the usual suspects

[jod23]

Dont you people think it is time to start fighting? No more catch Bin Laden and thats the end of it, its time to find any terrorist anywhere and attack him. What if Bin Laden takes responsibility and gives himself up....we'll go "ahh great thats that then"??? Not good enough because then someone else will come along and do what we saw on Tuesday all over again. Its time to wage a war against Terrorism, not just the USA, all Nato countries must fight back. Put fear into terrorists never to do it again, i think something like that has to happen.

 

[Joe Mama]

For those who think that Terrorism is only perpetrated by islamic and arab groups, i'll leave you with this

Terrorism in the Middle East started on a big scale with the Stern Gang, whose leader was Israel's first Prime Minister, David Ben-Gourian, thier tactics were to blow up British garrisons and positions in Palestine when they had the mandate there from 1920-1947, and to kill british citizens and palestinians if neccesary.

They harrassed the Poms until they gave up and gave in to thier demand for a Jewish homeland in Palestine, they initially wanted to split up the nation into two states, Israel and Palestine, but the US and Israel didn't wan't a bar of this and threw up the British plan, the british abandoned Palestine and left the palestinians to thier fate and the land that was originally set aside for palestinians was taken by Israel and supported by the United States and its vey powerful jewish lobby.

Add to this, the land Israel took from its neighbours, during the wars of 1967 and 1973, and that is bound to get some people very angry.

No cause can be justified through the loss of innocent lives (As para-phrased by UN Secretary General, Kofi Annan), but the point I was trying to make was no organisation or government is truly pure and innocent or demonsterably evil, all have commited atrocities under the name of the people they claim to represent, although Ah_19's views I don't totally agree with, but he or she's basic point was that the world is different shades of grey, and balanced ang logical views and cool heads is what we need in a time like this.

 

[Joel]

Originally posted by The Truth


Decided to rejoin us eh Alfy boy?

Piss off - your views are not welcome here

And your views are?

 

[Joel]

What sort of dream world do some of you people live in?

There has and ALWAYS will be civillian casualties in WAR. This was not WAR, this was and act of terrorism, perpetrated without warning.

What this act of terrorism did was initiate WAR.

America has done it's share of "bad things", all countries have, the US is not alone. DO NOT GIVE TERRORISTS EXCUSES!!

ALSO, to those people who mention stuff like, "why doesn't the US overthrow regimes etc", why don't we just organise 500,000 suicide troops and send them to all trouble spots around the globe? I'm sure that will fix it! Get real, the free world can't be responsible to/for everyone.

 

[Joel]

Originally posted by Joel
What sort of dream world do some of you people live in?

There has and ALWAYS will be civillian casualties in WAR. This was not WAR, this was and act of terrorism, perpetrated without warning.

What this act of terrorism did was initiate WAR.

America has done it's share of "bad things", all countries have, the US is not alone. DO NOT GIVE TERRORISTS EXCUSES!!

ALSO, to those people who mention stuff like, "why doesn't the US overthrow regimes etc", why don't we just organise 500,000 suicide troops and send them to all trouble spots around the globe? I'm sure that will fix it! Get real, the free world can't be responsible to/for everyone.

I love having the last say, but why does it happen all the time?

 

[Westy_Boy]

You're just too good for us simple minded people, Joel =)

ODN's,

Having read your initial post again, I feel that my reply was totally unfair, so I apologise. All I was trying to get across were the glaring double standards in reporting, and I guess I just used your post as a way to organise my thoughts, which is the wrong way to go about it.

On your other comments re the bombing of civilians/"collateral damage", I don't know. There seems to be a thinking of "kill all of the f*ckers", which worries me. Why, for example, are they planning on bombing the Afghani capital, when Bin Laden is supposedly in the country side/hills of the country? Where is the proof that it was actually Bin Laden responsible ?

I have a feeling that they're after blood - any blood, so as to be seen to be doing something. Take the Oklahoma Bombing - If it hadn't have been Timothy McVeigh, and instead was one other sole nutcase acting on his own accord, who's name happened to to Mohammed Mohammed, would we have seen air raids of a Middle Eastern country? I don't know.

Double standards in the media, in wars etc. aren't your fault, and not what you were arguing, so once again, i apologise.


Ah19,

There is no 'right/good side' to a World War, and I can't believe that you used the word logic when discussing WWIII in that post.

How can anyone who's involved in indisrciminant murder be 'right'? How can it be 'logical'? A lot of muslims may have "agreed" with what happened last Tuesday, but don't you think that that makes them just as bad as parties that have bombed them in the past?

You may have believed that America 'got what it had coming to them', but what has it achieved? More air raids, more bombings, and loss of innocent lives for the middle east. What was their "cause" ? Hurting the people responible? Stop to think that all of the presidents who ordered those attacks in the past are sitting at home, watching this unfold on their TV sets?

They've achieved nothing but more heartache for their homeland -- explain to the Afghani bloke who's gonna lose his child later this week that his kid would still be alive had his mate not flown a plane into a f*ckin American building for his 'cause'!

I guess the terrorists didn't care that their families would be the ones killed when they we were flying those planes into buildings, huh? That they've given America reason to kill 500,000 of their people ?

People may be celebrating now, but name one way i which any person's life in the middle east has improved as a result of the attack. Not many, are there?

 

[Bee]

There is one thing in this terrorist attack that worries me. Why hasn't someone claimed responsibility?
If someone is "fighting for a cause" they always claim responsibility for whatever attack they have perpetrated. If the people responsible for the New York attack were so committed to their cause that they were not afraid to die for it, then why haven't they come forward?
If bin Laden is responsible why is he denying it? He has made no secret of the fact that he hates America and all it stands for, if he was behind this surely he would be taunting the Americans now with how easy it was for him to bring them to their knees.
Something doesn't seem right here. What if the Americans are blaming the wrong person and the guilty one is sitting back and waiting for the trouble to start? What if someone wanted to make it look like it is was bin Laden, so the Americans could vent their fury on Afghanistan?
God knows America has a lot of enemies.
Has anyone noticed how quiet Saddam Hussein has been?

 

[Blues_Brat]

Originally posted by Bee
Has anyone noticed how quiet Saddam Hussein has been?

Yes I have.

I've been saying for the last few days, I beleive it's highly likely he is behind it.

I don't think the American goverment really care who is exactly behind it. They just want to make someone pay for it and Osama bin Laden still hasn't been caught for his attacks on US interests overseas, so they'd love an excuse to throw everything at him.

A freind of mine went one further the night it happened. She beleives there are Americans behind it who have vested interests in starting a war. Could they go that far? Killing their own president is one thing (Kennedy), but this is huge.

 

[Dippers Donuts]

Originally posted by Bee
There is one thing in this terrorist attack that worries me. Why hasn't someone claimed responsibility?
If someone is "fighting for a cause" they always claim responsibility for whatever attack they have perpetrated. If the people responsible for the New York attack were so committed to their cause that they were not afraid to die for it, then why haven't they come forward?
If bin Laden is responsible why is he denying it? He has made no secret of the fact that he hates America and all it stands for, if he was behind this surely he would be taunting the Americans now with how easy it was for him to bring them to their knees.
Something doesn't seem right here. What if the Americans are blaming the wrong person and the guilty one is sitting back and waiting for the trouble to start? What if someone wanted to make it look like it is was bin Laden, so the Americans could vent their fury on Afghanistan?
God knows America has a lot of enemies.
Has anyone noticed how quiet Saddam Hussein has been?

There is now little doubt that Bin Laden was the mastermind behind this. He won't come out and admit responsibility; he never does. His modus Operandi is to admit to nothing. That way he gets blamed for all the things he did do and all the things he didn't do. He likes it that way; it adds to his mystique. There is mounting evidence that he is the mastermind behind this; although there is also little doubt that he has received assistance from his terrorist friends.
Saddam Hussein involved? Not sure; he may be mad but he aint dumb - if the yanks found any evidence of his involvement they would blow Iraq to kingdom come. He may have provided some ancilliary support (be it emotional or physical) but if he did you can bet he covered his tracks so it would be impossible to prove. Thus the yanks cant touch him. Unlike Bin Laden, he has territory/people/assets to protect.

 

[Joel]

You're just too good for us simple minded people, Joel =)

Westy Boy, what is that supposed to mean?