Food & Drink The Hangar Wine Thread! (posts moved from various locations)

[tesla1962]

A bit porty. My wife described it as the sort of wine her grandma would keep stashed away to be served to someone she didn't like.
Cost me $20 and is the first wine in a long time that I have not been able to drink.
Are you still in Wagga Wagga?

sounds awful, maybe a reductive thing from being stored in a hot place - heat can do that
cork or screw cap?
yeah for my sins I am destined to reside in wonderful Wagga Wagga for a goodly time
the silver lining is that it's considered a remote region by my employer so i get 5 weeks leave a year
it's actually not that bad

 

[eth-dog]

I grabbed a bottle of 2015 Heathcote Creek Shiraz last night and ended up pouring it down the sink.

Throwing it away very young. Especially from Heathcote. Should have waited another 3-4 years at least IMO.

 

[tesla1962]

Throwing it away very young. Especially from Heathcote. Should have waited another 3-4 years at least IMO.

no it sounds like it was ****ed and never getting better
but it would have been ok to cook with
PS in these times with winemaking practices and harvesting decision most red wines, including shiraz, are drinkable fairly early. Exceptions being something like Durif with all its tannin, and the acidic semillons from the hunter can be tough before they age

 

[eth-dog]

no it sounds like it was stuffed and never getting better
but it would have been ok to cook with

Yeah, maybe. I was saying I wouldn't have opened it till around 2019 or 2020 though.

 

[tesla1962]

Yeah, maybe. I was saying I wouldn't have opened it till around 2019 or 2020 though.

yeah you are right about optimum time
but what Dero described is not a function of the wine being young, it's a function of it being cooked (probably)

 

[BrunoV]

Going to put it out there, I have no time for Pinot Noir and I doubt I have tasted one that I would pay for again.

It's too acidic and seems to be poorly made in general with the overwhelming flavour being the taste of alcohol as opposed to the taste of the grape.

Appreciate that bold reds are not for everyone, so if you are after something which is lighter, has minimal tannin and some spice get a cool(er) climate shiraz (e.g. from the King Valley). The wines I was drinking from the King Valley were what the pinots I'm always being poured would taste like if fruit and spice were the dominant flavours and sensations (as opposed to alcohol and acid).

 

[tesla1962]

ICONOCLASTIC

 

[DERO]

Throwing it away very young. Especially from Heathcote. Should have waited another 3-4 years at least IMO.

I struggle to cellar wine. I am more of grab it as you need it kind of guy. This wine was rank and would still have been rank in three years!

 

[tesla1962]

It's too acidic and seems to be poorly made in general with the overwhelming flavour being the taste of alcohol as opposed to the taste of the grape.

Some (a lot in certain price points) of the Pinot coming from NZ of late is thin and acidic and I suspect vines are being over cropped. They also exhibit green characters and this may lead to your view of Pinot being just alcohol and acid.

However, I strongly disagree with your characterization of Pinot generally. With Pinot it really is a case of getting what you pay for, which is why I tend not to drink too much Pinot.

 

[BrunoV]

I struggle to cellar wine. I am more of grab it as you need it kind of guy. This wine was rank and would still have been rank in three years!

Difficult to cellar wine unless you have hundreds of bottles.

I think 700 is considered to be the magic number.

 

[Doss]

Some (a lot in certain price points) of the Pinot coming from NZ of late is thin and acidic and I suspect vines are being over cropped. They also exhibit green characters and this may lead to your view of Pinot being just alcohol and acid.

However, I strongly disagree with your characterization of Pinot generally. With Pinot it really is a case of getting what you pay for, which is why I tend not to drink too much Pinot.

If it's from Central Otago, and a lot of NZ Pinot is, then it may have something to do with that area having colder than normal winters over the past two or three years.

We're talking bitterly cold, to the point where it's hard not to imagine it affecting vineyards.

 

[BrunoV]

Some (a lot in certain price points) of the Pinot coming from NZ of late is thin and acidic and I suspect vines are being over cropped. They also exhibit green characters and this may lead to your view of Pinot being just alcohol and acid.

However, I strongly disagree with your characterization of Pinot generally. With Pinot it really is a case of getting what you pay for, which is why I tend not to drink too much Pinot.

The way I look at it, at that price the competition becomes merlot and the excellent cool climate shiraz and then, even if the pinot is good it's out of it's depth. It's a lot of money to spend on a wine just to get a good version of a style.

Even the Italian reds, which I am often disappointed by, are much better representations of what lighter wines can be.

 

[tesla1962]

If it's from Central Otago, and a lot of NZ Pinot is, then it may have something to do with that area having colder than normal winters over the past two or three years.

We're talking bitterly cold, to the point where it's hard not to imagine it affecting vineyards.

not likely, vines are dormant during winter and unless the vines are actually killed* then any effect is likely to be positive as vines need adequate chilling to ensure even budburst (and I suspect colder winters truncate flowering, which is a positive thing)
the temperature range during ripening and vine management (including cropping levels) are the critical things

* in certain parts of china they lean vines over and bury them during each winter otherwise they would be killed

 

[Beerfish]

in certain parts of china they lean vines over and bury them during each winter otherwise they would be killed

Wow. Cool factoid.

 

[Doss]

Well actually as I understand it's not just colder winters, it's been colder than normal generally in Otago, the summers have been cooler than normal too.

 

[tesla1962]

Well actually as I understand it's not just colder winters, it's been colder than normal generally in Otago, the summers have been cooler than normal too.

This may come into play then, but it's not something that has come across my transom. Even though Pinot is classic cool climate it can be too cool and fruit won't ripen properly. I still think most of it is likely to be over cropping.

Edit: I am just musing on Central Otago. there is a large altitudinal range so it might actually be that some of the plantings are on sites that are too cold or marginal.

 

[Pweter]

Going to put it out there, I have no time for Pinot Noir and I doubt I have tasted one that I would pay for again.

It's too acidic and seems to be poorly made in general with the overwhelming flavour being the taste of alcohol as opposed to the taste of the grape.

Appreciate that bold reds are not for everyone, so if you are after something which is lighter, has minimal tannin and some spice get a cool(er) climate shiraz (e.g. from the King Valley). The wines I was drinking from the King Valley were what the pinots I'm always being poured would taste like if fruit and spice were the dominant flavours and sensations (as opposed to alcohol and acid).

The way I look at it, at that price the competition becomes merlot and the excellent cool climate shiraz and then, even if the pinot is good it's out of it's depth. It's a lot of money to spend on a wine just to get a good version of a style.

Even the Italian reds, which I am often disappointed by, are much better representations of what lighter wines can be.

Amen.

 

[Doss]

This may come into play then, but it's not something that has come across my transom. Even though Pinot is classic cool climate it can be too cool and fruit won't ripen properly. I still think most of it is likely to be over cropping.

Fair enough. How about rainfall? I'm not sure whether it's been wetter or drier than normal there (Central Otago is the driest part of NZ, about as dry as say near Echuca normally), but could that have an effect?

 

[tesla1962]

Fair enough. How about rainfall? I'm not sure whether it's been wetter or drier than normal there (Central Otago is the driest part of NZ, about as dry as say near Echuca normally), but could that have an effect?

most of central otago would be irrigated on gravels (free draining) so irrigation is about striking a balance but it may still be about making sure that vines are not irrigated too much
if vines are overly vigourous then you would be looking at big canopies and shaded fruit, which would lead to the sorts of wines described
if they are pushing for higher yields this is a potential outcome

This thread needs to know so how do you fancy a trip to central otago to get to the bottom of this issue? Of course pre-trips to Burgundy and Oregon to set an international context would be a given.

 

[DERO]

Difficult to cellar wine unless you have hundreds of bottles.

I think 700 is considered to be the magic number.

700 huh? That's some serious wine. My "cellar" normally consists of a bottle of red and two bottles of desert wine that were given to me 10 years ago that I would never drink. Occasionally at this time of the year, I'll expand it to a couple of dozen but they disappear before having a chance to improve.

Also, 100% with you on Pinot.

 

[eth-dog]

Difficult to cellar wine unless you have hundreds of bottles.

I think 700 is considered to be the magic number.

We have approximately 550 wines in the cellar

 

[Doss]

most of central otago would be irrigated on gravels (free draining) so irrigation is about striking a balance but it may still be about making sure that vines are not irrigated too much
if vines are overly vigourous then you would be looking at big canopies and shaded fruit, which would lead to the sorts of wines described
if they are pushing for higher yields this is a potential outcome

This thread needs to know so how do you fancy a trip to central otago to get to the bottom of this issue? Of course pre-trips to Burgundy and Oregon to set an international context would be a given.

Had my chance recently with Burgundy, alas I went to Medoc (Bordeaux) instead, which was amazing in its own right. Still to get to the US west coast; LAX doesn't count.

I'll happily have BF finance a trip to Central Otago for me! I'm actually going to Queenstown, Wanaka and Te Anau in April- close enough that I might be able to sneak a side trip down towards where the vineyards in Central Otago are - generally around places like Cromwell, Alexandra and Ranfurly.

 

[Beerfish]

Had my chance recently with Burgundy, alas I went to Medoc (Bordeaux) instead, which was amazing in its own right. Still to get to the US west coast; LAX doesn't count.

I'll happily have BF finance a trip to Central Otago for me! I'm actually going to Queenstown, Wanaka and Te Anau in April- close enough that I might be able to sneak a side trip down towards where the vineyards in Central Otago are - generally around places like Cromwell, Alexandra and Ranfurly.

Travel thread floggo!!1

 

[tesla1962]

We have approximately 550 wines in the cellar

what was your address again?

 

[tesla1962]

Also, 100% with you on Pinot.

DERO ICONOCLAST