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Discussion in 'Fremantle' started by jedi mind tricks, Mar 27, 2016.
Sadly we're not GWS...
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See I didn't see a need for any hosing down of expectations (other than from a few on this board). The media weren't talking him up that I saw. If anything, by not playing him, it's actually got the media focussing in that direction hence Ross's need to justify his decision not to play him.
exactly. give the kid a run in the first JLT when we were shaking the cobwebs out and see what we see.
i get the feeling rtb really wants that first win against Geelong and many other things, logue included, are taking a back seat. last year was his first r1 loss i believe and we all saw what happened next with his worst season as senior coach resulting.
I'm not expecting a quick rebuild where all the youngsters are thrown into the fray. not going to happen. plus he knows fyfe could still walk if it continues poorly from last season.
It's pretty likely he won't play until 2018 anyway so he's got plenty of time to get used to it.
Edit.....Oops didn't notice Dudley Docker had beaten me to it.
Logue did play junior footy. Not sure what RTB is on about.
I think what he trying to do is if somebody injured( eg spurr) he will use afl experience as an excuse to use suban, ibbo , sutty and sheriden instead of the kids.
How many first year draftees have played under Lyon?
I'd be surprised if he played this year, we would have to have another bad run with injuries.
Tucker, Collins and Yarran played last year. (Balic might have but was injured)
Weller, Blakely, Langdon and Hughes played in 2015.
Apeness in 2014.
Taberner (rookie) in 2013.
Neale, Sheridan, Crozier, Sutcliffe and Spurr in 2012.
Most of the players on our list have debuted in their first year.
Fyfe in 2010.
Hill, Walters, Ballantyne, Suban and Clarke in 2009.
and so on...
We had least two last year for a start.
Logue is almost certain to debut his year. Ross is pulling some shit.
Late edit : See above. ( that's impressive )
This comes across as an ignorant opposition fan regurgitating groupthink. It would have taken 1 minute of research (demonstrated by wtg), or just actually watching our games to realise how silly and incorrect a statement that is. The argument can be made that they haven't been played enough, sure, but not at all? wtf
Have some people gone mad? You simply can't gift games to high draft picks because you are transitioning your list. Games have to be earned.
Otherwise you will have another Melbourne. All the talent in the world but no integrity in selection or desire to win games. That can create a rot in the club culture which can take a decade to recover from.
Bottom line is even if our list is transitioning (which we all know it is), the coaches will play Logue once they feel he deserves it.
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Does giving a young player a crack in a practice match cause Melbourne like rot?
Tucker (12), Collins (12) and Yarran (6) played last year due to injuries and the fact that freo weren't exactly fighting for a top 8 spot. Without those two conditions I would of thought Tucker and Collins would of struggled to get games with Yarran being the only sure player.
In 2015 Blakely (1) and Hughes (1) debuted against Port Adelaide in the game where a lot of the main squad rested in prep for finals. Langdon (2) and Weller (3) the only ones with games beforehand.
2014 and 2013 didn't have many debutantes from first year players. Apeness and Tabs being the only ones left (Simpson and Tanner both debuted their first year but have since left, for example).
While some first year players often debut under Ross, they have never really seen regular game time. 2016 is an anomaly due to the injuries freo sustained and the fact that freo wasn't exactly in contention. Making the only real standout 2012 where only Neale (11) and Spurr (13) saw relatively higher numbers of games. Understandable though as Neale is a gun and Spurr was a mature-age recruit.
Before that Ross wasn't in charge so we can't hold him accountable.
I'm lazy so I won't go looking through Ross' time at St Kilda but the data from there would have to be taken into consideration too if we are talking about Ross' tendency to play youth.
However it can be said that mature-age/body draftees do often get games. Spurr, Collins and Yarran for example. So I would expect someone like Logue to make it into the side for about 10 games this season.
There is still integrity to selection. He might get a chance this week but he isn't in the first team.
Tucker met team expectations last year and played ahead of Suban for example. The coaching staff felt he did enough to justify selection even for a 1st year player @ 18 years of age. Once Logue is deserving, he will get a game.
I thought Ross would have learned a lesson from Alex Pearce. It was only through injury that he got a game and straight away you could tell he was going to be a gun.
It's bloody pre season, give these guys a run so you can see what they bring to the table on match day and it also gives them a taste of what intensity is required for an AFL (pre-season) game.
In a game that means absolutely nothing, you give unkown players a chance to surprise you to the upside. Even if they fail, the team loses absolutely nothing, whereas the player should be learning an immense amount about the AFL standard.
The statement made was how many have debuted in their first year - not how many games they played in their first year. That aside you are also inaccurate about Tucker. He played Round 5 before we had all the injuries and no-one was really injured in his position either. He impressed in the very first NAB game and RTB pretty obviously wanted to play him early on. Collins may have not had as many opportunities although he was picked ahead of Dawson on a number of occasions.
As for the three amigos. Yes two of them only played 1 game in 2015 but we won the first 10 rounds. It's pretty hard to change your selections when you are winning. I was of the opinion we should have tried some more things out once we started losing but I also don't think Langdon or Blakely were ready yet. From an overall perspective I think how they have been developed has actually worked really well. They have created a really strong bond playing at Peel and Freo together and have a Peel premiership which is something they clearly value. I don't think Blakely or Langdon would have charged out of the gates like a Neale did, and things like Rising Star nominations probably wouldn't have happened if brought in too early.
Most of the guys you are talking about played only as the sub when there was a sub rule and in games we tanked.
Righteo can sound as high and mighty as he likes, there's a reason Lyon has a rep for not playing kids. It's because he doesn't, unless he's forced to like last year when we literally had 25 fit players some weeks.
Not sure what you are debating? I agree Ross probably doesn't play them as early as some other coaches might. He's also had us in finals every year except last year (when the youngsters all played). I'm personally going to wait until we see an actual regular season game this year (maybe even a couple or more) before complaining too much about things. But go for your life, it is the melt thread
Lyon debuted more kids in 2011 than 14 other teams - not because he was forced to, but because he was starting a rebuild.
Correcting a factually incorrect statement makes me "high and mighty"? lol ok m8
Only really debating the likelihood of Logue getting a game this year. I just don't think its particularly likely given hes probably behind Collins as well as the current incumbents.
Like I said he probably won't play unless we have another bad run with injuries.