisfying to you I've no idea) was a temporary unit. There were two more chambers used after that.

 

[Procrastinator35]

No, that facility killed 10,000 people (why that should be satisfying to you I've no idea) was a temporary unit. There were two more chambers used after that.

Eh....Who is 'satisfied' by it?.....I'm looking for numbers to match up with factual claims here Mess.....Why the attempt to project a warped 'relish' on my behalf here?

 

[Messenger]

Eh....Who is 'satisfied' by it?.....I'm looking for numbers to match up with factual claims here Mess.....Why the attempt to project a warped 'relish' on my behalf here?

You're satisfied by it. You think that a single facility killing 10,000 people achieves your greater aim of downplaying the number of people killed in the Holocaust. Why do you need to downplay this? Thousands of hours of first person testimony, written records and you wilfully ignore it to attach yourself to crackpots. Yet another Youtube video. I produce a written document with scientific analysis and you erroneously confirm a death count.

What sort of miserable campaigner are you?

You took the first paragraph of a long article about that video, read into it what you wanted and ignored the rest. Delousing people with hydrogen cyanide? Jesus wept.

 

[Procrastinator35]

You're satisfied by it. You think that a single facility killing 10,000 people achieves your greater aim of downplaying the number of people killed in the Holocaust. Why do you need to downplay this? Thousands of hours of first person testimony, written records and you wilfully ignore it to attach yourself to crackpots. Yet another Youtube video. I produce a written document with scientific analysis and you erroneously confirm a death count.

What sort of miserable campaigner are you?

You took the first paragraph of a long article about that video, read into it what you wanted and ignored the rest. Delousing people with hydrogen cyanide? Jesus wept.

WOW....I mean, just WOW.

I'm in no way 'satisfied' by it....What I'm not satisfied with is the supposed 'evidence' for backing the claims behind Auschwitz.

Your DE-bunking article doesn't discredit all the anomalies that Cole points out about the supposed 'Gas-chamber' bunker at all....I don't see Cole as trying to dis-credit the fact that many people died at Auschwitz, but rather attempting to get to the bottom of the basis of the claims about it's gas-chambers.

All you can do is go on the evidence provided by those who make the claims....The facts are that those proclaimed gas-chambers in Auschwitz had been altered to include air-vents 'after the fact' of WW11 coming to an end, even though it's appointed tour-guides claim otherwise.....Also, it's clear that the rooms have been altered, with bathroom facilities & washrooms evident from old piping & drains in the floors, not to mention the removal of walls in order to 'project' the image of a massive gas chamber facility.....This is nothing less than fraud by those who administer the site in making these claims as a factual basis.

What's with all this emotional investment Mess?.....Are you afraid of the truth?.....Why the need for these personal attacks upon a person simply asking questions?

And then to finish it off you call me a miserable campaigner....Dude. I'm a Hawks man, How could you even think that!

 

[DraftBalta]

The British Historian David Irving, speaking on "The Faking of Adolf Hitler for History" identifies some of the many FRAUDULENT historical documents that have been quoted AND referred to over the many years by "conformist historians" of the Third Reich era.

Even many of Mr. Irving's opponents DO admit.., that Mr. Irving's knowledge of Hitler and wartime Germany in unrivaled !! Mr. Irving is the author of numerous books on this era of history.., many of them having been "best sellers".., including his monumental work (3 volumes in one book!).., titled "Hitler's War"...

WOW what a mind turd Mr Irving is

 

[Heisenberg_]

WOW what a mind turd Mr Irving is

Yep he's a absolute piece of s**t and anybody that follows him should seek help.

 

[Procrastinator35]

WOW what a mind turd Mr Irving is

Yep he's a absolute piece of s**t and anybody that follows him should seek help.

These comments add absolutely nothing whatsoever to the debate & merely serve as 'cheer-leading' nonsense.....It ought to be the facts & truth people should be concerned with....Not with 'personalities' & taking-sides FFS.

It's been 72 years since the end of the Second World War for pete's sake....Can we leave this emotional residue out of it....Appeals to emotion & ad hominem are logical fallacies as I'm sure most here are aware.....All this proves is just how emotionally conditioned some people have been programmed to become over any questions about the Holocaust....Meaning: Taboo, do not question, do not touch....Alls the more reason for doing precisely that.....We live in an open Democracy, where full disclosure & transparency are hallmarks of it's stated values....Opening the vault on this most sacred of Cows ought then to be welcomed with open arms....If nothing else, then to corroborate all the claims therein.

That rebuttal article on Cole with an opening attack on his person, was attempting to depict him as nothing other than a s**t-stirring trickster & thereby discredit any evidence he presented, by way of it....Rather than serving that end, all it did was pique my interest even more, as it's author was clearly disturbed by some of the claims Cole made about the Auschwitz gas-chambers. Which remain valid in spite of the Rebuttal articles non sequitors to the contrary.

If people are frightened by the truth & asking the hard questions, then the conspiracy board is not for you.

 

[DraftBalta]

These comments add absolutely nothing whatsoever to the debate & merely serve as 'cheer-leading' nonsense.....It ought to be the facts & truth people should be concerned with....Not with 'personalities' & taking-sides FFS.

It's been 72 years since the end of the Second World War for pete's sake....Can we leave this emotional residue out of it....Appeals to emotion & ad hominem are logical fallacies as I'm sure most here are aware.....All this proves is just how emotionally conditioned some people have been programmed to become over any questions about the Holocaust....Meaning: Taboo, do not question, do not touch....Alls the more reason for doing precisely that.....We live in an open Democracy, where full disclosure & transparency are hallmarks of it's stated values....Opening the vault on this most sacred of Cows ought then to be welcomed with open arms....If nothing else, then to corroborate all the claims therein.

That rebuttal article on Cole with an opening attack on his person, was attempting to depict him as nothing other than a s**t-stirring trickster & thereby discredit any evidence he presented, by way of it....Rather than serving that end, all it did was pique my interest even more, as it's author was clearly disturbed by some of the claims Cole made about the Auschwitz gas-chambers. Which remain valid in spite of the Rebuttal articles non sequitors to the contrary.

If people are frightened by the truth & asking the hard questions, then the conspiracy board is not for you.

You are a very sad individual

 

[Procrastinator35]

You are a very sad individual

Cheers....Right back at ya.

 

[DraftBalta]

Cheers....Right back at ya.

You should be ashamed of yourself

 

[Procrastinator35]

You should be ashamed of yourself

Nope.....Not one ounce of guilt nor shame here on my behalf.....Might want to look somewhere else for your guilt trips to hang sweet-pea.

 

[DraftBalta]

Nope.....Not one ounce of guilt nor shame here on my behalf.....Might want to look somewhere else for your guilt trips to hang sweet-pea.

Sieg Heil!

 

[Exe Gesis]

Open. Can we keep this discussion civil and REPORT offensive posts rather than launching into personal attacks?

Replying to a post with "nonsense" is fair enough, but calling posters "dickheads" or "morons" crosses the line!

You are a very sad individual

You should be ashamed of yourself

Sieg Heil!

 

[Procrastinator35]

Yeah....But I'm playing the devil's advocate on the most sensitive & touchy subject of all....So that makes it alright GG.

 

[Mofra]

All you can do is go on the evidence provided by those who make the claims....The facts are that those proclaimed gas-chambers in Auschwitz had been altered to include air-vents 'after the fact' of WW11 coming to an end, even though it's appointed tour-guides claim otherwise.....Also, it's clear that the rooms have been altered, with bathroom facilities & washrooms evident from old piping & drains in the floors, not to mention the removal of walls in order to 'project' the image of a massive gas chamber facility.....This is nothing less than fraud by those who administer the site in making these claims as a factual basis.

Having been to Auschwitz, I find it remarkable that you would claim this as a 'fact' considering the Nazis performed a detonation of the gas chambers, the quarters at Auschwitz being mostly old barracks as a re-purposed facility, and that the nearby Birkenau camp that did have rows upon rows of structures to house the detainees had no piping at all (they were poorly constructed stone shacks with rudimentary roofing and straw mats as beds many detainees slept upon and a large and sophisticated dual-structure for the extermination). There were however concrete structures that could be kind of described as bathroom facilities but they were pretty much just concrete pits with drains within the concrete itself, not pipes.

That and the countless witness testimonies - both Nazi and Jew - that have informed the best estimates of the extermination, noting conspiracy theorists tend to ignore Einsatzgruppen activities as well.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Having been to Auschwitz, I find it remarkable that you would claim this as a 'fact' considering the Nazis performed a detonation of the gas chambers, the quarters at Auschwitz being mostly old barracks as a re-purposed facility, and that the nearby Birkenau camp that did have rows upon rows of structures to house the detainees had no piping at all (they were poorly constructed stone shacks with rudimentary roofing and straw mats as beds many detainees slept upon and a large and sophisticated dual-structure for the extermination). There were however concrete structures that could be kind of described as bathroom facilities but they were pretty much just concrete pits with drains within the concrete itself, not pipes.

That and the countless witness testimonies - both Nazi and Jew - that have informed the best estimates of the extermination, noting conspiracy theorists tend to ignore Einsatzgruppen activities as well.

I have yet to cover Birkenau....The notion of the old Gas-chambers being 'blasted' at Auschwitz I've not encountered as yet & will look into in more detail, including Messenger s claims about the Zyclon B agent being strictly used for principally human extermination.

The lad Cole, in that video I presented, did not mention anything about a 'blown-up' gas chambers & nor did it's superintendent a Dr Piper....A thorough examination & knowledge by either of them is either lacking, or they just plain forgot to mention such an important detail....A significant omission if true, to be sure.

I'll ensure that I have covered all bases on Birkenau, the 'detonated' old gas-chambers at Auschwitz & the Zyclon B gas, before posting info here again....It's getting interesting the more I delve into it, to say the very least.

 

[strung_out7]

Having been to Auschwitz, I find it remarkable that you would claim this as a 'fact' considering the Nazis performed a detonation of the gas chambers, the quarters at Auschwitz being mostly old barracks as a re-purposed facility, and that the nearby Birkenau camp that did have rows upon rows of structures to house the detainees had no piping at all (they were poorly constructed stone shacks with rudimentary roofing and straw mats as beds many detainees slept upon and a large and sophisticated dual-structure for the extermination). There were however concrete structures that could be kind of described as bathroom facilities but they were pretty much just concrete pits with drains within the concrete itself, not pipes.

That and the countless witness testimonies - both Nazi and Jew - that have informed the best estimates of the extermination, noting conspiracy theorists tend to ignore Einsatzgruppen activities as well.

Could you please share everything you know on the einsatzgruppen with documentation? I know there's letters and proof of potentially up to 1 million victims, but where they not partisans?

The work by Father Patrick Desbois isn't really case closed kinda stuff either. He finds mass graves in a country where 10 years prior to 3 war fronts going through it, somewhere around 7 million people were starved to death.

 

[NEGAN]

Having been to Auschwitz, I find it remarkable that you would claim this as a 'fact' considering the Nazis performed a detonation of the gas chambers, the quarters at Auschwitz being mostly old barracks as a re-purposed facility, and that the nearby Birkenau camp that did have rows upon rows of structures to house the detainees had no piping at all (they were poorly constructed stone shacks with rudimentary roofing and straw mats as beds many detainees slept upon and a large and sophisticated dual-structure for the extermination). There were however concrete structures that could be kind of described as bathroom facilities but they were pretty much just concrete pits with drains within the concrete itself, not pipes.

That and the countless witness testimonies - both Nazi and Jew - that have informed the best estimates of the extermination, noting conspiracy theorists tend to ignore Einsatzgruppen activities as well.

What about the Jews who tell a different account though?

Are they ignored?

 

[Mofra]

What about the Jews who tell a different account though?

Are they ignored?

Not at all - if you can provide evidence to the contrary I'll read it, but overall in matters of conjecture I'd side with the weight of evidence - and that includes the stories from my own family, two of whom suffered / survived Nazi occupation.