TJTIGER
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Player Watch #29: Shai Bolton - What an absolute jet!
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Groupie_
time to return the traditional Richmond yellow
all our picks over the years have this tag stuck on em
- Apr 27, 2014
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How many of our great picks after Dusty have kicked on? Rioli is our great pick IMO, but the cupboard is bare. I prefer to wait before I start carrying on as I don't want to jinx the little fella.
Our selections and/ or development of players has been abysmal so I've lost faith in going early.
Our selections and/ or development of players has been abysmal so I've lost faith in going early.
- Jan 3, 2012
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Yeah but they were all there for our pick
caroma
Club Legend
meh, 3/4 of the country can't pronounce 'derby' properly...
Actually i realise most of my comments on this kid paints a poor picture. Like all nd picks he has talent and i wish him well.
My problem is not the player but the process along list management lines and where we took Bolton.
I was 100% certain that a playe rof his type would be available very late or even in the rookie draft. I think this because this is actually the norm.
Lo and behold what happens two very similar types go at 5 and 6 lebois and stengle in the rookie draft. What i am pissed about is having taken Rioli the yr before with a top 20 pick we took this runt with what amounted to our first pick this yr we sure are keen to invest in kids that project as sml fwds who MAY IF LUCKY become good mids.Rioli i can live with but in a list management sense taking bolton or a similar type to him with our first two picks is madness.
Now as i said good luck to the kid i have faith he will do well but fmd dont mention list management or the overall direction we have taken. Im sorry i just can not buy into it.
IMO scraping into the 8 justifying the coach and the board has taken precedence over the right approach which would have meant embracing the ND and almost certainly missing the 8 again not that we will make it or theres any real certainty we will anyway.
My problem is not the player but the process along list management lines and where we took Bolton.
I was 100% certain that a playe rof his type would be available very late or even in the rookie draft. I think this because this is actually the norm.
Lo and behold what happens two very similar types go at 5 and 6 lebois and stengle in the rookie draft. What i am pissed about is having taken Rioli the yr before with a top 20 pick we took this runt with what amounted to our first pick this yr we sure are keen to invest in kids that project as sml fwds who MAY IF LUCKY become good mids.Rioli i can live with but in a list management sense taking bolton or a similar type to him with our first two picks is madness.
Now as i said good luck to the kid i have faith he will do well but fmd dont mention list management or the overall direction we have taken. Im sorry i just can not buy into it.
IMO scraping into the 8 justifying the coach and the board has taken precedence over the right approach which would have meant embracing the ND and almost certainly missing the 8 again not that we will make it or theres any real certainty we will anyway.
Agent13
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Deja Vu all over again, I seem to recall reading this post about ten times. Likely in ten different threads. WE GET IT. You don't like the pick, let's all acknowledge that and move on...
caroma
Club Legend
Are you an AFL list manager?
No they are not. ATM they project at afl level as sml fwds and nothing more. They have similar traits and attributes and importantly are a similar size. Personally id prefer stengles chances of being the better fwd Bolton has the better chance of being a mid very outside at that.
At pick 29 and especially if it your first and only decent pick in the entire draft, plus you have gaping holes in FAR MORE IMPORTANT AREAS there is no way I would be using that pick on a super sml super skinny player who may or may not become an afl mid slash fwd. I know and have shown there is plenty of opportunity to dabble in this type much later.That is not even bringing into account SERIOUS DEFICIENT LIST NEEDS.
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talls? they have said that its on the agenda for next year...
They say that every yr. They have only fallen 3 or 4 yrs behind in this. No actually they have never got remotely close when it comes to talls.
You start with structure and strength and build from there. And that takes so much time to build. So why are we adding cream on top types who will rely heavily on that structure to survive first.
I say again i have nothing against Bolton he may end up a champ but fmd we ignore continuously the real needs of rebuild.
Tell me how many tall nd picks have we used after 09 then tell me we will target talls. FMD they have said inside mids are a priority almost from day dot and have proceeded to ignore the problem and now have been forced to trade out of a really deep draft for mids to at least attempt to address that problem.
It has been a complete basket case and forgive me me if i have little faith in any thing they say or think they have any idea at all about serious list needs. Ive been waiting too long .
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What if he becomes one of the best players from the draft? Surely having more quality on the list can only be good?
What is the point of getting another Astbury type just for the sake of getting a tall when we could pick up a Lever type next year?
It's not as simple as picking size. We need quality.
I'm hoping Bolton is quality.
The only AFL team I can think of that consistently follows that line of player recruiting and team player management is the Bumbers...
And look where that has got them currently...
- Apr 27, 2014
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I don't think that is the reason why they're down ATM.
Try James and Danks. They had some very good talls before the pooh hit the fan with their peds cheating.
Heisenberg_
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Yeah I'm pretty shattered we didn't take some talls who more likely then not won't be up to it just to say we took them.
It's worked so well with guys like McBean and Elton in the past.
I've no doubt in next years draft that's loaded with quality talls, not just guys who are tall we will address it with one or both of our first round picks.
It's worked so well with guys like McBean and Elton in the past.
I've no doubt in next years draft that's loaded with quality talls, not just guys who are tall we will address it with one or both of our first round picks.
TJTIGER
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This is a general post regarding list management (apologies to mods, if you think this is better served else where , please move)....
List management and player selection at drafts is a multifaceted issue that may be impacted on by opposition list analysis as well as considering your own lists needs. Some people saying we made this mistake or that. As we could've taken player x at the rookie selection etc, etc You don't know if a player will slip through to rookie or your second or third picks but if another team has deficiencies for example in the small forward area? Let's say for example we let Daniel go past our first selection?
I don't know for sure but I'd suggest that the Hawks for example knew that they were going to lose Brad Hill, I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest they would have taken him (Daniel) at their first selection last year, given him a season to develop & learn then played him as a possible Hill replacement?
Opposition list management is a full-time position? ( correct me if I'm wrong please RFC_Official ), I'm thinking there are a lot of things this person would be considering not just who may be available as a restricted/unrestricted free agent? But what are their lists needs as well as (opposition Clubs) strengths/weaknesses & how do they match up against our for when we play them? Also liaising with player managers to develop strong relationships etc in readiness for possible player transfer to our club as a desired club of destination may be another part of their role?
But if I'm a person who can think of these elements and I have nothing to do with recruiting, can you imagine how many things an opposition list manager or similar person might actually be doing? Point is no matter how much we might be saying this or that decision is "bad, wrong, could have taken this or that player later" etc I'd suggest it's never a simple decision and the rationale changes each season as the club (all clubs) needs/wants etc fluctuate season to season as well as what's available draft to draft.....Just my 2c worth..(steps off soap box....)
)....List management and player selection at drafts is a multifaceted issue that may be impacted on by opposition list analysis as well as considering your own lists needs. Some people saying we made this mistake or that. As we could've taken player x at the rookie selection etc, etc You don't know if a player will slip through to rookie or your second or third picks but if another team has deficiencies for example in the small forward area? Let's say for example we let Daniel go past our first selection?
I don't know for sure but I'd suggest that the Hawks for example knew that they were going to lose Brad Hill, I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest they would have taken him (Daniel) at their first selection last year, given him a season to develop & learn then played him as a possible Hill replacement?
Opposition list management is a full-time position? ( correct me if I'm wrong please RFC_Official ), I'm thinking there are a lot of things this person would be considering not just who may be available as a restricted/unrestricted free agent? But what are their lists needs as well as (opposition Clubs) strengths/weaknesses & how do they match up against our for when we play them? Also liaising with player managers to develop strong relationships etc in readiness for possible player transfer to our club as a desired club of destination may be another part of their role?
But if I'm a person who can think of these elements and I have nothing to do with recruiting, can you imagine how many things an opposition list manager or similar person might actually be doing? Point is no matter how much we might be saying this or that decision is "bad, wrong, could have taken this or that player later" etc I'd suggest it's never a simple decision and the rationale changes each season as the club (all clubs) needs/wants etc fluctuate season to season as well as what's available draft to draft.....Just my 2c worth..(steps off soap box
....)
- Jan 3, 2012
- 43,763
- 88,955
- AFL Club
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- Chelsea FC, Victory, All Blecks,
This is a general post regarding list management (apologies to mods, if you think this is better served else where , please move
List management and player selection at drafts is a multifaceted issue that may be impacted on by opposition list analysis as well as considering your own lists needs. Some people saying we made this mistake or that. As we could've taken player x at the rookie selection etc, etc You don't know if a player will slip through to rookie or your second or third picks but if another team has deficiencies for example in the small forward area? Let's say for example we let Daniel go past our first selection?
I don't know for sure but I'd suggest that the Hawks for example knew that they were going to lose Brad Hill, I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest they would have taken him (Daniel) at their first selection last year, given him a season to develop & learn then played him as a possible Hill replacement?
Opposition list management is a full-time position? ( correct me if I'm wrong please RFC_Official ), I'm thinking there are a lot of things this person would be considering not just who may be available as a restricted/unrestricted free agent? But what are their lists needs as well as (opposition Clubs) strengths/weaknesses & how do they match up against our for when we play them? Also liaising with player managers to develop strong relationships etc in readiness for possible player transfer to our club as a desired club of destination may be another part of their role?
But if I'm a person who can think of these elements and I have nothing to do with recruiting, can you imagine how many things an opposition list manager or similar person might actually be doing? Point is no matter how much we might be saying this or that decision is "bad, wrong, could have taken this or that player later" etc I'd suggest it's never a simple decision and the rationale changes each season as the club (all clubs) needs/wants etc fluctuate season to season as well as what's available draft to draft.....Just my 2c worth..(steps off soap box
TJ you're absolutely correct about players slipping in the draft after all how often do we hear from our drafting team say , they were always going to take player x or y and were surprised all the other clubs passed and let him slip to us, geniuses I say
- Mar 12, 2014
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am I correct you are more in the draft for position not talent school of thought?
If you had to pick one player at 29, who would you have chosen?
- Apr 27, 2014
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It's not if our results justify this. People brag that we've selected a great crop of smalls yet after Dusty I see Rioli only being a possible A grader. I'm not dismissing this years lot , but 7 years of noise has eventuated to exactly that. Our tall stocks have basically been poorer , so where do you start to build a list?
Spine , mids or short people? I know where I would be going.
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Josh Battle
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He works for hindsight.
