Vent Thread

[Decipher]

Do non religious people take any meaning from Christmas

I dont like weighing in on relgious debates but im an atheist. I personally dont take any significance from anyday other than Anzac day. You cant go past the real sacrifices made by Australians to protect us and our way of life. Christmas, Easter, Valentines day are all just commercialised events with no significance to me personally.

 

[happy_eagle]

Ive seen these arguments every year on Bigfooty, and none of them ever conclude

I just wanted to express the other side of oppinion on the issue, that on a football forum of football fans isnt usually expressed

Anyway onto DT matters
Hopefully i dont have to vent at Pendlebury tomorow, and Riewoldt as captain

 

[WoGiTaLiA]

Do non religious people take any meaning from Christmas

Define meaning? I gather with my family, we exchange gifts and we eat but that is more because it is what we do than any religious founding. I mean we do all but the gift part on boxing day as well.

We don't do any soul searching, suddenly start saying prayers or grace or anything like that if that is what you are getting at. It's a holiday that we embrace the corporate side of, as is Easter and the chocolate involved.

 

[happy_eagle]

Yep it appears that Commercialism has given non Catholics a reason to celebrate religious ceremonies
Not that theres anything wrong with that

 

[Crow-mo]

Perhaps it was a deliberate use of the word to help your argument, but I suggest you check the definition of "sect" mate. I believe you've used it incorrectly here in the context of the discussion on not playing footy on Good Friday.

nonsense. not only is that pointless and pedantic, its also wrong.

more to the point, it is also irrelevant as it changes nothing unless secular also has a different meaning too.

 

[Crow-mo]

Good Friday is far from a celebration
It is a day of deep reflection and darkness (even for those non religious)

NO ITS NOT.

it has certain meaning for one particular group of people, none of whom are afforded any priority in our society. it means nothing at all, to anyone of any different persuasion.

There are games on Easter Sunday, because that is seen as a celebration of the rising of christ, and football is seen as an activity of celebration and entertainment.

only to you, and your particular beliefs. you do not represent the views of the secular state.

Solem days such as Good Friday are meant to be meaningful and reflective days, where those with faith can truly devote their love to God. For non religious people, it gives them a day to reflect with themselves within, and evaluate their own lives

for non christian people its merely one of the allocated public holidays.

and christian ideology has no greater primacy than hindu, judaism, or even the wonks who mark jedi down on their census forms.

this is a point of fact, and no opinion. this is mandated by the constitutional separation of church and state, not your opinion.

The AFL feel as though staging an AFL game, would prevent both Christian people, and non Christians from using this day to reflect, and do not feel as though a celebratory entertaining game of football is needed, on what is a dark and spiritual day for a large majority.

It would be like the Americans organizing a large sporting event on September 11, or Poland playing a soccer match against Germany on the anniversary of its invasion.

Although some of us dont understand alot about the Christian faith, and dont believe, we should all acknowledge that it does mean alot to some people (just look at events like world youth day), and surely the rights and demands of these Christians can be followed for one day. After all we have Labour Day, Fathers Day/Mothers Day, ANZAC day etc...

Its irrelevant whether you believe or not

this is just you talking about why your beliefs matter. and they do to you, no argument there. but no more than that.

only the last sentence is applicable to the debate however.

 

[Crow-mo]

Do non religious people take any meaning from Christmas

you mean the pagan holiday that is not the birth of christ, but merely the appropriation of an existing festival day for convenience purposes.

the 25th of december is a pagan, not christian day.

http://www.essortment.com/all/christmaspagan_rece.htm

http://www.zenzibar.com/articles/christmas.asp

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/special_report/for_christmas/_new_year/pagan_christmas/37276.stm

 

[Crow-mo]

Yep it appears that Commercialism has given non Catholics a reason to celebrate religious ceremonies
Not that theres anything wrong with that

catholism isn't christianity, and christmas (under a different name) existed long before christianity.

 

[Hannabal]

Melbourne is a multicultural city

Which of course is one of Keating's legacies.

And before the nuffies on here get flustered, let me say that I'm all for immigration, but I don't in any way embrace "multiculturism".

 

[WandallBone]

Which of course is one of Keating's legacies.

And before the nuffies on here get flustered, let me say that I'm all for immigration, but I don't in any way embrace "multiculturism".

please explain

 

[Hannabal]

please explain

The idea that a Govt should embrace a policy whereby diversity of cultures is keenly sought to benignly co-exist with often opposing cultures yet somehow prosper and positively interrelate and influence each other is naive in the extreme.

There have been studies that argue MC adversely affects democracy and social trust.

Imo, it's a very flawed concept. And one that is already showing its ill conceived consequences in today's society.

I hope that helps.

 

[Lakey91]

No problem with religious people choosing to reflect(or non-religious for that matter) but to force that activity on others would just be to reinforce the negative outlook that many take towards the church and to force people to not have football is pretty close to being just that. Basically saying this is "our" holiday, screw the rest of you, you can either do what we are doing or nothing.

Ok Wogitalia - Ill give you a trade off. Ill give you your AFL game on the friday, and I wont force the "religious" stuff on you (as you ask). For the reason that the "religious" stuff doesn't mean anything to you (or you would rather it wasn't forced on society), I think that you wont need a public holiday on friday and monday. Oh, and no footy on monday either since its just any other day. Itll just be your normal weekend to keep you happy.

Meanwhile, I think Im just going to respect the customs of christianity, have a nice quiet night on the friday, enjoy the extra 2 days off, and enjoy the footy on thursday and monday.

 

[Hannabal]

Ok Wogitalia - Ill give you a trade off. Ill give you your AFL game on the friday, and I wont force the "religious" stuff on you (as you ask). For the reason that the "religious" stuff doesn't mean anything to you (or you would rather it wasn't forced on society), I think that you wont need a public holiday on friday and monday. Oh, and no footy on monday either since its just any other day. Itll just be your normal weekend to keep you happy.

Meanwhile, I think Im just going to respect the customs of christianity, have a nice quiet night on the friday, enjoy the extra 2 days off, and enjoy the footy on thursday and monday.

I like the boy.

 

[Kenny_01]

Don't we have a seperate board for religion?

I for one logged in to amuse myself by people who started Warnock over Hille, selected Clark over Sandi and/or traded out J Brown last minute, not to read about the meaning of Good Friday.

 

[Bert1]

Don't we have a seperate board for religion?

I for one logged in to amuse myself by people who started Warnock over Hille, selected Clark over Sandi and/or traded out J Brown last minute, not to read about the meaning of Good Friday.

Take your complaints to the appropriate vent thread... Oh wait.

 

[Jars458]

Ok Wogitalia - Ill give you a trade off. Ill give you your AFL game on the friday, and I wont force the "religious" stuff on you (as you ask). For the reason that the "religious" stuff doesn't mean anything to you (or you would rather it wasn't forced on society), I think that you wont need a public holiday on friday and monday. Oh, and no footy on monday either since its just any other day. Itll just be your normal weekend to keep you happy.

he extra 2 days off, and enjoy the footy on thursday and monday.

That is such a flawed argument. Historically the days off were becasue of the christian meaning given to Easter. Over the years for most they have just become public holidays and a chance to have an extended break.

They are now part of the working conditions of all Australian workers and rightly so. Work life balance is important and Easter plays a major part. The religous basis of the holidya is now irrelevnat to many and society in general puts more store on chocolate eggs than on what are in my view mythical stories.

I will happily take the two days off and happily go to the footy on good friday even though I don't believe in God.

Footy should be played on good friday.

 

[JimmyRecard]

Mitch Clark nuff said

 

[Thorgils]

Damn you Clark you promised me elite and gave me mediocrity.

 

[Bert1]

Damn you Clark you promised me elite and gave me mediocrity.

Chin up Thorgils.
He could end up a straight swap upgrade for those with Hille etc.
Well, he'd have to show signs of improving before I'd bother giving him a look in at this stage but.

 

[Skeeta Olly]

Damn you Clark you promised me elite and gave me mediocrity.

 

[Skeeta Olly]

Chin up Thorgils.
He could end up a straight swap upgrade for those with Hille etc.
Well, he'd have to show signs of improving before I'd bother giving him a look in at this stage but.

Could be the same for Cox.

 

[Bert1]

Could be the same for Cox.

True Dat.

At the rate things are going Hille could end up the best of the 3. I seriously doubt that though. Pretty confident given a bit more match fitness Cox and Clarke will be lifting their games. The only thing working against them though is the emergence of Naita and return of Luenberger. If they can show this not factoring on their output too much, timing will be the key for those looking at this sort of trade.

 

[Thorgils]

If a picture says a thousands words then the pic fits perfectly thanks Skeeta.

It makes no difference he's being traded next week .

Thanks for the encouraging words Bert1 you know just how to cheer a bloke up.

 

[Skeeta Olly]

If a picture says a thousands words then the pic fits perfectly thanks Skeeta.

I think he'll come good, but I guess there is a chance he could just score 70's all the time which isn't what you paid big $ for. It's a tough decision. Whats his break-even/ how much does he drop if he scores a 60/70?

 

[Sportman1987]

How did I not hear about Le Cras being out????????? FML