Only Five Clubs Profit Without Pokies - The Big 5?

[Bunk Moreland]

And as others have mentioned, if we're going to have moral discussion, let's start with the single greatest scourge on our community: alcohol.

The game markets it at every turn, to adults and kids, through sponsorships.

 

[ManWithNoName]

Wonder if we would've been profitable if not for the ASADA nonsense.

One of the disappointing things about a trip to Windy Hill. Pokies everywhere.

 

[Jay-Z]

And as others have mentioned, if we're going to have moral discussion, let's start with the single greatest scourge on our community: alcohol.

The game markets it at every turn, to adults and kids, through sponsorships.

You aren't seriously arguing that alcohol is worse than pokies are you?

 

[The Falcon Strike]

I honestly don't understand why non-for-profit clubs are allowed to own things like Pubs and Pokies. Makes no sense. Non for profit should be adding community benefit otherwise why exactly are they given tax concessions.

The other side of the coin is - who would you rather be profiting from misery - footy clubs or corporations?

IF - the relinquishing of pokie revenue by AFL clubs reduced problem gambling I would be strongly in favour of it - if they are simply sold to corporations to then profit from - then how is that benefiting the community at all?

Taking Hawthorn as an example - 70,000 members get a benefit out of Hawthorn receiving pokie revenue. If it was sold to James Packer as an example - how does the community benefit?

I agree - I'm stoked we don't have many of them in WA - don't want them, they cause too much misery - however that is not a "utopia" that is going to happen in the rest of the country any time soon

 

[Bunk Moreland]

You aren't seriously arguing that alcohol is worse than pokies are you?

Ahhh

Health (mental and physical)
Disease and illness
Death
Violence
Domestic abuse
Marketing direct to children

Yeah, I am. In terms of measuring "evils", there's really no contest in any measurable sense.

 

[Randy Campbell]

willing to live with that so we don't have to deal with the bullshit around pokies they have over east.

I would prefer better facilities and cheaper meals. If consenting adults want to play pokies that’s up to them.
People still have gambling problems in WA.
Ban alcohol, people will still drink it.
Ban drugs, people will still take them.

 

[Obese Arachnid]

You aren't seriously arguing that alcohol is worse than pokies are you?

 

[Randy Campbell]

Perth does have pokies and James Packer has them all.

 

[Probitas_]

Perth does have pokies and James Packer has them all.

Seems relevant to the conversation. Which club does Packer run?

 

[Belnakor]

Perth does have pokies and James Packer has them all.

actually i think you'll find they are gaming machines which are slightly different.

 

[Randy Campbell]

I'm so glad that we don't have those filthy machines out West.

Seems relevant to the conversation. Which club does Packer run?

The big building next to the new stadium.

 

[Belnakor]

I would prefer better facilities and cheaper meals. If consenting adults want to play pokies that’s up to them.
People still have gambling problems in WA.
Ban alcohol, people will still drink it.
Ban drugs, people will still take them.

you obviously haven't lived over east and don't understand how pervasive they are. They are completely different to regular gambling.

And your forgetting the social cost. More bums on the street. More crime etc. If you look at problem gambling stats there are no where near as many problem gamblers in WA compared to VIC/NSW/QLD.

Do yourself a favor and read this. http://www.qgso.qld.gov.au/products/publications/aus-gambling-stats/aus-gambling-stats-28th-edn.pdf

page 51. Total gambling in WA is 5 mill and VIC/NSW is 10x that.

 

[Kram]

you obviously haven't lived over east and don't understand how pervasive they are. They are completely different to regular gambling.

So much this. Their prevalence really shocked me when I was over in Queensland.

 

[Probitas_]

The big building next to the new stadium.

I assumed because we were on a footy forum, to talk about footy, that he was talking about footy clubs. Shocking I know.

 

[Messenger]

This thread isn't about living in Western Australia.

 

[Hot Pocket]

This thread isn't about living in Western Australia.

Well its not now. Thanks to you. SHEEESH.

 

[The Speaker]

I put it down to one of your billionaire oligarchs that the WA folk worship not having actually figured out how much money they could make from it yet.

Or that complete piece of s**t James Packer paying off said oligarchs to maintain his total monopoly on it. Actually yeah, that one is by far the most likely.

They were banned in 1974 on account of a royal commission into gambling.

 

[Hot Pocket]

They were banned in 1974 on account of a royal commission into gambling.

That is legitimately interesting. What were the findings?

Was it focused on illegal gambling?

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Actually, the article says "non-football revenue minus pokies", yet includes norths 500k as non footy related, but imcludes hawthorns as footy related


Therefore it's not exactly accurate


In reality, if the clubs didn't have ex pokies, someone else would
And if pokies were gotten rid of, these people don't instantly become better off


Look overseas
England has the most profitable sports betting companies in the world

In the USA, Indian casinos are more profitable then any gaming venue here, despite being located miles from anything

People will do anything for a fix
We need to look at better educating people (people still believe that machines "have to pay" and act as though they're the only ones putting money in

Victoria has the best set up, where there is a limit on venues, and machines in any region
Taxation is at 60% of all takings of which that money is then redistributed into government projects, keeping costs down for rate payers

 

[Hot Pocket]

So its a good thing to have a highly addictive and life destroying activity subsidising "costs" (i.e. stopping people from paying their fair share of taxes) of other people?

Sounds predatory actually.

 

[The Speaker]

That is legitimately interesting. What were the findings?

Was it focused on illegal gambling?

The full report is not online, but the conclusion regarding pokies was this:

We do not feel that we should recommend the legalisation of poker machines in Western Australia. From our observations, we formed the opinion that poker machine playing is a mindless, repetitive and insidious form of gambling which has many undesirable features. It requires no thought, no skill or social contact. The odds are never about winning. Watching people playing the machines over long periods of time, the impressionistic evidence at least is that they are addictive to many people. Historically poker machines have been banned from Western Australia and we consider that, in the public interest, they should stay banned.

 

[Rob]

This article is a bit simplistic. It appears to be taking the profit figure and subtracting the pokie revenue without taking into account any of the expenses that come from owning pokie venues. It's unlikely Hawthorn actually make a $4.1m profit from their pokie venues. It might not even include the significant taxes that need to be paid on the revenue.

 

[TBoyleSuperstar]

I don't get the uproar. The Clubs are a business and as such, look at revenue streams to ultimately build themselves up to a point where they can survive and, hopefully, win a flag. Hawthorn make money form Pokies, and we budget for that income. If it were to be taken away, we simply reduce the amount we spend, or find another revenue stream.
I'm sure if clubs could find a way to maintain their existing spending and do it in a morally acceptable way, then I'm sure they would. But ultimately you have a market there and they look to get their share out of it.

End of the day, the AFL is sponsored by betting companies, alcohol companies and fast food companies, as this is the case, why should clubs be any different??

The way I see it, if people are stupid enough to put all their money into Pokies, then it's their own stupid fault. Sick of society trying to protect people who clearly don't wish to be protected.

 

[Hot Pocket]

I agree, the AFL should be boycotted completely.

 

[Probitas_]

I don't get the uproar. The Clubs are a business and as such, look at revenue streams to ultimately build themselves up to a point where they can survive and, hopefully, win a flag. Hawthorn make money form Pokies, and we budget for that income. If it were to be taken away, we simply reduce the amount we spend, or find another revenue stream.
I'm sure if clubs could find a way to maintain their existing spending and do it in a morally acceptable way, then I'm sure they would. But ultimately you have a market there and they look to get their share out of it.

End of the day, the AFL is sponsored by betting companies, alcohol companies and fast food companies, as this is the case, why should clubs be any different??

The way I see it, if people are stupid enough to put all their money into Pokies, then it's their own stupid fault. Sick of society trying to protect people who clearly don't wish to be protected.

I agree with everything else you posted but this is a simplistic view, it's addictive behaviour, of course they shouldn't start it but it shouldn't just be so freely accessible either.