Who would you rate as the weakest minor premier of the last 20 years?

[Freomaniac]

Come off it, nobody could have defeated the Purple Haze that year. They were completely dominant until the great West Coast side of 2015 came along.

Hahaha I love this narrative when people, hawks fans on here especially, said that Freo were invincible in 2015.

Freo got injuries to key players at the worst possible time and find have an adequate 3rd or even a 2nd tall to help Pavlich.

Hawks had the easiest 3 peat in that 2013-15, end of story

 

[Dirty Bird]

Lol


Lol you really are sour

And given your top selections didn't win you look pretty hilarious.

how am i sour?
Just going off stats

 

[PAFC_1870]

how am i sour?
Just going off stats

Yeah. Make believe.

Port won the flag in 04 and beat the 4th, 3rd and 2nd in the Finals. Eagles won in 06.

You won sweet FA in 05.

 

[Dirty Bird]

For the dates specified

Best to worst

1. Collingwood 2011
2. Geelong 2008
3. Essendon 2000
4. St Kilda 2009
5. Hawthorn 2012
6. Geelong 2007
7. Sydney 2016
8. Sydney 2014
9. Collingwood 2010
10. Adelaide 2005
11. Richmond 2018
12. Adelaide 2017
13. Hawthorn 2013
14. Essendon 2001
=15. Port Adelaide 2002
=15. Port Adelaide 2004
17. Port Adelaide 2003
18. Essendon 1999
19. West Coast 2006
20. Fremantle 2015

Lol


Lol you really are sour

And given your top selections didn't win you look pretty hilarious.

Heres another list done with different stats (highly respected)

1. Collingwood 2011
2. Geelong 2008
3. Essendon 2000
4. Hawthorn 2012 (+1)
5. Collingwood 2010 (+4)
6. St Kilda 2009 (-2)
7. Sydney 2016
8. Geelong 2007 (-2)
9. Adelaide 2005 (+1)
10. Richmond 2018 (+1)
11. Sydney 2014 (-2)
12. Adelaide 2017
13. Essendon 2001 (+1)
14. Port Adelaide 2002 (+1)
15. Port Adelaide 2004 (+1)
16. Hawthorn 2013 (-3)
17. West Coast 2006 (+2)
18. Essendon 1999
19. Port Adelaide 2003 (-2)
20. Fremantle 2015

 

[Roobs321]

If you don't choose Freo 2015 you are having a laugh. Strong in the autumn but ultimately were a slightly better North 2016 whose window shut whilst ladder leading. Hawthorn and West Coast were clearly the flag faves in 2015. Freo were ultimately good enough to Lyon themselves enough workmanlike wins to finish top.

Finals aside of course. That shouldn't have much bearing on a minor premier, which is more like a soccer campaign.

2020 Power/Brisbane is second worst. Lack of intimidating aura, still the sense that it was a 5 horse race. More competitive comp these days, as well as the closeness and lower scoring of shortened quarters, is also a factor there. Much the same applies for Geelong 2019, which would fill out the bottom 3, they were Freo 2015-esque in that were strong early on then fell back into the pack during the second half of the season, but without their window slamming shut or being out of contention.

 

[Dirty Bird]

If you don't choose Freo 2015 you are having a laugh. Strong in the autumn but ultimately were a slightly better North 2016 whose window shut whilst ladder leading. Hawthorn and West Coast were clearly the flag faves in 2015. Freo were ultimately good enough to Lyon themselves enough workmanlike wins to finish top.

Agreed. Going through the numbers, its an easy answer. Heres the numbers I have for the most recent list I did. As you can see Collingwood is easily the best, but it's pretty close the whole way down from 1 minor premier to the next right up until a gap between Port 03 and Freo 15

1. Collingwood 2011 - 149.34
2. Geelong 2008 - 138.67
3. Essendon 2000 - 138.49
4. Hawthorn 2012 - 137.97
5. Collingwood 2010 - 136.90
6. St Kilda 2009 - 135.71
7. Sydney 2016 - 135.69
8. Geelong 2007 - 132.83
9. Adelaide 2005 - 131.18
10. Richmond 2018 - 130.79
11. Sydney 2014 - 129.71
12. Adelaide 2017 - 129.12
13. Essendon 2001 - 128.67
14. Port Adelaide 2002 - 128.55
15. Port Adelaide 2004 - 126.31
16. Hawthorn 2013 - 126.28
17. West Coast 2006 - 125.64
18. Essendon 1999 - 122.71
19. Port Adelaide 2003 - 122.34
20. Fremantle 2015 - 116.68

 

[Roobs321]

Agreed. Going through the numbers, its an easy answer. Heres the numbers I have for the most recent list I did. As you can see Collingwood is easily the best, but it's pretty close the whole way down from 1 minor premier to the next right up until a gap between Port 03 and Freo 15

1. Collingwood 2011 - 149.34
2. Geelong 2008 - 138.67
3. Essendon 2000 - 138.49
4. Hawthorn 2012 - 137.97
5. Collingwood 2010 - 136.90
6. St Kilda 2009 - 135.71
7. Sydney 2016 - 135.69
8. Geelong 2007 - 132.83
9. Adelaide 2005 - 131.18
10. Richmond 2018 - 130.79
11. Sydney 2014 - 129.71
12. Adelaide 2017 - 129.12
13. Essendon 2001 - 128.67
14. Port Adelaide 2002 - 128.55
15. Port Adelaide 2004 - 126.31
16. Hawthorn 2013 - 126.28
17. West Coast 2006 - 125.64
18. Essendon 1999 - 122.71
19. Port Adelaide 2003 - 122.34
20. Fremantle 2015 - 116.68

Imo your stats should ignore finals and just take their end H&A record, as that is the award.

There are also other things to consider, like how it felt. Port 2003 felt like their most dominant minor premiership, because they finished a few games clear rather than it being decided in the final fortnight. And if you put aside their opening fortnight, they were unassailable for much of that season, just a worthy champion side getting the job done. The one thing that might bring them undone is not putting away the lowly sides (their record against the bottom 5 was soft). The QF/PF losses were pretty bad, but in season they looked the goods.

 

[Dirty Bird]

Imo your stats should ignore finals and just take their end H&A record, as that is the award.

They do.
I have not taken into account finals what-so-ever

 

[Roobs321]

They do.
I have not taken into account finals what-so-ever

That's cool. I was just a bit confused with the number, mistakenly taking it as a post-season percentage when it seems you must have your own formula going on there.

 

[PowerForGood]

Agreed. Going through the numbers, its an easy answer. Heres the numbers I have for the most recent list I did. As you can see Collingwood is easily the best, but it's pretty close the whole way down from 1 minor premier to the next right up until a gap between Port 03 and Freo 15

1. Collingwood 2011 - 149.34
2. Geelong 2008 - 138.67
3. Essendon 2000 - 138.49
4. Hawthorn 2012 - 137.97
5. Collingwood 2010 - 136.90
6. St Kilda 2009 - 135.71
7. Sydney 2016 - 135.69
8. Geelong 2007 - 132.83
9. Adelaide 2005 - 131.18
10. Richmond 2018 - 130.79
11. Sydney 2014 - 129.71
12. Adelaide 2017 - 129.12
13. Essendon 2001 - 128.67
14. Port Adelaide 2002 - 128.55
15. Port Adelaide 2004 - 126.31
16. Hawthorn 2013 - 126.28
17. West Coast 2006 - 125.64
18. Essendon 1999 - 122.71
19. Port Adelaide 2003 - 122.34
20. Fremantle 2015 - 116.68

I always thought being able to win the close ones is the sign of a good team.

I guess everywhere but BF.

 

[PowerForGood]

Hahaha I love this narrative when people, hawks fans on here especially, said that Freo were invincible in 2015.

Freo got injuries to key players at the worst possible time and find have an adequate 3rd or even a 2nd tall to help Pavlich.

Hawks had the easiest 3 peat in that 2013-15, end of story

Yep. Injuries means nothing.

Port Adelaide went years with our best ruckman in Primus and best mid in Francou with knee injuries, stood toe to toe to one of the best teams of all time in Brisbane 2001-4, won 3 minor premiership with 3 of the best W/L seasons played with 10 matches on the road.... but percentage lol.

Would genuinely laugh at where those Brisbane teams would rate on this "assessment".

 

[PhatBoy]

I always thought being able to win the close ones is the sign of a good team.

I guess everywhere but BF.

Being able to win close games is fantastic - being good enough that its rare for other teams to get close is, I think you'll find, better.

 

[Alfonz]

Freo probably were by the end of 2015. But the first part of the year was some of the best football anyone has played for a long time. Especially in first halves, before putting the cue in the rack. Which they probably did for a good reason, because old players and injuries eventually derailed the season massively.

The prelim (with our all time greats basically cooked) against one of the best ever sides was also much closer than the final margin would suggest.

 

[PowerForGood]

Being able to win close games is fantastic - being good enough that its rare for other teams to get close is, I think you'll find, better.

Being able to win more games best of all.

 

[Roobs321]

Freo probably were by the end of 2015. But the first part of the year was some of the best football anyone has played for a long time. Especially in first halves, before putting the cue in the rack. Which they probably did for a good reason, because old players and injuries eventually derailed the season massively.

The prelim (with our all time greats basically cooked) against one of the best ever sides was also much closer than the final margin would suggest.

Yep, that was noted, it was a culmination of their 2012-14 form, but a bit like Geelong in 2019 it was largely restricted to autumn. Lyon's Freo was still largely getting the job done against cellar dwellers, but in the second half of the season it became apparent that they were a limp flag prospect. Maybe if there had been a mess of (modern) contenders below them instead of 2 percentage runaways, they would have looked better. I think if a side looks a bit average throughout winter, then you have to mark them down a bit.

 

[PhatBoy]

Being able to win more games best of all.

I guess the bottom line is, in a fantasy world, is a team who goes 18-4 winning a heap of close games, likely to beat, or start favourite against, a team who goes 17-5 but generally wins matches by 60 points and only loses in close matches, never gets flogged.

 

[PowerForGood]

I guess the bottom line is, in a fantasy world, is a team who goes 18-4 winning a heap of close games, likely to beat, or start favourite against, a team who goes 17-5 but generally wins matches by 60 points and only loses in close matches, never gets flogged.

If you keep exaggerating the comparison sure. That's what a fantasy world is. I'm talking about reality. But if exaggerations is the point, apparently there's about 15 of those ranked #1 dominating teams that you're talking about. Apparently.

Reality is, the factual evidence of Vic teams, by virtue of their draw, gravitate towards each end of the ladder (good and bad).

 

[Sportsmad93]

Fremantle, however I think either Brisbane or Port will take that mantle this year.