What is plan 'B' from the kick in?

[Seppo]

Have you ever wondered what the back up plan is if Sandi goes down (god forbid)... What does Duffman do?

I have noticed this more at the ground behind the cheersquad than I do on the TV, but we seem to be using the long kick to the edge of the 50 against the boundry ALOT this year. Against Brisbane and Adelaide I reckon 90% of the kick ins went to Sandilands area and it was working quite well, be more recently against Nth Melbourne i noticed the opposition catching on to this and double teaming Sandi and going hard into his body.
Im kinda concerned that he takes on alot of heavy knocks from these 'packs' more than the ruck contest and i feel it will soon lead to an injury.

Something funny I noticed at the Crows game was with Duffman's kick ins he would always look to use the downward wind side as it stopped the ball heading back into the corridor. Johnson took one of the kick ins as Duffy was slow to come back and MJ kicked the ball in the opposite side to the 'strategic' side. The ball then went either out of bounds or turned over to the opposition who kicked another point, to that Duffman ran over to MJ and i could clearly see him pointing to the other side and yelling something at him..

If plan 'A' (kick it long to 211) is working, should we be worried about no plan 'B'?

I do remember last year we had the chipping the ball out along the side and then switching play through the corridor (which was always great to watch when it worked/sh!thouse when it didn't).

Should we be wanting our defense to keep the opposition guessing and mix it up a bit?

Would love to know your thoughts. Espicially those footy strategists who analyse the game a bit more than I do!

 

[im_a_lazy_sod]

Kick to Fyfe?

Pretty sure they do it every now and then

 

[tacopavlich]

yeh kick to fyfe or do what ever they did in the second half against adelaide when sandi went down.. i thought sandy WAS the plan b when no other options are avaliable and no ones leading.

 

[Nickos66]

Bomb it to whoever's shown capable of taking a pack mark. McPhee's taken a few, Johnson has on the rare occasion, SNOS has good hands and Fyfe can take one over Sandi if he had to! Either that or someone big enough to provide a contest and just make sure plenty of pressure or in & under players are at their feet.

That's the best I got..

 

[Higs]

Torp straight down the corridor, heap numbers to the pack?

edit: pretty sure that worked in a preseason game with a few seconds left, resulting in a goal and a win. Also sides wouldn't expect it because nobody does it. I think I'm convincing myself here. Go the torp

 

[Sman-21]

Kick to Sandi is Plan B

First option is to find an open target 40+m from goal.
If no options its then kick it to where the big guys are, everyone runs to get too foot of contest an at the back.
The goal is to take the mark or get it over the back to the open players running into space.
The benefits are everyone knows the plan so by getting lots of numbers into the area its highly likely that it will end in a stoppage not a turnover goal from kick in.

 

[tacopavlich]

Torp straight down the corridor, heap numbers to the pack?

edit: pretty sure that worked in a preseason game with a few seconds left, resulting in a goal and a win. Also sides wouldn't expect it because nobody does it. I think I'm convincing myself here. Go the torp

sounds like a good way to beat collingwood imo.

 

[Mockcockpit]

Seems like the plan is to get a stoppage outside 50 and back the league's best ruckman to win the tap and get a clearance. If Sandi takes big pack marks it's a bonus.

 

[im_a_lazy_sod]

I've notice we've reverted to the old huddle tactic - haven't seen that one used much recently

I remember it as an option in AFL '99 when kicking out of the square

 

[Notorious_29]

The kick to Sandi from the kick out works so well because all he needs to do is tap it over his head or at least bring it to ground, and our boys are ready and waiting. If he marks it, well that's just a bonus, but there isn't a player in the comp that's going to outmark him, bar maybe Ryder or Naitanui (Freakish leaps). Agreed this has been an obvious tactic this year.

 

[Dormammu]

Had a look at the two home games.

Against Geelong, there were 10 kick-ins (one point being scored after the siren).

Duff had 5 of them, targeting Sandi twice with long kicks. There was one long kick to Pav and the other two were short kicks to Elvis and Mundy.

The kick to Mundy was down the guts, the rest to the Roberts Rd boundary. In fact, all others were to Roberts Rd and only 1 of these to Sandi (from Suban).

Other kickers were Groves, McPharlin, MJ and Broughton.

On Sunday, 14 kick-ins, one is unidentifiable (kick to Pitt on the Subiaco Rd pocket). Duff took 9, 8 to Subiaco Rd side and one down the guts to McPhee. Of these 8, 4 were to Sandi and 2 to Kep (Sandi probably resting).

Grover took 2 and MJ another - all down the guts. Last one kicked by Elvis, Roberts Rd.

What's immediately interesting is the change in flanks (Roberts Rd vs. Cats, Subiaco Rd vs. Roos). The end to which we were kicking was irrelevant.

My theory is the far flank was targeted to make the older Geelong legs work harder to get to the contest.

Against Roos? About 10 points were scored after we had opened up a +12 point lead, so the team probably felt that the gameplan had finally clicked i.e. sticking to that flank corresponded with better results which in turn led to greater confidence (in themselves and the gameplan), leading to better results etc

Obviously there were other factors at play, the above might just be coincidental.

Undisputed is the fact that in the majority of cases we kick it to Sandi or another tall (Kep, Pav or Roberton) when they're close to the boundary. There's no fancy stuff anymore (such as flick-ons), and there's a greater emphasis on trying to shield the target from being hammered from opposition players coming over the top (about time too, Crows have been successfully shielding for some time now).

 

[Evans2608]

I noticed that we have often had Hill isolated out on the opposite wing to the 'pack' surrounding Sandi. We used this alot against Geelong who had set up an imposing zone from our kick in. We didnt actually seem to kick it to him often, but I think the idea was that if we could switch the ball quickly to Hill's side we would back him to use his pace, beat his man and take the ball down the wing

I haven't noticed this tactic as much in other games, probably because the zone other teams have employed has not been as difficult to get through in comparison to the Geelong one.

Would be interested to hear whether anyone else has noticed this or if they think that it is a valuable 'plan B'.

 

[Dormammu]

I noticed that we have often had Hill isolated out on the opposite wing to the 'pack' surrounding Sandi.

In the last quarter he was on his Pat Malone at least one of the centre bounces (Pitt also).

Was very surprised. Could have been that the Roos' gameplan had collapsed by then.

 

[Freo4life]

Kick it to Fyfe.

 

[Seppo]

Had a look at the two home games.

<SNIP>

Obviously there were other factors at play, the above might just be coincidental.

Undisputed is the fact that in the majority of cases we kick it to Sandi or another tall (Kep, Pav or Roberton) when they're close to the boundary. There's no fancy stuff anymore (such as flick-ons), and there's a greater emphasis on trying to shield the target from being hammered from opposition players coming over the top (about time too, Crows have been successfully shielding for some time now).

Thanks Dormammu, that analysis was exactly what I observed and it does seem to be working for us.

Iis nice to watch the odd kick straight down the middle when Sandi can tap it over the back onto a quick break away from Hill through the guts for a goal. End-to-End

 

[yakamoto]

When The Prince of Pockets was at the height of his powers the best kickers often tried to pick a fairly central target around the arc. With the development and then refining of the zone most teams seem to be adopting an increasingly conservative approach to the kick in. I'm sure we're seeing fewer attempts to hit an isolated target, even those close to a pocket boundary. Mostly it's a long wide kick to beyond 50, with the main variant being the kicker gaining a few metres out of the square before the kick. As a team we seem well placed to take advantage of this seemingly conservative approach as we have a number of options who are strong overhead. We're also doing better at stoppages than previously.
Dorm made a comment about the majority of our kick ins going to one side of the ground rather than the other. I don't really buy his theory about the "older" Geelong players having to run further if the ball is kicked to the outer wing - or is the ground asymmetrical in shape? Maybe wind direction had something to do with it.
I do recall that a past West Perth coach directed his players to kick the ball in towards left half back. His theory was that as most players are R footers, opposition players on gaining possession would naturally turn towards the boundary rather than to a more dangerous central position. Not sure wheter it worked or not.

 

[Dormammu]

with the main variant being the kicker gaining a few metres out of the square before the kick.

Very true

I do recall that a past West Perth coach directed his players to kick the ball in towards left half back. His theory was that as most players are R footers, opposition players on gaining possession would naturally turn towards the boundary rather than to a more dangerous central position.

Interesting - the opposite to this is that if they beat the opposition they would more than likely wheel around into the central corridor (as they would also likely be right footers), which is probably the best way to score quickly, especially when you're behind and the clock's against you.

 

[yakamoto]

Correct Dorm. I've just remembered. The development of this kick in strategy was attibuted to John Wynne. Probably wouldn't be useful now due to greater use of handball plus teams preferring to go deeper before centreing the ball.

 

[Scatter]

Last year a couple of things I noticed were the long kick to Sandi he was more a decoy and someone like a Haselby would actually take the mark with Sandi more shepherding the opposition. Also noticed when it was a short kick-in the player would often play on, wheel around and kick long - obviously our players were drilled to be in the spot (maybe 70m out on the boundary) for that second kick.
Not so much used this year though.

 

[yakamoto]

Scatter, I seem to remember the role of second kicker was Josh Head's one year. Didn't work out for the best.

 

[sabre_ac]

Kick to Fyfe?

Pretty sure they do it every now and then

Almost every kick in against the Roo's I noticed Fyfe in the area, though he may have been told to support Sandi.

We've got a number of strong marks in our midfield who can be targets other than Fyfe as well. Mundy can certainly hold his own in the air and don't forget McPharlin is a great mark.