Analysis Why the discrepancy? Pies v Tigers

[jjsmitty8]

I was just browsing some 2015 stats for fun (yes, fun), and it occurred to me that we were superior to, or broke even with Richmond in pretty much every stat during the 2015 season.

Compare the pair. Collingwood to the left, Richmond to the right.

*Per game averages*
Clearances total- 38.9 - 36.4
Tackles- 71.9 - 57.5
Cont Poss- 144.5 - 136.4
Centre Clr- 11.4 - 11.6
Stoppages- 27.5 - 24.8
Inside 50's- 52.7 - 50.1
Marks i50- 13 - 12.7
Goals- 13 - 12.8
Contested Marks- 10 - 11.1
Hitouts- 38.3 - 37.6
Disposals- 370.8 - 361.4
Disposal eff- 71.8 - 73.2

*Season average and Totals*
Goal Accuracy- 52% - 50.9%
Points For- 1972 - 1930
Points Against- 1856 - 1568

I know these aren't all the stats available, but it's still a fair body of stats to start with. The only clear win in Richmond's favour is the points against stat.

We have them covered in so many areas, yet they finished 15-7 and we finished 10-12. Where'd it all go wrong in 2015? The only reason I can see is that they're defensively sound, but still ordinary at the contest and in attack. Statistically though, I can see why Adam Treloar chose us

 

[Ulahoopski]

Like to see those same stats divided into first and second halves of the season.

 

[nahnah]

They scored 50 less points than us and gave up 300 less points than us and you're asking why they did better than us? They out scored their opponent by 250 more than we did

 

[Scodog10]

I was just browsing some 2015 stats for fun (yes, fun), and it occurred to me that we were superior to, or broke even with Richmond in pretty much every stat during the 2015 season.

Compare the pair. Collingwood to the left, Richmond to the right.

*Per game averages*
Clearances total- 38.9 - 36.4
Tackles- 71.9 - 57.5
Cont Poss- 144.5 - 136.4
Centre Clr- 11.4 - 11.6
Stoppages- 27.5 - 24.8
Inside 50's- 52.7 - 50.1
Marks i50- 13 - 12.7
Goals- 13 - 12.8
Contested Marks- 10 - 11.1
Hitouts- 38.3 - 37.6
Disposals- 370.8 - 361.4
Disposal eff- 71.8 - 73.2

*Season average and Totals*
Goal Accuracy- 52% - 50.9%
Points For- 1972 - 1930
Points Against- 1856 - 1568

I know these aren't all the stats available, but it's still a fair body of stats to start with. The only clear win in Richmond's favour is the points against stat.

We have them covered in so many areas, yet they finished 15-7 and we finished 10-12. Where'd it all go wrong in 2015? The only reason I can see is that they're defensively sound, but still ordinary at the contest and in attack. Statistically though, I can see why Adam Treloar chose us

Pretty easy to me. They didn't lose the close ones and were top 3 defensively league wide through 2015.

#bravingwood

 

[Kilmo]

Well from memory a little bit of luck against Hawks, Freo, Port, Sydney gives us 4 games right there with basically no perceivable change in stats

 

[vjknight]

disposal efficiency ???

but yeah, defensively far superior, but that was their gameplan too. playing attacking footy is pointless if you spray them everywhere,

 

[jjsmitty8]

Like to see those same stats divided into first and second halves of the season.

If was on a desktop and not my iPhone, I would!

Pretty easy to me. They didn't lose the close ones and were top 3 defensively league wide through 2015.

#bravingwood

Yeah that's a fair call. It just amazes me how we can finish 12th and still look better than Richmond.

 

[MarkT2]

Just based on the stats, they played much better defensive footy. Better defenders and better defensive game plan and execution. Ignoring stats, they generally looked more assured than we did. It's easy to blame our youth for that but they were generally as young as we were and when they beat us they fielded a younger side.

 

[Scodog10]

At the end of the day moments win matches and it's why I was so ropeable with White post Richmond, Fremantle and Hawthorn.

He missed three from dead in front that really really hurt. We may not have won all three, but it makes a difference...

We aren't that far off, but continuous improvement is a must!!

 

[Maggie5]

Free kicks is interesting 400 to us, 504 to Richmond. From Footy wire 21.9 per game, another player.
Still haven't gotten over where a total of 11 free kicks were given in the game.

 

[Ant85]

More disciplined as a team and better skills.

These two important factors aren't necessarily conveyed via stats. The stats show we can get our hands on the ball, which is the first job done, but how we use it is why we finished outside of the 8.

Richmond were confident in playing a keeping off game style with Freo and Hawthorn because they could pinpoint targets under high pressure. We cannot.

They also stick to their game plan with greater discipline, spread better, and support teammates. All areas we need to improve on.

 

[BEEG]

JUNK TIME GOALS

Seriously check this stat out compared to any of the top 8 teams

 

[jjsmitty8]

They scored 50 less points than us and gave up 300 less points than us and you're asking why they did better than us? They out scored their opponent by 250 more than we did

My point was more how are they able to defend in such a way that allows them to concede low scores when they're not even capable of statistically outperforming a 12th place side.

 

[jjsmitty8]

Free kicks is interesting 400 to us, 504 to Richmond. From Footy wire 21.9 per game, another player.
Still haven't gotten over where a total of 11 free kicks were given in the game.

On the flip side, we give away less free kicks than most of the comp.

 

[Maggie5]

On the flip side, we give away less free kicks than most of the comp.

Yes I saw that but doesn't compensate for 20 plus more kicks in the game.

 

[Robroy22]

Can you give us a stat of WHO they played twice compared to us?
The draw skews every stat these days.

 

[SuperSteele22]

Richmond have a nice best 22. Collingwood have a nice list. End of discussion.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Robroy good comment bud. You think that one day the league will be divided in 2 and are we the only footy code in the world where teams don't play each other twice 'in a league that's not divided into conferences'.

 

[mike123]

I'm guessing Richmond gave up a hell of allot less goals out the back...

 

[Lord of the Pies]

Richmond can be very clinical with their forward ball movement, at times as good as hawthorn. They are able to move the ball slowly forward through precise short kicking. Collingwood on the other hand just try to bomb it forward, outnumber the contest and lock it in. Frustrates me no end.

 

[Scodog10]

Can you give us a stat of WHO they played twice compared to us?
The draw skews every stat these days.

Largely irrelevant who they played twice, but Collingwood, Carlton, Essendon, Fremantle and North Melbourne. If we're focusing on the draw when they played teams not who is more important.

At the end of the day we went 2-9 in the second half of the season. No excuses that just isn't ****ing good enough!

 

[Ketchup]

We should compare ourselves to a good club

 

[domin8tors]

They scored 50 less points than us and gave up 300 less points than us and you're asking why they did better than us? They out scored their opponent by 250 more than we did

and if you want to simplify it more we lost if I recall 6 games under under 10 points. so had we only conceded 250 more points rather then 300 against Richmond and won those 6 games we would have been Top4. so the question is does Adam Treloar add 10 points a game to take us into the Top 8. my answer is Yes. he can and Will be the difference in close games.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Age comparison?
Average games played comparison?

Those stats may have some bearing

 

[1892]

Maybe it's because they're the biggest club in the land, just because they got a slightly higher attendance figure?

Richmond fans seemed excited about that, like they'd won the flag, so surely it comes into play and is important when comparing onfield performance?