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The Hawks

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From Bay 13 .... LINK

There has been more than enough said on the Hawthorn resurgence, and despite it being based on years of bottom dwelling and an abandonment of loyal players for draft picks, one has to admit that the process has been somewhat successful. Media personalities, club personnel and Hawks fans alike will tell you just how good this team is...from the dynamic key forwards Lance Franklin and Jarryd Roughead with support from Mark Williams, to the brilliant midfield led by Sam Mitchell, Luke Hodge, Brad Sewell and Jordan Lewis and the brilliant tactics of coach Alastair Clarkson, whose 'rolling zones' have caused opposition teams and coaches enormous headaches. We all know that the tactics basically involve the Hawks zoning off their players in such a way to ensure they own the corridor, constantly forcing opposition teams to go wide when they have the ball or face overwhelming numbers at the ball in the corridor.

A scrappy underpaid team with almost no budget, no home ground and a coach (whose temple throbs palpably in calm times let alone when that artery is put under stress) saw a way. The North Melbourne football club has shown the rest of the AFL just how to approach games against Hawthorn.

Not that the Saints needed any help tactically against the Hawks, they are our bitches and they know it.

Code:
# Year Rd Team    Score        vs Team    Score      Gnd Result Marg 
1 2007 16 St Kilda 14.11  (95) vs Hawthorn 11.12 (78) TD  WON  17 
2 2007  8 St Kilda  6. 8  (44) vs Hawthorn 10.12 (72) MCG Lost [COLOR="Red"]28[/COLOR] 
3 2006 13 St Kilda 18.17 (125) vs Hawthorn  8. 7 (55) TD  WON  70 
4 2005 12 St Kilda 15.10 (100) vs Hawthorn  8. 6 (54) MCG WON  46 
5 2004 13 St Kilda 19.13 (127) vs Hawthorn  9. 7 (61) TD  WON  66 
6 2003 10 St Kilda 17.16 (118) vs Hawthorn 14. 6 (90) MCG WON  28

Apart from the match where Hawthorn flooded us out of the match early last year, we have been completely dominant. Hawks supporters generally go into denial every time facts are used to demonstrate that their beliefs are not exactly consistent with reality. Just look at the scores of these matches - the highest score Hawthorn could muster against us was 90 and you have to go way back to 2003 to find it.:eek: yet the Saints are regularly topping the ton. Clarkson's cluster be damned - the Saints to win this by 5 goals. Ross Lyon wont be credited with the win - the media will declare its an aberation for the Hawks on their way to certain glory :rolleyes:

On the Hawks Board they have a few threads corncerning us:

Poll: Do you think the Hawthorn-St Kilda clash will be as bad as last years?

Saints Match-ups. What I would like to see

Possible Team vs. St.Kilda.??

Hawks plan to attack Saints

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Hawks plan to attack Saints

18/07/2008 2:18:55 PM
Brandon Cohen


Hawthorn coach Alastair Clarkson has promised a more attacking brand of football against St Kilda on Saturday night to the one that resulted in last year's 'snorefest'.
That game, in Round 8, saw just seven goals kicked to three-quarter time before the Hawks booted six goals in the last term to run out winners by 28 points. Of 291 marks taken that night, only 13 were contested.
While neither side accepted responsibility for a game that was dubbed by many in the media as 'ugly' and 'boring', Clarkson predicted a totally different mindset this weekend as both teams look to utilise their key marking forwards.

"I'm not sure how the game's going to unfold tomorrow night but both sides now want to play attacking footy," Clarkson said before a training session at a chilly Waverley Park on Friday.
"I reckon St Kilda have played their best footy when they've tried to run and carry the ball in recent weeks. They've got some talented players and it'll be another good test for us I'm sure."
"Every game is a significant challenge. St Kilda has been playing good footy the last three or four weeks. We're going to need to play really well against them to get the points."
Coincidentally, that Round 8 victory is Hawthorn's only win over the Saints in their past six meetings - yet another hoodoo the third-placed Hawks are hoping to break.
Should they do just that, it'll be just one more achievement they have notched up so far this season.
Last week they broke a six-match losing streak against Sydney and also toppled another bogey team in Round 12 when they defeated Adelaide at AAMI Stadium for the first time in 14 years.
The Hawks also broke their Gabba hoodoo earlier this season by beating Brisbane there for the first time in eight years.
Chance Bateman returns this weekend from a calf injury in another boost for the side following last week's return of Brad Sewell.
Veteran Shane Crawford won't be there, however, with Clarkson confirming the 1999 Brownlow Medallist was now a week-to-week proposition with knee tendonitis.


Last week the Hawks played host to the Swans:

Hawthorn 15.16.106 d Sydney 10.15.75

I had a look on the Swans Board and didn't find much that could be considered a comprehensive review of the match tactically, but this post is a decent comment on the match:
on the weekend we had 180 kicks and 147 h/balls to my reckoning way too many h/balls on many occasions we came out of defence and had clear options 50 meters away and instead chose to h/ball in the backline not once or twice but every single time ending in constant turnovers and loss of confidence for our players. whats more up forward rok was matched on guerra (rok could easily sit on his head) but never got the chance to because we would not kick it long to a contest. Our effort was there both kirk and goodsey busted their guts craig did his best but with this game plan and the constant badly thought through match ups we will struggle to beat the cats hawks dogs and pies even the roos because their too good with their defensive pressure and were not good enough under pressure to pin point 11 meter passes to teammates surrounded by opposition players, i love roosey but his coaching and overall match ups against the top teams has been lacking just hope we can remedy this because players like kirk deserve better for their effort.
PN in the same game the hawks had 195 kicks to 88 h/balls thats how you win at the G
 
I honestly think we're a good chance to win this game, and at the start of the year i thought we could go all the way. If we win this, i will have good evidence to believe that is still the case.

Go saints.
 
I mentioned the Sydney match because it was Hawthorn's last match, and two other reasons:
1) I noticed a change in the way they approached this match, tactically
2) I think they will approach the Saints match in much the same manner

Match ups

Louis Roberts-Thompson went to Franklin early and towelled him up, Roos must have decided that Williams was the more dangerous player and moved LRT onto him, putting Bolton on big Lance. Bolton wasn't adequate on Lance and it was lucky for the Swans that Franklin kicked atrociously (4g 7pts 3 ootf). Roos instincts were right though - Williams was the most effective forward for Hawks. Leo Barry spent the day on Roughead and did OK. Marty Mattner went to Cyril Rioli - who sacrificed his game to take Mattner out of the match (nullifying the very effective rebounding defender). They effectively cancelled each other out - although Rioli did make one very good tackle that had an influence on the match. Tadgh Kenelly was compromised - so Sydney's run out of defence was not up to scratch.

What I think is significant is that Williams is very much a danger man in the forward line, not just Lance and Roughy. We also have to watch what happens to the man on Rioli - to make sure that we don't lose one of our most effective rebounding players. Michael Osbourne may not have got great stats but he was a major force in getting the ball forward and is also a real danger man.

Kieren Jack tagged Birchall, Luke Ablett tagged Hodge and Brett Kirk went with Sam Mitchell.

Hodge and Mitchell were obvious but the Birchall tag was a little unexpected - clearly Roos rates him as integral to their forward thrusts.

The Hawks put Croad on O'Loughlan, Gilham on Playfair, I think Brown went to Goodes who started forward and Guerra had a run with role on Ryan O'Keefe. Their main tagger, Brad Sewell ran with McVeigh and did a fairly good job on him.

Robert Campbell did well around the ground including five tackles (great work for such a big man), both he and Simon Taylor did fair in the ruck contests - with Darren Jolly quite superior on the day (money hungry Everitt was ordinary).

Tactically - Hawthorn abandoned the rolling zones defence for the (finals oriented) one on one defence.
This is significant for the Saints - they can exploit a team whose experience with the one on one defence is limited.

I don't want to second guess Ross Lyon, but I have a few ideas of what he intends to do against the Hawks.

Hawthorn will shut down a match if they are not winning. It turns the match ugly and tars the saints with the same brush.
If we exploit their one on one defence - they may revert to the rolling zones and bring an extra man back.
They already run with a four man forward line to try and clear space for their "power forwards" so another man back makes the game a complete midfield battle - this is what they did in Rd 8 last year - and this ugliness worked for them.

Ross was able to counter their "ugly football" last time - and we ran away with it.

Interesting times
 
We have been Sydneys bitches, we have been Adelaides bitches, we have been a lot of teams bitches because we have been crap except for the last 18 months.

We have beaten Adelaide away for the first time in many, many years, Sydney for the first time since I don't know when. We have broken a number of hoodoos this year for no other reason than that we are now a good team. We aren't 13 and 2 by luck. But if it makes you feel better to compare our records over the last few years when you've been good and we've been rubbish then well and good, it won't count for nought tonight.
 

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Match Ups

FB: Sean Dempster, Max Hudghton, Sam Gilbert
FF: Mark Williams, Jarryd Roughead, Cyril Rioli

HB: Jason Gram, Sam Fisher, Brendon Goddard
HF: Chance Bateman, Lance Franklin, Michael Osborne

C: Aaron Fiora, Leigh Montagna, Nick Dal Santo
C: Clinton Young, Sam Mitchell, Xavier Ellis

HF: Robert Harvey, Nick Riewoldt, Clint Jones
HB: Campbell Brown, Trent Croad, Grant Birchall

FF: Stephen Milne, Justin Koschitzke, Adam Schneider
FB: Brent Guerra, Stephen Gilham, Rick Ladson

Foll: Steven King, Luke Ball, Lenny Hayes
Foll: Robert Campbell, Luke Hodge, Brad Sewell

Int: David Armitage, Robert Eddy, Andrew McQualter, Jason Blake
Int: Jarryd Morton, Tom Murphy, Travis Tuck, Simon Taylor


ST KILDA
Emg: Jarryn Geary, Jarryd Allen, Shane Birss

In: Aaron Fiora, Adam Schneider
Out: Jarryd Allen, James Gwilt

HAWTHORN
Emg: Tim Clarke, Jordan Lewis, Cameron Stokes

In: Bateman
Out: Shane Crawford (knee tendonitis)
 
We have been Sydneys bitches, we have been Adelaides bitches, we have been a lot of teams bitches because we have been crap except for the last 18 months.

We have beaten Adelaide away for the first time in many, many years, Sydney for the first time since I don't know when. We have broken a number of hoodoos this year for no other reason than that we are now a good team. We aren't 13 and 2 by luck. But if it makes you feel better to compare our records over the last few years when you've been good and we've been rubbish then well and good, it won't count for nought tonight.

It seems you may have to wait a little longer to lose that BITCH status :cool:
 
What pisses me off is that we have a great come from behind victory, but opening the sports pages of the Herald Sun all I can see is a 2/3 page picture of Buddy. Didn't we win? When does the Franklin love-in slow down? Thought it was very ordinary when Rioli flipped one over his shoulder to create a shot on goal, but all Buddy could do it look at himself on the big screen - how about celebrating the goal with your team-mates?
 
What pisses me off is that we have a great come from behind victory, but opening the sports pages of the Herald Sun all I can see is a 2/3 page picture of Buddy. Didn't we win? When does the Franklin love-in slow down? Thought it was very ordinary when Rioli flipped one over his shoulder to create a shot on goal, but all Buddy could do it look at himself on the big screen - how about celebrating the goal with your team-mates?

It was equally interesting to see that his teammates were not too interested in celebrating with him, but all went to Rioli instead (I still think it was a throw, but anyway...).

He appears to have gained a bit of weight (all those night club drinks will find their way to your hips eventually...), has real problems with his kicking, appeared not too interested and involved in their game at times and tried to beat Hudghton in wrestling contents rather than using his leads (this may have been the plan as nobody is better in spoiling such leads than Hudghton).

He is certainly not the same he was earlier this year.

But that's not our problem is it ?

Let the media underestimate us and concentrate on Hawthorn's problems and Geelong strength (they do appear unbeatable at the moment) - I certainly prefer this to the media making us a flag favourite earlier this year - while the new St Kilda train gains more and more speed and force on its way to September action !
 

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