Tippett's Gone - READ RULES BEFORE POSTING

[FR0GGY]

as PJ said, its cost (you could buy a house with 300k) but i dont think it will significantly impact our future.

the money is nothing, the draft picks will, and don't underestimate what this has done to the supporter base

 

[FR0GGY]

trigg prefers europe from what ive heard

clubs arent allowed to pay players fines so i doubt they would be allowed to pay administrators.

The afc wouldn't be paying the fine directly, the club could just pay them more if they wanted too. There is no salary cap for administrators is there?

 

[Tex200]

Unless there is a separate "gentleman's agreement" the fine will not be a net cost to the club. Triggy would be on say $500K and Harper $200K. I doubt that Rob Chapman will be paid as the interim CEO and Noble might get a slightly bigger bonus. The savings from salary payments will add up to almost $300K.

The impact of the lost draft picks should be relatively moderate. We lost pick 20 this year but the second pick was quite low and as mentioned by others may have been used on Siggins. Hopefully the two picks next year will be around 16+ and in the mid 30's.

The big loss relates to Tippett. We should have been able to get a early first round draft pick for him (say pick 5 - 10) or a good player. Even worse, we have $850K unspent in our TPP. Yes, we can pay more upfront to some of the players to free up space in future years but if we had planned for Tippett's departure we could have targeted two good players and offered them more than their current club could afford.

It's especially hard to stomach when we could have traded last year.

Anyway if i think too much on that one I'll be up all night.

 

[crowsup]

Q1:- Did you, in 2009, think the club should do anything it can to retain Tippett?
( If you did and now call the people responsible cheats and incompetent, you're an hypocrite)
Q2:- Did you agree with the club, in 2011, when the club refused to deal with Brisbane when Brisbane refused to include one of the SA kids in the deal?
(If you did and now lament the loss of the picks offered and now blame Trigg et all for it, you are an hypocrite)
Q3:- Did you balk at the thought that the club would make a deal with Brisbane for pick 23 and Jess White?
(If you did and now whinge for losing Tippett for nothing, you're an hypocrite)
Q4:- Have you ever thought the club to be weak for not confronting the AFL on any point? Were you ever 'sick and tired' of barracking for a squeaky-clean team?
(If you did and now want the people that tried to get one over VLAD sacked, you are, once again, an hypocrite. Or, maybe you want them sacked for getting caught?)
Someone earliers said - let those without sin throw the first stone-
I say - I'm glad I'm not a member of your family and have, possibly, made a mistake.

 

[SpeciousArgument]

The afc wouldn't be paying the fine directly, the club could just pay them more if they wanted too. There is no salary cap for administrators is there?

im sure there would be a way they could work it (free toyota for example, or just cpi + 50k on his next contract) but if the AFL are specifically against it i think the club would be very careful about any emails they sent etc in light of recent developments im sure they could its just i think they'll be risk averse for a while

the money is nothing, the draft picks will, and don't underestimate what this has done to the supporter base

Not living in Adelaide i dont talk to many other supporters other than on here, where i assume the more engaged supporters are (hence theyre seeking other people to talk to in the offseason) like i said, if it impacts membership, attendances or sponsorship, i'll be concerned but so far i havent heard of any sponsors pulling out, its too early to tell about attendances and we'll know re memberships soon enough i imagine. clearly im speculating but i think we'll all get over it soon as round 1 starts.

 

[MRB37]

Certainly not enjoying them playing the victim. Almost as bad as Tippett.

 

[Creasy]

I really wish I was a large AFC sponsor for 2 reasons:
1. That's all the AFC seems to care about at the moment so I believe the truth would be a lot easier to get hold of.
2. It would mean I am rich.

 

[Draft Bored]

I'm going renew my Footy park membership, but I won't renew my Crows Gold membership, I'm also going to change the team i support on my membership to Port Power.

Good, I signed up for the first time a week ago and I'm trying to upgrade my seat. Where's yours located sook?

 

[SpeciousArgument]

I really wish I was a large AFC sponsor for 2 reasons:
1. That's all the AFC seems to care about at the moment so I believe the truth would be a lot easier to get hold of.
2. It would mean I am rich.

3. corporate box with snacks

 

[macca23]

im sure there would be a way they could work it (free toyota for example, or just cpi + 50k on his next contract) but if the AFL are specifically against it i think the club would be very careful about any emails they sent etc in light of recent developments im sure they could its just i think they'll be risk averse for a while

Not living in Adelaide i dont talk to many other supporters other than on here, where i assume the more engaged supporters are (hence theyre seeking other people to talk to in the offseason) like i said, if it impacts membership, attendances or sponsorship, i'll be concerned but so far i havent heard of any sponsors pulling out, its too early to tell about attendances and we'll know re memberships soon enough i imagine. clearly im speculating but i think we'll all get over it soon as round 1 starts.

I won't speak for others and I'd be interested in their comments, but clearly I "mix" with 2 diametrically opposed groups of supporters.


It would be fair to say that most posters on Adelaide's BigFooty Board see what has happened as very significant in the life of the club. They care, one way or the other and want to have their say either just here or elsewhere. A handful have stated that they won't be renewing their membership, which is their right, though I cannot fathom any semblance of common sense or logic in the one that says he is going to nominate that he is a Port supporter


In direct contrast, in the real world, the average Adelaide supporter, who doesn't blog on BigFooty isn't overly interested in this case at all or the reasons why it happened. I've discussed the Tippett saga with many such supporters I haven't spoken to one such supporter that is going to chuck in their membership.


With Adelaide Oval on the horizon, I think there's a good chance that we'll have more members, not less, because it helps gets them to be a member at Adelaide Oval.

The sponsors have stood fat and our supporters are sticking as well. I don't think there will be very much collateral damage at all resulting from the offences for which we were found guillty.

 

[Wright Away]

The clowns have shown there true colours over the last couple of pages, it was pretty clear what I said, but some people have a hard time understanding simple concepts. I said in my post that I am going to renew my footy park membership, but switch the team i support on that membership to the power, now with ultimate now premier memberships which include all 22 games at Footy Park you can elect which team you support and in turn you get counted in their membership. I said I would switch that to the Power, doesn't mean i am going to stop going to Crows games. Though it was fun watching some of you have a tantrum over it. For a bunch of sycophants you don't know much about the football memberships, for shame.

 

[Draft Bored]

the money is nothing, the draft picks will, and don't underestimate what this has done to the supporter base

You are kidding yourself if you think the supporter base is going to take a hit. I signed up for the first time because of this and our awesome young team. I've never paid attention in the offseason or supported the team more then watching them on TV.

And moving to Adelaide oval... yeah we sure are going to lack support there...

The pessimists in this thread need to move on. It's done. Shut up or be positive because the players and the team need our support. The more negative you are about this, the more negative it looks. Realistically it's not that bad. Yes it's bad but you are turning it into a cancer. The media has moved on, other team's supporters have moved on and now you need to do the same or seriously take your membership, tear it up and support another South Australian team.

 

[Draft Bored]

The clowns have shown there true colours over the last couple of pages, it was pretty clear what I said, but some people have a hard time understanding simple concepts. I said in my post that I am going to renew my footy park membership, but switch the team i support on that membership to the power, now with ultimate now premier memberships which include all 22 games at Footy Park you can elect which team you support and in turn you get counted in their membership. I said I would switch that to the Power, doesn't mean i am going to stop going to Crows games. Though it was fun watching some of you have a tantrum over it. For a bunch of sycophants you don't know much about the football memberships, for shame.

Why say it at all?

And when did the word 'sycophant' become cool. I must have missed the memo.

 

[Thylacinus]

I heard the 5AA interviews tonight and couldn't believe what I was hearing. WE have a CEO who can't handle pressure. It was acknowledged that what was done was dumb, but by keeping Trigg on we have not learnt. That is a totally dumb move that will bite us. He is a lame duck CEO. I have not altered my view...he will not/cannot survive, unless we wan't to destroy the club. It was admitted that keeping him on is not an orthodox move. It is now obvious that Chapman and the borad have serious issues. Chapman has also lied as we have not got the full story as he said we would. Tippett is a hero for standing up to this incompetent bunch of delusional destroyers of the AFC. Today marks a very sad chapter in the history of this club. I am flabergastered at the denial that is going to cost us even more deeply than what we have seen already. Unbelievable! This is not about vengance...just a bit of accountability and proper procedure!

Dumb, Chapman. Dumb, dumb, dumb...and weak as you know what!

 

[Creasy]

3. corporate box with snacks

how could I forget that? I was going to say don't forget to mention the free alcohol but in a roundabout way, you are paying for it.

 

[SpeciousArgument]

The clowns have shown there true colours over the last couple of pages, it was pretty clear what I said, but some people have a hard time understanding simple concepts. I said in my post that I am going to renew my footy park membership, but switch the team i support on that membership to the power, now with ultimate now premier memberships which include all 22 games at Footy Park you can elect which team you support and in turn you get counted in their membership. I said I would switch that to the Power, doesn't mean i am going to stop going to Crows games. Though it was fun watching some of you have a tantrum over it. For a bunch of sycophants you don't know much about the football memberships, for shame.

youre going to be a port member and everyone else are the clowns?

 

[Draft Bored]

I heard the 5AA interviews tonight and couldn't believe what I was hearing. WE have a CEO who can't handle pressure. It was acknowledged that what was done was dumb, but by keeping Trigg on we have not learnt. That is a totally dumb move that will bite us. He is a lame duck CEO. I have not altered my view...he will not/cannot survive, unless we wan't to destroy the club. It was admitted that keeping him on is not an orthodox move. It is now obvious that Chapman and the borad have serious issues. Chapman has also lied as we have not got the full story as he said we would. Tippett is a hero for standing up to this incompetent bunch of delusional destroyers of the AFC. Today marks a very sad chapter in the history of this club. I am flabergastered at the denial that is going to cost us even more deeply than what we have seen already. Unbelievable! This is not about vengance...just a bit of accountability and proper procedure!

Dumb, Chapman. Dumb, dumb, dumb...and weak as you know what!

I switched off at the bolded part.

Tippett is a hero.... how deluded are you?! And "for standing up to them"...? Need I remind you how this begun? The AFC dragged him into it by confessing to the AFL at which point his father threatened to sue pretty much everyone.

He is AS GUILTY as the crows.

How exactly is he a hero troll? Actually nevermind, please see my above post:

The pessimists in this thread need to move on. It's done. Shut up or be positive because the players and the team need our support. The more negative you are about this, the more negative it looks. Realistically it's not that bad. Yes it's bad but you are turning it into a cancer. The media has moved on, other team's supporters have moved on and now you need to do the same or seriously take your membership, tear it up and support another South Australian team.

 

[boffo]

Does anyone have a link or can summarise what Demetriou had to say?

That yes, we are cheats.

 

[boffo]

I personally dont think what we've lost is that significant.

The picks weve lost are fairly speculative at a time when we have a strong young list.

The way i look at it now is that his good performances for many years and relatively minor inconvenience of the penalties warrants Trigg being granted a second chance.

This is the sort of thinking that makes me shake my head. 'Minor inconvenience' of losing 5-6 first and second round draft picks. Please go back to 2009 and 2010, see who we picked up with our fist and second round draft picks and then come back and tell us this is only a minor inconvenience.

The draft penalties will hurt the club starting in 2-3 times and lasting a decade.

And the dumb-incompetent people who caused it are still drawing a massive salary from the club.

 

[boffo]

That was my point. The CEO has ultimate responsibility in hiring (and firing) the people who pick the team.

Anyway, I'm clearly fraying a few nerves, so I'll unsubscribe from this thread now. So unless someone replies to me or tags me in I won't be participating further. All the best guys and gals.

You have been one of the quality posters on this thread, on behalf of the sceptics, sincere thanks for your input. You can see through the bullsh1t the club is now spinning to preserve the status quo.

 

[boffo]

Q1:- Did you, in 2009, think the club should do anything it can to retain Tippett?
( If you did and now call the people responsible cheats and incompetent, you're an hypocrite)
Q2:- Did you agree with the club, in 2011, when the club refused to deal with Brisbane when Brisbane refused to include one of the SA kids in the deal?
(If you did and now lament the loss of the picks offered and now blame Trigg et all for it, you are an hypocrite)
Q3:- Did you balk at the thought that the club would make a deal with Brisbane for pick 23 and Jess White?
(If you did and now whinge for losing Tippett for nothing, you're an hypocrite)
Q4:- Have you ever thought the club to be weak for not confronting the AFL on any point? Were you ever 'sick and tired' of barracking for a squeaky-clean team?
(If you did and now want the people that tried to get one over VLAD sacked, you are, once again, an hypocrite. Or, maybe you want them sacked for getting caught?)
Someone earliers said - let those without sin throw the first stone-
I say - I'm glad I'm not a member of your family and have, possibly, made a mistake.

With respect crowsup, your questions are the wrong questions. In 2009 we didn't know what the club knew about Tippett's homesickness and that we'd made promises to him that were against the AFL's rules. I think it is as weak as you know what for Triggy to blame the supporters for putting pressure on them to retain Tippett. It just confirms my view that our management is weak and lacks judgement.

 

[cmndstab]

I don't understand your post at all, crowsup.

Q1:- Did you, in 2009, think the club should do anything it can to retain Tippett?
( If you did and now call the people responsible cheats and incompetent, you're an hypocrite)

I wanted the club to do "anything" (obviously not actually anything, I didn't want them to offer him $4M/year) to retain him, yes. Obviously though, I wanted them to stick within the rules when they did it. When they failed to do so they were clearly either deliberately cheating, or incompetent. I don't find this to be a hypocritical viewpoint at all.

Q2:- Did you agree with the club, in 2011, when the club refused to deal with Brisbane when Brisbane refused to include one of the SA kids in the deal?
(If you did and now lament the loss of the picks offered and now blame Trigg et all for it, you are an hypocrite)

I agreed fully, and would have been furious had they accepted the deal. However, this viewpoint was formed without knowledge of the secret deal. Having held that view then does not make me a hypocrite. Had the deal not been in place, then turning Brisbane's offer down would have been the correct move, in my opinion.

Q3:- Did you balk at the thought that the club would make a deal with Brisbane for pick 23 and Jess White?
(If you did and now whinge for losing Tippett for nothing, you're an hypocrite)

Yes, I did. And I'm very disappointed that, because we signed an illegal deal, we lost the right to trade for Tippett. I don't see how that makes me a hypocrite.

Q4:- Have you ever thought the club to be weak for not confronting the AFL on any point? Were you ever 'sick and tired' of barracking for a squeaky-clean team?
(If you did and now want the people that tried to get one over VLAD sacked, you are, once again, an hypocrite. Or, maybe you want them sacked for getting caught?)

I want my club to stand up to the AFL, to stop taking shit lying down. I don't want them to break the rules and set ourselves up for nigh-unprecedented sanctions! This doesn't make me a hypocrite either, though perhaps this point doesn't apply to me in the strict sense of what you've written.

Someone earliers said - let those without sin throw the first stone-
I say - I'm glad I'm not a member of your family and have, possibly, made a mistake.

Look, I'm not trying to claim that I'm perfect. Nor am I trying to claim that Trigg is a bad person. What I am saying is that we are in the business of elite sports. If you make significant errors, you fall behind the pack and it can be nearly impossible to even catch back up again, let alone be one of the leaders of the pack.

Trigg's actions have caused significant detriment to the club. Whether it be a purposeful attempt to cheat the system, or just simple incompetence (I believe it to be a combination of the two) is really not that important. His actions have damaged the club significantly. Keeping him on at this point is ridiculous - one, because it allows a man whose judgement has proven to be questionable to remain in a vital position in the club, and two, because it gives the public impression that we don't care about what has been done.



I'm not saying I would have done any better than Trigg has in the role. In fact, I'm 100% certain I wouldn't have. But that's not good enough. We wouldn't keep a player on the list just because he's a better footballer than I am. He would have to be sufficiently capable compared to his peers. So then why would we keep a CEO, one of the most important people in the club, on our books who has opened our club up to the second-worst sanctions in AFL history? His performance, his choices, have damaged the club severely, and yet we're backing him to the hilt in a unanimous show of supporter! It's so absurd that it defies belief, and holding that view does not make me a hypocrite in the slightest.

 

[boffo]

I've now had time to listen to the Chapman interviews on 5AA breakfast, 891 breakfast and Chapman and Trigg on 5AA drive time. Plus we have feedback from members who Chappie has phoned.

A few observations:

1. Chappie is showing much over-due respect to supporters. He could bunker down and not bother communicating with members, so full marks for taking the time to put himself about. So far so good.

2. However, this is being done after making the decision to retain Trigg...so I can't help but think the club doesn't really care about our thoughts but is only worried about losing members.

3. On air, Chappie is not arrogant or aggressive; he is conciliatory. He usually accepts some part of the criticism implied in a question in a very reasonable and disarming way but.... then adds some points that are not really answering the question asked but skillfully redirect the questioner's thinking. There are no short direct answers, he is really very good, he keeps talking so there are no quick follow-up questions. All this is what you would expect from someone who makes a living from winning people's confidence.

4. However, when you analyse what he has actually said there is often a lot of spin. For example, there was a question on the 891 breakfast show about the impact on the club of the $300,000 fine and lawyers' fees. Chappie said it won't be paid with 'members or sponsors money', it will be paid from 'accumulated reserves from commercial ventures' (or words to that effect). This definitely sounds like spin to me. Surely, it's all money the club won't be able to use for a better purpose, money we have wasted defending incompetent management. I found it insulting that he would think he could get away with this spin so members don't feel their membership fees are being used to pay lawyers and the fine.

5. On another occasion Chappie said 'I've got every player saying keep Triggy'. Really Rob, you've spoken to every player, previously you named just three players who had told you they wanted to retain Trigg.

6. As I said, kudos to him for being accessible to members, even though belatedly, but I can't help but think he is just very good at polishing a turd......but it's still a turd.

Despite your work trying to win us sceptics back Rob, I am still not happy. You had the chance to move the club on, to make a fresh start with new leadership and you stuck with the status quo.

As for Triggy's interview on 5AA, I was disappointed with his self-justifying demeanour. Incredibly, at one point he said he didn't sack Rendell, 'he resigned', and then a minute later said it was a 'really hard thing to do'. Wait, didn't you just say he resigned, and then you say it was hard to sack him. WTF?

Come on Triggy, you've had a good go, please step aside for the good of the club.

 

[dazz69au]

Would there be anything from the afl to stop us paying them double for next year to cover there 2 and 6 month Vanuatu trips?

So we would pay them extra for the good job they did in getting the club sanctions and them getting the suspensions in the first place?

 

[jenny61_99]

Why say it at all?

And when did the word 'sycophant' become cool. I must have missed the memo.

Apparently when it was used to refer to me some years ago by the lord of darkness, he who must not be named, crow mo. Ever since then it is brought out on occasion by his followers.