Time to stop talking the talk and delivering!

[theoneyed]

This year has been an extremely frustrating year as a loyal supporter of this proud Club. I have enjoyed the highs of defeating the wobbles and the Dirty Tiges twice and the lows of losing to teams we should not lose to such as Port, North and the bloody Saints AGAIN as well as some weak as piss team performances leaving me thinking that the rumors of us being down hill skiers warrant. Now, before you jump down my throat hear me out, I understand that injuries have curtailed some of our most structurally important players such as Waite, Murphy, Carazzo, Laidler and the list goes on, however, I feel that this excuse is not an excuse for our below par performance for a team touted as a real premiership chance not only by the media, but more importantly by OURSELVES.

Now this is my Beef. For the last few years I have noticed through out promotion, "We're Coming" and "Look whats Cooking" as well as in the media, Carlton has been happy to tout it's goals openly and I would say arrogantly about where we were hoping to finish. This has fueled the expectations of the supporters and increased the haters because really, who continually goes out there in the media and tells the rest of the footballing public that we EXPECT nothing less than a top four finish, which in real terms is saying we believe we are better than 12 other teams out there. This has continued for too long. We don't see champion teams talk the talk, they let their football do the talking. I never heard Brisbane, Geelong or Collingwood go out of their way to talk themselves up as much as Carlton has before a foty has even been kicked.

In the media this last week, all I have read about is Waite going on about lets take a gues, making the top 4 next year, Ratten still hoping that the year is not over by living in denial and stating that we can mathematically still make the eight and Robbinson who I love as a footballer stating that we are going to give the 8 a crack.

Well I have a suggestion, if you honestly believe that you can make the top 4 at seasons beginnings, or even the 8 by the end of this God awful season, please keep it too yourself. I am sick and tired of hearing Carlton pump up it's own tires only to go flat again. It is time we change our approach.

Who ever is in charge or educating our players with how to speak to the media, can we please include humility to the curriculum as I think it is time that Carlton forgets about the fact that we walked with a swagger in the 80's and early 90's that was 20 years ago and thats almost as long as the last time we were actually a team that proudly wore and played for the Navy Blue jumper.

Carlton get with the times. Yes "we are Carlton, **** the rest" however lets keep it inhouse. If you are going to talk the talk then make sure you can deliver the walk.

Go Blues!

 

[Tanks_Alot]

Come on guys he has a point here. We have spent too much time pumping ourselves up publicly which has backfired.

Yes it's great to set high standards for ourselves, but you can't just do it with your mouth and marketing, you need to go out there and do it. Too many games this year players played like as if they thought they had games won before the first bounce. Then when they were losing these games, they didn't up their intensity they were just waiting for something to happen.

I still reckon we just outright gave up in the following games when things didn't go our way:

Kangas, Hawks, Power & Crows.

That's 4 games too many for a team with a goal of finishing top 4 to have a full shot at a flag. All the other losses you could probably come up with acceptable reasons as to why we lost them:

Bombers - 3 significant first quarter injuries to Laidler, Yarran and Carrazzo. 2 of which took no further part in the game and Yarran ran it out without having anywhere near the impact he normally can have. We played a terrible second quarter because of this and that ultimately cost us the game. THird quarter we were dominating early on but missing all our shots at goal, then they take it to the other end and score, effectively killing our momentum and confidence in winning that day. Still they fought on in the last quarter without quiting. BUT intensity was lacking in htat match and we played well below our best.

Saints - Came out to beat us physically. Despite this we had more scoring shots we just failed to convert as well as they did. 19.8 to 14.14.

Cats - Another game where we had more chances to score than they did and another game where bad kicking at goal cost us.

Eagles - PLayed them up there with a host of players out (let's be fair they had quite a few of their best out as well) and got pretty close to winning in the end. Had the lead at 3qtr time IIRC, just lost intensity at the start of the last quarter which cost us as well as VERY dodgy umpiring but that's normal up there.

Then there's the Swans loss. I think it's fair to say we fought as hard as we possibly could with the available players we had. In the end we were missing too many classy and experienced players. Still we had periods where we were dominating play and I don't buy all this Swans weren't trying their best they did just enough crap. Look, if a team has a chance to thump another team, they do it, they don't take their foot off the pedal. The reason the Swans didn't look at their best was because we didn't allow them to.

So I agree with the OP, instead of saying crap like we plan to finish top 4 next year, just take it one at a time and give every game a red hot go as they come. If you build up too much hype and then fail to deliver on it, it only angers the supporters more and feeds the media more fuel to burn us with.

 

[The_Wookie]

we spend too much time pumping ourselves up? have you even read the forums this year since round 4?

 

[Dramoth]

we spend too much time pumping ourselves up? have you even read the forums this year since round 4?

well... some of the so called supporters around here seem to have their hands firmly attached to their personal self inflation handles and are pumping like crazy

 

[laminex]

well... some of the so called supporters around here seem to have their hands firmly attached to their personal self inflation handles and are pumping like crazy

I sure do... i mean they sure do

 

[what did you say]

would be great if people understood only one club win a flag a year

 

[Big Red is back]

I have no issue with the club telling the world we have high expectations, as they are merely stating what everyone knows. I recall the pies doing it the year they won the flag.

Words are irrelevant weather we said these things or not we would still be 9 wins 9 losses.

 

[Monkey King]

Well I have a suggestion, if you honestly believe that you can make the top 4 at seasons beginnings, or even the 8 by the end of this God awful season, please keep it too yourself. I am sick and tired of hearing Carlton pump up it's own tires only to go flat again. It is time we change our approach.

Yep! I agree with 100%. What a pity there are some who've posted their toss in your thread instead of giving your comments a serious response. I saw some article the other day about Carlton claiming they could make the top 4 in 2013. Just STFU about it for goodness sake. I don't care what questions you're being asked, please, for next season at least, can we just play a straight bat. Everyone knows Collingwood and Hawthorn are aiming for a top 4 and a flag, but they're not coming out and announcing it. I swear, Carlton are starting to look like one of those yapping little of dogs. Time to let action do all the talking.

 

[I bleed Blue]

Yep! I agree with 100%. What a pity there are some who've posted their toss in your thread instead of giving your comments a serious response. I saw some article the other day about Carlton claiming they could make the top 4 in 2013. Just STFU about it for goodness sake. I don't care what questions you're being asked, please, for next season at least, can we just play a straight bat. Everyone knows Collingwood and Hawthorn are aiming for a top 4 and a flag, but they're not coming out and announcing it. I swear, Carlton are starting to look like one of those yapping little of dogs. Time to let action do all the talking.

Yeah talk of top 4 in 2013 should be a total no go zone. FFS we arn't even finished season 2012 yet.

When asked about expectations for next year, just play the straight bat. "We are just going to take it one week at a time, blah blah blah"

Internally the club knows what they expect, supporters know what they expect.

 

[Jabba73]

The marketing department cannot be held accountable for on-field performance. Every self-respecting enterprise has goals that they expect to achieve internally. If having them publically stated puts you off your endeavours to achieve them, then there is a serious problem with your focus and ability to do your job which needs addressing.

Publically stated goals holds the players and coaches to account. If we had said nothing about trying to reach the top 4 this year, would anyone seriously be any happier with the results we had achieved? I believe there would still be plenty of scrutiny on the playing group and coaching staff as we were media darlings after round three and supposedly flag favourites. We didnt state this as a club, it was done for us.

Natural progression with a talented and youngish list should have meant we were aiming for improvement which could only be a top 4 finish in 2012 and the benefits associated with it. It doesn't matter whether we state it publically or not, it was expected by us and almost all neutral observers, so I am at a loss as to how it has hurt our ability to deliver it by being in the public domain.

Whether we make finals from here or not, the club will be holding people to account for failing to reach our aim of a top 4 finish. It would be the same circumstance even if we had not publically announced our goals at the start of the season. The rest is just media hype searching for a story to tell.

 

[Blue Flame]

Grammatically ambiguous really, many would argue that we have already stopped delivering.
OK that was my "toss."

The marketing is for supporters and to encourage membership and sponsorship, we can't simply say nothing at all. The marketing has to be out there to grab headlines. Having said that, I personally would like more silent determination and aggression from the coaches and players.
The flip side of that is that a number of big-name coaches were never shy about declaring their intentions.

 

[JustaBattler]

Getting belted by Port by 10 goals was rock bottom. Getting smashed in clearances week in week out is not good. Wasting forward 50 entries and low conversion ratios even worse.

Question is - how much is this an outcome of injury and how much is poor coaching? The fact that there is a question - is a negative.

btw in my opinion the OP is a clear troll for anyone that can read English - cows don't do the thread intro any justice we need bulls.

 

[Azul]

Yeah talk of top 4 in 2013 should be a total no go zone.

Top 4 my backside. We should be aiming for the premiership! 2014 is the absolute last year for a 'window' before GWS and GC dominate for 6 years.

With the revitalisation of Mclean, the de-Richmondification of Collins and the emergence of Watson, McInness, Bell, Bootsma, Dale and Casboult we'll be stronger than we were at the start of 2012 when everyone earmarked us as preliminary finalists.

Judd, Carrazzo, Waite, Scotland each have one good year left before injuries and senility kick in.

 

[Monkey King]

Internally the club knows what they expect, supporters know what they expect.

Yes. And that's all that should be required. Seeing the headline "Blues eye top four in 2013" had me a little worried, but knowing that's an editor's take, I thought I'd wait and see what the quotes actually said, hoping they wouldn't even resemble the headline. So I was a bit disappointed to see Waite saying "... we wanted to finish top four, it didn't go our way, but we're confident going into next year that it's still a massive chance".

I would prefer to see the club start rolling out some stock standard nuetral line about next year's aspirations and just get about the business of making it happen. Talking ourselves up at this point is going to achieve nothing, while a silent resolve within the group could be just what's needed.

 

[I bleed Blue]

Top 4 my backside. We should be aiming for the premiership! 2014 is the absolute last year for a 'window' before GWS and GC dominate for 6 years.

With the revitalisation of Mclean, the de-Richmondification of Collins and the emergence of Watson, McInness, Bell, Bootsma, Dale and Casboult we'll be stronger than we were at the start of 2012 when everyone earmarked us as preliminary finalists.

Judd, Carrazzo, Waite, Scotland each have one good year left before injuries and senility kick in.

I would love nothing more than to see us win the premiership next year. The club should be aiming for a premiership next year but keep the aim internal. Don't come out and tell the media we are aiming to win the flag this year. Making those statments just puts unnceccisary pressure on the club. Everyone involved knows thats the aim, and the club doesn't need the external media pressure of the situation.

I love the CFC and want nothing more than for the club to be succesful. Lets just 'keep a lid on it' so to speak.

 

[Azul]

Don't come out and tell the media we are aiming to win the flag this year. Making those statments just puts unnceccisary pressure on the club.

Sure but I think Ratts' public aim of reaching top 4 was blown out of proportion. We finished 5th last year, so finishing one spot higher was only natural progression.

We come from a lower base this time. Assuming we miss the finals, our public expectation will be to 'make the 8'.

 

[dumb]

i agree with the OP, but unfortunately things like next years expectations are selling points for memberships. of course, you can question someone's support if they need grandiose statements to prise membership dollars from them.

it's all a bit cry wolf, just meaningless. i don't know how this thread can be accused of having no substance... for some parts of this year we played as a team ahead of itself. we talk about making top 4 next year, and we'll start believing all over again that it's just going to fall into place for us. that someone else will make the tackle, or make the contest. more concentration on performing the basics that will help things like winning clearances, and less talk. talk doesn't get you a top 4 position.

 

[JuddFevGoal]

Getting belted by Port by 10 goals was rock bottom. Getting smashed in clearances week in week out is not good. Wasting forward 50 entries and low conversion ratios even worse.

Question is - how much is this an outcome of injury and how much is poor coaching? The fact that there is a question - is a negative.

btw in my opinion the OP is a clear troll for anyone that can read English - cows don't do the thread intro any justice we need bulls.

Port - Explanation - We got owned by a coach who has now been sacked by his own club.

 

[SE_Blue]

Wasn't too upset about us declaring our intentions for top 4 this year. Had been steadily improving every year since Judd came, finished 5th last year, naturally the next step was top 4. However things did not pan out (injuries, attitudes of players etc) and we now have to wear the egg on our face.

 

[kurandus]

How does what the club or players say publicly have any impact what so ever? We all want consistent effort and performances, and we all want the team to be imposing as in years gone by, and because of injury (mainly) and other factors presumably (overconfidence, loss of belief/confidence, whatever) it hasn't happened, they need to work to resolve it, no issue there, agree, but telling someone who isn't wearing a cfc polo we expect as a group to be good enough to be in the top few teams though, does not flick a switch and cause us to put in a poor performance. Would anyone in the entire football community of seriously thought anything other then the top4 was our aim this year if we hadn't stated it was so? No.

And no I don't want a drone army of scripted players roaming the media circuit, it's bad enough as it is already.

If that all then comes off as arrogant, then let it come off as arrogant. We are Carlton, 16 flags gives us the right to be arrogant, who do people want to be? Some afterthought like St. Kilda? We're going to cop it from all and sundry no matter what happens if we fuel it or not, because we are proud, we are hated, we are feared, and we are Carlton. The hate of the footy nation is what makes it all so god damn satisfying, and you know what, I wouldn't have it any other way.

 

[Blue Flame]

How does what the club or players say publicly have any impact what so ever? We all want consistent effort and performances, and we all want the team to be imposing as in years gone by, and because of injury (mainly) and other factors presumably (overconfidence, loss of belief/confidence, whatever) it hasn't happened, they need to work to resolve it, no issue there, agree, but telling someone who isn't wearing a cfc polo we expect as a group to be good enough to be in the top few teams though, does not flick a switch and cause us to put in a poor performance. Would anyone in the entire football community of seriously thought anything other then the top4 was our aim this year if we hadn't stated it was so? No.

And no I don't want a drone army of scripted players roaming the media circuit, it's bad enough as it is already.

If that all then comes off as arrogant, then let it come off as arrogant. We are Carlton, 16 flags gives us the right to be arrogant, who do people want to be? Some afterthought like St. Kilda? We're going to cop it from all and sundry no matter what happens if we fuel it or not, because we are proud, we are hated, we are feared, and we are Carlton. The hate of the footy nation is what makes it all so god damn satisfying, and you know what, I wouldn't have it any other way.

Great stuff kurandus, I couldn't agree more. would hope that our boys have the resilience to beat teams regardles of whatever the media are saying.

 

[Monkey King]

The marketing is for supporters and to encourage membership and sponsorship, we can't simply say nothing at all. The marketing has to be out there to grab headlines.

Even at at a marketing level, it's not going to achieve much to keep talking ourselves up and then not delivering - ie just one winning final over four years since telling everyone "we're coming". The marketing department is still part of the club and we need to have some uniformity in how we present ourselves. The I AM CARLTON was a great campaign for where the club is at IMO and I hope they can pull out an even better campaign without having to be controversial next year. One thing is certain, the best marketing campaign available in footy is winning a flag.

Having said that, I personally would like more silent determination and aggression from the coaches and players.

After the last few years, yes, that's what I'd like to start seeing too.

 

[I bleed Blue]

Sure but I think Ratts' public aim of reaching top 4 was blown out of proportion. We finished 5th last year, so finishing one spot higher was only natural progression.

We come from a lower base this time. Assuming we miss the finals, our public expectation will be to 'make the 8'.

Don't get me wrong, I was all for our aim of making the 4 this year. But after the year we have just gone through I just want to see us keep a lid on it next year. By all means I want us to have high expectations but lets just keep it in house.

We all know the media is going to blow things out of proportion so the key is to not give them any ammo

 

[JuddFevGoal]

The worst one by a country mile was 'Can you smell what the Blues are cooking?' What in the name of oblivion, were they thinking?

 

[Dramoth]

Wasn't too upset about us declaring our intentions for top 4 this year. Had been steadily improving every year since Judd came, finished 5th last year, naturally the next step was top 4. However things did not pan out (injuries, attitudes of players etc) and we now have to wear the egg on our face.

At least we weren't the west coke e-girls and after getting a couple of injuries, completely tanked for picks in a compromised draft and a gimme fixture list last year.