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NWO/Illuminati US politics - Pt 6

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jatz14 said:
To your most relevant point. The answer is yes, I do believe having a child in another country and then bringing it back to China lets you escape those penalties. Because, if the child gets CITIZENSHIP, then in fact, they do not get those penalties.
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In light of that mistaken belief and your view that the news report video I posted has misinterpreted the motives of any Chinese who got involved with the whole 'Birth Tourism' saga, can I say how sad it is that the lawyer acting for Dongyuan Li didn't hire you as an expert witness for the defense rather than getting his client to plead guilty to two charges while in the process, admitting to ....

(1) "assisting pregnant foreign nationals – typically from China – to travel to and remain in the United States to give birth so their children would receive birthright U.S. citizenship ... charging each customer between $40,000 and $80,000, receiving $3 million in international wire transfers from China in two years.

(2) Coaching customers to make "false statements on their visa applications and to U.S. immigration officials" as well as advising them on "how to pass the U.S. Consulate interview in China, including by falsely stating that they were going to stay in the United States for only two weeks, when in reality, they planned to stay for up to three months to give birth."

(3) "bypass U.S. immigration controls by booking two flights – the first from China to Hawaii and the second from Hawaii to Los Angeles International Airport – because they thought it would be easier to clear U.S. Customs through Hawaii. Li’s customers also were coached how to trick U.S. Customs at ports of entry by concealing their pregnancies, according to the plea agreement."

I'm sure lawyers acting for 18 other people similarly charged would have appreciated your help also.

www.ice.gov

Archived: Chinese national pleads guilty to running 'birth tourism' scheme that helped aliens give birth in US to secure birthright citizenship

Dongyuan Li (李冬媛), 41, of Irvine, pleaded guilty to one count of conspiracy to commit immigration fraud and one count of visa fraud. Li was one of 19 defendants named in a series of indictments unsealed earlier this year which resulted from an massive probe by ICE's HSI Los Angeles and IRS...
www.ice.gov www.ice.gov

Also while we're speaking of law and justice can you tell me what you think of Biden's pardoning of hunter and Fauci et al in light of the fact that a few years ago you argued that the Supreme Court held in Burdick v. United States that acceptance of a pardon carries an "imputation of guilt" and is a confession to such guilt.
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/236/79/
 
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HitTheNailOnTheHead said:
In light of that mistaken belief and you view that the news report video I posted has misinterpreted the motives of any Chinese who got involved with the whole 'Birth Tourism' saga, can I say how sad it is that the lawyer acting for Dongyuan Li didn't hire you as an expert witness for the defense rather than getting his client to plead guilty to two charges and admit to

(1) "assisting pregnant foreign nationals – typically from China – to travel to and remain in the United States to give birth so their children would receive birthright U.S. citizenship ... charging each customer between $40,000 and $80,000, receiving $3 million in international wire transfers from China in two years.

(2) Coaching customers to make "false statements on their visa applications and to U.S. immigration officials" as well as advising them on "how to pass the U.S. Consulate interview in China, including by falsely stating that they were going to stay in the United States for only two weeks, when in reality, they planned to stay for up to three months to give birth."

(3) "bypass U.S. immigration controls by booking two flights – the first from China to Hawaii and the second from Hawaii to Los Angeles International Airport – because they thought it would be easier to clear U.S. Customs through Hawaii. Li’s customers also were coached how to trick U.S. Customs at ports of entry by concealing their pregnancies, according to the plea agreement."

I'm sure lawyers acting for 18 other people similarly charged would have appreciated you help also.

www.ice.gov

Archived: Chinese national pleads guilty to running 'birth tourism' scheme that helped aliens give birth in US to secure birthright citizenship

Dongyuan Li (李冬媛), 41, of Irvine, pleaded guilty to one count of conspiracy to commit immigration fraud and one count of visa fraud. Li was one of 19 defendants named in a series of indictments unsealed earlier this year which resulted from an massive probe by ICE's HSI Los Angeles and IRS...
www.ice.gov www.ice.gov

Also while we're speaking of law and justice can you tell me what you think of Biden's pardoning of hunter and Fauci et al in light of the fact that a few years ago you argued that the Supreme Court held in Burdick v. United States that acceptance of a pardon carries an "imputation of guilt" and is a confession to such guilt.
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/236/79/
Click to expand...
Circle, circle, circle, gurgle, gurgle, gurgle.

1. The essence of our argument, which you seem to have missed is MOTIVATION, not LEGALITY. I would not be a witness for the defence, because I am not saying nothing illegal occurred. I am saying, they did it to get around Chinese one child policies, not to create voters, which you are implying. And which you are implying by incorrectly suggesting that they would have no other reason to do this, as they would be penalised anyway, when they would not.

I would also point out, that I am Australian, and do not in fact care about US citizenship law at all. Couldn't give a ****. If they want to make it that only Orange billionaires that have been president are allowed to be citizens, or if they decide that anyone that can even spell America is a citizen, good luck to them, don't care. However, given that US citizenship is written into the US constitution, in a very very unambiguous and undisputable way, and given how very important the constitution is to Republicans, I am surprised you are not outraged at attacks on this aspect of the constitution.

The US gives birth right citizenships, Chinese individuals have tried to make use of this. If they broke the law, charge them, but I dont really care either way.

2. See 1. Dont care. Charge them.
Are you angry that they are law breakers? Or are you angry that they are part of some CCP plot to put foreign nationals on American electoral rolls?

As for the rest
imputation of guilt, to what charge?

See, this relates to when the world was normal. And under normal circumstances I would agree.
However, when you have a president that has both openly stated that he would, and has openly used the DOJ to go after people he has felt personally wronged by, irrespective of whether any valid evidence of a crime exists, then things become a little different.

Using presidential powers such as presidential pardons, to head of personal vendettas by people willing to attack people using the power of the state is a deeply deeply disturbing situation.

But I am more disturbed by the president that made it necessary than I am by the president that carried it out.
 
jatz14 said:
I am saying, they did it to get around Chinese one child policies ...
Click to expand...

I disagree. For a number of reasons.

(1) I don't think they could escape all the penalties associated with having a second child just by having it in the US. From what I've read they still faced most if not all of the same penalties when they returned to China. If you're relying on a source that tells you otherwise please provide a link.

(2) Your claim fails basic logic. In most cases the fees paid to the Birth Tourism Agency (which according to the court case I linked to were $40-$80,000 US) would be more than the main financial penalty the 'Social Maintenance Fee' for most people. Not to mention the cost of return air flights for the family members involved, accommodation etc.

(3) If the motivation for Birth Tourism involvement wasn't in order to obtain birthright citizenship with all the future benefits that would entail including easy access to US university study when the child finished school and possible extended family immigration once they were studying in the US but was instead purely to escape the penalties associated with the one child policy ---- why did Birth Tourism remain popular with Chinese nationals well after 2016 when the policy ceased? Why in fact was it still popular in 2024 and early 2025?
 
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HitTheNailOnTheHead said:
I disagree. For a number of reasons.

(1) I don't think they could escape all the penalties associated with having a second child just by having it in the US. From what I've read they still faced most if not all of the same penalties when they returned to China. If you're relying on a source that tells you otherwise please provide a link.

(2) Your claim fails basic logic. In most cases the fees paid to the Birth Tourism Agency (which according to the court case I linked to were $40-$80,000 US) would be more than the main financial penalty the 'Social Maintenance Fee' for most people. Not to mention the cost of return air flights for the family members involved, accommodation etc.

(3) If the motivation for Birth Tourism involvement wasn't in order to obtain birthright citizenship with all the future benefits that would entail including easy access to US university study when the child finished school and possible extended family immigration once they were studying in the US but was instead purely to escape the penalties associated with the one child policy ---- why did Birth Tourism remain popular with Chinese nationals well after 2016 when the policy ceased? Why in fact was it still popular in 2024 and early 2025?
Click to expand...
Because the American constitution allows for birthright tourism.

In fact, even if the Chinese people that did it are found guilty of exploiting immigration law, that still doesnt change the status of their children.

The constitution allowing for birth right citizenship was written before passports and most immigration control. They wrote it when anyone who could afford passage could come to the US, for any reason.

If Trump, or Miller, or anyone else in the GOP doesnt like it, then they need to get the constitution changed.

But they will not even try, they will try to undermine the constitution instead, because they are the sort of people that hate government over reach when not in power, and hate any restrictions on their power, including constitutional, when in power.

I still think the driver of it was the one child policy, I dont doubt its not the sole purpose of every person, or even a reason, for every person.

But, this is the kicker.

If your right, and they are doing it for the benefits being a US citizen brings their children, so what? Its US law, and the US constitution.

Its why I have no truck with people in Australia that are angry at immigrants because they think there are too many. They are here under our laws. They are here because we run a country like a ponzi scheme, and we need a constantly rising population to keep the economy above water. We are the reason they are here, there is no point being upset at the immigrants we invited and allowed, they havent done anything wrong.

If the US constitution specifically allows for birth right citizenship, there is no point being angry at the Chinese that try to have children in the US. Change the constitution.

As I said before, I dont actually care, its their country. If they want to make it harder to be a US citizen, I have no problem with that.
 
jatz14 said:
The constitution allowing for birth right citizenship was written before passports and most immigration control. They wrote it when anyone who could afford passage could come to the US, for any reason.
Click to expand...
. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
 
faux boi talking about 2nd rescued airman

In that moment of isolation and danger, his faith and fighting spirit shone through. You see, shot down on a Friday. Good Friday. Hidden in a cave, a crevice, all of Saturday. And rescued on Sunday. Flown out of Iran as the sun was rising on Easter Sunday. A pilot reborn, all home and accounted for, a nation rejoicing. God is good.

Despite incoming fire and unforgiving conditions, air troops brought every American home. No American lives were lost, and we leave no man behind. And that is not luck. It’s the result of unmatched training, superior technology, and unbreakable warrior ethos and sheer American grit.
 

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Hydatina Physis said:
You get a large amount of people gathering in one spot and there's a good chance once they disperse, the area will have litter all over the joint. Humans are trash, it's what we do, it's not exclusive to manufactured sides and it's certainly pretty ****ing low on the discussion worthy spectrum.

Much larger issues surely.
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He got what he wanted out of it - an extended multi page deflectory tangent on an absolute nothing "issue" while avoiding talking about the Iran war, Epstein, dear leader's continuing and obvious slide into full blown dementia etc.

One can only hope he's getting a few rubles for these efforts lol
 

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So Cranky, how are we doing with this?

HitTheNailOnTheHead said:
Thank you. I will digest all of that. It's a lot better than the evidence bourbons put forward for the proposition Trump is more corrupt than firstly Nancy and then Biden. EDIT: I spoke to soon. He's now put forward the proposition that Trump's dealings with Sheikh Tahnoon bin Zayed Al Nahyan are corrupt so I'll look into that as well.
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You'll never imagine my surprise when I logged in and caught up this morning, and found your considered good faith response to these examples of corruption nowhere to be seen despite you promising such a response in the Biden Crime Family thread.

Not like you to lie, mate :tearsofjoy:
 
bourbons said:
So Cranky, how are we doing with this?



You'll never imagine my surprise when I logged in and caught up this morning, and found your considered good faith response to these examples of corruption nowhere to be seen despite you promising such in the Biden Crime Family thred. Not like you to lie, mate :tearsofjoy:
Click to expand...

That's funny, I don't remember putting a time frame on it. Anyway, not quite finished yet mate but stick around, it will be worth the wait.
 
Lebbo73 said:
You’ve misinterpreted my post Muff. Mal accused me of being anti-Semitic but disappeared when you fellas criticised Israel.
Click to expand...
Speaking of disappearing, you disappeared shortly after I asked you this;
bourbons said:
Lebbo73 old son, in addition to letting us know if you believe Joe Biden is corrupt, please let us know if think Nancy Pelosi is too.
Click to expand...

Any danger?
 
darrenmorgan said:
tough guy TACO Trump has extended the deadline....again...
Click to expand...
Source?

This is The Guardian (font of all knowledge for you guys surely) 5 minutes ago - "He also reiterated a deadline of 8pm ET on Tuesday for the regime to reopen the strait of Hormuz or face a barrage of strikes on energy facilities and bridges."
 

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