Trades / Delistings & Draftees 2014 (latest: Clarke & Mooney going home, Yagmoor delisted)

[Snoop Dog]

If Frost and Martin are getting promoted, you'd think there would have to be more list changes to come.

We've only lost four off our senior list. If two of those four spots are taken up by promoted rookies - that means we're out of the national draft by the end of the second round (pick 26) - hardly the behaviour of a team trying to rebuild with youth.

In the last two years Hine has gone into the draft with two senior list spots up his sleeve to use on late draft picks if he wanted to. It has been a wonderfully successful strategy.

In 2012 he didn't use them in the (heavily compromised) national draft, preferring to use those picks in the rookie draft instead - Welcome to Collingwood Oxley (showed so much promise that he was promoted) and Frost (will be promoted).

In 2013 he did use them in the national draft. Welcome to Collingwood Langdon and Marsh.

2014 is an uncompromised draft and by virtue of finishing down the ladder, our picks are early in the draft order.

For example, in 2012 our fourth round pick was at #80 (which we didn't use) whereas in 2014 our fourth round will be #62.

Given the huge success of our strategy in recent seasons to go into the national / rookie draft with picks up our sleeves - surely we would do it again?

If so, we are due another two delistings at least - assuming Frost and Martin are promoted. Trading one player for another doesn't get us there. Trading players for picks might (with the help of pick swaps)

At present with Frost promoted Pies will have 4 picks.

Martin and Gault I think will probably get promoted for Caf and Shazza as soon as those can be placed on long term injury list.

I suspect they will go to draft with intent to trade 3 and leave one for a free agent or PSD. Could also drop Marsh to Rookie list and create a spot if wanted to. At present I have 2 rookie spots to pick but if they did that it brings the ND up to 5 and Rookie 1.

 

[Snoop Dog]

I would play Kennedy before I played Martin.

Has more Weapons and is a Better Prospect. Quicker as well

Didn't say they wouldn't just how they potentially all fit in to the 22.

 

[Gone Critical]

At present with Frost promoted Pies will have 4 picks.

Martin and Gault I think will probably get promoted for Caf and Shazza as soon as those can be placed on long term injury list.

I suspect they will go to draft with intent to trade 3 and leave one for a free agent or PSD. Could also drop Marsh to Rookie list and create a spot if wanted to. At present I have 2 rookie spots to pick but if they did that it brings the ND up to 5 and Rookie 1.

What about Ramsay to the rookie list. Despite his finish to the season I think he is still not near best 22 and not likely to be in the team short term unless lots of injuries. We have room for upgrades as required.

 

[DWil6]

Martin staying would be interesting. He'd have been odds on to go. Hasn't had much of a crack and didn't seem to be a favourite of Buckleys. I wish him well if he stays. I like him and at his best he could be a player. Needs to take the next step. Otherwise an expensive VFL player.

 

[Scodog10]

I can state categorically Snoop that regardless of where Frost sits in the scheme of things currently we will be required to use a rookie upgrade at this years draft if we wish him to be on the senior list in 2015.

At present we will have 3 options. Frost entering 2015 as a 3rd year rookie (highly unlikely) which gives us 4 picks. We then have the option of 3 live picks and Frost as a rookie promotion (most likely) and lastly we decide to go with a senior list of forty which allows 4 live picks and Frost as a promotion (plausible depending on how draft night pans out).

To cut to the core if you start the year on the rookie list and your club wants you on the senior list the following year the only way it can be done is as a rookie upgrade at the draft.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=347400138767554&id=192716170902619

We have some value for this trade.

 

[Embleberry]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/heretier-lumumba-to-quit-collingwood-20140904-10cmw1.html

 

[Primetime Pricey]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/heretier-lumumba-to-quit-collingwood-20140904-10cmw1.html

Good. Get rid of him while he has some trade value left

 

[Embleberry]

Good. Get rid of him while he has some trade value left

He wouldn't be worth a whole lot Though I'm hoping if he does want to leave then we can get O'Rourke out of it!!

 

[Rusty22]

He wouldn't be worth a whole lot Though I'm hoping if he does want to leave then we can get O'Rourke out of it!!

sheil

 

[Embleberry]

sheil

Why not both?

 

[Rusty22]

Why not both?

 

[76woodenspooners]

At present with Frost promoted Pies will have 4 picks.

How do you get 4 picks?

We lost Maxy, Lynch, Ball and Clarke off the senior list.

(We lost Hudson, Mooney and Yagmoor off the rookie list)

If we move Frost to the senior list, we end up with 3 on the senior list? (and if the Martin promotion rumour is correct then we end up with 2 on the senior list?)

 

[mike123]

I hope we don't promote Martin

 

[TradeDraft]

Didn't say they wouldn't just how they potentially all fit in to the 22.

Well guess Martin be more Inside player as Kennedy has some Tricks to play bit more Outside. Bit like Beams

 

[Macca_]

I hope we don't promote Martin

Martin hasn't had a fair crack at the top level yet.

 

[Harry O]

How do you get 4 picks?

We lost Maxy, Lynch, Ball and Clarke off the senior list.

(We lost Hudson, Mooney and Yagmoor off the rookie list)

If we move Frost to the senior list, we end up with 3 on the senior list? (and if the Martin promotion rumour is correct then we end up with 2 on the senior list?)

I assume they will go with 40 on senior list in 2015 instead of 39 + Hudson. So that is 1 extra pick. Plus say Armstrong and Lumumba gone and you have 6 picks.

 

[mike123]

Martin hasn't had a fair crack at the top level yet.

Yes, but not having a fair crack isn't enough to warrant a senior list spot. IMO his just a VFL player and doesn't have many weopons beside getting ball and kicking goals. We have players like that already on our list.

 

[TheFreshBanana]

I think he is earmarked for a Ball type role. Lot of people say that is ADams but Ball and Adams played together this year and I wouldn't mind betting Martin and Adams might be a plan they are working to. Kennedy is the other in that type of role but I think he will take Blair's role pretty quickly. BK and Martin can both play fwd as can Adams so gives them flex.

Ball played more of a high forward type with Adams in the side (unless it was Adams down back).

Martin up forward could be handy.

 

[damuzzdu]

If Frost and Martin are getting promoted, you'd think there would have to be more list changes to come.

We've only lost four off our senior list. If two of those four spots are taken up by promoted rookies - that means we're out of the national draft by the end of the second round (pick 26) - hardly the behaviour of a team trying to rebuild with youth.

In the last two years Hine has gone into the draft with two senior list spots up his sleeve to use on late draft picks if he wanted to. It has been a wonderfully successful strategy.

In 2012 he didn't use them in the (heavily compromised) national draft, preferring to use those picks in the rookie draft instead - Welcome to Collingwood Oxley (showed so much promise that he was promoted) and Frost (will be promoted).

In 2013 he did use them in the national draft. Welcome to Collingwood Langdon and Marsh.

2014 is an uncompromised draft and by virtue of finishing down the ladder, our picks are early in the draft order.

For example, in 2012 our fourth round pick was at #80 (which we didn't use) whereas in 2014 our fourth round will be #62.

Given the huge success of our strategy in recent seasons to go into the national / rookie draft with picks up our sleeves - surely we would do it again?

If so, we are due another two delistings at least - assuming Frost and Martin are promoted. Trading one player for another doesn't get us there. Trading players for picks might (with the help of pick swaps)

We have delisted 7 players 5 from the main list, so even if both JF & KM get upgraded that leaves 3 spots at the draft. KM might be able to stay a rookie as 2015 would be year 3 as a rookie.

Lists are 38+6+1 or 40+4+1. Also Caff & Scharenberg will be placed on LTI so that our rookies will be able to put on the senior list from as early as Round 1.

So that effectively makes it 42+2+1 (NB the 1 being Mason Cox)

 

[MyManLynch]

How do you get 4 picks?

We lost Maxy, Lynch, Ball and Clarke off the senior list.

(We lost Hudson, Mooney and Yagmoor off the rookie list)

If we move Frost to the senior list, we end up with 3 on the senior list? (and if the Martin promotion rumour is correct then we end up with 2 on the senior list?)

Remember Hudson was a nominated rookie or our 40th player on the list, hence his departure leaves another senior list spot open.
With 2 ACL injuries we can promote 2 rookies early in 2015, hence no need for a nominated rookie next season. We go with 40 senior, 4 rookies & up to 3 Cat B rookies (Cox, McKenna,?).

 

[Rusty Beam]

I'm just annoyed we never got a chance to see Mooney in the Grand Final sprint.

Would have been interesting to see whether he could have pipped Danger.

 

[Damon_3388]

Broomhead and Kennedy out of contract?

Didn't they both re-sign weeks ago?

 

[Snoop Dog]

What about Ramsay to the rookie list. Despite his finish to the season I think he is still not near best 22 and not likely to be in the team short term unless lots of injuries. We have room for upgrades as required.

Yeah but unlikely for mine.

 

[Apex36]

I'm just annoyed we never got a chance to see Mooney in the Grand Final sprint.

Would have been interesting to see whether he could have pipped Danger.

Meh. Just wait for next year when Marsh wins it